Hellbred or Water Orc for Warblade 20?

[danzibr]

So I made a Warblade recently (starts at 2, planning to go to 10x that) and he's currently a Hellbred. Kind of for flavor reasons, but it's really unnecessary. Should I go Water Orc instead? Or something else?

[Dusk Eclipse]

From a purely optimization point of view, Water orc is much better stats +4 str, +2 con -2 cha -2 int -2 wis. Add dragonborn to taste (and getting +2 Con and -2 dex to booth) while loosing the drawbacks such as the light sensitivity.

But take into account that is a high op race.

[Zonugal]

From a purely optimization point of view, Water orc is much better stats +4 str, +2 con -2 cha -2 int -2 wis. Add dragonborn to taste (and getting +2 str and -2 dex to booth) while loosing the drawbacks such as the light sensitivity.

But take into account that is a high op race.

He'd actually receive a +2 to con, not str, from the Dragonborn template. But the selling point for the Dragonborn Water Orc should be getting access to slight (which is really going to beat most of what the Hellbred will offer up).

[Dusk Eclipse]

From a purely optimization point of view, Water orc is much better stats +4 str, +2 con -2 cha -2 int -2 wis. Add dragonborn to taste (and getting +2 Con and -2 dex to booth) while loosing the drawbacks such as the light sensitivity.

But take into account that is a high op race.


He'd actually receive a +2 to con, not str, from the Dragonborn template. But the selling point for the Dragonborn Water Orc should be getting access to slight (which is really going to beat most of what the Hellbred will offer up).

No sir, you are most definitely wrong, you see in my post it clearly says +2 con, no +2 str, sir no sir.

[Zonugal]

But... But I saw! I SAW IT!!!!

[danzibr]

I'm not sure what to think, given the quote of the original post had +2 str written...

[Shades of Gray]

The post was edited after Zonugal posted.

Also, I agree on the dragonborn water orc.

I still love my slow (trait) Toughness x3 (feats, two flaws) Dragonborn Mongrelfolk Barbarian with 18 base Con (24 racially, 28 in rage)

29 HP at level one.

[Dusk Eclipse]

... apparently nobody saw the joke... my bad.

Edit: Yay someone saw it.

[danzibr]

... apparently nobody saw the joke... my bad.

I was trying to joke back. I did notice the edit. My bad as well.

[Zonugal]

... apparently nobody saw the joke... my bad.

Edit: Yay someone saw it.

I attempted to joke back but apparently no one saw the joke either.

I KNOW YOUR WOE!

[grarrrg]

I'm sure what to think, given the quote of the original post had +2 con written...

Didn't fix that for you...

We need a "shifty eyes" smiley...

[danzibr]

All jokes aside (though there's plenty of room for more), any other suggestions? Honestly I'll probably go Dragonborn Water Orc, but just wonderin'...

For that matter, what aspect is best for Warblade?

[Greensleeves]

Water Orc is better, but Hellbred is oh so more awesome in its fluff, so I'd say stick with it.

As for what Warblade are best at? Damage. Pure damage. Check out Crackdown builds on Brilliant Gameologist or the Wizards Char-Op board.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Wings is the best IMO EX flight is not too shaby; but the mind aspect gets some nice perception boosts, just don't bother with heart, the breath weapon uses your precious standard actions which you need for strikes or recovering your maneuvers.

[Hirax]

Synads (Complete Psionic) can grant you an extra swift action every day, or 2 if you take a racial feat that grants the ability a second time.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

I'd get Wings if you can afford to spend a feat on Reinforced Wings or avoid wearing medium armor. Heart is amazing if you can afford to spend a 1st level feat on Entangling Exhalation, and possibly spend another on Quicken Breath. The no-save-barring-evasion Entangled debuff on multiple opponents makes a whole world of difference in combat effectiveness. The Mind aspect is also excellent if your build is already feat-starved, but a passive benefit is seldom better than abilities which provide greater versatility.

Starting at level 2, you should consider also taking Mineral Warrior (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20031003e), especially if you can buy off (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/reducingLevelAdjustments.htm) the +1 LA. Get Dragonborn before gaining Mineral Warrior, so none of its traits will be lost. That would make your total ability score adjustments Str +6, Dex -2, Con +8, Int -4, Wis -4, Cha -4, with a +3 natural armor bonus, DR 8/Adamantine, 30 ft. land speed, 30 ft. swim speed, 15 ft. burrow speed, and if you get the Wings aspect you'll also have the 30 ft. fly speed. You'll gain the fly speed at your 6th character level despite having Mineral Warrior, since it only removes a fly speed you already have upon gaining the template. Get the Quick trait and you'll have a 40 ft. land and swim speed, and a 20 ft. burrow speed.

[dgnslyr]

While all this high-op race-choosing is fine and dandy, how are you going to sneak this past a DM？What kind of backstory lies behind a Dragonborn Mineral Warrior Water Orc? I'd like to know, that's for sure. It would certainlybe very interesting, if you can make a convincing back story.

[grarrrg]

What kind of backstory lies behind a Dragonborn Mineral Warrior Water Orc?

There was, like, this Orc guy, and he, like, lived underground, and one day these, like, rock-fighter guys....oh, this is before he was born by the way... these rock-fighter guys, like, did stuff to his mother, but she wasn't his mother yet, and then later he was born all rocky and weird and stuff, and then.... wait, he needs to do this after the dragon part doesn't he?.... um, so there was this Orc guy, and he really really liked Dragons as a kid? and he had this crazy old rich uncle orc guy, and, like, this crazy old uncle orc guy was, like, also really into dragons, and stuff, and they thought it would be, like, totally awesome to, like, worship bamahumahat (dragon god guy) and stuff, and so they did this thing, and it was pretty sweet. Then, later on, the Orc guy is wandering underground, cause he lived underground, and he got attacked by these rock-fighter guys, and they, like, captured him, and, like, did weird experiment things to him, and now, like, he's a rock-fighter-dragon-orc guy. And he kicks ass, and he's just so awesome you TOTALLY have to let me play him in our next game and stuff. It'll be sweet.

Edit:
Drat, WATER Orc... Ummm.... Pretend they lived by an underground river while they were living underground. Yeah, that's the ticket...

[danzibr]

[...] Then, later on, the Orc guy is wandering underground, cause he lived underground, and he got attacked by these rock-fighter guys, and they, like, captured him, and, like, did weird experiment things to him, and now, like, he's a rock-fighter-dragon-orc guy. [...]

I think I'll run this part past my DM. He's a cool guy, he'll probably like it.

Oh, and we won't be using LA buyoff so no Minearal Warrior. And in fact for less cheese I'd probably just go Orc Dragonborn. Yeah it's still cheesy, but I happen to love Dragonborn anyways. The one time I played 4e I went Dragonborn.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

While all this high-op race-choosing is fine and dandy, how are you going to sneak this past a DM？What kind of backstory lies behind a Dragonborn Mineral Warrior Water Orc? I'd like to know, that's for sure. It would certainlybe very interesting, if you can make a convincing back story.

His ancestors were a tribe of orcs who lived on the coast and were often seduced by Sirines (MM2) who needed protection from a Marid Genie (MotP) who wished to steal their pearls. This produced many halfbreed offspring, and generations later this bloodline thinned out resulting in a tribe of mostly water orcs.

This character in particular detested his tribe's warmongering and raiding of innocent villages, so he left as soon as he grew old enough. Life was difficult being a lone orc, so he kept near the coast because he could outswim anyone who meant him harm and was a capable fisherman. It wasn't long before he met a young bronze dragon, and after what it thought would be an appetizing chat they became friends. The dragon taught him of Bahamut, the wise and compassionate god who instructs his worshipers to do good and to encourage others to do good. (The PC) was discouraged that he was always judged on his appearance and that he was seldom given an opportunity to carry out these teachings. After a long period of contemplation and soul searching, he decided that it would be best to be reborn as a dragonborn of Bahamut.

(Mineral Warrior is obtained via a 6th level Sorcerer/Wizard spell called Mineralize Warrior, which compels the subject to serve the caster for one year plus one day.)
(The PC) was never too bright and wasn't very good with money, so a mercenary he'd made friends with got him a job working as a guard for a local wizard. One by one the wizard offered each of his guards the strength of stone, and every one of them was tricked into accepting the spell which turned them into a mineral warrior, thus enslaving them all for a year. The wizard understood (the PC)'s convictions and never ordered him to do anything to compromise his morals, and so he and the rest of the guards served the wizard for a year without any additional payment. Now that contract is over, and this is where the next chapter of his story begins....

[faceroll]

While all this high-op race-choosing is fine and dandy, how are you going to sneak this past a DM？What kind of backstory lies behind a Dragonborn Mineral Warrior Water Orc? I'd like to know, that's for sure. It would certainlybe very interesting, if you can make a convincing back story.

Seriously. Dragonborn requires you to worship a lawful good dragon of paladins, and mineral warrior requires 2,000gp and a ritual conducted by evil, depraved creatures. Any backstory is just hoops you're jumping through to justify being very powerful at ECL2.

That's why I would go half-minotaur dragonborn water orc. Tell people you're a half orc. :smallbiggrin:


His ancestors were a tribe of orcs who lived on the coast and were often seduced by Sirines (MM2) who needed protection from a Marid Genie (MotP) who wished to steal their pearls. This produced many halfbreed offspring, and generations later this bloodline thinned out resulting in a tribe of mostly water orcs.

This character in particular detested his tribe's warmongering and raiding of innocent villages, so he left as soon as he grew old enough. Life was difficult being a lone orc, so he kept near the coast because he could outswim anyone who meant him harm and was a capable fisherman. It wasn't long before he met a young bronze dragon, and after what it thought would be an appetizing chat they became friends. The dragon taught him of Bahamut, the wise and compassionate god who instructs his worshipers to do good and to encourage others to do good. (The PC) was discouraged that he was always judged on his appearance and that he was seldom given an opportunity to carry out these teachings. After a long period of contemplation and soul searching, he decided that it would be best to be reborn as a dragonborn of Bahamut.

(Mineral Warrior is obtained via a 6th level Sorcerer/Wizard spell called Mineralize Warrior, which compels the subject to serve the caster for one year plus one day.)
(The PC) was never too bright and wasn't very good with money, so a mercenary he'd made friends with got him a job working as a guard for a local wizard. One by one the wizard offered each of his guards the strength of stone, and every one of them was tricked into accepting the spell which turned them into a mineral warrior, thus enslaving them all for a year. The wizard understood (the PC)'s convictions and never ordered him to do anything to compromise his morals, and so he and the rest of the guards served the wizard for a year without any additional payment. Now that contract is over, and this is where the next chapter of his story begins....

He also never once gained experience during that entire time. Now, in the next week, he will gain 3 levels....

[NineThePuma]

Slightly off topic, but...

It's entirely possible to go Warforged -> Dragonborn, by RAW, despite fluff seeming to lend itself only to Humanoids (saying that it'd be against RAI doesn't work, since the author uses a dragonborn Warforged, but meh.)

The ritual to gain the Necropolitan Template is NOT in any way shape or form an evil act on your part.

It is thus possible to be a Necropolitan Dragonborn Warforged. Don't know why you would, but I found it interesting. You can then go ahead and take Evolved Undead for a couple dozen levels, and simply say that your character has been sealed away. But that's a little crazy.

[Endarire]

I like Hood (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19872838/Little_Red_Raiding_Hood_A_Tale_of_38_Guide_to_the_ 35_Dragoon) so I can one-shot things, but that's me.

[Greenish]

But take into account that is a high op race.For dump muscle, yes, but that's not usually such a high op option to begin with.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Seriously. Dragonborn requires you to worship a lawful good dragon of paladins, and mineral warrior requires 2,000gp and a ritual conducted by evil, depraved creatures. Any backstory is just hoops you're jumping through to justify being very powerful at ECL2.

That's why I would go half-minotaur dragonborn water orc. Tell people you're a half orc. :smallbiggrin:

He also never once gained experience during that entire time. Now, in the next week, he will gain 3 levels....

Mineralize Warrior is a Transmutation [Earth], there is absolutely nothing inherently evil about it. It specifies that the subject must be restrained within an enclosure of stone, thus the caster cannot target himself with it, but there is no indication that it is painful or depraved. The cost is only 500 gp per HD and 250 XP per HD of the target. The PC's cost for gaining it is the +1 LA, if it had nothing but a gp cost then it would not increase your ECL as per Spellstitched.

That backstory I gave described him running away from fights, and then going from ECL 1 to ECL 2 during the time in which he would have been gaining any XP. It makes perfect sense and fits with the character's race and templates.

[Master Elodin]

Massive Necromancy here, but oh well. I'm new and this thread applied to me as I'm gunna use a Water Orc Dragonborn Mineral warrior Barbarian :D. My fluff for the character is this:

A water orc who received the call of Bahamut, who once lived in an evil water orc underdark city, built on a lake. :smallcool:
He traveled the underdark, hunting the Deep Dragons that call it home, but bit off more than he could chew. He was cursed by a Deep Dragon and petrified. There he stood for 1000 years, until finally the platinum dragon took pity on him and turned him into a Mineral Warrior. Now he has left the underdark, and travels the strange and wonderful surface world, bringing Bahamut's war to the world of light and the dragons of flight. :smallcool: Hell Yeah.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff: Thread necromancy is not permitted on this forum. Please review the Forum Rules.