View Full Version : [3.5 PrC] Sagacious Defender of The Forge PEACH

2011-03-29, 10:53 AM
I made this PrC a long time ago now, for a specific campaign, I have altered it slightly to make it more accessible & hopefully more balanced. The original campaign used 3 pantheons for good, neutral and evil, and the domains were slightly freer, needing only 1 domain from your god, and the second coming from a list for the pantheon as a whole, so the domain thing may be a mixed bag, depending on which version of them you are using (Creation being an example of one which changes between books). This is my first thread, and my first major posting, but please feel free to pick it apart!

Anywhere it says Craft (any metal working), the intention is for blacksmithing, armoursmithing, weaponsmithing, etc. Any of these are acceptable.

'Never Dally, Know the Trade, Never Tell Them How It's Made.
Trust Your Armour, Be The Blade, Always Focused, Never Swayed' Defender's creed.
Alignment: Any non-chaotic
Base Attack Bonus: +5
Skills: Craft (any metal working) 7 ranks, Craft (Alchemy) 7 ranks, Diplomacy 2 ranks, Knowledge (Religion) 4 ranks, Knowledge (Arcana) 4 ranks
Feats: Weapon Focus (Any hammer or hammer-like weapon), Craft Wondrous Item, Craft Arms And Armour
Special: Ability to cast 3rd level divine spells
Special: Access to Artifice OR Creation OR Forge domain

1 | +0 | +2 | +0 | +2 | High Craft Master's Vow, Insightful Creator (+1), Measured Response (Smite) |
2 | +1 | +3 | +0 | +3 | Erudite Negotiator, Forge Lore | +1 level of existing divine class
3 | +2 | +3 | +1 | +3 | | +1 level of existing divine class
4 | +3 | +4 | +1 | +4 | Insightful Creator (+2), Forge Lore |
5 | +3 | +4 | +1 | +4 | Measured Response (Skill or save) | +1 level of existing divine class
6 | +4 | +5 | +2 | +5 | | +1 level of existing divine class
7 | +5 | +5 | +2 | +5 | Insightful Creator (+3), Forge Lore |
8 | +6 | +6 | +2 | +6 | | +1 level of existing divine class
9 | +6 | +6 | +3 | +6 | Measured Response (Complete) | +1 level of existing divine class
10 | +7 | +7 | +3 | +7 | Insightful Creator (+4), Forge Lore, Summon The Forge | [/table]

Class Skills (4+Int): Appraise, Concentration, Craft, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Heal, Knowledge (Arcana), Knowledge (Architecture & Engineering), Knowledge (Religion), Profession, Spellcraft, Use Magic Device

High Craft Master's Vow
The following are strictures under which the forgers are made to swear before learning the art, which is mystically reinforced.
1) 'The undeserving and undedicated shall never learn the secret arts. They may beat a piece of steel but never shall they learn to stand for the flame.' The Defender gains a +4 bonus on any Will save made to keep the secrets of their order.
2) 'You shall never desecrate or desert a sacred forge.' The Defender gains +2 vs. Fear effects
3) 'When you hear The Call, you shall answer it.' By the end of your life you will have received a divine message detailing a person and an item you must make for them. This is referred to as 'The Call'. Once the message is received it is the sacred duty of any Defender to accomplish the task he is set. Treat this effect as a Geas, except it may not be removed by any means other than completion of the task. Some defenders are called on early in their lives, some very late, but a few die before they ever get the call. Such Defenders are always remembered by the guild and referred to as 'unfortunates'. Once in a very long while, someone may be called more than once in their life, but this is exceptionally rare.

Insightful Creator (Su):
Beginning at first level, the Defender gains a +1 insight bonus to his caster level for the purposes of creating magical items and equipment. This counts towards the requirements for item creation feats and CL for item creation, but nothing else. This bonus increases by a cumulative +1 at levels 4, 7 and 10.

Measured Response (Su):
Beginning at 1st level the Defender may expend one turn/rebuke attempt as a free action to make his next attack a smite attack. He gains his Int modifier as an insight bonus to damage, and an insight bonus to hit equal to his Defender class level.
At 5th level he may expend a turn attempt as a free action to gain his Int modifier as an insight bonus to any one save or skill check instead.
At 9th level, whenever the Defender uses his Measured Response abilities, he gains his Int modifier as an insight bonus to AC, in addition to the ability's normal effect.

Beginning at second level, a Sagacious Defender gains new spells per day on each marked level (and spells known if applicable) as if he had also gained a level in a divine spellcasting class to which he belonged before adding the prestige class level. He does not, however, gain any other benefit a character of that class would have gained. If he had more than one divine spellcasting class before becoming a Sagacious Defender of the Forge, he must decide to which class he adds each level for the purpose of determining spells per day and spells known.

Erudite Negotiator (Ex):
At 2nd level, the Defender has learned to use his cunning where others need force of personality. He may use his Wis modifier instead of Cha for all Diplomacy, Gather Information, Appraise, and Intimidate checks when he is searching for a particular item, material, good, craft-house, guild, etc. A Defender should always be able to find and get his materials for a good price.

Forge Lore (Ex):
At 2nd level, then again at 4th, 7th & 10th, the Defender choses one ability from the list below;
Never dally. When crafting metal or alchemical items, the time required to do so is dramatically reduced. Whenever you spend a day crafting, a successful check result multiplied by the DC gives you progress in sp (instead of cp), likewise a week's crafting is now measured in gp (not sp). Furthermore, the time it takes to create magical items is halved, meaning an item takes 1 day per 2000gp in the item's base price (instead of the normal 1000gp).
Know the trade. For every item creation feat the Defender has, he gains a cumulative +2 insight bonus to all appraise and craft checks.
Never tell them how it's made. Gain the Slippery Mind ability (found on the Rogue's special ability list), the Defender shall not easily give up the secrets of The Forge.
Trust your armour. Whenever the Defender is using a magical shield or armour which he has made, he treats the magical enhancement bonus as being 1 higher than it actually is, and the armour check penalty is reduced by 1. (For example, the Defender is wearing +2 mithral breastplate of freedom, which he made himself. Whilst he wears it, he treats it as +3 instead. If anyone else wears the armour, it is a +2 as normal)
Be the blade. Whenever the Defender is using a magical weapon which he has made, he treats the magical enhancement bonus as being 1 higher than it actually is, and the weapon's threat range increases by 1. (For example, the Defender is wielding a +1 scimitar of speed, which he made himself. Whilst he wields it, he treats it as +2 instead, and the critical threat range becomes 17-20/x2, if anyone else wields the weapon, it is +1 as normal with 18-20/x2 critical). This ability stacks with keen edge or improved critical, but is applied after the doubling takes effect.
Always focused. Learning the secret chemical additions for the forgers fire and within the metals you get to reduce costs of crafting. Whenever you create a magical item which is predominantly metal, the xp & gold costs required to craft it are reduced by 25%.
Never swayed. Bonus item creation feat, you must still meet all the requirements for the feat.
None of these abilities may be taken more than once as they represent the 7 teachings of The Forge, and a lesson can only ever be learned once.

Summon The Forge (Su)
At 10th level, 1/month the Defender may summon an extraplanar forge, clad in perfectly dressed stone walls and ceiling, to any area large enough to house it (30ft by 30ft footprint, 20ft high) which stays in place for precisely 7 days before disappearing, along with any unattended items inside (any creatures inside are left behind with any gear they are carrying). The Defender is always aware of how long he has left, and anything left inside may be retrieved the next time the forge is summoned. The forge has one large sliding front door (locked DC 30 for anyone except the Defender), one small chimney (2 1/2ft square, covered with an alchemically hardened iron grate, hardness 20, 15hp), and everything and anything you could wish for in relation to metalworking (except expensive or rare components like mithral or dragon blood, DM decisions may be required!). As such it bestows a +5 equipment bonus on all Craft checks for predominantly metal items made by the Defender within the forge. Additionally (and probably far more importantly!), the forge comes with it's own Greater Fire Elemental (the heat source in the forge) who, although unable to leave the area of the forge, will defend it to the death from anyone not given permission to enter by the Defender.

2011-03-29, 10:54 AM
RESERVED FOR FLUFF AND GUMPH (If any ever gets requested!)

2011-03-29, 09:44 PM
I like the idea. The domain restriction seems a bit odd for me, but then again, I never played a 3.5 cleric. I wanted to play a smithing dwavern cleric in the next campgain. I'm definatly going to show this to my GM and see if he approves.

2011-03-30, 05:45 AM
Glad you like it. The domain thing is the only real fix from the original version (a few numbers have been changed a little though) and that's mainly because the original required Forge domain only on account of the gods used in the campaign setting. When it came to putting it on here I figured a lot of people wouldn't even know what the Forge domain was as it's a Dragonlance one, so I added Creation and Artifice to increase the chances of a smooth multi-campaign attainability. Alternatively the domain requirement could be changed to worship of an appropriate deity, the only important bit is that the flavour fits.
The whole point in the design was to create a cleric smith prestige who could reliably equip the group with good quality kit. The campaign it was designed for was a very low magic setting, not many spellcasters, and even less in the way of magic items, I think the first +1 anything we saw was at about level 6! To combat the problem, I had a long chat with the DM and he approved the class I'd made. Thing is, I wasn't sure if it would work or be balanced outside of the setting, which is half the reason I posted it here. You'll never get to 9th level spells with this class, but a human cleric with 1 level in fighter can take the first level of this at level 7, anything else will probably require level 9 or 10, depending on whether your DM allows you to buy prerequisite feats on the level you take the PrC or not (i.e. bonus feat @ lvl9 goes into craft arms & armour, so you can take Defender lvl1 @ 9th), some do, some don't. I think the pay-off is reasonable though.
Still not so sure about the capstone ability mind you, I'm tempted to make the forge act like a leomund's secure shelter as well as a forge, but not sure if that makes it too much..? It lasts for a week after all!

2011-04-02, 05:39 AM
Am I to believe there's nothing wrong with this at all then?! If so I'm very happy of course, but I was expecting a little more reaction!

What's all this PEACH business about btw?

2011-04-05, 03:39 PM
I like it, however a few things could potentially use work.

I would probably change the craft skill requirements to something more related to armor and weapon making. Metalworking (blacksmithing?) doesn't cover either of them (otherwise why would we have armorcrafting and weaponsmithing as separate skills? or was this meant as any metal related craft skill?) as it seems to me most of the abilities revolve more around armor and weapons than a fancy door knocker. Also I'd take out the Skill Focus (Craft (Metalworking)) requirement as well, entry requirements are already feat taxing as it is, maybe change the number of Forge Lore's you get from 3 to 4, and change the craft (metalsmithing) in both Always focused and Summon the Forge to just items that are predominantly metal.

As it is I'm already applying for a game using this class and the DM (ShamedShadow) and I have made some changes to fit the game better. The craft skill requirements were changed to any two craft skills (though I think it was left unspoken that they had to be metal related) at 7 ranks apiece and Erudite Negotiator is instead.

Erudite Negotiator (Ex):
At 2nd level, the Defender has learned to use his cunning where others need force of personality. He may use his Wis modifier instead of Cha for all Diplomacy, Gather Information, Appraise, and Intimidate checks when he is searching for a particular item, material, good, craft-house, guild, etc. A Defender should always be able to find and get his materials for a good price.

2011-04-05, 05:27 PM
The metalworking is basically for any metal-based craft, indeed. The reason for the alchemy is the additions needed for the forgers fire are alchemical in nature (fluff must get included soon, will work on that!). I may change ranks too, make them 7 each instead.
I agree with dropping the skill focus tbh, makes sense with the requirements to drop them a little, they're rather steep.
The intention is for ALL bonuses to be for the metalworking, but I shall reword entries to clarify this detail.
Glad you like it, mind if I lift your rewording of Erudite Negotiator? I toyed with including more skills and they make sense to me.

2011-04-05, 07:37 PM
Methinks ShamedShadow wouldn't mind if you took his interpretation of Erudite Negotiator.

2011-04-06, 11:18 AM
I've edited the class now, thought for a while about your (and your DMs!) suggestions and honestly couldn't fault them so, taadaa! The requirements look a little more sensible now! Please, please, please let me know how the class goes for you, I'm very intrigued as to how it will perform outside of my control-freak domain!

Next step, much fluff and gumpf!

....and maybe a feat or two....

....and perhaps an item.