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View Full Version : Foothold traps (3.5)



Lord Vukodlak
2011-05-17, 02:13 PM
Looking over my collection of books I couldn't find the simple foothold trap, aka bear trap. Now it sounds like it be quite effective in D&D when mixed in with an encounter. (the closest thing I found is the snare spell but its not the same thing).

A party member gets his leg stuck and can't move then whom ever layed the trap attacks. A spellcaster can't move out of a threaten area, a melee fighter can't move into attack.

It wouldn't be that serious of a trap on its own, smashing the chain with a sword or the mechanism its self wouldn't take to long, but it could take time precious time if combat begins immidiately after the trap is sprung.

I'm thinking a reflex save DC 20 to avoid getting your foot caught. If you take 1d6 points of damage and are entangled unable to move from that spot.(but not helpless).

You can escape via the following (short of physically attacking the trap)

You can pry the trap open with a DC 25 strength check but this requires two hands. You could use a staff, a sword or similar sturdy implament as lever to give you a +2 circumstance bonus on this check.
A DC 26 Strength check can break the chain tethering you down allowing you to move but you'd remain entangled.
A DC 25 escape artist check will let you slip free.

But the the easist way out of the trap is a DC 15 disable device check which takes 1d4 rounds.

I'm not sure how to price the trap, and its important because this trap would be fairly easy to pick up and move or sell.

ericgrau
2011-05-17, 02:23 PM
Since your arms are free I don't think you count as entangled. But you'd move at half speed until the injured leg is healed and jaws removed even after freed.

Something helpful from the SRD for getting out: "Chain has hardness 10 and 5 hit points. It can be burst with a DC 26 Strength check."

A real bear trap can be open if you simply step on the springs, so you'd need a way to prevent that in your custom trap. Obviously you need to conceal the trap too. Simple methods of concealment have search DCs ranging from 15-20, and can be found by non-rogues. Whereas complex mechanical or magical methods have higher DCs and only rogues can find them. I'm guessing that since it's only a bear trap the DC is 15-20. 15 is probably a simple breakaway floor while 20 would be tile carefully matched to surrounding stone and chiseled to a snug fit.

Lord Vukodlak
2011-05-17, 02:35 PM
Since your arms are free I don't think you count as entangled. But you'd move at half speed until the injured leg is healed and jaws removed even after freed.

If your leg is caught in the trap you can't move right, being entangled impedes your movement not necessarily your arms. The snare spell binds one leg and still entangles you. So a foothold trap which is similar but a bit more difficult then a snare should entangle you to.

You could make the argument that if your arms aren't restrained or bound then the entanglement has no effect on casting a spell. But being stuck in one place or having a clamp on your leg makes fighting more difficult. The character moves through out his square during a fight he's not standing still.



Something helpful from the SRD for getting out: "Chain has hardness 10 and 5 hit points. It can be burst with a DC 26 Strength check."
Hense why you can break the chain tethering you in place with DC 26 strength check.



A real bear trap can be open if you simply step on the springs, so you'd need a way to prevent that in your custom trap.
Thus the disable device check, most people aren't going to know how to escape a bear trap properly and this trap might as well assume the designer may have had more intelligent people in mind.

Concealment is another thing I'm trying to figure out as the trap is portable, I thinking the trap layer can use a hide check to conceal the trap from a spot check. But a 15-20 DC search check sounds right.
Hiding something from eyes is much easier then a search.

DracoDei
2011-05-17, 08:39 PM
Sounds like hit-point damage plus the "immobilized" condition (MM V or IV or some such... and probably other places). The search DC probably depends at least somewhat on the skill of the person setting it (I would allow both Hide and Wilderness Lore to be used, whichever the character has the most ranks in). Also, who says that a real world bear-trap isn't useful? Plenty of stuff in D&D that is feral enough to not be able to figure that sort of thing out easily.

Silverscale
2011-05-17, 10:22 PM
Also mention the strength of the closing mechanism because if it's strong enough it can sever the victims foot off.

IRL it only take 8psi to crack the human skull; not sure how PSI translate into Strength modifiers for D&D but when you think about it 8psi is alarmingly low to be able to crack your head open like an egg. Again not sure of the specifics or how it would translate into D&D but I have to believe that a leg bone is roughly as easy to cut through, as a skull is to break.

DracoDei
2011-05-17, 11:10 PM
Also mention the strength of the closing mechanism because if it's strong enough it can sever the victims foot off.

IRL it only take 8psi to crack the human skull; not sure how PSI translate into Strength modifiers for D&D but when you think about it 8psi is alarmingly low to be able to crack your head open like an egg. Again not sure of the specifics or how it would translate into D&D but I have to believe that a leg bone is roughly as easy to cut through, as a skull is to break.
Are you sure 8 PSI isn't the over-pressure in the cerebral-spinal fluid necessary to pop it like an over-filled balloon? Probably not, since brain-death would long precede that, making the statistic very very pointless, except maybe to illustrate how the skull is constructed for strength from the OUTSIDE, not the inside.

I DO know that in compression bone is about 3 times as strong as concrete (thus how martial artists can break cinder-blocks).

ericgrau
2011-05-18, 12:06 PM
If your leg is caught in the trap you can't move right, being entangled impedes your movement not necessarily your arms. The snare spell binds one leg and still entangles you. So a foothold trap which is similar but a bit more difficult then a snare should entangle you to.

You could make the argument that if your arms aren't restrained or bound then the entanglement has no effect on casting a spell. But being stuck in one place or having a clamp on your leg makes fighting more difficult. The character moves through out his square during a fight he's not standing still.

<snip>

The snare spell also flips you upside-down and has the possibility of grabbing a limb or multiple limbs other than a single leg. I just don't see the -2 AB and -4 dex to archers from being entangled when your arms are unhindered and the PC is upright on stable ground. It seems more similar to caltrops there: move at half speed until healed even if you get free and stuck to chain if you don't.

As for "<snip>", ya that works.

As for cracking bones... I've heard of bear traps injuring limbs and breaking bones but not cutting clean through. Since D&D doesn't handle these things very well and since adventurers are not commoners I'd leave it at 1d6 damage and call it a day.

Lord Vukodlak
2011-05-18, 01:13 PM
The snare spell also flips you upside-down and has the possibility of grabbing a limb or multiple limbs other than a single leg.

The snare spell only flips you upside down if a suitable tree is available otherwise it just tightens around the target. Archers have a proper stance just like a sword fighter to, having your foot caught in a bear trap will disrupt that.

ericgrau
2011-05-18, 03:50 PM
Ok but it can often flip you or grab your arm or gets both legs or etc. etc. I can see why they simply said "entangled" rather than worry about the details. But if only one leg is caught nearly every single time and it never pulls up I don't see why it's at all hard to aim or fight. Even if one foot happens to be stuck pointing the wrong way, it makes little difference. Then I'd think in this case entangled would be the exception not the rule.

... Not that it makes much difference however you rule it. The main thing is keeping the PC in one place. That's a lot more scary.