[3.5] Sonic Substitution

[Thurbane]

Hey all,

I believe the 3.0 version of Energy Substitution allowed for Sonic as one of the types you could substitute, but was dropped in the 3.5 version.

Just wondering if there are any ways, by RAW, to swap out fire, cold, electricity or acid damage from spells for sonic damage.

The only one I can think of is Elven Spell Lore (since it only specifies an energy type of your choice), but that only applies to one spell.

Cheers - T

[olentu]

The first thing that comes to mind is the archmage using mastery of elements.

[Boci]

It should be noted that the 3.0 energy substitution was +1, so it was balanced. Born three thunders allows you to swap half of the lightening damage for sonic, but also dazes you. On the plus side your enemies must save or be stunned.

[Dusk Eclipse]

It should be noted that the 3.0 energy substitution was +1, so it was balanced. Born three thunders allows you to swap half of the lightening damage for sonic, but also dazes you. On the plus side your enemies must save or be stunned.

You say it like it is difficult to avoid becoming dazed :smalltongue:

(quick recovery from LoM helps a lot)

[Boci]

You say it like it is difficult to avoid becoming dazed :smalltongue:

It kinda is. The dragon mark is arguably the easiest and it costs two feats.


(quick recovery from LoM helps a lot)

Requires a move action and you need to make a save against your own DC.

[Dusk Eclipse]

It kinda is. The dragon mark is arguably the easiest and it costs two feats.



Requires a move action and you need to make a save against your own DC.

..... ok that's what I get for not checking the books before posting.

[GoatBoy]

3.5 SRD Energy Substitution (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resources/systems/pennpaper/dnd35/soveliorsage/divineFeats.html). Sonic is technically allowed.

I once told one of my players that Sonic wasn't included, when it turns out it was. Personally, I wouldn't allow it because Sonic damage is designed to be rarer than normal. I would suggest lowering damage dice by one step (1d8 to 1d6, 1d6 to 1d4, etc).

[Dusk Eclipse]

You did note, those are feats designed for deities right?

[Tvtyrant]

You did note, those are feats designed for deities right?

Except that it doesn't indicate that as a pre-req in any way, that monsters can use player feats and players can use monster feats, and being placed into the divine category doesn't stop none divines any more then placing a feat into the psionic category stops none-psionics. Only the feats' prereqs matter.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Upon further checking I stand corrected.

[Tvtyrant]

I apologize if my wording was too harsh. :smalleek: Rereading the way that I wrote that it was hard worded, and I am sorry.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Oh don't worry, I didn't read it like you were harsh, I just checked the SRD to be sure you were right:smallsmile: I like when I am proven wrong in certain cases, this one being one of them.

[Thurbane]

3.5 SRD Energy Substitution (http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/resources/systems/pennpaper/dnd35/soveliorsage/divineFeats.html). Sonic is technically allowed.
That's a reprint of the 3.0 version from Deities & Demigods. And technically, it's not part of the SRD, it is part of the OGL material bundled with the SRD on many websites.

The latest version (Complete Arcane) drops sonic from the list...

[Tvtyrant]

That's a reprint of the 3.0 version from Deities & Demigods. And technically, it's not part of the SRD, it is part of the OGL material bundled with the SRD on many websites.

The latest version (Complete Arcane) drops sonic from the list...

Oh, you mean that all OGL's are wrong? You could be right, but the SRD D20 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineAbilitiesFeats.htm#energySubstitution) has sonic as an option.

[Thurbane]

Oh, you mean that all OGL's are wrong? You could be right, but the SRD D20 (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/divineAbilitiesFeats.htm#energySubstitution) has sonic as an option.
I'm not saying they are wrong as such, but I believe the OGL source is from the 3.0 Deities & Demigods. AFAIK, the latest (3.5) version (CArc) of the feat drops sonic from the list. I believe the general RAW is that the latest version trumps earlier versions.

If you allowed that version (which isn't really a problem), then there would be a lot of Wands of Sonicball floating around, since far fewer creatures tend to have energy resistance (sonic) than the other types.

@Boci - I'm blocked from many SRD sites from my current web access, but the one I have saved to HDD says it's +0 level metamagic?

[Zaydos]

The OGL (and SRD) uses the 3.0 version. The 3.5 version does drop Sonic from the list.

The 3.0 version was a +0 metamagic.

[Boci]

@Boci - I'm blocked from many SRD sites from my current web access, but the one I have saved to HDD says it's +0 level metamagic?

Sorry, my mistake, +0 it is (was?).

[Tvtyrant]

But for core it would still be sonic, its only when you get splats that it goes away. Which is actually a good balance really, since the best spells for substitution happen out of core.

[KillianHawkeye]

But for core it would still be sonic, its only when you get splats that it goes away. Which is actually a good balance really, since the best spells for substitution happen out of core.

Deities & Demigods is not core.

[Tvtyrant]

Deities & Demigods is not core.

Alright, SRD.

[Ernir]

You say it like it is difficult to avoid becoming dazed :smalltongue:
It kinda is.

It is. Here's a list (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10449509&postcount=46). Notice how short it is.

[Thurbane]

...so, back to the initial question. We've got Elven Spell Lore, Born of Three Thunders and Archmage (and the 3.0 version of Energy Substitution) - what other methods are there for substituting sonic damage into your spells?