awesome prestige class for rogue/wizard?

[nihil8r]

hey guys, i'm looking for an awesome prestige class for a 3.5 rogue/wizard. i'm not that impressed with the arcane trickster ... what else is out there? i only have the core books plus "cityscape" but can get anything at the game store. i want to play a sneaky tiefling girl with a sneaky rat familiar who sneaks around doing sneaky stuff. i don't really care about sneak attack or melee damage. i care about spell casting level and rogue skill points. so any ideas? :)

[GoatBoy]

Urban Savant in Cityscape is a good choice. So is Unseen Seer (CMage). Arcane Trickster is decent but you should try and fulfill the spell/sneak attack requirements via other prestige classes instead of entering it as a straight rogue/wizard. Daggerspell Mage (CAdventurer) is a rogue/caster hybrid but is mostly focused on melee combat. Loredelver (Races of Destiny) is good if you have the book available but requires you to be an Illumian, I think.

Here (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20050202a&page=2) is a prestige class which increases casting and sneak attack, but lacks skill points.

If you haven't made the character yet then you might like the base class, the Beguiler (Player's Handbook 2).

There might be more... rogue/caster is a popular combination.

[Darrin]

hey guys, i'm looking for an awesome prestige class for a 3.5 rogue/wizard. i'm not that impressed with the arcane trickster ... what else is out there?

Unseen Seer (Complete Mage) beats the pants off of Arcane Trickster. It's also a nice way to get some ranger/assassin divination spells such as hunter's eye (+1d6 sneak attack damage per 3 caster levels) and sniper's shot (no range limit on sneak attack). Finish off with Spellwarp Sniper (Complete Scoundrel).

[SilverLeaf167]

Many people think that spells such as Grave Strike or Vine Strike would be better to pick with Unseen Seer, as they allow you to apply your SA against normally immune creatures, but their usefulness depends on how much you rely on your Sneak Attack for damage.

[Cog]

Grave Strike or Vine Strike
The disadvantage there is that those two spells don't care about CL for anything except counter/dispells, so wand forms are really cheap for the rare times you'll want them.

[nihil8r]

thanks for the info so far. very interesting. i haven't made the character yet, and i only know one of the other players in the group. however based upon the make up of the group i'm expecting a lollercaust of monty haul shenanigans. the other characters are allegedly going to be:

- human rogue
- unknown tome of battle character
- warforged artificer
- human monk/cleric
- half-dragon ranger
- one still unknown

so ... yeah. i won't need to do melee damage. i'll need versatility and survivability. :)

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

i don't really care about sneak attack or melee damage. i care about spell casting level and rogue skill points. so any ideas? :)

The Beguiler base class in PH2 is perfect for this. It gets six skill points/level, Rogue+Wizard class skills, spontaneous Int-based spellcasting with Sorcerer progression and spells/day, and automatic knowledge of their entire class spell list which includes mostly illusions and enchantments but has enough other spells to have a solution to nearly any situation that could come up. They don't suffer arcane spell failure for light armor, so wear a chain shirt or mithral breastplate and use a mithral buckler and you'll be good. You can even take the feat Obtain Familiar in Complete Arcane to get a familiar, though I'd also get Improved Familiar from the DMG for an Imp or Quasit familiar. It's an extremely fun class to play, but just keep in mind that its Surprise Casting ability is not something you should make a huge effort to enable, or you'll just get frustrated.

Ideally you'll want to go Beguiler 5/ Mindbender 1/ Beguiler 14, mostly so your Advanced Learning class feature will fall on an even-numbered level so you can pick a higher level spell with it. The Telepathy ability is also great, especially if you can get the feat Mindsight from Lords of Madness. Another great trick is to take the feat Versatile Spellcaster in Races of the Dragon, which can give you access to your next higher level of spells two levels earlier. That lets you pick Advanced Learning spells one higher level yet, so if you get Versatile Spellcaster at 1st level you'll be able to pick a 2nd, 5th, 7th, 9th, and 9th level spell at each Advanced Learning. My choices in this case would be Ray of Stupidity, Shadow Form, Greater Shadow Conjuration, Greater Shadow Evocation, and Superior Invisibility, mostly from the Spell Compendium.

[Feytalist]

For versatility, Unseen Seer is not a bad idea. But what about Chameleon?

Although you might want to expand your group's arcane power at this point. In which case, Unseen Seer damages your CL with any school except divination spells.

[FlyingScanian]

For versatility, Unseen Seer is not a bad idea. But what about Chameleon?

Although you might want to expand your group's arcane power at this point. In which case, Unseen Seer damages your CL with any school except divination spells.

Practiced spellcaster: for the cost of a feat (and Complete Arcane), it does not any more...

Also: where can one find Mindbender? This sounds mightily intriguing...

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Also: where can one find Mindbender? This sounds mightily intriguing...

Complete Arcane, handy list so you don't have to ask next time (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/arch/lists).

[Feytalist]

Practiced spellcaster: for the cost of a feat (and Complete Arcane), it does not any more...

That's quite true, and a nice trick which I'd completely forgotten about. It makes the choice even better then.

[jmelesky]

hey guys, i'm looking for an awesome prestige class for a 3.5 rogue/wizard. i'm not that impressed with the arcane trickster

If your DM allows backports from Pathfinder, they made their arcane trickster (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/prestige-classes/arcane-trickster) far less sucky. You still get fewer skill points, but in exchange you get silent/still casting, free action greater invisibility, and sneak attack damage on spells.