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Kol Korran
2011-03-28, 03:41 PM
If you're either Itay, Guy, Tomer, Ariel or Alon, get out now!

A while back, while my players just reached 3rd level, they had a lead that might lead the through the Mournland- Eberron's bizarre-everything-can-and-will-happen world. I then asked for advice concerning a special encounter i was planning, that depended heavily on the particular personalities and abilities of the characters. there was a thread you don't need to read, some good advice, and i was set. however, the players chose to go another way.

they might be checking the route to the Mournland now, and for the most part i think the game is fine, but some characters changed, 2 players are playing brand new characters, and so i thought to ask for help again. let me explain:

the encounter is completely ad hoc and not supported in the rules, but it's been a long time since i DMed, and i'd appreciate advice.

the basic concept is that the party meets a strange wagon, with an amiable and friendly looking ogre (who acts quite unlike an ogre) driving it. the wagon has no beast pulling it, but it doesn't seem to matter. he knows the characters by name, and may even hint about secrets they have. but all of that is irrelevant- he is here to make a sale!

what does he sell? organs, and powers associated with them. the organs replace the characters, or are added to them, in return for the appropriate character's organ (or a piece of), and a small amount of money. there is also a cost in general health, as the "exchange", shakes the system. (the character loses 2 CON).

the process is reversible (as well as CON gain) but costs a bit more money. the players don't have to accept, just thought to introduce an interesting encounter for the Mournland.

i need help with:
- Ideas: i made some ideas for most characters except 1. but i'd appreciate other ideas for the other characters.
- balance: i want the exchange to be fairly equal to the 2 CON lost, and it should be equal between the characters. something cool, but not game changing.
- flavor: there is a small ritual of exchange for every organ. i'd like it to be somewhat disturbing. ideas are welcome. i suck at this.
also, any way to make the organ peddler more interesting (or the scene) in general) would be appreciated.

lets begin:
1) Half Giant Psychic warrior (we treat magic and psionics the same). he plays a bit like Roy. his powers tend to be either things to increase his defense, or damage output. he is a main damage dealer, but also takes up a lot of damage, and not well i thought of 2 ideas::

The heart of an ogre mage: "a big fellow like you, with magic in his mind, needs magic from the heart to fuel it! here, this belonged to a brother of mine. sort to speak."
benefits: Manifester level goes up by 1 (+1CL? +2CL?)
Ritual: the Organ peddler gets the body of an ogre mage from his cart, opens his chest and ribs to expose it's still beating heart. he then makes a shallow cut over the rib cage of the half giant, and says "now hug" as they do the half-giant's rib cage opens and the hearts... "flop" into place.


Skin graft of the stone giant: "i hear your tribe has a pact with the stone brothers" (true) "you could become a bit more like them, by losing some of yourself"
Benefits: he gets a +1 to NA normal, and can use a psychic power to increase this to +4? +5? +6? 2/3 times per day.
Ritual idea 1: the ogre brings out a geodic stone upon which are strung patches of skin, and blood. as the half giant touches it he starts to turn to stone, slowly, while his skis is peeled away painfully, in shreds, the process continues until he is turned to stone. after a bout a minute more, the stone figure moves, the half giant in his new skin.



2) A dwarf warmage. the player loves blowing stuff, lives for that, is somewhat of a rules lawyer and a power gamer (compared to the group that is). my problem is that the character is brand new, and other than loving drink, i know nothing about him. i hope i get another meeting at least till they get to the organ peddler, to learn about him. the player has displayed somewhat evil tendencies with previous characters. but not with this.

i need help with this one. my ideas are to maybe grant him some organ of a dragon, or an elemental? i don't want to push the "evil tendencies" angle to much, because i think the player is trying to veer away from it.

this may be the most powerful player in the group (he tends to be), so i'm looking for cool interesting options other than raw power.

3) Half elf Rogue/ Duskblade the rest: the player made it into a sort of a coward that prefers to avoid conflicts, but when he has to (most of the time due to a compelling curse), he carries a punch. for those of you who know Discworld, think of Rincewind, but with actual capabilities. he hasn't emphasized anything he wants yet. he carries a curse that propels him to do heroic deeds, that he fights as well as he can. the curse cannot be removed, and the player doesn't want it to be. he loves to talk his way out, and is quite the smoother talker.

Mane of the Lamia: "i see the trickster in you. one who uses words before swords. The hair of the Lamia holds it's power over others. will you take it?"
Benefits: he'll get some bonus to social skills, and can use suggestion 2/ day.
Ritual: the ritual need to look simple, since the character is abit... squeamish. the Ogre might agree to do the gruesome parts. a stunned/dead lamia is brought, only it's hair moves. the scalp needs to be cut, but the mane tries to shove the cutting hand away. the he needs to put the bleeding sculp on his head, where it attaches to it and painfully roots into it. thereafter the mane moves slightly all the time.

i'm not sure this is a good ritual. i think the player might reject it up front. something more subtle may be needed.

4) the Kalashtar woman wizard/sorcerres/ultimate magus: very charismatic and smart, plays as a good vizier/ advisor/ spell for every occasion, prefers to use her spells to circumvent problems, rather than fight. in the past she expressed an interest in the fey, but has since been far more focused on pure arcane power. her beauty is a source of pride for her, so the change needs to be (mostly) ascetic. i have two ideas in mind:


Organ: The skin of a nymph "the power of the fey can be yours, for only a kiss"
Benefit: she can use "stunning beauty" 3/ day. ("all shall love me and despair"), like the nymph power, only not blind, just stunned for 1d3 rounds
ritual: the ogre brings out a large uprooted tree from the wagon. near it's bark is the face of a captivated nymph. "kiss" says the ogre. as they kiss the nymph hugs her, and slowly the skin creeps into the sorceress skin, melding into it, making her skin seem a bit darker, but not much. the nymph ages and dies by this process, through the kiss. since the player is basically good, i may goad him by saying the dryad seems to implore her, or the ogre might says she is suffering slowly. not sure about it yet.

damn... i forgot the second idea.

5) Aasimar female cleric of a goddess of honor, self sacrifice and good (Dol Arrah). however the character had been captured by the main villains and been subjected to a lot of pressure, and so she... cracked a bit, done evil things, and is basically trying to redeem herself and do good, though at times she may become a bit less hinged. the party still doesn't (and probably won't) know she is an Aasimar. the player wishes to keep that secret as lon as he can. she's been the "batman cleric" so far, buffing, having a scroll for most cases, but she also loves to charge into battle, sometime raging. (her name is Savage, and the passion domain enables her to rage).

again, i'm not sure what to do with this one. obvious choice will be to offer a piece of either an angel or a fiend. but which one? and what effect will it have? help?

if you've been SOOOOOOO kind to read this far, please let me know what you think. help me make a fun encounter for my players!

Thanks a bunch,
Kol.

Veyr
2011-03-28, 03:44 PM
I'm a bit busy at the moment, but you might want to check out the Fleshwarping list in my sig: it has a lot of material that might be appropriate for this character.

RabidNinja
2011-03-28, 10:40 PM
Kol! This here's Old Greg. Haven't used this account in a while :smalltongue:

First off, I love the idea for this encounter. This sounds like something really enjoyable for the characters, and something that could be paid off later, plot-wise.

I only have one overall suggestion. It might be fun to have some long-term flavor to have as the result of the graft, as a bit of a gimmick. Maybe it could explain the -2 con, maybe it could be its own thing. For example, after the skin graft, the psychic warrior might find that he coughs up sand, or occasionally hacks up a smooth pebble. Something fun and odd, and maybe a bit disconcerting.

More specifically,

1. The warmage. I could see an acid/fire/ice/etc gland of a dragon being grafted onto the mage in some way or another, boosting spells of the same damage type, or maybe allowing him to turn other spells into the same damage type. For the long-term gimmick, maybe after receiving the ice gland of a silver dragon, he always feels chilly, or the gland of a green dragon gives him pretty intense acid reflux. For example:

Fire gland of a Red Dragon
Flavor: "Power and destruction flickers in your eyes. I think I have just the right thing for you..."
Benefit: Any spell that does energy damage may be converted into fire damage, and any spell that already is a fire spell gets its caster level increased by one.
Ritual: The Ogre pulls out a red dragonhide sack from his wagon. He reaches into it, and pulls out a slimy, pink, amorphous organ, roughly the size of your fist. He bounces it from hand to hand like a hot potato as he approaches you. "Open wide," he says, grinning. As your mouth opens, he grasps the gland and plunges it down your throat, his arm immersed in your mouth up to his elbow. You can't breathe as he moves the scalding organ around in your innards, but he eventually pulls out his hand and you collapse to the ground, coughing out billows of black smoke. The cough never really goes away.


2. For the Kalashtar sorceress, I could see that ability being, well, really powerful. A pretty effective AOE save or suck 3/day, for 2 con, seems like maybe too good of a deal. Mayhaps take it down to 1/day?


3. I had a bit of an idea for the cleric as well.

Finger of Sacrifice
Flavor: "You worship Dol Arrah, correct? Hm. Sacrifice. I think I might have something for you. It's a piece of a... well, maybe that should just be one of life's little mysteries, heh? Suffice to say that its previous owner served divinity, just like you."
Benefit: The cleric can, by touching an ally with the finger, heal them 2d8+2 damage. The drawback is, the cleric takes however much was healed as damage; the ideal self-sacrifice. Unlike most healing, this cannot be used as a touch attack against undead.
Ritual: After you consent, the Ogre giggles gleefully, and runs back to the wagon to collect a small, dull bronze apparatus something like a pair of curved scissors, as well as a smooth gray finger. Nonchalantly, the Ogre snips off your index finger, but quickly stops the bleeding- and the pain- with a gray paste. The Ogre affixes the finger to the paste, and over the course of the next few minutes, the paste melts into flesh, unifying your hand and the finger. Gray veins begins to spiderweb all over your hand, emanating from the finger. Every now and then, when you're not looking, the finger seems to try and etch something into a nearby surface with its long fingernail, entirely of its own volition. However, it stops as soon as you notice it, and the message has never gotten further than, "You ca..."

That's all I got right now. Good luck Kol!

-Old Greg

Kittenwolf
2011-03-28, 11:11 PM
Sounds like an interesting encounter, I like it :)

Well, -2 Con is a pretty big drawback, so the bonuses should be pretty solid, and if the campaign is designed to reach higher levels, you'll probably want bonuses that are scalable.
Another idea, expanding on what Rabid said, is it have the issues be more long-term.

Say the player loses 1/4 of their HP from the ritual, and regain it at the rate of one point per day/week/whatever is appropriate for your campaign (just to represent healing from the trauma), with maybe a couple of points being permanently lost (I'm thinking similar to Ignus teaching you spells in Planescape Torment).
Then, over time as the wounds heal, they start feeling.. effects from the new organ. Maybe a penalty to whatever was the creature's worst save, or they take on a lesser form of whatever the creature has a vulnerability to, etc.

For eg, going with a suggestion that I was going to give but Rabid beat me to; say the Warmage gets offered the frozen Elemental gland of a White Dragon (cast all Cold spells at +2CL). Over time he starts to find that he's really slow and sluggish in the morning (-2 Dex before midday) and fire/heat hurts a lot more than it used to (+25% damage taken from Fire).

That way we get a nice chunk of up-front "Oh gods the trauma", and then lingering effects tailored to the bonus they get.

Kittenwolf
2011-03-28, 11:47 PM
And now for some specific examples :)



1) Half Giant Psychic warrior (we treat magic and psionics the same). he plays a bit like Roy. his powers tend to be either things to increase his defense, or damage output. he is a main damage dealer, but also takes up a lot of damage, and not well i thought of 2 ideas::


I quite like the ones that you've got there, especially the Ogre Magi one.



2) A dwarf warmage. the player loves blowing stuff, lives for that, is somewhat of a rules lawyer and a power gamer (compared to the group that is).


Like above, I think the elemental gland of a dragon to give +2CL to whatever element he most favors would be a fun way to go :)



3) Half elf Rogue/ Duskblade the rest: the player made it into a sort of a coward that prefers to avoid conflicts, but when he has to (most of the time due to a compelling curse), he carries a punch.

Well, other than enhancing his diplomatic side, you could do something about his fight-or-flight side :)
"Ah, I know others like you, a whole bunch of them in fact, never knowing if they should stay or flee, but vicious when cornered"
Item: Hamstrings of the Kobold
Ritual involves (painfully) tearing the hamstrings out of the PC and replacing them with ones from a Kobold.
Benefit: Either a +10ft bonus to land speed, an extra 5ft step per round, or (like 4th ed) being able to 5ft step regardless of other movement in a round.



4) the Kalashtar woman wizard/sorcerres/ultimate magus: very charismatic and smart, plays as a good vizier/ advisor/ spell for every occasion, prefers to use her spells to circumvent problems, rather than fight. in the past she expressed an interest in the fey, but has since been far more focused on pure arcane power. her beauty is a source of pride for her, so the change needs to be (mostly) ascetic. i have two ideas in mind:


Ascetic or aesthetic? :)
I definitely think pulling a looks from a Fey is a good way to go. Maybe the Nymphy's Stunnign Glance? That one's single target rather than AoE



5) Aasimar female cleric of a goddess of honor, self sacrifice and good (Dol Arrah). however the character had been captured by the main villains and been subjected to a lot of pressure, and so she... cracked a bit

Sounds a whole lot like Supernatural to me :)
I can't really suggest much here, though I did immediately think of giving her a blood transfusion that grants her the ability to X/day cut herself and drip her blood on someone's wound to cast Cure Light Wounds, but I have no idea what creature that would come from.
I'll take a look in the BoED when I'm near my books, surely there's something in there about taking other's wounds...

classy one
2011-03-29, 04:24 AM
I think you are doing fine as it is. Still have to wonder about the nature of this ogre mage. I would imagine your players may try to guess at it or at the very least do a knowledge or sense motive check on him. It would suck if you at least have some basic info for them.

Grafts are nothing new in Eberron of course. The Daelkyr love symbionts and grafts are similar in a way. An ogre half Daelkyr fits the bill pretty well. Maybe some levels in impure price if he's high enough level.

An interesting twist would be that he is trying to create new grafts/symbionts using "hero" organs. In fact he is selling he prototype organs to the heroes as a field test, see how well they work "in the field". If he is to be a "boss fight" later on, you can even have their grafts betray them at critical time. Lots of potential here.

Other places to look are:
Magic of Eberron: half Daelkyr template and impure prince are there, as well as a bunch of new symbionts and ten Pages of grafts of various types. There there some rituals in this books as well n

Warhammer 40k: the marines get a bunch of implants that you might be able to lift ideas from.

Book of Aberrations: loads of grafts and classes that give grafts. Fluff is a bit different but should still work.

Good luck

Kol Korran
2011-03-31, 11:07 AM
thanks for the replies guys. few replies, but quality ones!
to reply:

1) a main idea is to have some sort of after effect, either just creepy details, or something with a game effect. still unsure how i want to do this. some have suggested a recovery path, i may do this over the next few days, but i need a simple mechanic. thoughts about this:
- the person looses more than 2 con, perhaps 4. the con damage is healed through making will saves (con saves will be reciculeous), and when the person fails, all con damage turns to con drain. a bit like the deal with negative levels.
- drawn from that avenue- how about the person doesn't incur an ability loss, but rather is treated is it has died in terms of experience points, and regaining them? (going down a level). what do you think?

2) penalty: some think a -2 to con is a hefty penalty... isn't it worth a belt or amulet of health +2 that doesn't take place?- around 8000? i'll throw the "dowsn't take body slot" in for nothing, just because...

3) scalability: hmmm... interesting, either i'll need to make the powers scalable, or... not. this will differ in how these organs and influence will be prevelent later on. i'm thinking not, since the pary is allready powerful, no need to make it more.

4) SPecific characters: (including after effects)
1) half giant: heart of ogre mage- perhaps his skin start turns bluish, or maybe his presence disturbes the 0 level spells of his friends? will it be a +1 or +2 to CL? not sure how much it's worth...

Skin of a sonte giant: i'm thinking just having it as a +3 NA and that's it. coughing up pebbles sounds awesome to me, or else, he could hear the voices of stones around him. natural stone is more... content, but worked stone seems to bemoan it's fate.

2) the dwarf warmage:
I'm thinking that altering the energy of his spells to a particualr energy is a bit redundent with him being a warmage- access to most energy spells and being a spontaneous caster? however i have 2 other ideas:
- burning spells to summon elementals of the shoen elemental like a druid (using the same spell level and so on). the player loves controlling stuff, so this might be fun.
- or maybe enabling him to TURN into an elemental by expanding spells, for limited rounds? i'm afraind this may be too much. what do you think?
in each cases somehow taking an elemental gland (perhaps instead of the stomach?) might be the way to go.
after effects: some sort of an effect that happens every sometime depending on the element (sweating profusely, setting items on fire, a torrent of wind and so on)

3) half rogue/duskblade: sorry, but i don't like the idea of increased movememnt simply because... the player moves very little as it is (prefering to cast spells and use it's bow). i'm still thinking suggestions, but i thought of another creature:
- vocal cords of a Succubi: a few cuts are made in his throat, and in hers, the ogre first takes his vocal cords, and THEY start telling some of his secrets, while he can't object, while sewing the new vocal cords ever so slowly... just as the cords are back, the ogre stops closes them in a box.

after effects: the succubi vocal cords directly lie to people very conviencengly, or perhaps fumble one of the duskblades spells.

4) Kalashter wizardess: so stunning beauty is too much? hhmmm... how about one of the following:
- being able to summon nature's ally like a druid (natural animals only) same as the warmage
- learning one druid spell from every spell level she knows (up to say... 4th) to be used as a wizard spell, or a SLA?
- aura of beauty: enchantment spells (especially charm person and the like) get a +2 CL, +4 against anyone that might be attracted to her?
or are these still too strong?
as to after effects: perhaps she glows a bit at times, making her more visible? or perhaps she feels weakened when not in contact with nature every so while?

5) the aasimar cleric: OG if you're reading this i loved your idea, but here is an alteration: instead of a finger of sacrifice, how about... a stigmata? the player loves religion, and two bleeding wounds from his hands will go well with his melodramatic streak.
- benefit: he can make the wounds bleed or close t/standard/ move action? the bleed damage equal half his level every round. this damage cannot be healed in any way until 1 hour until after they stopped bleeding. as they bleed the party and enemies are under the effect of a prayer, and her healing spells are empowered?
after effects- at times the wounds open just a bit, and blood dribbles. as OG suggested, some of the fingers start writing something, but it can't be easily deciphered... something in celestial and infernal...

5) Nature of the dealer this character may bea recurring character in various campaign of minem having many different roles, but always making some sort of deal. it is supposed to particularily evade detection, though there may be a few myths about it. currently i'm thinking this is in fact a quite powerfull neutral night hag, with obvously some quite... unusualy skills. the entire episode here in the mournland is supposed to be something between real and a dream.

these are sepcifically not grafts in the usuall sense, especially in the way that they are inserted or given power.

the ogre does indeed want the heroes organs however, but to what end the players (and me) don't yet know.

i'd love any further ideas, on the old builds or the new. thanks in advance,
Kol.:smallsmile:

Telonius
2011-03-31, 11:49 AM
For the Aasimar: "You ... now, you look like the sort that's always in a quandary, never sure which way is up or down. Always of two minds about something. On the one hand, this; on the other, that. Well, this might be just the thing for you."

He opens a box, and you see two shriveled, severed hands clasped together. A close inspection shows they used to belong to a Deva and an Erinyes. The two became lovers, and both "fell" to Neutral. They were shunned by both Celestia and Baator.

Ritual: The Cleric separates the hands from each other; each hand grasps one of hers, and melts into the skin.

Benefit: She is able to Inflict or Cure wounds spontaneously, as well as Turn or Bolster undead, depending on which hand she uses. (To make things interesting, the Deva's hand will Inflict and Bolster, but the Erinyes' hand will Cure and Turn). Once a day, she can Cure (or Inflict) a Maximized spell with no increase in caster level.

McSmack
2011-03-31, 12:01 PM
Sounds fun and creepy. I like it. I think it would be interesting if later on they run into NPC's that have whatever organs they gave up. Or they occasionally lose some of thier powers (-1 or 2 to a stat or lose a single spell or something) as NPC's use the PC's former organs. Or a dragon shows up demanding that the warmage return his testicle.

RabidNinja
2011-04-05, 01:44 PM
1. I kinda like the -2 con how it is, personally. Your call. Like you said, can always be offset by a magic item if need be.

2. Most of the abilities and such don't seem like they need to be scaled to me. A flat bonus to AC or CL, for example, is going to have roughly the same ultimate effect across all levels.

Half-Giant: I'm afraid I don't know enough about Psionics or Psychic Warriors to give a candid response concerning the Ogre Mage bit. The +3 NA seems good though.

Warmage: I think summoning elementals might be the better route to go. Another option, either to add on or on it's own, could be turning/rebuking elementals as a cleric of the same level.

DuskRogue: What benefit were you thinking the vocal chords would grant? I like the flavor of it. Perhaps a bonus to bluff checks, and a bonus to CL for sonic or mind-affecting spells?

Wizardess: All of those look like fine options, I like either the druid spells or the bonus to enchantment. With the enchantment spells, It might be more relevant to give her, say, a +2 to the save DC of such spells instead of a caster level bonus, seeing as most enchantment spells only care about CL for the purposes of duration and resisting dispelling.

Cleric: The stigmata sounds badass. I think the move action sounds like a better idea, that way it's something that can be more viably busted out in a tight spot. I can't think of a way to flavor it in terms of an organ transfusion though, unless you're thinking a full on double hand trade, which just sounds kinda odd. Maybe... not so much an organ trade, but instead, the Ogre/Hag takes two spikes from a Barbed Devil, says an incantation, and straight up stabs him in the palms.

Kol Korran
2011-04-06, 01:24 PM
1. I kinda like the -2 con how it is, personally. Your call. Like you said, can always be offset by a magic item if need be.

<snip>

Warmage: I think summoning elementals might be the better route to go. Another option, either to add on or on it's own, could be turning/rebuking elementals as a cleric of the same level.


hhmmm... interesting, only there probably won't be that many elementals in the campaign. i don't want him later complaining that some of this powers weren't used.

also, a thought- how about the organ belonging to an Azer? his beard? now the warmage will have a smoldering beard? the player loves fire, and i think he will like it. as a ritual, he will have to shave his beard with a fiery razor made of the skin of an azer, as the razor shouts and curses in fiery dwarven!



DuskRogue: What benefit were you thinking the vocal chords would grant? I like the flavor of it. Perhaps a bonus to bluff checks, and a bonus to CL for sonic or mind-affecting spells?

oh, i forgot to say i intended the benefits to be the same as before. a bonus to social skills (under our house rules they are grouped together as "influence"), and suggestion as an SLA... i thought 2/ day? should make it interesting but not too powerful i think.



Wizardess: All of those look like fine options, I like either the druid spells or the bonus to enchantment. With the enchantment spells, It might be more relevant to give her, say, a +2 to the save DC of such spells instead of a caster level bonus, seeing as most enchantment spells only care about CL for the purposes of duration and resisting dispelling.

hhhmmm... enchantment are already her favorite spells (most notably sleep, tasha's laughter, and coming up next- deep slumber). i'll have to think about it.

if i'm going to go with spells, i need to somehow balance it with the warmage- he gets only spells i decide upon, and possibly just from one element, while the wizardes gets to choose... my thoughts:
- the wizardess is about versatility and "interesting spells" so maybe she gets more spells known (3 from level 1, 2 from 2, 1 from 3?) while the warmage gets power? (he gets the summoning plus a +1/2 to DCs of the element, maybe a caster level increase?



Cleric: The stigmata sounds badass. I think the move action sounds like a better idea, that way it's something that can be more viably busted out in a tight spot. I can't think of a way to flavor it in terms of an organ transfusion though, unless you're thinking a full on double hand trade, which just sounds kinda odd. Maybe... not so much an organ trade, but instead, the Ogre/Hag takes two spikes from a Barbed Devil, says an incantation, and straight up stabs him in the palms.
actually, my idea of a ritual is quite similar. i thought i wrote about it. apparently i haven't. the ogre brings two covered containers, out of them are tubes. he holds a tube from each container, and stabs these at the palms of the Aasimar. at that moment the containers are emitting thuds and thumps, as id something is moving inside. perhaps they might even hear some scream if they hear right. the tube takes out the aasimar's blood, and replaces that with whatever divine creature is within.

what do you think?