+0 LA CHA Template

[dark.sun.druid]

I'm wondering if any template exists that meets all of the following requirements:


+0 LA or rules to offset LA (It is to be used in a 1st level campaign)
+2 or more CHA
Can be applied to a construct with the living construct subtype (specificaly a Warforged)
Can be from any source book, even 3rd party books


Along similar lines, does anyone have a list of templates that impose a negative LA (if these even exist)?

[HalfDragonCube]

I'm wondering if any template exists that meets all of the following requirements:


+0 LA or rules to offset LA (It is to be used in a 1st level campaign)
+2 or more CHA
Can be applied to a construct with the living construct subtype (specificaly a Warforged)
Can be from any source book, even 3rd party books


Along similar lines, does anyone have a list of templates that impose a negative LA (if these even exist)?

I'm almost certain there is nothing like that in official books, otherwise everyone would include it in builds.

[Vulaas]

As it's for a living construct...Incarnate Construct is -2 LA.

Otherwise, LA+0 templates for raising Charisma include Unseelie Fey (seeing as you qualify as 'any living'), and ditto for Magic Blooded (Both are from Dragon magazine, not sure on the issue numbers).

[Cog]

Magic-Blooded from Dragon 306 does this, though there's an argument to be made that it can only be applied to the PHB races.

Edit: Unseelie Fey is likewise questionable. The LA is only given for the sample gnome Warrior, and not for the template as a whole.

[Kaeso]

I can't think of a template, but I can give you two +0 LA CHA races.
The lesser Aasimar gives you +2 WIS and +2 CHA

The lesser Drow gives you +2 INT +2 CHA



Both are from Players Guide to Faerun.

[Callista]

I'd go for the lesser Aasimar, myself. You can just tell everybody you're human, and not even know any different yourself. Having celestial blood needn't be something your character's aware of. Give them an odd eye or hair color--golden or very light blue eyes, maybe; or very light hair in a dark-skinned family (think Storm from X-men)... But have them think they're human; after all, they've got no reason to think they're not. They've just got an odd feature that they were born with. If you want to go Evil, then the Aasimar just adds an extra creepy factor; Good is pretty much classic with Aasimar and might explain why your character is an adventurer (his celestial blood calls him to right the wrongs of the world, even though he doesn't know why he wants to do this). Make sure your DM knows your character's heritage; it makes a decent plot hook.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Incarnate Construct in Savage Species gives LA -2 and makes you creature type Giant.

Primordial Giant in Secrets of Xen'drik is LA +0 and gives Int +4, Cha +4, with a Str and Con penalty and a few other benefits, it can only be applied to giants.

Phrenic in XPH/SRD is LA +2 and gives +4 Cha, power resistance, psi-like abilities, etc.

The net total of those things would be LA +0, and Cha +8, though both Primordial Giant and Phrenic are inherited templates and Incarnate Construct is an acquired template, so combining them is extremely questionable.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Do warforged get ageing bonus and penalties? if so you could be an old warforged and get +2 int, cha and wis,

[Talya]

Magic-Blooded from Dragon 306 does this

I'm using this in a game on the forums here. It's +2 cha, -2 wis, low light vision (which replaces any special vision you might already have) and a handfull of cantrips as Spell-Likes.

I'm playing a human, but I can't see how it would be limited to PHB races.

[Prime32]

Incarnate Construct in Savage Species gives LA -2 and makes you creature type Giant.

Primordial Giant in Secrets of Xen'drik is LA +0 and gives Int +4, Cha +4, with a Str and Con penalty and a few other benefits, it can only be applied to giants.

Phrenic in XPH/SRD is LA +2 and gives +4 Cha, power resistance, psi-like abilities, etc.

The net total of those things would be LA +0, and Cha +8, though both Primordial Giant and Phrenic are inherited templates and Incarnate Construct is an acquired template, so combining them is extremely questionable.Incarnate Construct will only turn a Construct into a Giant if it's Large and has a humanoid anatomy.

Also, spellscales are an LA +0 race with +2 Cha. Then there's Dragonwrought kobolds.

Warforged can be middle-aged (if you can find a good reason for it), granting Str -1 Dex -1 Con -1 Int +1 Wis +1 Cha +1.

[Cog]

Incarnate Construct in Savage Species gives LA -2 and makes you creature type Giant.

Primordial Giant in Secrets of Xen'drik is LA +0 and gives Int +4, Cha +4, with a Str and Con penalty and a few other benefits, it can only be applied to giants.
No matter how many times you post this build, it will remain an illegal one. :smallannoyed:

[Curmudgeon]

Do warforged get ageing bonus and penalties? if so you could be an old warforged
Sorry, but Old Age isn't possible. Warforged decay over time, which simulates aging, but only to Middle Age; they have no further aging effects after that point. See page 27 of Eberron Campaign Setting.

[PlzBreakMyCmpAn]

I'm almost certain there is nothing like that in official books, otherwise everyone would include it in builds.lol

I love this board.

The max cha at ECL1 without TO is +9. It is available in my optimi

[Thrice Dead Cat]

lol

I love this board.

The max cha at ECL1 without TO is +9. It is available in my optimi

Curse you, Candlejack! To be fair, there are multiple things. One of them is the Spark template from some Dragon magazine, -2 WIS, +2 CHA for +0 LA. Then there's the LA buy-off rules. Found here and Unearthed Arcana. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/reducingLevelAdjustments.htm)

[Big Fau]

+0 LA or rules to offset LA (It is to be used in a 1st level campaign)

A Forgotten Realms splat allows you to take penalties to certain rolls (Spell Resistance, Attack Rolls, Saving Throws) to play high-LA races/templates at lower levels. It's possible to play a 1st level Dragonwrought Kobold with the Dracolich template in this way (normal LA:+4).


I THINK is was PGTF, but I may be wrong on the source. I know it exists though.

[Thurbane]

No matter how many times you post this build, it will remain an illegal one. :smallannoyed:
How so? At a glance, it seems to work as far as I can tell?

Assuming a large Construct as the base, of course...

[The_Snark]

How so? At a glance, it seems to work as far as I can tell?

Assuming a large Construct as the base, of course...

Because it uses an acquired template to qualify for an inherited one, which does not make sense fluffwise and contradicts the Monster Manual's rules on applying more than one template to a creature (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/improvingMonsters.htm#addingMoreThanOneTemplate).

[Hirax]

To work through it step by step, the issue is that the base creature is required to be a construct for incarnate construct to be applied. The base creature needs the giant type for the primordial giant template to be applied, and they'd need to not be mindless for the phrenic template. So to get incarnate construct in there, you'd need to turn a giant into a construct, then apply incarnate construct to turn them back into a giant.

Also, incarnate construct takes away special abilties/attacks, so phrenic loses a lot of its advantages since you'd lose all the psionic abilities. Half-nymph gives the same abilities score mods with an additional +2 dex, it's a better candidate, for instance.

[Thurbane]

OK, but what happens when two Incarnate Constructs breed - is their child an Incarnate Construct, and also eleigible for other inherited templates? It's not at all cut-and-dried, IMHO...

[Hirax]

My hunch is they'd be sterile and not even interested, like dragonborn.

edit: though I did come up with a workaround for a character not interested in charisma that would probably get you pelted with books at any table. This is strictly for the most +ability score total.

Half-minotaur half-giant turned half- iron golem construct turned incarnate construct.
Total ability scores so far: +26 str, -6 dex, +2 wis, -6 cha, and con and int as non-abilities. While you lose out on the +8 con and -8 int thanks to becoming a construct. Primordial is optional, it would effectively get you -4 str and +4 cha since int and con get wiped out. Then you apply incarnate construct, and it specifically instructs you to roll 4d6 and drop the lowest to determine your int and con. At least when point buying you know you can dump 2 stats and potentially still have them be decent.

I think that works. For certain definitions of "works." Theoretically you could apply the half-golem template again at this point.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

After all, cases might also arise in which inherited templates, which are meant to be present from a character's birth, could nevertheless be acquired midgame. (http://wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20030824a)

There are official ways to gain an inherited template after an acquired template.

[Cog]

OK, but what happens when two Incarnate Constructs breed - is their child an Incarnate Construct, and also eleigible for other inherited templates? It's not at all cut-and-dried, IMHO...
There are some templates that are both acquired or inherited, IIRC. Whether or not that's true, Incarnate Construct is not one of them, and so whatever such an offspring might be (if it even is possible, which is up to the DM to determine), they would not be an Incarnate Construct. Incarnate Construct as a template is specifically the result of a spell printed in the same book, and no other means of getting the template are given.


There are official ways to gain an inherited template after an acquired template.
Those conversion rules are simply an alternate option, for the DM to allow or not as they please, as they are entirely dependent on plot. As the quote says, they can be acquired "midgame". Simply claiming them for your background without specific permission is not something even those expanded rules allow.

[faceroll]

Incarnate Construct in Savage Species gives LA -2 and makes you creature type Giant.

Only if you are a large construct. Vanilla warforged are medium, so applying Incarnate Construct makes you a humanoid.

Which is fine, because then you go necropolitan, the evolved 3 times, buy off evovled once at ECL4, then evolve again for a net of +6 charisma. If you can swing magic blooded and aging, that's +10 charisma. Throw some corpsecrafting feats on the necromancer leading the crucifimigation ritual and put it on a desecrated altar, and you've got yourself +6hp/level and some other tasty treats.

[Cog]

Only if you are a large construct. Vanilla warforged are medium, so applying Incarnate Construct makes you a humanoid.
There are various ways to make yourself large temporarily, and as long as you can maintain it for the spell's casting time (eight hours) it'll make you a giant instead of a humanoid, even if you revert to a medium size afterward.

[Mad Gene Vane]

Sorry to interrupt but what is LA short for?

[Cog]

Level Adjustment. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/intro.htm)

[dark.sun.druid]

A Forgotten Realms splat allows you to take penalties to certain rolls (Spell Resistance, Attack Rolls, Saving Throws) to play high-LA races/templates at lower levels. It's possible to play a 1st level Dragonwrought Kobold with the Dracolich template in this way (normal LA:+4).


I THINK is was PGTF, but I may be wrong on the source. I know it exists though.

This is absolutely amazing! I was never aware of this rule! There are several people I must inform straight away. Thank you very much.

[Big Fau]

This is absolutely amazing! I was never aware of this rule! There are several people I must inform straight away. Thank you very much.

You're welcome. Be warned, it can be very cheesy.

[erikun]

Reducing Level Adjustments (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/races/reducingLevelAdjustments.htm)

It makes playing a +1 LA not too bad, and +2 LA managable, at least if you're playing until 10th level or so. Above that, it's not as easy.

[Aron Times]

Sorry to interrupt but what is LA short for?

Los Angeles.

[PlzBreakMyCmpAn]

Rules quote check on 'some drag mag' and 'some fr splat'

Btw candlejack has never caught me.

[Big Fau]

Rules quote check on 'some drag mag' and 'some fr splat'

Btw candlejack has never caught me.

Player's Guide to Faerun, page 190.

[Thrice Dead Cat]

Rules quote check on 'some drag mag' and 'some fr splat'

Btw candlejack has never caught me.

The Dragon magazine should be 306, meaning it is technically 3.0. The CHA boosting one (along with the CON boosting one) is probably the best, largely due to it being +0 LA.

[Cog]

The Dragon magazine should be 306, meaning it is technically 3.0. The CHA boosting one (along with the CON boosting one) is probably the best, largely due to it being +0 LA.
Arctic gets you Con for Cha, which is a pretty good trade too, and there's a couple other LA 0 ones in that issue as well.

[Coidzor]

The Dragon magazine should be 306, meaning it is technically 3.0. The CHA boosting one (along with the CON boosting one) is probably the best, largely due to it being +0 LA.

306 should be Magic-Blooded, yeah.

What's this Spark thing that was mentioned?

[Cog]

306 should be Magic-Blooded, yeah.

What's this Spark thing that was mentioned?

Spark is an alternate name for Magic-Blooded. I think all the variants in that issue had two names like that.

[Coidzor]

Spark is an alternate name for Magic-Blooded. I think all the variants in that issue had two names like that.

...*facepalm* Dangit, Dragon-mag. :smallannoyed: I bet they did that just to mess with people who were going to try to discuss it.

[Shadowknight12]

Star elves are a +CHA, -CON race from Faerun. I believe they originally appeared in Unapproachable East. They have the Extraplanar subtype and they can confer the Ghost Touch property to the weapons and armour they wear.

[averagejoe]

The Mod They Call Me: Thread necromancy.