Flaming Frostrager

[Ixil]

Simple question: does Barbarian 6 / Frostrager 5 / Pyrokineticist 9 work?

Thanks!

[Keld Denar]

Assuming you use a psionic race or take either Wild Talent or Hidden Talent, yes.

[KillianHawkeye]

You could always ask your DM to swap all the fire stuff to ice, and play a cryokineticist instead.

[Halae]

You could always ask your DM to swap all the fire stuff to ice, and play a cryokineticist instead.

Cryokineticist requires you to be lawful, killing yoiur ability to be a barbarian too. I believe you even lose rage

[Lateral]

Not the Mind's Eye one. (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20040625e) The Frostburn one is a lot worse, although neither are exactly great (this one is the worst of the five, but not by as much as the Frostburn one.) Sonokineticist is the best one, honestly.

[Hyfigh]

I'd stick it out with fire and ice - that way you can deal with immunity and resistances a little easier.

[Malkav]

You could always ask your DM to swap all the fire stuff to ice, and play a cryokineticist instead.

I swapped frozen berserker to flaming berserker. I was a flaming berserker bear warrior. I was doing around 120dmg/rd with pounce too.

[CodeRed]

Take Blazing Berserker from Sandstorm as well as the one from Frostburn and you instantly become immune to the two most common elemental damage types as well. The funny part is that neither precludes the other at all. But yeah, Frostrager with 4d6 weapon aflame on your fists is pretty brutal.

[Ixil]

Take Blazing Berserker from Sandstorm as well as the one from Frostburn and you instantly become immune to the two most common elemental damage types as well. The funny part is that neither precludes the other at all. But yeah, Frostrager with 4d6 weapon aflame on your fists is pretty brutal.

What feats would you take? Would Improved Natural Attack for the unarmed attack be worth it?

[faceroll]

What feats would you take? Would Improved Natural Attack for the unarmed attack be worth it?

If you are making a lot of attacks/round; yes. Superior Unarmed Strike is another strong contender, and that makes your fists bigger as you level.

[Aron Times]

Am I the only one who thought, "flamboyantly gay Eskimo with a greataxe," when he saw the thread title?

[Greenish]

Am I the only one who thought, "flamboyantly gay Eskimo with a greataxe," when he saw the thread title?Maybe, but I'm thinking of it now.

[CodeRed]

What feats would you take? Would Improved Natural Attack for the unarmed attack be worth it?

Yes. Anything that can increase your unarmed dmg die is usually pretty good.

[Greenish]

Yes. Anything that can increase your unarmed dmg die is usually pretty good.Eh, 1d6 (frostrager)-> 1d8 is on average a one-point increase. Weapon Specialization would be better.

[Darth Stabber]

Am I the only one who thought, "flamboyantly gay Eskimo with a greataxe," when he saw the thread title?

Yes, and I also have my next character's concept. He'll bring new meaning to the term "Bear" Warrior.

[Ixil]

Yes, and I also have my next character's concept. He'll bring new meaning to the term "Bear" Warrior.

ROFL
:smallbiggrin:

[Ixil]

Another thing... How to go around the fluff (you know, frost vs. flames)?

[Lateral]

Another thing... How to go around the fluff (you know, frost vs. flames)?

Blue fire and red ice claws.

[Greenish]

Another thing... How to go around the fluff (you know, frost vs. flames)?Well, you're just that awesome.

Also worth noting that those aren't real flames (the ice is real if you're frostrager), and give off no heat.

[IthroZada]

Another thing... How to go around the fluff (you know, frost vs. flames)?

There is no fluff inconsistency between fire and ice. Cold is simply the absence of heat, therefore you are a barbarian who has complete control over the heat he produces.

[Lateral]

It's not cold, though, it's ice. Ice melts. Plus, he's doing both fire and ice at the same time.

[Aron Times]

Another thing... How to go around the fluff (you know, frost vs. flames)?
http://gatherer.wizards.com/Handlers/Image.ashx?type=card&multiverseid=27166

All hail the Izzet League!

[IthroZada]

It's not cold, though, it's ice. Ice melts. Plus, he's doing both fire and ice at the same time.

The ice won't melt if he simply drains the heat out of it. There's no reason he can't do both at the same time. He is simply generating and draining heat at the same time from different places. Plus the fire apparently doesn't give off heat.

[Ixil]

There is no fluff inconsistency between fire and ice. Cold is simply the absence of heat, therefore you are a barbarian who has complete control over the heat he produces.

True, true... I thinks this is the way to go if the DM gives me a hard time... (The group I play with tends to be a little picky with small stuff like this...)

[Ixil]

Is it worth it to trade 2 of the barbarian levels for 2 fighter levels?

[Keld Denar]

Depends, what feats are you planning on picking up with them?

[Ixil]

Depends, what feats are you planning on picking up with them?

Haven't really thought about it... Probably something to increase damage and/or attack modifier...

[Keld Denar]

Thus the crux of CharOp. Figuring how many feats you NEED vs how many feats you WANT, and whether or not the feats you WANT give you more or less toys to play with than actual class features.

Generally, you want as few Fighter levels as possible while still getting enough feats to do your job, baring things like Dungeoncrasher and Zhent sub levels. Between Frostrager and Pyrokintecist, you'll need like, 4 feats, plus a couple of other nice toys like Combat Reflexes and possibly Imp Trip and/or Knockdown.

Figure out what you want to do, how many levels you need to attain that, and then trim the fat, reevaluate, and repeat. CharOp tends to be a rather iterative process.

[Ixil]

Thus the crux of CharOp. Figuring how many feats you NEED vs how many feats you WANT, and whether or not the feats you WANT give you more or less toys to play with than actual class features.

Generally, you want as few Fighter levels as possible while still getting enough feats to do your job, baring things like Dungeoncrasher and Zhent sub levels. Between Frostrager and Pyrokintecist, you'll need like, 4 feats, plus a couple of other nice toys like Combat Reflexes and possibly Imp Trip and/or Knockdown.

Figure out what you want to do, how many levels you need to attain that, and then trim the fat, reevaluate, and repeat. CharOp tends to be a rather iterative process.

Thanks dude!

[Ixil]

Is there a list somewhere on feats to upgrade damage dealt by unarned attacks/natural attacks, attack modifiers and number of attacks per round? :smallconfused:

[Keld Denar]

Like this? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127026) Or maybe this one. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7081777)

[Ixil]

Like this? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127026) Or maybe this one. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7081777)

Very cool links, thanks.

[Darth Stabber]

There is no fluff inconsistency between fire and ice. Cold is simply the absence of heat, therefore you are a barbarian who has complete control over the heat he produces.

This combo is no weirder than the Bear Warrior's ability to to get so angry he turns into a bear. D&D pretty much requires that you do something wierd to be a viable combatant at any level higher than ~6. Character power is almost directly purportional to the number of things contradictory to reality on your character sheet, and two things are contradictory with each other and reality at the same time, so much the better.

[Greenish]

Is there a list somewhere on feats to upgrade damage dealt by unarned attacks/natural attacks, attack modifiers and number of attacks per round? :smallconfused:Person_Man on Getting big (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7081777), extra attacks (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7066595), attack modifiers (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=134446).

[Ixil]

From what I can gather, a goliath's powerful build allows him to wield bigger weapons, but its unarmed attack still counts as if from a medium sized creature. If it takes the Goliath Barbarian Mountain Rage substitution level, does the unarmed attack damage increase during the rage (due to the increase in size)?

Edit: If anyone helps me with this one, I promise I won't bother anyone anymore...

[Greenish]

From what I can gather, a goliath's powerful build allows him to wield bigger weapons, but its unarmed attack still counts as if from a medium sized creature.True.

If it takes the Goliath Barbarian Mountain Rage substitution level, does the unarmed attack damage increase during the rage (due to the increase in size)?Yes. Mountain Rage provides actual size increase, with everything that comes with it.

[Ixil]

So, a Goliath with the Improved Natural Attack feat, under the effect of the Greater Mighty Wallop spell (say second weapon size increase), with Montain Rage sub level and Improved Frostrage would deal 6d6 + Str mod of damage (plus the cold damage bit)?

[Greenish]

So, a Goliath with the Improved Natural Attack feat, under the effect of the Greater Mighty Wallop spell (say second weapon size increase), with Montain Rage sub level and Improved Frostrage would deal 6d6 + Str mod of damage (plus the cold damage bit)?Going off the top of my head, Frostrager ups your unarmed damage to 1d6, right?

Then you add size increases, one from Mountain Rage, one from INA, two from GMW (at CL 8), your damage goes 1d6 -> 1d8 -> 2d6 -> 3d6 -> 4d6.

Though I'm not sure if Frostrager's unarmed damage is tied to size, by RAW.

[Ixil]

Going off the top of my head, Frostrager ups your unarmed damage to 1d6, right?

Then you add size increases, one from Mountain Rage, one from INA, two from GMW (at CL 8), your damage goes 1d6 -> 1d8 -> 2d6 -> 3d6 -> 4d6.

Though I'm not sure if Frostrager's unarmed damage is tied to size, by RAW.

Large Frostrager with Improved Frostrage deals 2d6 points of damage (medium deals 1d8 points of damage)...

[Greenish]

Large Frostrager with Improved Frostrage deals 2d6 points of damage (medium deals 1d8 points of damage)...Yeah, then you do get up to 6d6.