Quick help on a Crusader refreshing manuevers

[Brock Samson]

So I just started playing a ToB character for the first time, only 1 session in, and I'm level 2. I took Extra Granted Manuever. So I have 3 Granted at the start of an encounter, and 5 in my total granted. So let's say I use a manuever round 1, on my turn round 2 I'll get my 4th manuever granted, then round 3 I'll get my 5th manuever granted. Let's say I've used up 2 manuevers already.

What now? All my manuevers have been granted but I've used two. Can someone just explain this to me simply, because my brain is tired and I think I'm just over-thinking everything. What happens on round 6/7/8/etc...

[McSmack]

It's on page 10. First column.

'If you cannot get a new granted manauver because you don't have any more withheld, you recover all the one's you've used and a new pair of readied ones are given to you.'

So bascially you reshuffle the maneuvers you've used and give yourself two new readied maneuvers in addition to the ones you already have readied. In this case, since you'd only used two, you get those back as readied maneuvers.

I'm assuming if you have less than two maneuvers expending and no withheld maneuvers you simply recover the one you just used.

Of course I've yet to play a ToB character so I could be wrong.

If you haven't yet go to the wizards website and download the cards, I hear it makes things much easier.

[Veyr]

The easiest way to play a Crusader is to use the Maneuver Cards (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20061225a). When you ready your maneuvers, you choose 5 cards, and shuffle them. On your first turn, draw 3. Next turn, draw the next one, third turn, draw the last one. On turn 3, you have all 5 maneuvers available to you. On turn 6, your deck is empty (since you already have all 5 drawn), so you take all five cards, shuffle them, and draw a new 3, just like you did for your first turn. You continue like this until the encounter is over. Every time you shuffle your deck, all of your maneuvers are recovered, so you can use them again.

Using (expending) your maneuvers does not affect this process in any way: this is very important to playing a Crusader. You should always be using maneuvers, because they're automatically cycling and there's no point in saving them.

Here, this might help:
Ready maneuvers: choose 5 cards.
Combat begins: roll initiative. The following are actions taken in the numbered turn:
Shuffle your deck and draw 3 random cards. You have these maneuvers granted, and 2 others withheld.
Draw another card; you now have 4 maneuvers granted, 1 withheld.
Draw another card; you now have 5 maneuvers granted, 0 withheld.
You have no more withheld maneuvers: all of your maneuvers are recovered, and you shuffle all 5 cards and draw a new 3, which are your new granted maneuvers. The other 2 are now withheld.
Draw another card; you now have 4 maneuvers granted, 1 withheld.
Etc.
Combat ends.

Personally, I don't feel that Extra Granted Maneuver is a particularly worth-while feat for a Crusader. It's only really useful if you find yourself using maneuvers faster than they're being granted.

[Brock Samson]

Ok, I think I've got it. But so, whenever I run out of withheld manuevers, the following turn I turn in ALL cards, even those currently in my hand, and reshuffle. So if for some reason you don't use any of your granted manuevers and after a few rounds have all 5 in your hand ready to use, the next round you'd turn them in and just get the automatic 3 granted, right?

[Veyr]

Exactly. And that's why you should always be using maneuvers.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

Personally, I don't feel that Extra Granted Maneuver is a particularly worth-while feat for a Crusader. It's only really useful if you find yourself using maneuvers faster than they're being granted.

I'd argue hard against this stance, as you're very, very likely to have some counters, boost, and other non-standard action maneuvers you'll be blowing through, so making sure you have at least two sets of options at all times is crucial.