OOTS Villains in 4E

[TsukikoJ]

Hi all,

I'm really interested in creating playable character versions of the main villains from OOTS, specifically Tsukiko and Redcloak. I've seen several threads discussing the specifications of the villains in regards to 3.5E, but can anyone think of an accurate build for the villains in 4E? I'm a fairly new D&D player, so I can use all the suggestions I can get! Thanks for the help!

[SadisticFishing]

For Redcloak, quite simply a Wisdom/Charisma (laser) Cleric would do fine. It won't be totally accurate, but can get very close. A bit more radiant than he is, but that's an edition thing. Can't copy a character exactly into a different universe, eh? Don't do this as a goblin, if possible, especially considering goblins aren't a character race.

For Tsukiko... Wait for Heroes of Shadow, Necromancer. OR try to hybrid Wizard and Invoker (Human is *not* the race for this, but why are you trying to match exactly anyway?) and take as much interesting necrotic and summon-type powers as possible. Take the power Vengeful Dead.

[Mystic Muse]

For Redcloak, quite simply a Wisdom/Charisma (laser) Cleric would do fine. It won't be totally accurate, but can get very close. A bit more radiant than he is, but that's an edition thing. Can't copy a character exactly into a different universe, eh? Don't do this as a goblin, if possible, especially considering goblins aren't a character race.


They're usable, they just aren't as good as most character races since they don't get any support in other books and they wouldn't be particularly good clerics.

[Sarco_Phage]

He'd be equipped with an extremely powerful homebrewed cloak, though. The Red Mantle.

[MReav]

He'd be equipped with an extremely powerful homebrewed cloak, though. The Red Mantle.

It would be an Artifact.

I wonder what Redcloak's Concordance with it would be.

[oswulf]

For Redcloak, quite simply a Wisdom/Charisma (laser) Cleric would do fine. It won't be totally accurate, but can get very close. A bit more radiant than he is, but that's an edition thing. Can't copy a character exactly into a different universe, eh? Don't do this as a goblin, if possible, especially considering goblins aren't a character race.

For Tsukiko... Wait for Heroes of Shadow, Necromancer. OR try to hybrid Wizard and Invoker (Human is *not* the race for this, but why are you trying to match exactly anyway?) and take as much interesting necrotic and summon-type powers as possible. Take the power Vengeful Dead.

The 4.0 monster manual does give rules for PC goblins toward the end. Basically you take that & character class--cleric & go from there.

[TsukikoJ]

Thanks for the advice, guys.

I've purchased way too many of the books for D&D 4E. My biggest disappointment, however, is that they give little to no information on building Evil PCs. Would you suggest I return the 4E books and buy the 3.5? Everything I read suggests that there is way more variety and flexibility in terms of what kind of characters you can create and role play. In 4E, I can't even find spells that are comparable to Redcloak's undead controlling abilities, for example.

[Ancalagon]

Buying 3.5 is not that easy anymore. Check ebay and be prepared to pay 60 or 100 € for a 3.5 PHB or DMG.

[Hazzardevil]

I belive most people use PDF's now. But isn't downloading the pdf's not illegal since wizards don't sell them anymore?

[Morph Bark]

I belive most people use PDF's now. But isn't downloading the pdf's not illegal since wizards don't sell them anymore?

There are sites where you can buy the PDFs.

[SadisticFishing]

The monster races are precisely that - races for building monsters. While technically legal, they are not meant to be played as PC characters. Most DMs, as well as any competitive or "serious" playing, do not allow them.

[Sarco_Phage]

Pathfinder would be much easier to acquire and work with, though their goblins are psychotic little imps rather than the goblinoids of DnD.

[theNater]

I've purchased way too many of the books for D&D 4E. My biggest disappointment, however, is that they give little to no information on building Evil PCs.
To create an Evil character in 4E, create a character as normal, then write Evil in the alignment section of the character sheet. It's that easy!:smallbiggrin:

One difference between 4E and previous editions is that 4E has few, if any, effects that directly interact with alignment. So an Evil character is built just like a Good one; the difference is in behavior, not in power selection.

Would you suggest I return the 4E books and buy the 3.5? Everything I read suggests that there is way more variety and flexibility in terms of what kind of characters you can create and role play.
3.5 is more flexible in terms of mechanical choices for your character, but this comes with a few downsides. One of the big ones is that the flexibility allows for a huge gulf in terms of character power. You can see this in OotS; Vaarsuvius can single-handedly take out a dragon that is a major threat to the rest of the party combined, while Elan is...well, Elan.

A really good DM can deal with this, by arranging appropriate challenges for each character, but it's a lot of work.

In 4E, I can't even find spells that are comparable to Redcloak's undead controlling abilities, for example.
This was actually another thing that was intentionally changed. Both 3.5 and 4E are designed for a small group of PCs to go out and fight monsters. As such, the rules aren't very good at dealing with necromancers, summoners, and other characters who can field a small army. 3.5 just up and let you do it anyway, despite the problems. 4E decided to avoid the problems by avoiding the situation.

That said, 4E does have a few options you might be interested in. Check the cleric powers for things with the Conjuration keyword; those often result in summoning creatures to do your bidding(within strict limits). A little reflavoring can turn them into skeletons and zombies. Familiars and animal companions show up in Arcane Power and Martial Power, respectively; with your DM's help, you may be able to tweak the rules there to come up with one or two constant corpsey companions.

Or if you can wait for a couple of weeks, Heroes of Shadow seems to be coming out on the 19th. It may have some of the options for dealing with undead you are looking for.

[Boogastreehouse]

I've purchased way too many of the books for D&D 4E. My biggest disappointment, however, is that they give little to no information on building Evil PCs. Would you suggest I return the 4E books and buy the 3.5? Everything I read suggests that there is way more variety and flexibility in terms of what kind of characters you can create and role play. In 4E, I can't even find spells that are comparable to Redcloak's undead controlling abilities, for example.

I've played both, and I really feel that 4e is so balanced that it's boring. It has a few improvements over 3e, but after playing in a campaign for over a year, I went back to 3.5. I'm just glad I didn't blow money on the books.

I'm looking into Pathfinder (essentially 3.6) and it looks pretty damn cool.

[Flame of Anor]

Buying 3.5 is not that easy anymore. Check ebay and be prepared to pay 60 or 100 € for a 3.5 PHB or DMG.

Seriously? I'm so glad I got my DMG a while back. (I already had a PHB.)