Wacky theory. Do not enter!

[Fish]

I called that the green-haired elf was V's opposite from the Linear Guild, based on the observation that there was a kobold in the dungeon with Belkar. (I didn't foresee WHO the green-haired elf was. Nobody did.)

I'm prepared to go one wacky step further and propose an answer to the question, "Where is Durkon's opposite?"

It is Hilgya, disguised as Malack.

You were warned: it is a wacky theory. However, there may be some justification for it:
Malack and Durkon have been really polite and civil, much more so than you'd expect an evil cleric and a good cleric to be. Malack is offering him cake, helping with his spell research, and friending him on Macebook.

[ThePhantasm]

(Cannot reply to this theory as I am currently wiping Coca Cola from my computer screen)

[Morquard]

Which would mean that Tarquin is Nale, because otherwise he'd realise that his long friend Malack is suddenly different.

[Fish]

It's a remote possibility, which I have mentioned before. If Tarquin is really Nale, then the whole wanted poster thing was designed to trap Elan all along.

[Mauve Shirt]

The entire government of the EoB is just the Linear Guild helped by Girard's illusions. :smalltongue:

[Yana]

Or! Or!

This is all an elaborate illusion by Draketooth. The Order has been under the influence of this spell since they reached the gate coordinates while Draketooth judges them. All of the characters that we have met since the Order returned from the desert are actually members of the organization that Girard set up that are somehow part of this illusion.

Edit: Great minds think alike, I guess. Ninjaed by Mauve, though I fleshed my theory out more :smalltongue:

[Fish]

How very Star Trek that would be, and not in a good way. The whole thing was protected by illusion! No, I reckon it's more like a literary theme: the illusion gate has a subplot about trickery, the paladin gate has a subplot about dishonor, etc.

I suppose it's possible, but that suggests that these plot points — Haley's dad, for one, and how Bozzok's plan relates — would still have to be resolved. Maybe if it is all an illusion, the Order isn't the only one trapped in it.

[Morquard]

Yes, I guess if the Tarquin empire was the only thing at stake so to say, then saying "boo, all an illusion" would work.
But there are other things riding on it as well, like Haley's dad. It would be a real bummer if it all turns out to be a lie and he's not really here.

Draketooth might come to the Orders rescue though, having seen them oppose Tarquin or fight the Linear Guild.

But then again, it's probably more likely Xykon turns up, zombifies everyone while turning the place upside down looking for the gate.

[Fish]

Just a thought: if it is all an illusion, with a few real people trapped inside it, it would be the ideal place to leave Tarquin, virtually unknown in the real world, but surrounded by illusionary adoring citizens. Poignant.

But also: if it were all illusionary, Haley's dad becomes crucial. He doesn't believe anything.

[Talvereaux]

I don't like the resolution that everything that's happened in this arc is an illusion.

The "it was a dream" ending is a discredited twist for a reason--it does nothing but let the audience down after exciting them with hopes of things happening in the story. If this whole thing were a complicated network of illusions, it would be effectively not much different from it all being a dream.

Moving back to the central topic, I think for similar reasons, Malack is more likely his own character. I'd note both Zz'dtri and Thog were previously vague entities without any dialog contradicting their personalities before their identities were revealed, and I think that's a good thing. Malack's been built up as a character with individual motives and goals; I don't think I'd be the only one that would be disappointed if he were three ducks in a man costume.

[sims796]

I don't think I'd be the only one that would be disappointed if he were three ducks in a man costume.

Where did this phrase come from, again?

[WeLoveFireballs]

No. Not an entire continent. But I am certain that Draketooth is in the empire of blood right now along with several of his agents. He is definitely some kind of ally to Tarquin. Tarquin certainly has secrets pretaining to Draketooth and likely has a dramatic reveal ready.

[Fish]

The "it was a dream" ending is a discredited twist for a reason--it does nothing but let the audience down after exciting them with hopes of things happening in the story.
This is why I find the whole illusion idea improbable unless, as I said, a bunch of real people are trapped in the illusion along with the Order.* For instance, in addition to the Order, also the Linear Guild, Tarquin, maybe Malack, Ian, and maybe Uncle Geoff are real. Otherwise, you're right: if nothing is real, then no real progress has been made, no plot points have been reached, and so on.

Malack's been built up as a character with individual motives and goals; I don't think I'd be the only one that would be disappointed if he were three ducks in a man costume.
I said it was a wacky theory. I'm having a hard time reconciling the evil lizard cleric of a massive empire being buddy-buddy with a lawful good dwarf cleric he's never met before, and given that my other guesses have been paying off, I'm willing to take the long shot.

*Still and all, it's interesting to reflect how many main characters in this realm get exactly what they wished for, no matter how improbable: Tarquin has his empire, Haley got her hair grown back, Elan got a ride on a dinosaur, and so on. I'm not suggesting it means anything, I'm just observing. The only reason I consider it even remotely possible is Ian, whose character has been constructed on a foundation of mistrust, paranoia, and disbelief. What I want to know is, why? What purpose does that serve the narrative? The answer: disbelief and illusion go hand in hand, under D&D rules.

Is the entire continent an illusion? No. But as someone mentioned upthread, there's a tiny chance that once they reached Girard's coordinates, they never left. Perhaps they've been in an illusion ever since. No, I don't consider this likely, and anyway there's virtually no way to prove it; it's just interesting.

[Red XIV]

You were warned: it is a wacky theory. However, there may be some justification for it:
Malack and Durkon have been really polite and civil, much more so than you'd expect an evil cleric and a good cleric to be. Malack is offering him cake, helping with his spell research, and friending him on Macebook.
None of that seems out of line (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AffablyEvil). People with opposing alignments can be friends, and besides, it's entirely possible that Malack is Neutral rather than Evil. Sure, he's involved in a plot that brings about a lot of deaths, but to a worshiper of the god of death that might not be such a big deal.

[Lateral]

Malack and Durkon have been really polite and civil, much more so than you'd expect an evil cleric and a good cleric to be. Malack is offering him cake, helping with his spell research, and friending him on Macebook.

Malack is offering Durkon... "cake."*
*Shortly after writing this, Lateral was banished to a horrible, hellish otherworld for perpetrating this unspeakable horror of horrors upon his fellow man.

[Morgan Wick]

Nale would be insanely stupid to employ Hilgya again, at least if he knew anything about her true motives or what she did after they marched off to jail.

Oh, wait. This is Nale we're talking about. Never mind.

[Fish]

Who's to say Nale did know anything about Hilgya? She fell away during the fight at the beginning (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0060.html).

[SPoD]

Guys, Malack can be Durkon's designated Linear Guild opposite WITHOUT being Hilgya.

He can just be Durkon's new designated Linear Guild opposite.

[Brahamut]

...Draketooth is in the empire of blood right now along with several of his agents. He is definitely some kind of ally to Tarquin.

No, definitely not.

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0694.html

Draketooth: "...I've never trusted authority figures, be they kings, presidents, or party leaders." If he didn't trust a paladin's rule, he's certainly not going to trust, or work for, a blood-thirsty, homicidal dictator.

[Kislath]

Ah HA! Then that cinches it! That's the last place he'd be, so thusly he is here; This whole town IS the gate's camoflauge.

[King of Nowhere]

All we need to decide is wheter Girard is sabine shapeshifted, or sabine is girard under illuusion. Or both.

Remember, with an illusionist and a shapeshifter around, you can trust no one. Unless that's exactly what they want. In that case, you must trust everybody.

[grimbold]

It's a remote possibility, which I have mentioned before. If Tarquin is really Nale, then the whole wanted poster thing was designed to trap Elan all along.
this would actually make sense
Malack may actually have been another friend of Nale's and is not neccesarily hilgya in disguise
judging by his color scheme he may be sabine however

[gooddragon1]

Or! Or!

This is all an elaborate illusion by Draketooth. The Order has been under the influence of this spell since they reached the gate coordinates while Draketooth judges them. All of the characters that we have met since the Order returned from the desert are actually members of the organization that Girard set up that are somehow part of this illusion.

Edit: Great minds think alike, I guess. Ninjaed by Mauve, though I fleshed my theory out more :smalltongue:

Since when were you under the impression that it wasn't an illusion by Draketooth?

[Fish]

There's no way to prove it's all an illusion, but there are two events that I'll be looking at closely, one which almost certainly will happen, and one of which may happen:

When they dispel the enchantment on Haley, there may be some side effects if the background illusion is affected.

If they're surrounded by illusion, what happens if Elan casts his own illusion?

As I said, I don't buy this idea. By definition, solipsism is hard to spot.

[Wrecan]

I really hope Giant is saving Hilgya for Kraagor's Gate.

[ericgrau]

I think it's Malack disguised as himself, seeing how Hilgya was never loyal to the linear guild in the first place. Nice catch with the kobold, looks like another mirror match is coming. EDIT: Wait, Malack works for Tarquin, why would he even care. I think we need another cleric to enter the scene.

[BlackestOfMages]

but, as malack spent a while explaining to the dwarfmaster, his god's painfully neutral, and I get the impression he is too.

remember, just because it's an 'evil' adventure party, dosen't mean there can't be neutral charachters there, just as you get in a 'good' party:smallbiggrin:

and also, good and evil don't always boild down, in a realistic siuation, to hate each other absolutley. It's a conflict of intrests and methods, but that dosen't mean we can't all be freinds...

also, I doubt it is Hylga, due to the lack of fire, or happy

[Boogastreehouse]

I really like the idea of all this being an illusion; perhaps an epic-level copy of the real world in which the Order might wander around forever.

Watch for "glitch in the Matrix" jokes.

The thing is Girard crafted this illusion long ago. Tarquin, Malek, Ian and who knows who else, might have entered and been trapped for years. They needn't be Girard's allies.

Also anyone could die in here, and it could just turn out to be an illusionary copy of them. I am NOT suggesting that Belkar will escape his doom this way, but he could seem to for a while ("Rock on, self buddy!" "Shut up illusory Belkar."). Also that could be an illusionary Thog, so even if Roy kills him, we might still get more Thog.

If all this is true, then I suspect that Girard is watching the proceedings disguised as the Empress of Blood.

[Absol197]

One thing that makes me doubt this theory: Malack's magic aura is black, while Hilgya's is orange. Magic aura color is the one thing that it seems is very difficult for a spellcaster to hide.

[martianmister]

Guys, Malack can be Durkon's designated Linear Guild opposite WITHOUT being Hilgya.

He can just be Durkon's new designated Linear Guild opposite.

I can't see him as teamed with murderer of his children.

[Arrakiz]

This entire city cannot be a camouflage for the gate for a really simple reason- this would be too dangerous. For one- the explosion of his trap could damage the gate. And if there is a gate and they didn't really left the place but this thing is just an ilusion- then why the act with explainig why there is NO gate here? If there is one and there is an ilusion- he wouldn't have to go through all this. They would be traped enyway. Now- the gate is most definetly NOT there but. But that just might be an ilusion. It would be far safer for Girard to trap the intruders some place FAR away from the reall thing. But right now we are reaching the point where it doesn't matter- bicouse if we assume Girard was able to trap them in a perfect ilusion of a city we might as well just assume that Tarquin is in fact- disguised Girard. Or Haley's father. Or Thog. Bicouse- why not?