Sculpt Spell by RAW

[averagejoe]

Because I couldn't figure out how to phrase this as a small number of simple rules questions. Sculpt Spell is a metamagic feat from the Complete Arcane (p.83), for those not in the know. I'm mainly looking for RAW responses on this. What's reasonable or desirable can be figured out by me as the DM, or between me and my DM, whatever the case may be.

If I apply this feat to a spell and use the, "Four 10-foot cubes," option, do those cubes need to be adjacent to one another? Do I actually get four separate cubes, each within the range of the spell?

What happens when you apply this feat to grease or entangle and use the, "Cylinder," "4 10-foot cubes," or, "ball," options with these spells? Say I used the cylinder option, which turns the spell into a 10ft. radius 30ft. high effect. Would this mean that a flying creature less than 30 feet above the effect would have to save or be entangled? With grease, this would obviously affect the ground in a 10 foot radius (provided I put the base of the cylinder on the ground), but would it also grease any people or objects standing in the AoE?

[HalfDragonCube]

Entangle

Transmutation
Level: Drd 1, Plant 1, Rgr 1
Components: V, S, DF
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Long (400 ft. + 40 ft./level)
Area: Plants in a 40-ft.-radius spread
Duration: 1 min./level (D)
Saving Throw: Reflex partial; see text
Spell Resistance: No

Grasses, weeds, bushes, and even trees wrap, twist, and entwine about creatures in the area or those that enter the area, holding them fast and causing them to become entangled. The creature can break free and move half its normal speed by using a full-round action to make a DC 20 Strength check or a DC 20 Escape Artist check. A creature that succeeds on a Reflex save is not entangled but can still move at only half speed through the area. Each round on your turn, the plants once again attempt to entangle all creatures that have avoided or escaped entanglement.
Note: The effects of the spell may be altered somewhat, based on the nature of the entangling plants.

I'm fairly sure spreads go upwards as well as laterally, so Entangle affects creatures flying even in the normal version. Also, there is little point in cylinderifying entangle unless you are in a confined space as it only makes the area smaller.

I'm not too sure whether the cubes should be adjacent or not, but there is nothing saying they should be.

I like the idea of a cone of Grease, as you could steamroller encounters just by drowning everything in front of you.

[person29]

I think one of the main benefits of sculpt spell would be non-adjacent squares...you could shape area blasts to not hit allies that way

[Feldarove]

I don't think the original entangle spell would allow for you to entangle things higher than 5 feet off the ground. I assume all area spells work this way unless they state that they are spherical in nature.

What I believe the clause at the end of the spell description is saying is more something like....

if you are in a 10ft x 10ft hallway and cast entangle...you could entangle the floor, two side walls, and ceiling for 40ft (80ft...bc its radius...my brain hurts from math)...bc the plant would grow out from the floor (maybe just the floor and walls)....

I dont think it means that you can say you pick a 5ftx5ft plot of land and grow a giant living tree to grab rocs out of the sky

[person29]

I don't think the original entangle spell would allow for you to entangle things higher than 5 feet off the ground. I assume all area spells work this way unless they state that they are spherical in nature.

What I believe the clause at the end of the spell description is saying is more something like....

if you are in a 10ft x 10ft hallway and cast entangle...you could entangle the floor, two side walls, and ceiling for 40ft (80ft...bc its radius...my brain hurts from math)...bc the plant would grow out from the floor (maybe just the floor and walls)....

I dont think it means that you can say you pick a 5ftx5ft plot of land and grow a giant living tree to grab rocs out of the sky

but perhaps you could grow that giant tree to grab rocs out of the sky if you used sculpt spell...?

[Feldarove]

I dont believe you could use the feat and entangle to get a flying creature unless the creature is actually in a square you put the new feat'ed entangle. But the creature could easily fly around it.

As a fun dm, i'd probably allow it with the feat. The entangle spell does say "in the area or those that enter the area"....it doesn't specify the creature is on foot.

However I'd like to point out that I was saying....

"I dont think it means that you can say you pick a 5ftx5ft plot of land and grow a giant living tree to grab rocs out of the sky" ....

...as flavor text....the roc(s) get a save, not a grapple check yadayada

[Greenish]

I don't think the original entangle spell would allow for you to entangle things higher than 5 feet off the ground. I assume all area spells work this way unless they state that they are spherical in nature.I find that assumption unfounded. The description on the nature of spread, for example:
A spread spell spreads out like a burst but can turn corners. You select the point of origin, and the spell spreads out a given distance in all directions. Figure the area the spell effect fills by taking into account any turns the spell effect takes.[Emphasis added.]

I see no reason to assume that the shapes described in the magic section are flat unless otherwise noted.

[Feldarove]

After review of some rules and things pointed out by greenish...it appears entangle is awesome.

Spread works just like burst just as pointed out by greenish and according the PHB the default shape of a burst spell is a sphere.

And as the spell states "Grasses, weeds, bushes, and even trees"

basically you are creating a forest in the spherical area (read volume) of the spell?

I would point out though that the spell entangle pointed out by giantitpmudkip has a glaring mistake:

They posted: Note: The effects of the spell may be altered somewhat, based on the nature of the entangling plants.

PHB Reads: Note: The DM may alter the effects of the spell somewhat, based on the nature of the entangling plants.

[Moriato]

And as the spell states "Grasses, weeds, bushes, and even trees"

basically you are creating a forest in the spherical area (read volume) of the spell?


Well, the spell never says that it creates the bushes, trees, etc. But it also never states that the spell requires they be there beforehand. Pretty much every DM I've played with has ruled that there has to be some sort of existing vegetation, that the spell doesn't create any, but RAW is unclear.

[Feldarove]

good point on the creation

[averagejoe]

Well, the spell never says that it creates the bushes, trees, etc. But it also never states that the spell requires they be there beforehand. Pretty much every DM I've played with has ruled that there has to be some sort of existing vegetation, that the spell doesn't create any, but RAW is unclear.

The area of the spell is plants within a 40 ft. radius spread (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/entangle.htm), so by RAW plants must exist there. So, yeah, for volume spell effects, it just affects that volume, but there must already be plants there.

Still not sure on grease, though, and that was kind of the one I was more iffy about anyways.

[Moriato]

The area of the spell is plants within a 40 ft. radius spread (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/entangle.htm), so by RAW plants must exist there. So, yeah, for volume spell effects, it just affects that volume, but there must already be plants there.

Still not sure on grease, though, and that was kind of the one I was more iffy about anyways.

Ah, ok, so no target for the spell if there's no plants.

Well with grease I'd say there's no reason why would couldn't use the cylinder or cubes or whatever. Looking at the spell description:


A grease spell covers a solid surface with a layer of slippery grease

So any solid surface within that cylinder or cube or ball would be covered in grease. It still needs a surface to coat, it wont just create a huge cylinder of grease, at least as far as I can tell. I suppose you could... grease the floor and ceiling at the same time if you have a rogue climbing up the walls or someone using spider climb or some such thing.

[Irreverent Fool]

What happens when you apply this feat to grease or entangle and use the, "Cylinder," "4 10-foot cubes," or, "ball," options with these spells? ...but would it also grease any people or objects standing in the AoE?

Regarding grease, it would not coat each creature in the area. Grease doesn't consider creatures as valid targets. As stated above, if cast as a large area, it would coat all solid surfaces within the area (even if you consider a creature a solid surface, which is a stretch, there's no listed mechanical effect). It has an alternate target, which is "one object", but that bit isn't affected by sculpt spell, so the mechanical effect of coating armor or weapons with it would not apply to armor and weapons within the area of a sculpted grease spell by the RAW.

[No brains]

Cheese time!

You could use a sculpted entangle to make a single blade of grass continually grow through a pillar of effect until it reaches something in the sky!

You can't grease creatures, but you can grease their armor, weapons, components, magic items... hilarity ensues.

[averagejoe]

Regarding grease, it would not coat each creature in the area. Grease doesn't consider creatures as valid targets. As stated above, if cast as a large area, it would coat all solid surfaces within the area (even if you consider a creature a solid surface, which is a stretch, there's no listed mechanical effect). It has an alternate target, which is "one object", but that bit isn't affected by sculpt spell, so the mechanical effect of coating armor or weapons with it would not apply to armor and weapons within the area of a sculpted grease spell by the RAW.

Yeah, you're right. And I was afraid everything was much more complicated than that. :smallredface: Thank you!

[dextercorvia]

One of my favorites was Sculpted Caltrops. It would rain pointy bits. IIRC, creation spells have to be supported, so that wouldn't actually work, but it would be cool.

[HalfDragonCube]

I would point out though that the spell entangle pointed out by giantitpmudkip has a glaring mistake:

They posted: Note: The effects of the spell may be altered somewhat, based on the nature of the entangling plants.

PHB Reads: Note: The DM may alter the effects of the spell somewhat, based on the nature of the entangling plants.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/entangle.htm

I quoted the SRD, not the PHB.:smallannoyed:

There are some small differences in wordings.