Continuity timeline mistake?

[King of Nowhere]

I think I found a contraddiction in the timeline of a minor nitpicking event.
In this strip (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0123.html) haley talk about those two gemstones, and she says that she had them since she was 12, and that her mother gave those to her (explicitly in the last panel).
The way she phrase it suggest that her mother gave her the gems in person.
Ok, we an change the interpretation if we wiggle around, and we can also say haley was lying - but that would be a stretch.
But, from this comic (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0772.html), haley's mother died well before haley was 12. She looks like she's somewhere near 5. So haley couldn'pt have received those gems from her mother when she was 12.

No, not that I think this is important in any way, or even that it detracts somehow from the value of the comic. Heck, probably many of you will be perfectly comfortable with thinking that Mia wanted haley to have those gems, but gave them to Ian for safekeeping until haley was grown enough.
But I was suddenly hit by the realization :smalleek:, and couldn't help feel the need to post it.
Which probably means I need some rehabilitation.
On the brigth side, I visit this forum frequently, and I've never seen anyone coming up with this before, so I should get some bonus points or something :smallcool:

[Sarco_Phage]

No, no mistake. The phrasing "they came from my mother's side" simply means that the gems followed the line of descent from her mother's side of the family. There is no indication that her mother gave her the gems personally.

[veti]

The phrasing "these two gemstones (that my mother gave me)", however, is considerably less vague.

Possibly Haley's not lying, but leaving out some important details. Maybe her mother left them in a package with instructions to be opened on her 12th birthday, or something. Or conceivably her mother recovered from her death in 772 and lasted another seven years, although that seems to undermine the drama of that strip somewhat.

[NerfTW]

I'm going with nitpicking. There's no lying, or missing details.

At worst, it's a joke that he didn't remember when making the scene. Although as we haven't seen any explicit twelve year olds in the comic, I wouldn't say definitively that she's five in that scene.

But it's pretty common to say that your mother/father/grandparent/whatever "gave" something to you even when it's being kept by your guardian until you're older. It was still given to you, you just didn't have personal possession of it. Like if it were a house, or a car. Or in this case, a pair of orbs that would be broken by a small child.

[Morquard]

You have to keep something in mind: the world is based on D&D rules.
Age plays not a huge role there, you can be an adult or middle age, or old, or really old so to say. If you're 16 or 34 doesn't matter at all. If you're 35 or 52 is still middle age, etc.

If you look at Ian in the flashbacks (2 years ago) and now, you see that he most likely crossed the barrier into "old" in the meantime and changed considerably.

Equally its possible that ages for children are something like: toddler, child, teenager, and everyone in the "child" category looks about the same age.

[ThePhantasm]

With all the plotlines, civilizations, groups, families, characters, and more that is going on in the Order of the Stick, its actually amazing that Rich keeps it all together and there aren't lots of continuity mistakes. Little ones like this (from early on in the comics) aren't too big a deal methinks.

[Warren Dew]

But, from this comic (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0772.html), haley's mother died well before haley was 12. She looks like she's somewhere near 5. So haley couldn'pt have received those gems from her mother when she was 12.
I think the best excuse is to say that Haley was small for her age at 12.

Good catch, though.

[Chaos rising]

When I first read that comic I took Haley's excuse that she got them from her mother as a quick defensive lie to make it sound like she got them by honest means.

[EmperorSarda]

Or she inherited them from her mother's side. As she said. Her mom could have given them to her through inheritance, getting them at age 12.

[Gift Jeraff]

On the brigth side, I visit this forum frequently, and I've never seen anyone coming up with this before, so I should get some bonus points or something :smallcool:
It was pointed out by several people when #681 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0681.html) came out. :smallwink:

It's a continuity error that's easily handwaved/ignored.

[hobbitkniver]

They aren't important enough for this to be explained, but congrats on noticing this.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

If you look at Ian in the flashbacks (2 years ago) and now, you see that he most likely crossed the barrier into "old" in the meantime and changed considerably.
If Ian’s hair went white prematurely (last panel) (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0758.html), it’s not much of a stretch to think the wrinkles could also be premature. I wouldn’t make any assumptions about his current age category based solely upon his appearance.

Though given his suspicious nature, it does strike me as a strong possibility that Ian was probably old enough when he fathered Haley to indeed have crossed into the Old category with his daughter only being in the mid-twenties. It probably took Mia years to get close enough for him to trust her, let alone start a family. But then that’s speculation. He could have just as easily been less suspicious when younger and fallen in love just as easily as the average young fella, only growing distrustful years later.

[NerfTW]

It's a continuity error that's easily handwaved/ignored.


They aren't important enough for this to be explained, but congrats on noticing this.

It's only a continuity error if you insist on making it one. This isn't hand waving, it's pointing out that saying she's five in that scene is making a big assumption, and even then, "X gave these to me" is a very common phrase in English when referring to inheritances that you don't receive until you're older.

[EmperorSarda]

We also don't know how old she was in those two flash backs. She could have been 10 for all we know.

[nihil8r]

half-celestials might age differently than humans, so who knows what age haley was when her mother died? if that was even her real mother! :sigh:

[Gift Jeraff]

It's only a continuity error if you insist on making it one. This isn't hand waving, it's pointing out that saying she's five in that scene is making a big assumption, and even then, "X gave these to me" is a very common phrase in English when referring to inheritances that you don't receive until you're older.
It's a continuity error in the sense that I think the Giant intended it to mean exactly the way most people read it at first (Did you honestly not imagine Haley's mom actually giving them to her when you first read it?), but, yes, it makes 100% perfect sense if you read it the "fixed" way. Maybe continuity error isn't the correct term.

Then again, the Tarquin/Ian subplot was already planned out in a few strips, so maybe he already did intend to have Mia die when Haley was young at that point.

[Nimrod's Son]

I wouldn’t make any assumptions about his current age category based solely upon his appearance.

Though given his suspicious nature, it does strike me as a strong possibility that Ian was probably old enough when he fathered Haley to indeed have crossed into the Old category with his daughter only being in the mid-twenties.
Haley says here (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0766.html) that he's "over sixty", so he was at least forty when she was born.

So, yeah, we can't use art clues as an accurate way of estimating a character's age. Would anyone have guessed that Ian was at least 55 when we first saw him (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0093.html)?

[Swordpriest]

As an author, I can say that timelines are dang tricky to keep straight. Heck, there's enough doubt about some date in history to make that quite understandable.

I guess I'm in the "continuity error, good job spotting it, but it's no big deal" camp. :smallwink:

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Haley says here (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0766.html) that he's "over sixty", so he was at least forty when she was born.
Ah. Now, that indicates he is in the Old age category.

Good catch.

[snikrept]

When I first read that comic I took Haley's excuse that she got them from her mother as a quick defensive lie to make it sound like she got them by honest means.

Agreed - I had interpreted her parentheses as sort of the equivalent of Gollum's "it came to me on my brithday, so it was my birthday present." Perhaps her mother "gave" them to her at 12 when she looted the family tomb or something.

[King of Nowhere]

You have to keep something in mind: the world is based on D&D rules.
Age plays not a huge role there, you can be an adult or middle age, or old, or really old so to say. If you're 16 or 34 doesn't matter at all. If you're 35 or 52 is still middle age, etc.

If you look at Ian in the flashbacks (2 years ago) and now, you see that he most likely crossed the barrier into "old" in the meantime and changed considerably.

Equally its possible that ages for children are something like: toddler, child, teenager, and everyone in the "child" category looks about the same age.
So people should age instantly at 35 (annd 55, and 70) years? I like that idea. Could make for some good jokes, with a characther making a "ding" sound, getting wrinkles and grey hairs in a moment, and sayinbg "crap, I just advanced another age category" :smalltongue:

Since this world is based on d&d, could be part of how the biology works...

[grimbold]

remember
that strip was fairly early on and not everything was worked out at that point (i think) or at least not the extraneous details (i think)
also the
from my mothers side thing suggests they were not from her mother

[Warren Dew]

When I first read that comic I took Haley's excuse that she got them from her mother as a quick defensive lie to make it sound like she got them by honest means.
That sounds like a reasonable possibility too.


remember
that strip was fairly early on and not everything was worked out at that point (i think) or at least not the extraneous details (i think)
I'm pretty sure the author is on record as saying he had the whole plot line worked out before strip #100.

[Sarco_Phage]

But not minor details. Knowing what will happen is different from knowing the script in each individual episode down to a T.

[Flame of Anor]

Would anyone have guessed that Ian was at least 55 when we first saw him (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0093.html)?

I never noticed the poster for "The Cure Light Wounds" before! :smallbiggrin:

[Swordpriest]

Fifty five in that picture .... dang. :smalleek:

[hamishspence]

If the youngest Ian can be now is 61,

and Haley is 24 here:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0168.html

and therefore about 25 now- then, when she was 15, he would have been 51.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

and therefore about 25 now- then, when she was 15, he would have been 51.
At least 51, anyway. And that’s assuming Haley doesn’t mentally translate
“60 years and three months” to “over 60.”

(( You ninjaed me, hamish. :smalltongue: ))

[hamishspence]

Yes- I was putting it as almost as low as it's possible given haley's statement.

It also puts his minimum age at Haley's birth, as 36 (he might be younger, but only by months).

That said it's entirely possible he was 40 or so- it's just not the minimum possible.

[Nimrod's Son]

If the youngest Ian can be now is 61,

and Haley is 24 here:

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0168.html

and therefore about 25 now- then, when she was 15, he would have been 51.
Erm. Yes. For reasons I can't fully explain, I apparently deducted 25 from 65 instead of from 60. Despite stating his correct age in the same sentence.

Tch. Numbers, eh? :smallredface:

[hamishspence]

Question is, was he Old when haley was a teenager? There's a little grey hair, but that's all.

Old age for humans starts at 53- so if he was (only just) Old when Haley was 15, he'd be only 63 now.

[Jay R]

(Did you honestly not imagine Haley's mom actually giving them to her when you first read it?

To be absolutely truthful, I imagined the same thing Roy, Elan, Belkar & Durkon did.

:redface:

[Shhalahr Windrider]

Question is, was he Old when haley was a teenager? There's a little grey hair, but that's all.

Old age for humans starts at 53- so if he was (only just) Old when Haley was 15, he'd be only 63 now.
So now that we have established that Ian is actually Old now, we have to figure out if he was actually Middle Age or not then to verify if he actually “crossed the barrier” in the past ten years?

Twelve Gods, we’re nerds. :smalltongue: