Mystic Theurge....worth it with early entry?

[Maho-Tsukai]

Would a combination of, say, wizard/archivist/MT with an early entry trick like say alternate source spell be worth it? True, you would only get 9ths on one side, but if you advanced archivist you could get some wiz/sorc 9ths on your archivist side via domains and while you lose one caster level you get a crapload of spells per-day and easier access to wiz/sorc spells if your GM is stingy with scrolls. So, would such a thing be worth it or is Wiz/Ur-Priest/MT the only viable MT build?

[Dusto]

I played a favored soul/sorc/MT that seemed to work out well. Getting the double bonus from CHA.

[Godskook]

Yes, MT is worth it with early entry.

Although, I suppose it depends on your definition of 'worth it', though. Still not as good as a caster Arcane Hierophant, but now mostly cause of the total lack of class features over 10 levels.

[Maho-Tsukai]

True, but Heirophant requires you be a druid, which in turn requires you to be quite MAD. I'd rather be SAD and lack class features then have class features and suffer that level of MAD. That's just me, though. A fair number of people don't worry about MAD as much as I do so in their case the class features trump the ability to bypass MAD. However, hierophant is strictly better if you have the stats for it. If you don't MT becomes much more appealing.

[HalfDragonCube]

I currently play a low-level Wiz/Arc and love it. It really helps if you need someone in the party with reliable casting and knowledge of magic. Go for it.

Max out Spellcraft, Concentration and as many Knowledge skills as you can. Max Int, Dex and Con are useful if you somehow get hit (unlikely with things like Abrupt Jaunt). Dump all other ability scores. I suppose you already know this, but it is worth saying all the same.

Scribe lots of scrolls, get some item creation feats if you want to churn out magic items cheaply. If you are evil, sacrifice stuff for bonuses. If you are good, get the dragonborn of bahamut template and be a grey elf.

Yeah, tier one classes are awesome. Even more awesome if you have two at once.

[Maho-Tsukai]

Yeah. I'd also love to see how viable an arc/wizard/MT could be as a necromancy. They'd be better then a strait wizard, for sure, but the cleric still may be a tad better. However, if you choose to advance archivist when MT ends(smart idea as an archivist can obtain some high level wiz/sorc spells quite easily due to them being on domain lists while a wizard had no way to obtain high-level cleric or druid spells without extreme cheese/crazy tricks) you could use to contemplative to do that and grab the deathbound domain as one of your bonus domains.

The MAIN allure, though, is the amount of spells you get. Even a DM out to break the caster will have a hard time draining you of spells.

[HalfDragonCube]

Yeah. I'd also love to see how viable an arc/wizard/MT could be as a necromancy. They'd be better then a strait wizard, for sure, but the cleric still may be a tad better. However, if you choose to advance archivist when MT ends(smart idea as an archivist can obtain some high level wiz/sorc spells quite easily due to them being on domain lists while a wizard had no way to obtain high-level cleric or druid spells without extreme cheese/crazy tricks) you could use to contemplative to do that and grab the deathbound domain as one of your bonus domains.

The MAIN allure, though, is the amount of spells you get. Even a DM out to break the caster will have a hard time draining you of spells.

Clr/Dread Necro? MAD, yes. Stylish undead hordes. yes.

[Maho-Tsukai]

Actually, not MAD if you take dynamic priest at 1st level. Sure, your cleric side will have stinky saves, but with that level of MAD one side was going to have bad saves anyway. The only issue is, well, taking 10 lvs of MT means your not getting undead mastery, in which case DN dose nothing special since it's main lure is undead mastery....it's spell list is rather limited and lackluster without undead mastery to back it up so it's not really worth using in MT.

Death Master/Archivist/MT, however, would be loads of fun...and you get rebuke via death master so you can take divine feats if you so wish. Oh, and death master gets animate dead as a LEVEL 2 spell and a nice undead minion(though on a DM-based MT it will be worthless since it scales with class level, not character level or caster level.) Again, archivist would be the better class to ride out to 9ths, as it has a wider selection of them due to the Death Master having it's own spell list and only one spell list.

[HalfDragonCube]

Actually, not MAD if you take dynamic priest at 1st level. Sure, your cleric side will have stinky saves, but with that level of MAD one side was going to have bad saves anyway. The only issue is, well, taking 10 lvs of MT means your not getting undead mastery, in which case DN dose nothing special since it's main lure is undead mastery....it's spell list is rather limited and lackluster without undead mastery to back it up so it's not really worth using in MT.

Death Master/Archivist/MT, however, would be loads of fun...and you get rebuke via death master so you can take divine feats if you so wish. Oh, and death master gets animate dead as a LEVEL 2 spell and a nice undead minion(though on a DM-based MT it will be worthless since it scales with class level, not character level or caster level.) Again, archivist would be the better class to ride out to 9ths, as it has a wider selection of them due to the Death Master having it's own spell list and only one spell list.

You seem to know most of what there is to know about necromancer MTs.

[Maho-Tsukai]

How so? I am not claiming I am totally knowledgeable and there are still some things I may know. I am just saying that without undead mastery the DN's spell list is rather meh for an MT when other, better options exist. If you CAN, however, get Undead Mastery on a DN-based theurge it would be totally awesome, though the only way I see that occurring is using Ur-Priest as your divine side, though. The UPSIDE to a DN-based MT is not having to keep multible spellbooks, which can be a pain.

Another good combination for the would be a cleric/wizard/MT using academic priest to set cleric casting for everything but DCs to int. Focus on int and forget wisdom, as you can just use your wizard side for offensive casting and save your cleric side for undead animation and other no-save spells. Also, you could, as odd as this sounds, take True Necromancer. You would, eventually, get 9ths on one side and 8ths on the other, and while it's not as great as other builds, you WOULD get 9ths on one side by level 20, and in a mid-low OP party you'd not suck. A fun build if your in a group full of low-tier classes.