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View Full Version : Advice for a first-time Homebrewer?



Immonen
2011-04-14, 06:37 PM
Hello, Playground. I've been lurking for a while, but I've got a few questions that no thread I've found has answered well, and a few ideas that I'd like you to help me with.
Usually I play vanilla 3.5, but I've been organizing a campaign for a few weeks now and I wanted to try something different. Most of the players have also never played before, so I'm trying to streamline a few things. We're also starting at 6th level, and the campaign setting is a low-magic Transylvania.

First off, I'm looking for a substitute for the battle-grid system that doesn't involve measuring tapes or just making marks on graph paper. I have a whiteboard, but it's only 1x1 feet, so using that as WotC would like isn't exactly feasible. The paper grid in the DMG also wouldn't work, as I have no tiles or scenery, and at least one of the players likes to go into stupid mode when something isn't perfectly clear. A few days ago, I saw a post that suggested a front-line/ rearguard/ flank system, and that looked nice. Something similar, maybe?

Secondly, I've changed up Dodge a little bit, so that it's more useful. Anyone who takes it has the option of making a Reflex save against an attack roll, and a success lets the PC take a 5-foot step. I also added a Parry feat, which is similar, but used for weapons/ shields and doesn't need the 5-foot step. Does this sound balanced?

Finally, I'm thinking of allowing the players to retrain a feat once per three levels. Since I had to do the character sheets myself, I want to give them a little room for customization once they get a feel for the game. Again, balanced?

Thanks in advance for any ideas/ criticism.

Mulletmanalive
2011-04-14, 07:14 PM
For the non battle-grid thing, I'd suggest taking a leaf out of the oldschool's book and allowing the character to edge around a target to get a flank once he's engaged them. Charge a Move action for it, should work fine.

Your dodge, i don't know, it's useless against ranged attacks for the most part and won't actually work all that often. Probably not overpowered, possibly next to useless; i'm afraid i like the inclination to run the numbers right now.

Retraining feats isn't going to cause any consternation as long as you make it clear that you can't abandon a feat that's a prerequisite for something else, unless that's your intention. The latter will become a mecha of abuse for power-gamers.

Starting at 6th with new players is asking for trouble with so many abilities all at once. I'd suggest starting out at maybe 3rd, where you have the hit points to survive a couple of mistakes but not too many abilities to get muddled with.

Welknair
2011-04-14, 07:20 PM
1. Not sure exactly what you're looking for. You pretty much use a grid or not (With the latter either being the aforementioned tape measure, or something similar). For quite a while we used a bunch of pencils to make the walls of a dungeon the party was going through which worked out all right. Then we just estimated distances. Not sure if that would work for you though.

2. Give this to any self-respecting Rogue and they can't be hit at all. Depending on how you define the 5-ft step, that could be it's one limiting factor - you need to have room to make the step. In this way, Parry would be even more powerful.

3. When you say "Vanilla", does that mean "Core" or does it mean "No Homebrew"? If it's the latter, there's some decent ideas to be found in Unearthed Arcana, including rules for Retraining feats. But I would advise against simply allowing characters to rechoose feats. It has to be a bit more arduous than that. And no matter what, make sure that's it clear that you may not retrain a feat that is the requirement for another feat, or a prestige class. Otherwise this would be quite abusable for various builds. Then again, since you're making the characters...

Instead of instituting a homerule that allows for the retraining of feats, I'd just say that after their first real benchmark in the adventure (Hopefully around now they've gotten a feel for things) you allow them to edit their character however they please.

Immonen
2011-04-14, 07:37 PM
3. When you say "Vanilla", does that mean "Core" or does it mean "No Homebrew"? ...

By vanilla, I mean core. Generally I've only used homebrew for things that make no sense in the core books. I do have Unearthed Arcana, but it's the first edition AD&D one, so it doesn't have the variant rules.


Your dodge, i don't know, it's useless against ranged attacks for the most part and won't actually work all that often. Probably not overpowered, possibly next to useless; i'm afraid i like the inclination to run the numbers right now.

It would work fine against ranged attacks- those would be attack rolls, after all. And it's not really intended to give any massive benefits (they still need hella dexterity to pull it off), just to give them a shot if they're low on HP and don't mind moving.


2. Give this to any self-respecting Rogue and they can't be hit at all. Depending on how you define the 5-ft step, that could be it's one limiting factor - you need to have room to make the step. In this way, Parry would be even more powerful.

This is true- a high-level Rogue would be untouchable by anything short of magic. I'm not sure if I like this or not. However, the save could be at a penalty, or maybe cost a move action on their next turn. For Parry, it could be an attack action, and possibly cause damage to the PC's weapon.


Retraining feats isn't going to cause any consternation as long as you make it clear that you can't abandon a feat that's a prerequisite for something else, unless that's your intention. The latter will become a Mecca of abuse for power-gamers.


But I would advise against simply allowing characters to rechoose feats. It has to be a bit more arduous than that. ... Then again, since you're making the characters...

Of course, I won't allow them to drop something that's a prerequisite, unless they feel like dropping an entire feat tree/ PrC levels to get one feat. On that same note, I'm ruling that they can't level up in-dungeon. They'll have to go to a town or find a dojo to level up, learn skills, or retrain feats. They are new, as well, so finding loopholes, power gaming, and builds are alien to them; I'm not concerned too much about loopholes. I'm not really making the characters, per se. I drew up the character sheets, but after we begin the game, they have full control and responsibility over them.


Starting at 6th with new players is asking for trouble with so many abilities all at once...

We're playing with the classic party, and I'm restricting spell lists to first-edition AD&D (with a few exceptions for really useful spells). They still don't have very many abilities, with the exception of the archer (fighter), whose feats I tried to keep simplistic.


1. Not sure exactly what you're looking for. You pretty much use a grid or not (With the latter either being the aforementioned tape measure, or something similar). ...

Something more along the lines of Final Fantasy- two lines, one in the front and one in the back, that defined what attacks you could use, who could hit you, and what kind of bonuses you got, possibly allowing a small amount of movement inside a zone to allow for cover use.

Mulletmanalive
2011-04-14, 08:34 PM
unless you're using that 5ft step to relocate behind cover [for +4 AC], into concealment for a miss chance, dropping prone for a +4 AC or shifting range categories, none of which come up much, that version of Dodge won't change anything with concern to ranged attacks.

You haven't said that the attack is negated and ranged attacks target you, not the square you are in, and aren't limited by reach or what-not.

Hence, useless against ranged attacks.

Golden-Esque
2011-04-14, 09:16 PM
When in doubt; scaffold.

Use existing material as a guideline for balance. Always strive to make things as balanced as possible. The best way to think about it is: "is this a choice, or would I always/never pick this as a player?"

Immonen
2011-04-14, 10:36 PM
unless you're using that 5ft step to relocate behind cover [for +4 AC], into concealment for a miss chance, dropping prone for a +4 AC or shifting range categories, none of which come up much, that version of Dodge won't change anything with concern to ranged attacks...


When in doubt; scaffold.

Use existing material as a guideline for balance. Always strive to make things as balanced as possible. The best way to think about it is: "is this a choice, or would I always/never pick this as a player?"

I've given it some thought, and I've decided that the Dodge change is a bad idea, although I still don't like that feat and really do want to make it useful in some way, preferably an RTD of some sort. Open to suggestions.

Dragon Elite
2011-04-14, 10:51 PM
Use your AoO for a dodge bonus to AC? That allows combat reflexes to be more useful. Also, good luck, hope your characters enjoy the campaign!

NichG
2011-04-14, 10:56 PM
I think the Dodge/Parry thing as listed is a way too good for a low prereq feat. It's getting close to the Starmantle/Evasion combo except that you have to hit the enemy's attack roll rather than a fixed DC. Also, compare with Epic Dodge, which lets you just avoid one attack per round, is quite good, and has very difficult prereqs.

If you made it so that you could make a Reflex save to avoid an attack once per round, it would still be quite potent but not as breakable. Against something with 4 attacks a round, for example, its like having up to a 25% miss chance that stacks with other miss chances. That's a pretty good deal for a feat, on par with or better than Improved Toughness, but maybe not as good as Power Attack.

Immonen
2011-04-14, 11:14 PM
I think the Dodge/Parry thing as listed is a way too good for a low prereq feat. It's getting close to the Starmantle/Evasion combo except that you have to hit the enemy's attack roll rather than a fixed DC. Also, compare with Epic Dodge, which lets you just avoid one attack per round, is quite good, and has very difficult prereqs.

If you made it so that you could make a Reflex save to avoid an attack once per round, it would still be quite potent but not as breakable. Against something with 4 attacks a round, for example, its like having up to a 25% miss chance that stacks with other miss chances. That's a pretty good deal for a feat, on par with or better than Improved Toughness, but maybe not as good as Power Attack.

This was actually exactly what I was thinking. One sidestep is nice, except for things with multiple attacks and/or reach. Like I said, we are a mid-level party already, so raising the prerequisites to, say, Dexterity 16 and a base Reflex save of +3 or 4 would be doable.

NichG
2011-04-15, 12:54 AM
A sidestep is potentially more powerful since it also defeats a full attack sequence from someone without reach who has used their own 5ft step already. Of course its no good against reach or ranged attacks, so its a tradeoff.

Maybe make Parry use the sidestep mechanic and Dodge simply avoid the single attack? Of course, then people could take both and avoid two attacks a round...