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BladeTempest
2011-04-05, 11:00 AM
VoidBlade

Fluff
Not all warriors wear heavy armor or are blood thirsty berserker's. Much like Monks, Voidblades prefer to look inwardly and develop their minds, bodies, souls, and skills. Unlike Monks, who fight unarmed or with peasant weapons, a Voidblade has dedicated themselves to the mastery of the blade. Practitioners of this class are proficient and competent with and sword like weapons, but often they pursue the mastery of a single blade at the exclusion of all others.
Adventures: Always seeking to improve their skills and understand more about world by understanding themselves Voidblades tend to adventure for reasons similar to Monks. Voidblades will adventure and attempt an challenge simply for the sake of testing their skills and learn more of their limitations so they may surpass them later. Not all Voidblades are as humble as monks, however, and some adventure to showcase their skills. Some Voidblades are fortunate enough to have had their reputation spread far enough to have been sponsored by a noble as a duelist and elite bodyguard, following where ever their patron's footsteps either publicly or in their shadow.
Characteristics: Some people have a hard time differing a Voidblade from a Monk who happens to use a sword. While a Monk and Voidblade may train in fairly similar ways and have similar personality traits the similarities tend to end there. While monks look inward and bring about mystical abilities and powers fueled by Ki, Voidblades on the other hand look inward to draw out a power they call the Void. The Void is inner calm and focus few other than Voidblades and perhaps Monks can understand. In looking inward and utilizing the Void to teach themselves their skills a Voidblade is capable of inhuman focus, precision, and speed, all characteristics which they use to cut down foes who stand before them.
Alignment: Most Voidblades are of a lawful bent, because of their rigorous training and single minded dedication to mastering the blade and the Void. In areas of good or evil they vary just as wildly as any other class. Chaotic persons lack the discipline to follow the blade, therefore Voidblades may be of any non-chaotic alignment.
Religion: The rigorous training and single minded dedication to perfecting their understanding of the Void leave little room for interest in deities. Like Monks the Voidblade tends to be more spiritual than religious. However, the few Voidblades who do worship a deity tend to warship deities of battle, war, or other deities affiliated with martial skill.
Background: A Voidblade typically learns their skills in one of two ways. The first and most likely is from having been trained by an older more experienced Voidblade. The second is someone training to become a Monk but discovering an aptitude with blades so strong they abandon their Monk training and begin training as a Voidblade. A "hidden" third origin may be in monasteries where blade training as well as unarmed training are taught side by side where no one has more influence in the other. In fact it is in this method the Voidblade training was rumored to have originated.
Races: Humans are the most predominate group of races comprising the Voidblade class, followed closely by half-elves and elves. While the training is theoretically available to any and all in civilized areas few members of the most dominate races become Voidblades. Halfling tribes wander far and wide leaving little time for the training necessary. Dwarves and martially inclined Gnomes find the skills of Voidblades to be useful in certain situations but the whole idea all together to alien for it to have sunk into the culture. Half-Orcs can be trained in the arts but few do preferring either the path of the Barbarian or that of a Fighter.
Other Classes: Because of their connection to the Void and their single minded dedication to the path of the Blade, Voidblades have very little connection with people of other classes other than the Monk. Voidblades see Monks as fellows, in spite of the different path they pursue. Monks tend to view Voidblades with a small amount of reserve. While both classes may follow very similar means to slightly different ends not all Viudblades are as focused as others of their kind and as such must be held at a slight distance.
Role: A Voidblade serves similar roles as a Monk in combat. Voidblades find opportunity in combat strike and retreat. However, Voidblades truly shine in one on one combat, especially in duels where their focus lies. A Voidblade excels in one on one combat where they are either supported by allies or in a duel where all gloves are off and most foes wear as heavy armor as they can afford to protect their bodies from a single well placed blow.

Game Rule Information: A Voidblade has the following game statistics.
Abilities: Charisma is the key skill for several Voidblade class features. Dexterity is important because Voidblades fight without armor. Intelligence gives a Voidblade more skill points and Constitution is as important as it is to any other class. Voidblades tend to weaker than other melee classes with their class features making up for the lack of damage/accuracy.
HD: d8

Class Skills: Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (any) (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (Local) (Int), Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Profession (any) (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), Tumble (Dex), and Use Rope (Str).
Skill Points at First Level: (6 + Int mod) X 4
Skill Points each additional level: 6+ Int mod

Level | BAB | Fort | Reflex | Will | Special | Ac Bonus | Speed Bonus
1 | +1 | +0 | +2 | +0 | Favored Weapon, Path of the Void | +1 | +10 ft
2 | +2 | +0 | +3 | +0 | Lightning Stance, Weapon Technique | +1 |+10 ft
3 | +3 | +1 | +3 | +1 | Evasion, Uncanny Dodge | +1 | +10 ft
4 | +4 | +1 | +4 | +1 | Bonus Feat, Void Draw, Void Cloak, Strength of Void (Magic) | +2 | +20 ft
5 | +5 | +1 | +4 | +1 | Weapon Technique | +2 | +20 ft
6 | +6/+1 | +2 | +5 | +2 | | +2 | +20 ft
7 | +7/+2 | +2 | +5 | +2 | | +3 | +30 ft
8 | +8/+3 | +2 | +6 | +2 | Bonus Feat, Weapon Technique | +3 | +30 ft
9 | +9/+4 | +3 | +6 | +3 | Strenght of Void (Alignment) | +3 | +30 ft
10 | +10/+5 | +3 | +7 | +3 | | +4 | +40 ft
11 | +11/+6/+1 | +3 | +7 | +3 | One Strike Two Cuts, Weapon Technique | +4 | +40 ft
12 | +12/+7/+2 | +4 | +8 | +4 | Bonus Feat, Void Strike | +4 | +40 ft
13 | +13/+8/+3 | +4 | +8 | +4 | Strength of Void (Special Materials) | +5 | +50 ft
14 | +14/+9/+4 | +4 | +9 | +4 | Weapon Technique | +5 | 50 ft
15 | +15/+10/+5 | +5 | +9 | +5 | | +5 | +50 ft
16 | +16/+11/+6/+1 | +5 | +10 | +5 | Bonus Feat | +6 | +60 ft
17 | +17/+12/+7/+2 | +5 | +10 | +5 | Weapon Technique | +6 | +60 ft
18 | +18/+13/+8/+3 | +6 | +11 | +6 | Strength of Void (Supreme) | +6 | +60 ft
19 | +19/+14/+9/+4 | +6 | +11 | +6 | Void Death | +7 | +70 ft
20 | +20/+15/+10/+5 | +6 | +12 | +6 | Bonus Feat, Weapon Technique | +7 | +70 ft


Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A Voidblade is proficient with all simple weapons and Blade class weapons except massive blades (explained in the next section) Voidblades are not proficient in any armor or shields.

Favored Weapon: At first level a Voidblade gains the Weapon focus feat for free with any blade class weapon with which he is proficient in. The weapon he chooses with that feat is then considered his favored weapon. Several of the Voidblades class skills work only while wielding his favored weapon. He must also be wielding his favored weapon when using his many different combat techniques.

Path of the Void: At first level Voidblades have established a personal connection to the Void. This connection affects the Voidblade in several ways. First a Voidblade adds his Charisma bonus to Ac, additionally the Voidblade gets a +1 Void bonus to Ac that increases by one at fourth level and increases by another one every three levels there after. Secondly the training a Voidblade endures increases their speed and agility resulting in an increase in movement speed as indicated on the table above. Lastly because of their training in bring mind, body, and spirit as close to perfection as possible a Voidblade adds his Charisma modifier to all Strength and Dexterity skill checks and ability checks with the exception of Initiative checks..

Lightning Stance: Voidblades learn a special stance that allows them to act faster than normal senses would allow. At second level Voidblades have mastered listening to the Void to "feel" for danger. This class feature allows a Voidblade to add his Charisma modifier to his Initiative rolls as well as his Dexterity modifier. This ability stacks with Improved Initiative feat and does not prevent access to the feat.

Weapon Technique: A Voidblade of second level has established his connection to the Void and gained several mystical abilities from it. However, in order to survive the dangerous world Voidblades have ventured into to test their skills and help themselves to reach perfection they must also learn several techniques. These techniques which have either been passed on from master to student or developed on the fly by an adventuring Voidblade are grouped into several different categories based on the type of weapon they have chosen as their favored weapon. A Void blade can only preform these techniques while they are wielding (or in some cases merely holding) their favored weapon. These techniques are grouped into several styles. The styles are as follows: Battōjutsu, Dual Weapons, Empty Hand, Finesse, Heavy Handed, and Void Focus. The first time a Voidblade gains this class feature he chooses a style and gains the first technique listed. Later when he gains access to another technique he may choose to continue improving the style he has begun learning or he may choose a new style to begin training in should his favored weapon meet the requirements set forth by the individual style. The specifics of the styles and their techniques can be found below.

Evasion: As the Rouge class feature

Uncanny Dodge: As the Rouge class feature.

Bonus Feat: At fourth level and every four levels there after (4th, 8th, 12th, 16th and so on...) a Voidblade gains a bonus feat chosen from the following list:

Combat Reflexes, Combat Expertise, Combat Intuition, Danger Sense, Death Blow, Dodge, Extra Technique*, Improved Critical (Favored Weapon only), Improved Disarm, Improved Feint, Improved Initiative, Improved Trip, Improved Sunder, Improved Unarmed Strike, Mobility, Power Attack, Quick Draw, Toughness, Spring Attack, Stunning Fist, Whirlwind Attack,

* A new feat I just made up.

Void Draw: At fourth level a Voidblade has spent enough time contemplating the Void to learn how to turn drawing his favored weapon into a lethal attack. Whenever a fourth level Voidblade catches an opponent flat-footed if his favored weapon is sheathed he may draw it and attack that opponent as a single standard action. The Voidblade adds 1d8 damage per point of Charisma modifier to his damage roll should the attack succeed.

Void Cloak: When Voidblades move the Void itself moves around and with them to protect them from harm. Whenever a Voidblade of fourth level moves 10 ft or more this class feature grants the Voidblade a 20% miss chance to all attacks targeting him. As a side effect of this ability foes must also make a Spot check against DC (10 + Voidblade levels + Dexterity modifier + 1 per 10 ft moved.) Failure results in the foe losing track of the Voidblade for half an instant as the Voidblades enhanced speed catches them off-guard, denying them their Dexterity bonuses to AC and causing the enemy to be flat-footed. If an enemy is otherwise immune to being flat-footed (such as being in possesion of the Uncanny Dodge class feature) they are still caught flat-footed for the purpose of a Void Draw. Otherwise should the opponent succeed in the Spot check he manages to keep track of the relitive position of the Voidblade but still suffers the 20% miss chance if they target a Voidblade with an attack.

Strength of Void: At fourth level a Voidblade has learned how to infuse more and more raw essence of the Void into his chosen weapon. At fourth level his chosen weapon is treated as magic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. At ninth level while wielding his favored weapon his weapon is treated as if it where aligned as the same alignment as the Voidblade wielding it (with the exception of any neutral components of his alignment. When a true neutral Voidblade gains this ability he may choose any one alignment to align his weapon to). At thirteenth level his weapon is treated as if it where of any one special material of the Voidblade's choice. At eighteenth level it can pierce of DR X/- rounded down.

One Strike Two Cuts: At eleventh level a Voidblade may make two attacks as a standard action rather than one at his option. However, he suffers a -2 penalties to all attacks until the beginning of his next turn.

Void Strike: When a Voidblade gains this class feature at level he has learned how to empower his Void Draw with even more power, and become even more eerily accurate with this deadly skill. The Void Draw now becomes a Void Strike. Any references to one skill also refers to the other. Whenever a Voidblade manages to catch a foe flat-footed he now deals 1d8 + 1 per point of Charisma modifier as bonus damage. Furthermore he need only succeed in a touch attack in order to deal this damage as his Void powers help him to score a leathal blow on the enemy.

Void Death: At nineteenth level whenever a Voidblade would be able to make a Void Strike he may instead choose to make a Void Death attack. First he must succeed on a melee touch attack as per Void Strike. If that attack is successful the target must make a Fortitude save DC = (10 + 1/2 Voidblade levels + Charisma Modifier) or die from the attack. This attack deals structural damage and as such undead and constructs are not immune to the attack, however, they do enjoy a +10 bonus to their saving throw. Failure indicates they are destroyed. Any opponent who succeeds in this saving throw is still subject to bonus damage from Void Strike. A Voidblade may use this ability a number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier.

BladeTempest
2011-04-05, 11:07 AM
* This is an edit of a previous post. If some of the conversation after this point doesn't make sense do not worry this post did not affect any of it :)

Massive Blades*
Weapon name | Category | Damage | Critical | Weight | Cost
Fullblade | Massive, Two-handed | 2d8 | 19-20/X2 | 45 lbs | 100 gp
Grandblade | Massive, Two-handed | 2d8 | 19-20/X2 | 35 lbs | 150 gp
Claymore | Massive, Two-handed | 4d6 | 19-20/X2 | 30 lbs | 100 gp

Weapon descriptions:
Fullblade: Although these weapons come in different shapes and sizes to suit the needs of their wielders these weapons are an uncommon bordering rare sight. The original "FullBlade" was little more than the longsword of some huge creature a group of adventurers brought down. When confronted in battle the barbarian of the group missed with his greatsword and shattered the blade. Without any other weapon he picked up the massive sword and began swinging. Impressed with the havoc it inflicted on the enemy this nameless barbarian began wandering the land carrying this blade, inspiring other warriors to learn how to learn to use the blade.

Grandblade: An improvement on the Fullblade. This weapon is always single edged and has a curve on the back of the blade where it would ordinarily touch the users shoulders, resulting in more room to swing the blade and more momentum built per swing.
Special: Anyone proficient with the blade are able to make maximum room out of the curve on the back of the blade. Proficient users with the Power Attack feat deal +1 damage for every -1 penalty they take on their attack rolls. This additional damage is added after multiplying additional damage for using Power Attack with a Two-handed weapon.

Claymore: The Claymore was once a weapon designed for foot soldiers from a lost kingdom long ago to combat mounted units by slaying both rider and mount. However, the costs of producing the weapon along with the inherent fragility of the weapon. The weapon needed to be wieldable by any man on the field but the resulting blade was too thin and was often easily sundered by the mounted units they where designed to kill. The result is an ancient weapon that only now has any viability because of new methods of weaponsmithing.
Special: When this weapon kills a mount or its rider the user gains an automatic cleave attempt on the other. This cleave attempt does not affect the Cleave feat or its counterpart Great Cleave. Should this cleave attempt succeed the user may continue cleaving under normal rules should the user have the Cleave or Great Cleave feats.
*Obtaining proficiency requires exotic weapon proficiency to wield once/blade.
note: Several additional weapons could be considered massive but for this purpose i am only focusing on blades

Styles:
This section shall be organized like so:
Weapon Style's name: Description
Prerequisites: requisite weapon types

1) The first technique learned by this weapon style.

2) Second technique

3) Third technique

4) Fourth Technique

5) Fifth Technique

Battōjutsu: This weapon style's existence stemmed from perhaps one of the most deadly fighting styles known to have ever graced, it roughly translates to the Art of Quick Draw in common. Because the Void disciplines originated in very close proximity to this lethal fighting style many Voidbladed's also learned the style and eventually incorporated their understanding of the Void into the technique resulting in what it is today for today's Voidblades.
Prerequisite: Any one handed or lighter weapon with a hard sheath.

1) Voidblades fight with their sheath in their off hand almost like another weapon. The sheath uses the same stats as the weapon it was made for with the following exception: the sheath deals one less die of bludgeoning damage for the weapon it was designed to hold. This technique imparts on the Voidblade the Two Weapon Fighting feat

2) Foes who take damage from a Void Draw must make a Fortitude save (DC = 10 +1/2 Voidblade levels + Charisma Modifier) or be Staggered for 1d4 rounds. This condition is impact based (the Voidblade has learned how to channel more kinetic impact from the Void into his Void Draw class feature) and as such it also affects foes who would ordinarily be immune to the condition (typically undead and constructs.) This technique also allows any Voidblade with this technique to retry a missed Void Draw attempt by using their sheath. This retry imparts a -2 penalty on the attack roll.

3) The practitioner gains the Improved Two Weapon Fighting and Two weapon Defense feats. The penalty on the retry of a missed Void Draw are now reduced to -1

4)A Voidblade may now choose to Stun his targets rather than Stagger them using a Void Draw (duration remains 1d4 rounds, normal Stunning rules apply).

5)Weapon sheathes now deal damage appropriate to the weapon they hold. Voidblades gain the Greater Two Weapon Fighting feat. Lastly a Voidblade may make 2 Void Draw attempts on any enemy he catches flat-footed. One for his main weapon and another from his sheath (at no penalty).

Dual Weapons: By practicing with their Favored Weapon in one hand and another (perhaps another copy of their favored weapon such as two shortswords) in their off hand the Voidblade has learned how to fight practically with two weapons.
Prerequisite: Favored Weapon must be One handed or lighter.

1)The Voidblade gains the Two Weapon Fighting and Two weapon Defense Feats. Secondly once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade may lessen the penalties of Two Weapon Fighting by one for 1d3 rounds.

2) The Voidblades Favored Weapon is always considered light for the purpose of Two weapon fighting. Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade may attack an opponent twice when they provoke an attack of opportunity. One from their main hand and once from their off hand.

3) The Voidblade gains the Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Improved Two Weapon Defense, and Two Weapon Rend Feats.

4) Voidblades who deal damage to a foe with both weapons may stun them. After a Voidblade has stopped attacking an enemy they must make a Fortitude save Dc = (10 + 1/2 Voidblade Levels + Charisma mod + 1 for every attack that damaged the foe) or be stunned for 1d3 rounds + 1 round for every attack that dealt damage to the foe

5) The Voidblade gains the Greater Two weapon Fighting Feat. Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade instead gains as many attacks with his off hand as he has with his main hand (including haste but not including the speed weapon property.)

Empty Hand: This style is a misnomer. This weapon style focuses on using the favored weapon in the Voidblades main hand and nothing in the other.
Prerequisite: Favored weapon must be one handed or lighter, and off hand must be empty.

1) The Voidblade gains the Unarmed Strike and Combat Expertise feats. Additionally the Voidblade adds a +1 Deflection modifier to Ac. Once per day per point of Charisma Modifier a Voidblade may make one extra attack each round using his off hand at no penalty.

2) The Voidblade may now ignore the first -1 penalty he takes from the Combat Expertise feat. Secondly his Unarmed damage improves by one die. Lastly his unarmed attacks are also included in the Strength of the Void Class feature.

3) Whenever the Voidbade strikes his foe in combat with his off hand he Staggers that foe unless the succeed on a DC (10 +1/2 Voidblade levels + Charisma Modifier) for 1d4 rounds. This effect is impact based and affects even foes normally immune to the condition (namely constructs and undead.) Secondly once per day per point of charisma modifier a Voidblade may inflict a -2 penalty to an opponents attack rolls, armor class, or damage rolls for 1d6 round unless they succeed a Will save Dc = (10+ 1/2 Voidblade leves + Charisma Mod)

4) The Voidblade may now ignore up to a -3 penalty on attack rolls from the Combat Expertise feat. Combat Expertise is no longer limited to a maximum of -5 to attack rolls +5 to armor class. The penalty he ignores becomes is added to his deflection bonus to ac. Damage from an unarmed strike improves by one die. The Voidblade improves his ability to inhibit his foes. Whenever a Voidblade would inflict a penalty to attack rolls, armor class, or damage rolls the penalty is now a -4 unless the foe makes its will save.

5) The Voidblade may now Stun foes rather than stagger them (normal stunning rules apply). The Voidblades unarmed attack now threatens a critical hit on a natural roll of 19 or better. Lastly a Voidblades unarmed strikes meddles with a foes ability to think. Once per day per point of Charisma Modifier a Voidblade may Confuse a target (as per the spell) for 1d8 rounds unless they succeed on a Will save Dc = (10+ 1/2 Voidblade levels + Charisma modifier.
Finesse: The Finesse style focuses on using light weapons for quick, accurate, stinging attacks. Each attack alone may not deal much damage, but the sheer number of stings a Voidblade can unleash with this style can quickly become overwhelming.
Prerequisite: Favored weapon must be light or a one handed weapon to which the Weapon Finesse feat could apply.

1) The Voidblade gains the Weapon Finesse feat. Additionally he may use his Dexterity modifier rather than his Strength modifier when dealing damage.

2) Whenver the Voidblade takes a full round action to make a full attack he may add one additional attack with his Favored Weapon at his highest base attack bonus at a -2 penalty.

3) A Voidblade may now make a full attack action as part of his charge.

4) Now whenever the Voidblade makes a Full attack he may add 2 attacks to his full attack routine at his highest base attack bonus these extra attacks are made at a -3 penalty. This ability stacks with all abilities above.

5) A Voidblade may now make a full attack after a Void Draw.

Heavy Handed: Most Voidblades take up one handed or lighter weapons and learn how to defeat a foe by using many rapid blows or by using hit and run tactics. There are a few Voidbladeds, however, who have a need to battle using the biggest baddest weapons they can find. These Voidblades are practitioners of the Heavy Handed Style.
Prerequisite: Favored Weapon must be a heavy two handed blade or massive blade.

1) The Voidblade gains the Power Attack and Cleave feats. Additionally the Voidblade deals an extra one point of damage for every die the weapon deals (ex: a greatsword deals 2d6 damage. So a Voidblade with this ability would deal a minimum of 2d6+2 damage.)

2) Whenever a foe is successfully hit by a power attack they must make a fortitude save (Dc = 10 + 1/2 Voidblade Class levels + penalty accepted from power attack) or be Staggered for 1d4 rounds + 1 for every -1 penalty accepted on the attack roll. This effect is impact based and as such affects foes normally immune to this condition (namely constructs and undead.)

3) The Voidblade may now accept a -2 penalty to attack rolls from the Power attack feat to gain a +3 to damage rolls. Gains the Weapon Specialization Feat.

4) A Voidblade may now choose to Stun a foe rather than Stagger them. This ability follows all the rules from the Staggering option above.

5) By infusing the power of the Void into their heavy weapon a Voidblade has unlocked a secret few let out freely. Voidblades now adds 1.5 his Strength bonus on an attack roll, deal double their strength bonus on a damage roll, deal triple damage instead of double with power attack for every penalty accepted, and lastly deal four times their Strength bonus damage on a charge.

Void Focus: Not all Voidblades choose to learn new weapon techniques. Instead some turn even further into themselves to unlock even more power of the Void. These Voidblades are masters in their own rights of the Void.
Prerequisite: Must have access to his Favored Weapon.

1) Once per day per point of Charisma modifier you may add your Charisma bonus to any one save. The use of this action requires no thought and can be used as an immediate action.

2) A Voidblade now may add his Charisma bonus rather than his Constitiution bonus to Hit points gained at each level (this ability is retro active allowing the Voidblade to recalculate Hit Points). A Voidblade still dies if his Constitution score is reduced to zero.

3) Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade with this ability may teleport himself to any distance he can see that is within 5X his movement range as a move action.

4) A Voidblade now adds his Charisma bonus to all melee damage rolls. Additionally his Void Draw now affects all targets within his reach.

5) Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade with this ability may focus the power of the Void into his blade and unleash it in one powerful attack. The Voidblade deals 1d8+1 points of damage per Charisma modifier on any one single melee attack or may unleash this Void energy as a ranged attack with a range of 50 ft.

New Feat(s?)

Extra Technique
Prerequisites: Must have a Favored weapon Technique
Benefit: Anyone who gains this feat may chose an additional Favored weapon Technique.

Favored Weapon Training
Prerequisites: Must be proficient in the weapon, must have weapon focus in the weapon.
Benefit: Choose a single weapon (such as a longsword, greatsword, or dagger) This weapon is now also treated as your favored weapon.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. Each time you must choose a new weapon with which to apply the benefit of this feat to.

Djinn_in_Tonic
2011-04-05, 12:16 PM
also can some one explain the different "tiers" to me? my goal is for this to be a high 2 low 3 if my understanding of the tiers is correct.

The Class Tiers

Tier 1: Capable of doing absolutely everything, often better than classes that specialize in that thing. Often capable of solving encounters with a single mechanical ability and little thought from the player. Has world changing powers at high levels. These guys, if played well, can break a campaign and can be very hard to challenge without extreme DM fiat, especially if Tier 3s and below are in the party.

Tier 2: Has as much raw power as the Tier 1 classes, but can't pull off nearly as many tricks, and while the class itself is capable of anything, no one build can actually do nearly as much as the Tier 1 classes. Still potencially campaign smashers by using the right abilities, but at the same time are more predictable and can't always have the right tool for the job. If the Tier 1 classes are countries with 10,000 nuclear weapons in their arsenal, these guys are countries with 10 nukes. Still dangerous and world shattering, but not in quite so many ways. Note that the Tier 2 classes are often less flexible than Tier 3 classes... it's just that their incredible potential power overwhelms their lack in flexibility.

Tier 3: Capable of doing one thing quite well, while still being useful when that one thing is inappropriate, or capable of doing all things, but not as well as classes that specialize in that area. Occasionally has a mechanical ability that can solve an encounter, but this is relatively rare and easy to deal with. Challenging such a character takes some thought from the DM, but isn't too difficult. Will outshine any Tier 5s in the party much of the time.

Tier 4: Capable of doing one thing quite well, but often useless when encounters require other areas of expertise, or capable of doing many things to a reasonable degree of competance without truly shining. Rarely has any abilities that can outright handle an encounter unless that encounter plays directly to the class's main strength. DMs may sometimes need to work to make sure Tier 4s can contribue to an encounter, as their abilities may sometimes leave them useless. Won't outshine anyone except Tier 6s except in specific circumstances that play to their strengths. Cannot compete effectively with Tier 1s that are played well.

Tier 5: Capable of doing only one thing, and not necessarily all that well, or so unfocused that they have trouble mastering anything, and in many types of encounters the character cannot contribute. In some cases, can do one thing very well, but that one thing is very often not needed. Has trouble shining in any encounter unless the rest of the party is weak in that situation and the encounter matches their strengths. DMs may have to work to avoid the player feeling that their character is worthless unless the entire party is Tier 4 and below. Characters in this tier will often feel like one trick ponies if they do well, or just feel like they have no tricks at all if they build the class poorly.

Tier 6: Not even capable of shining in their own area of expertise. DMs will need to work hard to make encounters that this sort of character can contribute in with their mechanical abilities. Will often feel worthless unless the character is seriously powergamed beyond belief, and even then won't be terribly impressive. Needs to fight enemies of lower than normal CR. Class is often completely unsynergized or with almost no abilities of merit. Avoid allowing PCs to play these characters.

As written, your class falls into Tier 5. It is only good at melee combat, and it's honestly not particularly impressive even at that. It has few options, thrives on small, numerical, linearly scaling bonuses (the weakest and arguably the least interesting type of class features), and cannot compete with classes that provide a number of differing options and features.

For a good example of a Tier 3 fighting class, check out the Tome of Battle classes. The power and variety of those classes is what you'll need to achieve for a tier 2 or high tier 3 melee class.

That said, knowing a bit about why this class is different and unique enough (in your mind) to merit a new base class would really help me, at least, determine what suggestions I can offer. "Master Swordsman" can be done by tons of base classes...what makes this one special, to you?

If you can't answer that, you might be better off making a bunch of swordsman feats. If, however, you DO have an answer...well, then we can work with that. :smallbiggrin:

BladeTempest
2011-05-02, 01:04 AM
I apologize for the potential necromancy here. However, I have just made a huge overhaul to the class. The original idea of the build was a schizophrenic idea that just wouldn't work so i decided to take one aspect of the idea, focus on it and magnify it to make it shine through the gunk. PEACH please. Constructful criticism is welcome but flames are not. I know that the Book of Nine Swords is the pinnacle of powerful "warriors" and i personally loved the book but i wanted to make a class that was just as "potent" as those classes, but have something you didn't need a whole book in order to use... (does that make any sense?)

BladeTempest
2011-05-02, 10:17 AM
That said, knowing a bit about why this class is different and unique enough (in your mind) to merit a new base class would really help me, at least, determine what suggestions I can offer. "Master Swordsman" can be done by tons of base classes...what makes this one special, to you?

If you can't answer that, you might be better off making a bunch of swordsman feats. If, however, you DO have an answer...well, then we can work with that. :smallbiggrin:

Sorry. I never saw your edit. Anyways I wanted to make a base class in this fashion because of all the "melee" combatants none of them screamed what I thought a true blade master (in a fantasy setting) should be.

MY idea of what a true blade master should be is a mobile, unarmored, fast, and skilled melee fighter. These warriors are not ment to be front line soldiers wearing heavy armor fighting in formation in warriors. They are more or less ascetic versions of a fighter in my opinion with a different "bag of tricks"...

i don't know how else to describe them. I think the best way for me to describe my ideal swordsman is to direct you to the Myrmidon class from fire emblem... or point to Kenshin Himura from the Rurouni Kenshin anime.

Morph Bark
2011-05-02, 11:36 AM
I currently have no comments regarding the class, but I just thought I'd tell you that if the creator of a thread in the Homebrew forums posts in the thread after 6 weeks of no new posts, it is not counted as thread necromancy.

BladeTempest
2011-05-02, 11:53 AM
thanks for the tip... ill keep that in mind for later. I have just been so busy with so many other things lately that i have been unable to work on my class. last night i got the sudden urge to finish 10% of the work i had started on... and yes this class is only 10% of a class project i have in the works for one of three campaign settings i am currently in development of. but i look forward to hearing reviews about the class.

BladeTempest
2011-05-02, 03:13 PM
bump because i am impatient and anxious

Prime32
2011-05-02, 04:01 PM
Sorry. I never saw your edit. Anyways I wanted to make a base class in this fashion because of all the "melee" combatants none of them screamed what I thought a true blade master (in a fantasy setting) should be.

MY idea of what a true blade master should be is a mobile, unarmored, fast, and skilled melee fighter. These warriors are not ment to be front line soldiers wearing heavy armor fighting in formation in warriors. They are more or less ascetic versions of a fighter in my opinion with a different "bag of tricks"...

i don't know how else to describe them. I think the best way for me to describe my ideal swordsman is to direct you to the Myrmidon class from fire emblem... or point to Kenshin Himura from the Rurouni Kenshin anime.Sounds like a swordsage, unarmed variant. Maybe trade unarmed strike for Iaijutsu Focus as a class skill.

BladeTempest
2011-05-02, 04:41 PM
i appreciate the comment. i really do... however i am in the middle of preparing for a "homebrew" campaign and the whole idea is to build classes (base classes 1-20) for use, bringing to the table something new and slightly unique. we are playing in a no magic no psionics no Book of nine swords setting. but classes like the monk are still allowed *shrugs shoulders* as it was explained to me the "monks" will one day be the precursor to magic, and it may be happening soon pending on our "progress"/"decisions". I would also wonder how "viable" this class is so far as written.

BladeTempest
2011-05-03, 07:28 PM
just a bump so it stays up front for a few days... after which if i get no replies i will let it die

YouLostMe
2011-05-03, 07:57 PM
Quick Draw, Swift Strike, Void Draw, and Impossible Speed are really the only different abilities of the Swiftblade. All the other abilities provide passive bonuses to attacks or AC or whatever, or just power up Swift Strike and Void Draw.

As such, there's probably one pattern for the class: Run around and full attack... That's really all the class does from 20 levels, which doesn't make it very interesting.

Your idea of a master swordsman brings a few things to mind. Namely, I consider a "mobile" swordsman to be able to move, attack, and then keep moving (so like Ride-By Attack, but not on a horse). Your kind of swordsman sounds like he'd be good at dispatching mooks, so giving the Swiftblade the Whirlwind Attack feat, and then scaling it so he can use the feat as a standard action would be cool.

If you like mobility, I recommend giving him Skirmish damage that isn't precision damage (move at least ten feet, get bonus dice of damage. From the Scout), using some mechanic for parrying, and letting him perform Jump or Tumble checks to avoid AoOs. I'm not sure if the idea behind the class is holding the enemy off or dealing heavy damage, but if you're looking for it to be good at avoiding attacks with less emphasis on stabbing things really hard, I'd recommend getting rid of the "+1 attack, -2 penalty to all attacks" thing, since it's pretty DPS-style.

Elfstone
2011-05-03, 08:04 PM
What system are you playing with no magic no psi.... Not Dnd...

Class is interesting, but I would make the penalty for endless attack lower, because you want at least 4 attacks in, so I would say make it -1 until the fourth, and then -2.

BladeTempest
2011-05-03, 09:47 PM
As such, there's probably one pattern for the class: Run around and full attack... That's really all the class does from 20 levels, which doesn't make it very interesting.

I understand your view point on that. I really just wasn't sure what to do entirely with void strike... but now i have an idea.

part of what i think for this is being a battlefield blur and making it as close to impossible to be hit as possible, as well as being able to take big advantage of hitting flat footed foes... i wanted to add a clause in there that treated him as a rouge of a level equal to their Swiftblade level when dealing with foes who have uncanny dodge. simply so that a Swiftblade could make use of Void Draw.

I also understand where you are coming from on the skirmish dice but i don't really want to borrow features from other classes other than evasion and uncanny dodge.

let me throw a few ideas out

1) changing void strike to the following:

VoidStrike: Whenever you would make a Void Draw treat your Charisma score as if it where 4 points higher.

2) Changing the final ability of Master of the void to add an additional 4 points to a Swiftblades Charisma score for Voidstrike that stacks (total +8)

3) The idea is for the class to be a dps with bursts of big damage when catching an enemy flat-footed. (they are duelists who usually face each other in a quick draw fashion hence void draw. The aim with Void Draw is the first strike should be the last strike. Hence the capstone of Void Death).

4) I didn't want to really clutter the class with too many different class features. But I can see where you would be coming from where doing only one thing would be boring. I was planning on using their skills to spice things up but now that i think about it that really wouldn't do it by itself. What about Timeless body and perfect self? pull some more on the monk influence and use some of those abilities (Monk is just about the only class that i am willing to pull from because it is closest to the "flavor" and "fluff" that i am going for. If this shoots me in the foot badly enough then perhaps i can change my mind.)

5) Giving them a class feature to heal themselves a small amount ala wholeness of body?

what else did i fail to address? im not really good at doing that :D im better off if you give me lists of things you have issues with... i am trying though


What system are you playing with no magic no psi.... Not Dnd...

Class is interesting, but I would make the penalty for endless attack lower, because you want at least 4 attacks in, so I would say make it -1 until the fourth, and then -2.

The idea of the setting is that Magic, psionics, blade magic, etc... are just beginning to emerge. The game itself is going to take place over thousands of years with our characters being the victims of a time flux as we visit different "times" as the uncontrolled magic just picks us up and throws us wherever like a raging river.

and are you serious O.o? i would think that that kind of small penalty would have people rage quitting the game. Granted that does make sense... perhaps i can work it in yet...


@no one in particular: I will take a look at changing some of the stuff around but if anyone has good suggestions for additional abilities or ways other than skirmish (im not trying to recreate the scout) to add that would still be in flavor and stuff i am all ears... maybe that didn't come out the right way but i hope you all understand what i ment

Ziegander
2011-05-04, 02:03 AM
SwiftBlade

Not all warriors wear heavy armor or blood thirsty berserker's. Much like Monks Swiftblades prefer to look inwardly and develop their minds, bodies, souls, and skills. Unlike Monks, who fight unarmed or with peasant weapons, a Swiftblade has dedicated themselves to the mastery of the blade. Practitioners of this class are proficient and competent with and sword like weapons, but often they pursue the mastery of a single blade at the exclusion of all others.

I'll tell you what I'm sure others here have already told you: this concept seems much more suited as a Prestige Class rather than a class. What you have is a very narrow concept, a character whose mastery of a single weapon grants them special bonuses and attacks. Base classes are generally meant to be more open-ended to accommodate various different character concepts.

That said, a game with a class system like D&D is well-suited to homebrew designers that want to create a class that offers an exact suite of class features at precisely the levels they want. Some people may cry foul at this class for being too narrow, but there is nothing inherently wrong with it.


Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A Swift blade is proficient with all simple weapons and all martial weapons of the sword class (any weapon with sword in its name as well as the katana, scimitar, falchion, and rapier.) Swiftblades are not proficient in any armor or shields.

Would be more quickly and easily written like this:

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A Swiftblade is proficient with all simple weapons and all weapons from the Heavy Blades and Light Blades weapon groups (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/buildingCharacters/weaponGroupFeats.htm#weaponGroupHeavyBlades). Swiftblades are not proficient with armors of shields.


Favored Weapon: Swiftblades are famous for choosing a single weapon and practicing endlessly with it. While wielding their Favored weapon a Swiftblade enjoys a +1 to attack, damage, and opposed rolls to avoid being disarmed. These bonuses increase by one at fifth level and again at tenth level and every five levels thereafter (5th +2, 10th +3, 15th +4, 20th +5... and so on). Additionally Swiftblades enjoy other various benefits from other class features indicated in their individual entries. Furthermore a Swiftblade cannot benefit from his other class features should he be encumbered in a similar manner.

Frankly, these bonuses are not only insignificant, but they are boring. It has long been known that melee classes do not need higher numbers to be effective, but rather they need better action options.

To this end, I would recommend gutting this feature entirely and replacing it with a list of interesting and unique actions available to the Swiftblade depending on a single chosen weapon.

Think of maneuvers and stances here, think of video games, think of movies. Melee characters need their actions to be more than, "I roll an attack and deal 1d8+20 damage."


First Steps: At first level a Swiftblade has begun his training in earnest and has learned to move swiftly and dodge blows that may have otherwise landed true. The Swiftblade may add his Charisma modifier to his armor class as a deflection modifier and gains a +1 dodge bonus to Armor Class. Additionally he gains a +10 ft bonus to movement speed. The dodge bonus and increase to speed increase by one at fourth level and every three levels thereafter (4th +2/+20, 7th +3/+30, 10th +4/+40... and so on). Swiftblades do not gain these bonuses when wearing any armor or carrying a shield. Swiftblades also lose these bonuses whenevery they are carrying a medium or heavy load.

The fluff on this feature is awkward, but that's not why I'm here. Be careful with this as a Sorcerer dip. Cha+1 to AC at 1st level + 10ft of free movement is very tasty, almost better than a Paladin 2 dip.

The mechanics, like the fluff, are a bit hit and miss. Charisma modifier to AC suggests either intimidation or charm causing foes to think again about attacking the Swiftblade, but Cha as a deflection modifier, which can block touch attacks, suggests almost a force of will type, personal supernatural protection. But then we move from that idea and in the same feature that gives us an Intimidating or Charming or Supernaturally Willed Swiftblade, we also get a nimble and fast Swiftblade.

This feature is something of a necessary evil. The AC bonus is necessary as this is a melee class which wears no armor, so without it the Swiftblade couldn't survive. I want this feature to somehow strongly tie into the concept of the Swiftblade's Void connection. Rather than First Steps, let us see something like Void Steps. Rather than a speed bonus, let us see something like concealment from moving more than 10ft. Maybe as he gains levels he can pass through occupied squares, phase through solid objects, teleport, or even pass into the ethereal or astral planes.


Quick Draw: At second level a Swiftblade is considered to have the Quick Draw feat for the purpose of drawing his favored weapon. Later at fifth level when he gains the Iai Draw ability he may apply this ability to any weapon he may carry.

Favored Finesse: A second level Swiftblade may apply his Dexterity modifier to attack rolls with his favored weapon as if he had the Weapon Finesse feat, even if his favored weapon would not normally be able to have the Weapon Finesse feat applied to it.

These are feats that I pretend don't exist that's how weak and pointless they are. But you do hand them out in addition to another class feature, so it's not so bad.


Lightning Stance: Swiftblades learn a special stance that allows them to act faster than normal senses would allow. At second level Swiftblades have mastered listening to the Void to "feel" for danger. This class feature allows a Swiftblade to add his Charisma modifier to his Initiative rolls as well as his Dexterity modifier. This ability stacks with Improved Initiative feat and does not prevent access to the feat.

Not too shabby.


Focused Acrobatics and Athletics: Swiftblades are much more agile and physically capable than their physical appearance lets on. At third level Swiftblades have learned how to apply lessons they have learned from meditation and contemplation of the Void to their physical skills. A Swiftblade may add his Charisma modifier as a competence bonus to the following skills: Balance, Climb, Escape Artist, Jump, Swim, and Tumble.

Similar to, but weaker than, a Factotum's Brains Over Brawn feature. I like it, but you might as well go whole hog like the Factotum and just say that he adds his Cha mod to all Str and Dex based skill checks. Note: that would apply to Initiative checks.


Void Draw: At fifth level a Swiftblade has spent enough time contemplating the Void to learn how to turn drawing his favored weapon into a lethal attack. Whenever a fifth level Swiftblade catches an opponent flat-footed if his blade his sheathed he may draw his chosen weapon and attack that opponent as a single standard action. The Swiftblade may add +1d8 damage/ Charisma mod to his damage roll should the attack succeed. Also as noted earlier a Swiftblade may now use his Quick Draw feat to draw any weapon he may be carrying.

Flick of the Wrist meets Iaijutsu Master. Interesting and powerful. Be sure to clarify that it deals "an additional 1d8 damage per point of Charisma modifier" to the damage roll.


Uncanny Dodge: As the Rouge class feature.

No uncanny dodge until 6th level?? No Improved Uncanny Dodge at all??

Note: I have been known to hand out both Uncanny and Improved Uncanny Dodge as a single class feature to highly competent melee warriors as early as 3rd level. I'd consider that this class seems competent enough to join those ranks.


Improbable Speed: When experienced Swiftblades move the eyes of mortals have a difficult time keeping up. At seventh level whenever a Swiftblade moves at least 10 ft in a round opponents suffer a 20% miss chance to attacks targeting the Swiftblade unless they succeed a spot check with a DC = (10 + 1/2 Swiftblade level + Dex mod + Movement rate/10). For example Alexander an eighth level Swiftblade with a Dexterity modifier of +3 and movement speed of 60 ft is attacked by a group of bandits. Whenever Alexander moves at least 10 ft each round the bandits must succeed on a DC 23 (10 + 4 + 3 +6) Spot check to make out his movements or suffer a 20% miss chance to any attacks targeting him.

Ahhh, so here is the ability I was looking for earlier. I think I see what's going on here. I think you'd have a better class in the Swiftblade by naming it the Voidblade instead and focusing all of the fluff, all of the class features, and the whole class itself around the concept of drawing out this supernatural Void and using one's body and melee weapons to channel its power. Instead we have the Swiftblade that is halfway really fast and halfway really into the Void stuff. I want boiling hot or freezing cold rather than lukewarm.


Void Blade: At tenth level Swiftblades have learned how to channel even more of the Void into their attacks. Swiftblades of this level may now add their Charisma modifier to damage rolls while wielding their Favored Weapon.

At a later level and with a weaker ability score than a Swashbuckler's Insightful Strike, but still a welcome bonus. Just remember, at this level you are competing with monsters that can do things like Enslave thralls, teleport at-will, and or hurl boulders like siege engines.


Void Strike: At eleventh level the Void Draw class feature becomes a Void Strike. A Void Strike is executed in much of the same way as a Void Draw only now he may make a full attack after drawing his weapon. The first strike of a Void Strike deals normal Void Draw damage and each additional attack after the first deals two less d8 damage from the original. For example after reaching eleventh level in the class Alexander manages to catch his opponent in a duel off guard. He has a +4 Charisma modifier and deals his normal weapon damage +4d8 on the initial strike of his Void Strike, his second Void Strike gains only a +2d8 (two less die than the previous strike), and his third and final strike gains no bonus to damage because he has no more additional dice to damage after subtracting 2 from his most recent attack.

A fine class feature, and in line with monsters' out of nowhere exponential increase in hit points.


One Strike Two Cuts: At fourteenth level a Swiftblade may make two attacks as a standard action rather than one at his option. However, he suffers a -2 penalties to all attacks until the beginning of his next turn.

This isn't bad. I want to say it's a bit late, but it might be okay. I'd have rather seen this at 11th level, but probably no earlier than that. Not because it would be too powerful earlier (the Warblade can attack twice as a standard action as early as 1st level), but just because I like the tension it creates between using a standard action to get two attacks at -2 or using a full round action to get three attacks at full BAB.


Master of the void: By Seventeenth level a Swiftblade has truly earned the title Master of the Void. Having spent most of his adventuring life meditating and contemplating the Void Swiftblades of this level have begun unraveling the greatest powers of the void. Whenever a Swiftblade makes a Void Draw or Void Strike attack he only needs to succeed on a melee touch attack to deal damage from those class features. Additionally he adds his Charisma modifier to each bonus d8 to damage he receives from those class features. Lastly bonus damage from subsequent attacks from the Void Strike class feature now only lose 1d8 from the previous attack.

You lose me here. Even without the confusing touch attack bit the extra damage here just seems entirely unnecessary. Yes, monsters enjoy another exponential HP boost in these levels, but we're talking about potentially dealing 100+ damage just from your Charisma modifier alone and that's on a single attack and before rolling weapon damage or Void Draw dice or even strength bonus or power attack. ****, I also forgot that this is a standard action full attack because of Void Strike. Holy. Moly.

A 17th level PC with Cha 26 (Starting 16 +7 Inherent (4 from levels, 3 from Tome of Leadership & Influence), +3 Enhancement from item) has a modifier of +8. This grants him 8d8 additional damage dice when he uses Void Draw. Through this class feature a Void Draw would deal 8d8+64 damage on top of whatever his weapon normally deals, his strength modifier, any power attack or additional bonuses, oh, and +8 more from his Charisma modifier again because of his Void Blade feature. So let's say he's got Str 14 and he's using a +1 Longsword that gives us 9d8+75 damage on his first attack (an average of 115.5), 8d8+67 on his second, 7d8+59 on his third, and 6d8+51 on his fourth. Meanwhile the Warblade is thinking he's pretty cool just using a standard action to add +100 damage to one attack, while you're doing all of this damage with touch attacks (or something, the ability isn't clear).


Endless Assault: When using a full attack action a Swiftblade may choose to forgo his normal number of full attacks and instead instead unleash an Endless Assault. Using an Endless Assault requires to make a single attack against a target as a full round action. If that attack succeeds he may make another attack at a -3 penalty. If that attack succeeds he may make another attack at a -6 penalty. A Swiftblade may continue making attacks taking a -3 penalty for each previously successful strike until he misses at which point his momentum has failed him and he is no longer able to continue attacking.

This is kind of like the Diamond Mind maneuver Avalanche of Blades, but it's worse and the Swiftblade doesn't get it until 5 levels after a Warblade could use it. This would be weaker if it wasn't for the amazing overpowered-ness of the Master of the Void.


Void Death: At nineteenth level whenever a Swiftblade would be able to make a Void Draw attack he may instead choose to make a Void Death attack. First he must succeed on a melee touch attack as per Void Draw (from the Master of the Void class feature). If that attack is successful the target must make a Fortitude save DC = (10 + 1/2 Swiftblade levels + Charisma Modifier + Favored Blade bonus) or die from the attack. This attack deals structural damage and as such undead and constructs are not immune to the attack, however, they do enjoy a +10 bonus to their saving throw. Failure indicates they are destroyed. Any opponent who succeeds in this saving throw is still subject to bonus damage from Void Draw. A Swiftblade may use this ability a number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier.

Since you are almost guaranteed to kill something you hit two or more times with your Master of the Void feature, and since you full attack as standard actions Void Death is really, really unnecessary. They're going to die regardless.

In summation, I think there are cool things happening here, but the problem I'm seeing is that you seem to have taken the Iaijutsu Master, the Monk, and a hint of Swashbuckler, smashed them together and then tried to make it work. The end result is a mix up of speed and compelling supernatural power which often make odd bedfellows, a bunch of minor bonuses here and there, and a LOT of unnecessary damage boosts.

The Void is a really interesting concept that you really should try and do more justice to. I know the concept was touched on with Iaijutsu Master PrC from which you are borrowing it, but this class is neither a Monk nor a Samurai, and it could be so much more than an Iaijutsu Master. I recommend really honing the supernatural angle of this class and not the speedster angle. Of course, the Void could grant the character some supernatural speed boost, but that's not the point. By concentrating on the Void part you enable yourself to design more flavorful features and character options. It also will potentially open the class up to a wider variety of characters. Some characters may draw out supernatural speed from the Void, while others are granted supernatural toughness. The possibilities are many and varied.

BladeTempest
2011-05-04, 08:46 PM
ok folks a slightly large update to the core mechanics of the class... I am missing styles and weapon groups but trust me they will be worth the wait. I basically have the styles and their techniques plotted out but i want some more time to hammer out finesse and the dual weapons groups.

also the styles require a favored weapon of certain types to actually be used. Fear not, however, as most blades (with the exception of Massive Blades) will generally fit into at least 2 categories if not more. there are no other requirements for these styles/techniques just what i have mentioned so far...

I just hope that they will be worth waiting for.

Elfstone
2011-05-04, 09:24 PM
I like it. However suggestions for keeping the dips to a minimum. Add a clause saying they keep this bonus so long as they have at least half their PC levels in the void blade class?

Also, Martial aptitude would be very nice for this class. Makes it be able to change weapons and provides more options. I look forward to seeing the styles.

YouLostMe
2011-05-09, 09:51 PM
... I am missing styles and weapon groups but trust me they will be worth the wait. [...] I just hope that they will be worth waiting for.

I just wanted to point out the irony of that, and I will be awaiting the finished sytles and weapon groups before making my comments!

Ziegander
2011-05-09, 10:03 PM
[...]I will be awaiting the finished sytles and weapon groups before making my comments!

Me too, BT! So get back to work! :smalltongue:

BladeTempest
2011-05-10, 02:47 PM
Finally got it all done to 90% of my satisfaction (cant have 100% satisfaction until i get feedback :))

BladeTempest
2011-05-10, 05:54 PM
a post so everyone knows i have updated... as well as a change in title

BladeTempest
2011-05-11, 06:05 PM
well here i was promised reviews after i got the last stuff posted and im not getting them :smallfrown:

Elfstone
2011-05-11, 07:36 PM
They are pretty good. Empty hand seems pretty bad to me. You should pump it as much as possible. You wanna make them more of a melee boss than a monk.

YouLostMe
2011-05-12, 01:09 AM
well here i was promised reviews after i got the last stuff posted and im not getting them :smallfrown:

Oy, I don't check this website fanatically. I spend time in the outside world as well... and even if I did check daily, this is a total revamp. I'm taking it bit by bit, currently processing those techniques by level. I'll get back to you, I promise.

Ziegander
2011-05-12, 01:31 PM
well here i was promised reviews after i got the last stuff posted and im not getting them :smallfrown:

No worries, I too have a real world life. Two air flights later and now I'm halfway across the country enjoying a well-earned vacation. Don't worry, though, for D&D (and other games) design is very much a part of this vacation. I'll give you a full review, perhaps later today, and if not, sometime in the next coming week.

Ziegander
2011-05-12, 10:51 PM
Path of the Void: At first level Voidblades have established a personal connection to the Void. This connection affects the Voidblade in several ways. First a Voidblade adds his Charisma bonus to Ac, additionally the Voidblade gets a +1 Void bonus to Ac that increases by one at fourth level and increases by another one every three levels there after. Secondly the training a Voidblade endures increases their speed and agility resulting in an increase in movement speed as indicated on the table above. Lastly because of their training in bring mind, body, and spirit as close to perfection as possible a Voidblade adds his Charisma modifier to all Strength and Dexterity skill checks and ability checks with the exception of Initiative checks.

You have made this THE go to Sorcerer dip. 1 single level gets you Cha+1 to AC, Cha to many useful skill and ability checks, and +10 to speed. That is an incredible bunch of benefits that really, really needs to be split up. I recommend moving the Cha to AC to 2nd level, the Cha to Str and Dex checks to 3rd level (and include Initiative checks), and move the Speed bonus to one of the weapon styles (Empty Hand or Finesse make the most sense to me, but Dual Weapons or Void Focus could also work). So... well, that pretty much eliminates the ability altogether from 1st level. Then you can replace it with something new.


Lightning Stance: Voidblades learn a special stance that allows them to act faster than normal senses would allow. At second level Voidblades have mastered listening to the Void to "feel" for danger. This class feature allows a Voidblade to add his Charisma modifier to his Initiative rolls as well as his Dexterity modifier. This ability stacks with Improved Initiative feat and does not prevent access to the feat.

See my comments above.


Weapon Technique: A Voidblade of second level has established his connection to the Void and gained several mystical abilities from it. However, in order to survive the dangerous world Voidblades have ventured into to test their skills and help themselves to reach perfection they must also learn several techniques. These techniques which have either been passed on from master to student or developed on the fly by an adventuring Voidblade are grouped into several different categories based on the type of weapon they have chosen as their favored weapon. A Void blade can only preform these techniques while they are wielding (or in some cases merely holding) their favored weapon. These techniques are grouped into several styles. The styles are as follows: Battōjutsu, Dual Weapons, Empty Hand, Finesse, Heavy Handed, and Void Focus. The first time a Voidblade gains this class feature he chooses a style and gains the first technique listed. Later when he gains access to another technique he may choose to continue improving the style he has begun learning or he may choose a new style to begin training in should his favored weapon meet the requirements set forth by the individual style. The specifics of the styles and their techniques can be found below.

These were all fairly well written and they add a proper touch of power to the class where needed, but my biggest complaint is that so many of the styles boil down to doing the same thing (Stagger/Stun, Stagger/Stun, Stagger/Stun, etc...). I think you really should be diversifying the styles MUCH more than you have. I have more specific comments later. One thing I was unsure of was that in the class table you list 7 instances of Weapon Styles, but each style only has 5 parts. Was this intentionally done so that after mastering one style a player has to start another one? I'd suggest adding two extra parts to each Weapon Style. That way at higher levels the Voidblade can continue to get high level abilities rather than having to start all the way over getting an ability that he could have gotten at 2nd level.


Bonus Feat: At fourth level and every four levels there after (4th, 8th, 12th, 16th and so on...) a Voidblade gains a bonus feat chosen from the following list:

Why not the entire list of Fighter Bonus Feats? I think it would thematically appropriate to include the full list of Fighter Bonus Feats as well as all [Psionic] feats.


Void Draw: At fourth level a Voidblade has spent enough time contemplating the Void to learn how to turn drawing his favored weapon into a lethal attack. Whenever a fourth level Voidblade catches an opponent flat-footed if his favored weapon is sheathed he may draw it and attack that opponent as a single standard action. The Voidblade adds 1d8 damage per point of Charisma modifier to his damage roll should the attack succeed.

Fourth level seems early for this. Maybe move it to 6th level and lower the damage dice to d6s so to make Void Strike more of a boost.


Void Cloak: When Voidblades move the Void itself moves around and with them to protect them from harm. Whenever a Voidblade of fourth level moves 10 ft or more this class feature grants the Voidblade a 20% miss chance to all attacks targeting him. As a side effect of this ability foes must also make a Spot check against DC (10 + Voidblade levels + Dexterity modifier + 1 per 10 ft moved.) Failure results in the foe losing track of the Voidblade for half an instant as the Voidblades enhanced speed catches them off-guard, denying them their Dexterity bonuses to AC and causing the enemy to be flat-footed. If an enemy is otherwise immune to being flat-footed (such as being in possesion of the Uncanny Dodge class feature) they are still caught flat-footed for the purpose of a Void Draw. Otherwise should the opponent succeed in the Spot check he manages to keep track of the relitive position of the Voidblade but still suffers the 20% miss chance if they target a Voidblade with an attack.

Drool. This is wonderful.


Strength of Void: At fourth level a Voidblade has learned how to infuse more and more raw essence of the Void into his chosen weapon. At fourth level his chosen weapon is treated as magic for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction. At ninth level while wielding his favored weapon his weapon is treated as if it where aligned as the same alignment as the Voidblade wielding it (with the exception of any neutral components of his alignment. When a true neutral Voidblade gains this ability he may choose any one alignment to align his weapon to). At thirteenth level his weapon is treated as if it where of any one special material of the Voidblade's choice. At eighteenth level it can pierce of DR X/- rounded down.

This is somewhat odd to see on a class focusing in wielding manufactured weapons, but it also makes some sense. Maybe add that if his weapon is already magical it may be treated as if it possessed the Ghost Touch property?


Void Strike: When a Voidblade gains this class feature at level he has learned how to empower his Void Draw with even more power, and become even more eerily accurate with this deadly skill. The Void Draw now becomes a Void Strike. Any references to one skill also refers to the other. Whenever a Voidblade manages to catch a foe flat-footed he now deals 1d8 + 1 per point of Charisma modifier as bonus damage. Furthermore he need only succeed in a touch attack in order to deal this damage as his Void powers help him to score a leathal blow on the enemy.

So, let's see, 12th level, let's be generous and give him a Cha of 24, resulting in a +7 modifier. With this he can swing with a weapon and deal 7d8+7 on top of normal weapon damage and his attack is a touch attack? Pretty brutal, but reasonable. Power Attack with impunity!


Void Death: At nineteenth level whenever a Voidblade would be able to make a Void Strike he may instead choose to make a Void Death attack. First he must succeed on a melee touch attack as per Void Strike. If that attack is successful the target must make a Fortitude save DC = (10 + 1/2 Voidblade levels + Charisma Modifier) or die from the attack. This attack deals structural damage and as such undead and constructs are not immune to the attack, however, they do enjoy a +10 bonus to their saving throw. Failure indicates they are destroyed. Any opponent who succeeds in this saving throw is still subject to bonus damage from Void Strike. A Voidblade may use this ability a number of times per day equal to his Charisma modifier.

Not bad, not bad. I would eliminate the +10 bonus that undead/constructs get entirely since this is a little too high for such a death attack. At least that gives it extra oomph to make the wait a bit more worthwhile. I like it.


Massive Blades*
Weapon name | Category | Damage | Critical | Weight | Cost
Fullblade | Massive, Two-handed | 2d8 | 19-20/X2 | 45 lbs | 100 gp
Grandblade | Massive, Two-handed | 2d8 | 19-20/X2 | 35 lbs | 150 gp
Claymore | Massive, Two-handed | 4d6 | 19-20/X2 | 30 lbs | 100 gp

Weapon descriptions:
Fullblade: Although these weapons come in different shapes and sizes to suit the needs of their wielders these weapons are an uncommon bordering rare sight. The original "FullBlade" was little more than the longsword of some huge creature a group of adventurers brought down. When confronted in battle the barbarian of the group missed with his greatsword and shattered the blade. Without any other weapon he picked up the massive sword and began swinging. Impressed with the havoc it inflicted on the enemy this nameless barbarian began wandering the land carrying this blade, inspiring other warriors to learn how to learn to use the blade.

Grandblade: An improvement on the Fullblade. This weapon is always single edged and has a curve on the back of the blade where it would ordinarily touch the users shoulders, resulting in more room to swing the blade and more momentum built per swing.
Special: Anyone proficient with the blade are able to make maximum room out of the curve on the back of the blade. Proficient users with the Power Attack feat deal +1 damage for every -1 penalty they take on their attack rolls. This additional damage is added after multiplying additional damage for using Power Attack with a Two-handed weapon.

Claymore: The Claymore was once a weapon designed for foot soldiers from a lost kingdom long ago to combat mounted units by slaying both rider and mount. However, the costs of producing the weapon along with the inherent fragility of the weapon. The weapon needed to be wieldable by any man on the field but the resulting blade was too thin and was often easily sundered by the mounted units they where designed to kill. The result is an ancient weapon that only now has any viability because of new methods of weaponsmithing.
Special: When this weapon kills a mount or its rider the user gains an automatic cleave attempt on the other. This cleave attempt does not affect the Cleave feat or its counterpart Great Cleave. Should this cleave attempt succeed the user may continue cleaving under normal rules should the user have the Cleave or Great Cleave feats.
*Obtaining proficiency requires exotic weapon proficiency to wield once/blade.

I like these. With Grandblades why not just have them grant the Improved Power Attack ability of Frenzied Berserkers? And Claymores could grant Supreme Power Attack in addition to the free (situational) Cleave?


Battōjutsu: This weapon style's existence stemmed from perhaps one of the most deadly fighting styles known to have ever graced, it roughly translates to the Art of Quick Draw in common. Because the Void disciplines originated in very close proximity to this lethal fighting style many Voidbladed's also learned the style and eventually incorporated their understanding of the Void into the technique resulting in what it is today for today's Voidblades.
Prerequisite: Any one handed or lighter weapon with a hard sheath.

1) Voidblades fight with their sheath in their off hand almost like another weapon. The sheath uses the same stats as the weapon it was made for with the following exception: the sheath deals one less die of bludgeoning damage for the weapon it was designed to hold. This technique imparts on the Voidblade the Two Weapon Fighting feat

2) Foes who take damage from a Void Draw must make a Fortitude save (DC = 10 +1/2 Voidblade levels + Charisma Modifier) or be Staggered for 1d4 rounds. This condition is impact based (the Voidblade has learned how to channel more kinetic impact from the Void into his Void Draw class feature) and as such it also affects foes who would ordinarily be immune to the condition (typically undead and constructs.) This technique also allows any Voidblade with this technique to retry a missed Void Draw attempt by using their sheath. This retry imparts a -2 penalty on the attack roll.

3) The practitioner gains the Improved Two Weapon Fighting and Two weapon Defense feats. The penalty on the retry of a missed Void Draw are now reduced to -1

4)A Voidblade may now choose to Stun his targets rather than Stagger them using a Void Draw (duration remains 1d4 rounds, normal Stunning rules apply).

5)Weapon sheathes now deal damage appropriate to the weapon they hold. Voidblades gain the Greater Two Weapon Fighting feat. Lastly a Voidblade may make 2 Void Draw attempts on any enemy he catches flat-footed. One for his main weapon and another from his sheath (at no penalty).

This one is quite good (especially for you to lead off the styles with).


Dual Weapons: By practicing with their Favored Weapon in one hand and another (perhaps another copy of their favored weapon such as two shortswords) in their off hand the Voidblade has learned how to fight practically with two weapons.
Prerequisite: Favored Weapon must be One handed or lighter.

1)The Voidblade gains the Two Weapon Fighting and Two weapon Defense Feats. Secondly once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade may lessen the penalties of Two Weapon Fighting by one for 1d3 rounds.

2) The Voidblades Favored Weapon is always considered light for the purpose of Two weapon fighting. Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade may attack an opponent twice when they provoke an attack of opportunity. One from their main hand and once from their off hand.

This is starting out very nicely. I would suggest making the "attack twice" portion on a standard action rather than on an attack of opportunity. Save the AoO bonus for a later level (like perhaps Style III).


3) The Voidblade gains the Improved Two Weapon Fighting, Improved Two Weapon Defense, and Two Weapon Rend Feats.

You are really devil-may-care about throwing feats around! I like it. :smallsmile: It would be a nice touch to make the extra damage dealt by the Two Weapon Rend feat not only scale appropriately to level (since an extra 2d6 is lame at higher levels) but also deal force damage (or raw void damage or something).


4) Voidblades who deal damage to a foe with both weapons may stun them. After a Voidblade has stopped attacking an enemy they must make a Fortitude save Dc = (10 + 1/2 Voidblade Levels + Charisma mod + 1 for every attack that damaged the foe) or be stunned for 1d3 rounds + 1 round for every attack that dealt damage to the foe

This would be nice in a vacuum, but since so many of the Styles are based around stunning (or staggering and stunning) your foes it all just seems a little boring. Maybe you inflict some kind of bleeding status on your foe with a save DC and degree of severity based on how many times you hit in the round?


5) The Voidblade gains the Greater Two weapon Fighting Feat. Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade instead gains as many attacks with his off hand as he has with his main hand (including haste but not including the speed weapon property.)

This is good, but a little underwhelming compared to other levels. Maybe add just a small thing to spice it up. Like... 1d6 extra force damage per attack or something...


Empty Hand: This style is a misnomer. This weapon style focuses on using the favored weapon in the Voidblades main hand and nothing in the other.
Prerequisite: Favored weapon must be one handed or lighter, and off hand must be empty.

The only unique thing this style gets is a bonus from Combat Expertise and the Confuse thing.


Finesse: The Finesse style focuses on using light weapons for quick, accurate, stinging attacks. Each attack alone may not deal much damage, but the sheer number of stings a Voidblade can unleash with this style can quickly become overwhelming.
Prerequisite: Favored weapon must be light or a one handed weapon to which the Weapon Finesse feat could apply.

This is probably doing enough unique stuff to be a worthy choice, though the fact that it shares flurry of blows with the unarmed style is a little meh.


Heavy Handed: Most Voidblades take up one handed or lighter weapons and learn how to defeat a foe by using many rapid blows or by using hit and run tactics. There are a few Voidbladeds, however, who have a need to battle using the biggest baddest weapons they can find. These Voidblades are practitioners of the Heavy Handed Style.
Prerequisite: Favored Weapon must be a heavy two handed blade or massive blade.

This one reads like all the others before which strikes me as boring at this point.


3) The Voidblade may now accept a -2 penalty to attack rolls from the Power attack feat to gain a +3 to damage rolls. Gains the Weapon Specialization Feat.

Remember that 8th level is the earliest he can get his 3rd Weapon Style and a slight boost to power attack and a 4th level feat aren't exactly level appropriate here.


Void Focus: Not all Voidblades choose to learn new weapon techniques. Instead some turn even further into themselves to unlock even more power of the Void. These Voidblades are masters in their own rights of the Void.
Prerequisite: Must have access to his Favored Weapon.

1) Once per day per point of Charisma modifier you may add your Charisma bonus to any one save. The use of this action requires no thought and can be used as an immediate action.

2) A Voidblade now may add his Charisma bonus rather than his Constitiution bonus to Hit points gained at each level (this ability is retro active allowing the Voidblade to recalculate Hit Points). A Voidblade still dies if his Constitution score is reduced to zero.

3) Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade with this ability may teleport himself to any distance he can see that is within 5X his movement range as a move action.

4) A Voidblade now adds his Charisma bonus to all melee damage rolls. Additionally his Void Draw now affects all targets within his reach.

5) Once per day per point of Charisma modifier a Voidblade with this ability may focus the power of the Void into his blade and unleash it in one powerful attack. The Voidblade deals 1d8+1 points of damage per Charisma modifier on any one single melee attack or may unleash this Void energy as a ranged attack with a range of 50 ft.

Waitaminute, not one of these abilities reference staggering or stunning a target? Nice. A combination of defensive, utility, and offensive features rolled into one style. It's good, but the 5th one is a back lackluster as it just makes a number of attacks per day into Void Draws even if your foe isn't flat-footed (or doubles a Void Draw). I dunno, it's okay, but could maybe do something more special. I really like that you can make a decent ranged attack out of it.

BladeTempest
2011-05-14, 11:46 AM
You have made this THE go to Sorcerer dip.

I know people keep on mentioning this as a dip, and i am deliberately "ignoring" it for awhile for a reason. well i suppose I will announce it anyways. after I am done with this class i am going to start on several other void themed classes. The kicker later with these will be that they may freely multiclass with other "void" classes but if they ever deviate from the void path they instantly lose all their void given abilities as they turn to other sources of power. however, i liked the idea of giving them some potential psionic feats... ill think about incorporating that in there some how...

but still thanks for the responses... i will get to work on those asap and present you all the new styles and such