interesting planar shepherd thought:

[samster712]

ok so what I don't understand is lets say you are a planar shepherd. you choose the plane of fire as your plane of choice. If you turn yourself into an efreeti and have three free wishes, can't you just wish that you and you're viper companion had the manipulate forms ability, or is that not allowed under the limitations of wish?

If so, then if you happened to be a 'scaled one' like a lizardfolk, you could potentially be a druid pun-pun, correct? seems like it would be pretty darn cool.

or you can just wildshape into a creature that is a scaled one.

on a partially unrelated note...from what i understand a hit die determines the amount of HP a creature has. How does that effect what a druid can wildshape into? I thought wild shape was just determined by the size of the creature?

[Bang!]

If so, then if you happened to be a 'scaled one' like a lizardfolk, you could potentially be a druid pun-pun, correct? seems like it would be pretty darn cool.
...and it comes full circle.
EDIT: Forgot how that thing originally worked.

[TheCoelacanth]

That's not one of the listed "safe" wishes so the DM is free to not fully fulfill your wish.

Also any method that requires you to get to level 14 to become Pun-Pun is extremely sub-par.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Isn't Pun-Pun down to three levels by now?

And you want a decently balanced Eberron druid PrC, go shifter and take the Moonspeaker PrC.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Actually Pun-Pun-inuted can be attained at level 1 with any race you want (Kobold is still a tradition; but not necessary)

[Kuulvheysoon]

Actually Pun-Pun-inuted can be attained at level 1 with any race you want (Kobold is still a tradition; but not necessary)

Clearly I'm behind on the latest cheese. Oh well.

...but seriously? FIRST level god-hood? Daaaaaaaaaaaamn...

[The Rabbler]

Clearly I'm behind on the latest cheese. Oh well.

...but seriously? FIRST level god-hood? Daaaaaaaaaaaamn...

there's a reason people call the candle of invocation broken beyond all belief.

[Dusk Eclipse]

You just need to summon Pazuzu (as per Fiendish Codex 1), and he will grant you 1 wish (be a LG paladin so he won't mess with the the wish, it is written he doesn't do that so Raw).

Wish for a LE candle of invocation and start the wish loop as normal.

[Greenish]

Or start as a Precocious Apprentice wizard/sorcerer with the spell Summon Mirror Mephit (Expedition to Demonweb Pits).

Mirror Mephit gets Simulacrum as an SLA at CL 8.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Or start as a Precocious Apprentice wizard/sorcerer with the spell Summon Mirror Mephit (Expedition to Demonweb Pits).

Mirror Mephit gets Simulacrum as an SLA at CL 8.

Is summon mirror mephit a [summon] or [calling] spell? IIRC Summoned monsters can't use SLA that mimics a spell with an XP cost.

[Hyfigh]

Care to site that rule?

[Dusk Eclipse]

Care to site that rule?

When I get to a proper computer I'll try to look in the SRD.

[TheCoelacanth]

Player's Handbook pg. 173

[Hyfigh]

When I get to a proper computer I'll try to look in the SRD.

Got ya covered.


... A summoned creature cannot use any innate summoning abilities it may have, and it refuses to cast any spells that would cost it XP, or to use any spell-like abilities that would cost XP if they were spells.

[samster712]

Someone please tell me what WotC was thinking when they created planar shepherd!!! I mean seriously, almost any plane you choose there are amazingly overpowered monsters you can become! not to mention the effects of the plane itself which you can bubble in...I mean seriously?? how could Wizards not have seen the extreme brokenness of this class

[Dusk Eclipse]

Someone please tell me what WotC was thinking when they created planar shepherd!!! I mean seriously, almost any plane you choose there are amazingly overpowered monsters you can become! not to mention the effects of the plane itself which you can bubble in...I mean seriously?? how could Wizards not have seen the extreme brokenness of this class

It is pretty accepted (or at least I think it is) that the designer of the Planar Shepher is/was a Druid Fanboy, so he definitely gave so much to the class on purpose. And really WotC editing team is not known for it's thoroughness or their ability to do their job.

For extra Fun, choose Dal Quor as your plane, every damn creature you want, exists on this plane. Yes, even that one. And the time is borked, so for every round it passes on the prime 10 rounds pass on Dal Quor http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/Smileys/default/plotting.gif

[Innis Cabal]

You just need to summon Pazuzu (as per Fiendish Codex 1), and he will grant you 1 wish (be a LG paladin so he won't mess with the the wish, it is written he doesn't do that so Raw).

Wish for a LE candle of invocation and start the wish loop as normal.

This is of course assuming Pazuzu exists in your world or that it operates like that in your world.

[Dusk Eclipse]

This is of course assuming Pazuzu exists in your world or that it operates like that in your world.

. But I agree that houserules and other settings might change how Pazuzu works (or if it even exists) as you say; but RAW he exists and works like that.

[Kuulvheysoon]

Oh yeah. Planar Shepard is 9 different hells type of broken.

Did you see what I did there?

[Seerow]

This is of course assuming Pazuzu exists in your world or that it operates like that in your world.

If you want to go that route, you are also assuming that the Sarruhk exists, and that Manipulate Form works like it does. It also assumes that Ice Assassin can be used to grant Divine Rank, and that Gods aren't going to be aware of what Pun-Pun is capable of and smite him out of existance before he makes the knowledge check necessary to summon the Pazuzu and ascend.

[Dusk Eclipse]

http://files.sharenator.com/fry_see_what_you_did_there_scaled_RE_Blind_kitten-s300x375-88086-580.jpg

[Ungvar]

on a partially unrelated note...from what i understand a hit die determines the amount of HP a creature has. How does that effect what a druid can wildshape into? I thought wild shape was just determined by the size of the creature?

From the SRD:

"The new form’s Hit Dice can’t exceed the character’s druid level."

So, for example, at level 8, Danny Druid gets the ability to wildshape into Large animals. Dire Bears are Large sized, but they also have 12 hit dice, so our druid friend has some leveling to do.

Hit Dice not only determine the number of Hit Points (along w/ Con modifier), HD also determine number of additional feats, ability points and skills. For every three HD an animal has, it gains a feat. More importantly, HD determines Base Attack Bonus and Base Saves for an animal (for all creatures, really). Also, advanced versions (ie, more powerful versions) of creatures have more HD, and can consequently increase in size category.

Generally speaking, more HD = more badass.