LA 0 Core Race/Monster with Spell Immunity?

[tuesdayscoming]

Does such a thing exist?

I'm having an ECL 5 duel with a friend this Friday (Me: Wizard, He: Fighter), and said friend is making the representation that he's found a race with no racial HD and no LA that has immunity to spells. I've been pouring through the Monster Manual looking for such a thing, but I can't find it.

I assume that he's either bluffing, trying to get me to rebuild my character to use a different set of spells than I would prefer, or that he is somehow mistaken.

All the same, thought I'd check in with the Playground.

Does anyone know of such a race or monster, even if it has a listed LA of '-'?

edit: Important detail I forgot to mention. The only books allowed are PH1, DMG, MM1, CAd, CAr, CW, and CD.

[HalfDragonCube]

Nope. AFAIK there is nothing like that. They are probably trying to trick you. Zap them with your complete superiority in class choice and be done with it.

[Thefurmonger]

its worth noting that LA - is not the same as LA 0

[HalfDragonCube]

its worth noting that LA - is not the same as LA 0

Yup, otherwise right now I would be playing my avatar.

[Morph Bark]

Yup, otherwise right now I would be playing my avatar.

On that note, why isn't it also half-troll? :smallwink:

[tuesdayscoming]

its worth noting that LA - is not the same as LA 0

Yup, I know, but if there was a RAW unplayable race (-) with Spell Immunity, it might at least show me what my opponent was thinking when making this claim.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Yup, I know, but if there was a RAW unplayable race (-) with Spell Immunity, it might at least show me what my opponent was thinking when making this claim.

Golems have LA of --, so it's possible he's confused on that front? I honestly have no idea though...

[Gullintanni]

I'm most inclined to think that your opponent is playing Warforged; and confusing the standard construct immunities with full on spell immunity. That's my best guess anyway. Or your opponent is using an LA (-) creature and simply doesn't understand the LA system.

[HalfDragonCube]

On that note, why isn't it also half-troll? :smallwink:

Or a zombie, or a skeleton, or anything else that says that the template can be applied to any corporeal creature? I didn't know what worked when I asked Qwernt for the avatar.

[mootoall]

On the other hand, why do you care? Just use spells with SR: No (There's a spell that literally says "rocks fall, everyone dies" :P) like the Orbs/Lesser Orbs. Then the various Hearts of [element] to trounce all of his strategies. Have fun!

[tuesdayscoming]

I'm most inclined to think that your opponent is playing Warforged; and confusing the standard construct immunities with full on spell immunity. That's my best guess anyway. Or your opponent is using an LA (-) creature and simply doesn't understand the LA system.

Warforged is not allowed. We're using Core 3 and 4 of the Completes, as noted in the edit at the bottom of the OP.

All the same, Im pretty sure he's just bluffing. While he may not get me to change my build, the bluff has at least gotten me to waste time I could have spent refining my character thumbing through books. So bravo, I guess.

[DR/Good&Wizard]

Rakshasas kind of because although they have LA 7 if you are starting at lvl 7 you function as a level 7 sorcerer which stack with levels of sorcerer and has SR 27+class levels

[HalfDragonCube]

On the other hand, why do you care? Just use spells with SR: No (There's a spell that literally says "rocks fall, everyone dies" :P) like the Orbs/Lesser Orbs. Then the various Hearts of [element] to trounce all of his strategies. Have fun!

Are you referring to Hail of Stone? That sounds like it, but it doesn't actually say 'rocks fall, everyone dies'. Still, that and the orbs are faily good attacky spells from the Conjuration School, so dump Evocation and Enchantment and you have yourself a fairly good low-level caster. Shame you don't have access to Abrupt Jaunt, as that is always funny for when you get charged.

Fighter: :thog: 'I charge the spellcaster and hit him for 1d12 + 587 damage!

Wizard: :vaarsuvius: 'No you don't'

[gbprime]

With those sources, there's nothing ECL 5 that is immune to spells or magic, no.

Best you're going to pull off is Spell Resistance. If you're letting truly odd things in, he might try to pull a Formian Warrior on you with Spell Resistance 18. So just make sure you're packing a few spells that ignore SR. A wand of Hail of Stone is great for this.

My personal dueling favorite for ECL 5 is Melf's Acid Arrow. No spell resistance, no save, just hit them, and acid resistance is rare at low levels. Extended as a 3rd level spell, it gives 4 rounds of continual damage. And if you had a +1 caster level modifier (like from the Acidic Splatter reserve feat, which you alas do not have access to), that would be six rounds of continual damage. Hit em and play keep-away, and if they try to heal themselves instead, hit em with other stuff.

For some casters, this gets truly evil. (Dracolexi, for example. Extend is free, Energy Substitution to Fire so Empower is free, and add Searing Spell so Fire Resistance does not apply. Watch them slowly burn from within...)

[XianTheCoder]

Been a few years since I was allowed to play any non core race, whats the difference between LA 0 and LA (-) again?

[HalfDragonCube]

Fly + Bag of Holding + Anvils = Win.

Edit @^: LA +0 means you can play the race like any other. La - means it is unplayable as a PC race.

[PlzBreakMyCmpAn]

Depending on who close to TO you want, this is doable only barely by that ECL.

The catch? You won't play the one non-epic non-unique creature type in all of 3.x that has true magic immunity.

I'll give you a hint. It requires WBL shenanigans, being a p*ssy (you don't do the fighting, your

[tuesdayscoming]

Well, now that we have PlzBreakMyCmpAn weighing in, I'm sure my friend is full of sh*t :smallbiggrin:

Could you possibly finish your post, tho, sir? I'm quite interested in what you had to say, but it seems you were cut off mid-thought.

[HalfDragonCube]

Good luck with pummelling your friend into the ground with your superior class choice.:smalltongue:

[Hirax]

Half-golems (MM2) are all that came to mind for me.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Have the Explosive Runes shenanigans ready, and if it doesn't work have Shrink Item shenanigans as backup. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10932249&postcount=14)

[tuesdayscoming]

Have the Explosive Runes shenanigans ready, and if it doesn't work have Shrink Item shenanigans as backup. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=10932249&postcount=14)

Lord almighty me are these tricks ever delicious. A bit too cheesy for this particular challenge, but Im absolutely going to use them in the future :smallbiggrin:

[HalfDragonCube]

Too cheesy? This friend lied to you in a hope to get you to change your class or some such thing.

Hitting with the amplifier of pain, eleven is too good for them.

[tuesdayscoming]

Indeed, sir, but why should a creature of such inherent nobility and grace as Mr Wizard stoop to the level of such a base, iniquitous foe? Certainly there is no need - much better to smile in the face of deceit, and deliver a beat-down for the history books without any chicanery whatsoever.

[Teron]

Rakshasas kind of because although they have LA 7 if you are starting at lvl 7 you function as a level 7 sorcerer which stack with levels of sorcerer and has SR 27+class levels
If you're starting at level 7, you can't play a rakshasa. Their ECL without class levels is 14 (HD + LA).

[Tvtyrant]

I think its uttercold orb of cold with easy metamagic time:smallcool:

[HalfDragonCube]

I think its uttercold orb of cold with easy metamagic time:smallcool:

There are all sorts of ways to fill a fighter full of those lovely metamagicked conjurations.

[Lateral]

I wonder how this is going. Looks like fun.

...Your friend is screwed, even at ECL 5.

[ericgrau]

Well the wizard has, what, 25 HP? Even losing initiative could end the fight at level 5. Though his friend doesn't sound that competent.

[HalfDragonCube]

Well the wizard has, what, 25 HP? Even losing initiative could end the fight at level 5. Though his friend doesn't sound that competent.

There is a Wizard/Archivist/Master Specialist build I'm using that has a whole bunch of feats by level three, and improved initiative is one of them. It goes into Mystic Theurge at level 4, so it can easily empty spell slots into fighters by the dozen.

[Lateral]

Well, it's Saturday, so now it's happened. We'll see.

[HalfDragonCube]

Well, it's Saturday, so now it's happened. We'll see.

[anticipation]

[ericgrau]

If I knew I'd be dueling a core wizard at level 5 I'd probably be an elf rogue with point blank shot, rapid shot, improved initiative, potions of invisibility and a magic bow. If I didn't win in round 1 I'd go invisible and ready an action to disrupt casting. Or maybe shoot w/o waiting depending on the situation. Moving to prevent the inevitable glitterdust guess(es), naturally.

[Lateral]

The other guy's a Fighter. See the OP. :smallamused:

@V: True dat. :smalltongue:

[HalfDragonCube]

The other guy's a Fighter flammable. See the OP. :smallamused:

Fixed that for you.:smalltongue:

[tuesdayscoming]

Well, it's Saturday, so now it's happened. We'll see.

Well, sir, that was an entertaining duel indeed. Suffice to say that the fighter was thoroughly trounced. For those curious as to the duel's specifics, I've spoilered an overview below.

The Set-Up:
I was originally going to be a middle aged Gray Elf Enchanter, going for Coup de Grace tastiness. Last minute, however, I decided that I wanted to out-fighter the fighter, so I rebuilt to an Orc Transmuter with 20 strength and 13 intelligence. Good thing I did, too, as while my opponent did not have Spell Immunity, he did have saves of F10, R11, W10, due to his racial selection of Deep Dwarf (+3 all saves vs spells), taking the Iron Will feat, and investing heavily in Dex and Wis.

For the duel's ground rules, any spell with a duration expressed in 10 min/lvl or more we could have in place before the duel started. I don't know what he had in place, but I started out with Greater Mage Armor from a scroll; Barkskin from a potion; Heroism from a scroll; False Life that I cast myself; Alter Self that I cast myself, turning me into a Troglodyte (3 natural attacks, Multiattack, and 6NA); and finally, Disguise Self that I cast myself to make me, the orc-gone-troglodyte, look like a Venerable Gray Elf. I also had a scythe strapped to my back, just to complete the minor deception.

Anyways, we did a best 2 out of 3, starting 50 feet away from each other in a large room (maybe 150ftx70ft?) with a dirt floor. Our mutual friend who was kind enough to DM for us introduced our characters by name and allowed us to give a brief description of our physical appearances and of any gear we carried. My opponent was described as a small, gnomish looking man, holding a war axe and covered in pouches.

Round One:
First match I ended up winning initiative (I had a +7, he a +8, but rolls were in my favor). I quaffed a potion of invisibility, and moved out of the way. He responded by throwing two Thunderstones across the room, hoping to hit one of the squares I had moved to, thereby deafening me for an hour. He did not get me, however, and next turn I cast fly, moving 15ft up and whizzing around the room.

Next turn he also quaffed a potion of invisibility, so I of course responded by casting See Invis and moving a bit. He then moved to the back of the arena, holding his axe and a bag of some sort in his hand, and did nothing else, apparently waiting for me to reappear. I cast Enlarge Person, he moved a bit, I cast Fist of Stone for an additional Slam attack and +6 Str, and moved to within striking range of him. He then moved directly under me, provoking an attack of opportunity. I took it and used the slam, hitting for 1d6+1.5Str, which was now a colossal 28. He was not happy. He finished out his turn by moving back out from under me, and throwing a Tanglefoot Bag at my face. I handily made the save, and on my turn was still within full attack range.

He did not survive the flurry of natural attacks.

Round Two:
Before Round Two started, we made an agreement to not use Invisibility. We had had a pretty good sized audience last round, and we figured that it wasn't fair to them to force each contestant to step out of the room on his opponent's turn. Just slowed down the game too much. So instead of preparing See Invis, I prepared Earthen Grasp from Complete Arcane.

Again, I won initiative. I cast fly and moved 15 feet up in the air, and back 30 feet away from him. He moved thirty feet forward and threw a Tanglefoot Bag at me, which missed and crashed into the wall behind me. I cast Earthen Grasp, and he was successfully grappled. On his turn, he failed to escape from said grapple. I cast enlarge person, and the Earthen Grasp fist pinned my opponent, who took 1d6 damage. Again, my opponent failed to escape, so I cast Fist of Stone and got within full attack range; he remained pinned and took another 1d6 from the Earthen Grasp.

Again he failed to escape. I full attacked him with my Claw/Claw/Bite/Slam routine, he took another 1d6 from the Earthen Grasp, and fell.

Long story short, I won both rounds without taking a single point of damage. Had I played a more traditional caster, however, it is likely that his extraordinary saves would have evened the playing field a bit. As it was, though, we both came up with nontraditional builds, and mine just happened to have the upper hand.

It was an extraordinarily entertaining experience, and I can't thank all of you guys enough for your thoughts and advice. It made a big difference and helped me towards a rousing victory. :smallbiggrin:

[Lateral]

That is really awesome.

[HalfDragonCube]

[/anticipation]

That is really awesome.

Hey, I wanted to put on that tag!

'Twas awesome indeed, although since the fighter didn't do anything but hurl alchemical items and chug potions then they hardly did much that works with their class.

[tuesdayscoming]

Indeed, sir. He was trying to disable me, but just... wasn't very good at it at all. It did get me interested in trying to work up a fighter build that does battlefield control well, but that isn't a trip monster.

Hmm...

[Veyr]

Would have been interesting if you'd done a run where you let him go first, just to eliminate claims of 'luck' since he had the higher Initiative.

[Lateral]

Indeed, sir. He was trying to disable me, but just... wasn't very good at it at all. It did get me interested in trying to work up a fighter build that does battlefield control well, but that isn't a trip monster.

Hmm...

Harpoons and spiked nets?

[awa]

its not a fighter but my ranger in recent games has been lassoing then allowing his mount to trip/drag foes past all the waiting allies so they can get their free attacks of opportunity against a prone entangled foe that's kinda battle field control. and a fighter get handle animal and ride he could train something big and strong.

[HalfDragonCube]

its not a fighter but my ranger in recent games has been lassoing then allowing his mount to trip/drag foes past all the waiting allies so they can get their free attacks of opportunity against a prone entangled foe that's kinda battle field control. and a fighter get handle animal and ride he could train something big and strong.

Scoop 'em up and maul 'em. Of course, real rangers lasso them, tie them to another horse, ride their horse alongside and get in on the AoO feast as well.

Yee haw.

[awa]

i had a dire bat and couldn't hurt the creatures in question due