Doppelganger as a character

[hobbitkniver]

I'd like to invent a character who is actually a doppelganger but will try to pass as an elf to the party for as long as possible. He will eventually have to fess up, and I need a hook as to why a doppelganger is adventuring in disguise for so long. I'm doing this because my DM decided that LA is stupid and ignores it and I'm the only character who doesn't have LA because my party is drows, half dragon, sord arkon and tiefling. I'm feeling a little usless as a legitimate character and maybe having a complete party of level adjustment will shock him out of his delusions. I couldn't find very much about doppleganger society in the Monster Manual and was wondering what the playground could contribute.

[Dr.Epic]

You have a bounty on your head and posed as an elf as a cover. Also, in the party you have decoys but over time you being to like your fellow party member and feel like telling them the truth.

Best I could come up with.

[Milo v3]

Whats your class?

[Winds]

Dopples normally pose as a member of a race until there's reason to do otherwise. No one likes dopples. Most dopples give them reason.(That is, all races are listed as disliking them. Exceptions are always possible, but that person would likely be very strange.) Dopples basically keep their disguise up until revealed or back home in Whatevertheplaceiscalled. What's more, you've got him taken up with a band of LA'd adventurers. It's basic survival instinct to stay hidden from them.

[Veyr]

Races of Destiny has an entire section on Dopplegangers, IIRC. Certainly plenty of Doppleganger-related material (including the excellent Chameleon).

[Elric VIII]

In Races of Destiny it mentions that Dopplegangers often try to integrate into Human society, having so real society of their own. They are described as having an overwhelming feeling of wantion to belong.

It also mentions that scholars speculate that Dopplegangers were once Human. Maybe you could be an Elf-descended Doppleganger.

[hobbitkniver]

Whats your class?
I am a ranger.

[Veyr]

Ouch. I'm sorry to hear that; my condolences. That... probably has more to do with your intra-party balance issues than LA does, sorry to say.

[Milo v3]

Doppelganger Ranger
Doppelgangers are feared by most because of there ability to be anyone and know your secrets.
Rangers live apart from society in the wilderness.

You home and forest (Or other terrain) could have been destroyed so you had move into civilised land. But as you were still an outside you decided you join with other outcasts from society in this case drows, a half dragon, sord arkon and a tiefling.

[hobbitkniver]

Ouch. I'm sorry to hear that; my condolences. That... probably has more to do with your intra-party balance issues than LA does, sorry to say.

Is one class really so bad that I can't be useful as it?

[Milo v3]

Whats wrong with Rangers? :smallconfused:
3.0 Rangers sucked but 3.5 are pretty decent. Especially with all the free feats.

[HunterOfJello]

Have you considered playing a Changeling instead of a Doppleganger? Even ignoring the +4 LA, Dopplegangers still start out with 4 racial hit die.

Also, you just finished watching Doctor Who today didn't you?

[hobbitkniver]

Have you considered playing a Changeling instead of a Doppleganger? Even ignoring the +4 LA, Dopplegangers still start out with 4 racial hit die.

Also, you just finished watching Doctor Who today didn't you?

My DM doesnt believe in LA. Thats most of the problem.

[Divide by Zero]

My DM doesnt believe in LA. Thats most of the problem.

But RHD aren't LA. Is your DM ignoring them too, or unaware of them? If you do have to take them, then you'll be significantly better off as a changeling with a template or two.

[Cealocanth]

How's this for a backstory?

You were adopted under a family of elves and raised in Wherevertheylive as a child. Your parents were Dopplegangers, and, when they feared that having a child knee deep undercover in human/elven society would destroy the evil political takeover they were slowly staging, they abandoned the baby and used an enchantment to place it under an elven disguise.

And so you were raised under an elven family and trained as a ranger, but in the later years of puberty, your doppleganger origin manifested itself, and you were forced to abandon your family and elven lands in cover of night in order to preserve your life from those who hunted creatures like you. In the forests, you eventually learned to disguise yourself, and at the age of (closely after adulthood), you traveled to human society disguised as the elf you grew up as. You hoped to find a new life in the accepting cultures of human trade society, but the wild chaotic origin of your species and the call of the wild convinced you to take up the bow once again, and pursue the riches of the world as an adventurer.

[Veyr]

Is one class really so bad that I can't be useful as it?
Whats wrong with Rangers? :smallconfused:
3.0 Rangers sucked but 3.5 are pretty decent. Especially with all the free feats.
Your Animal Companion has a fairly-decent chance of becoming a warrior about as good as you are, and it's already weaker than a Druid's. The bonus feats are overall fairly meh since they're both attack styles that rely on many attacks, but the Ranger has no (realistic) source of extra damage. Favored Enemy is a joke, but it's not funny and is possibly insulting. Camouflage and Hide in Plain Sight are both excellent class features that come way, way too late.

In short, the Animal Companion and the spells are the only things the Ranger has that are all that good, and both are strictly-weaker versions of the Druid class features. That leaves very little mechanical reason to take the class.

That's... that's pretty much all there is to say on the matter. It's an OK source of free feats, and that many skill points on a full BAB class is rare, but ultimately a straight Ranger doesn't have enough unique features that are worthwhile.


Although, I suppose Hunter's Eye can fix a lot of the Ranger's problems. There are some good Ranger spells; it's a shame they get so very few per day.

[hobbitkniver]

Your Animal Companion has a fairly-decent chance of becoming a warrior about as good as you are, and it's already weaker than a Druid's. The bonus feats are overall fairly meh since they're both attack styles that rely on many attacks, but the Ranger has no (realistic) source of extra damage. Favored Enemy is a joke, but it's not funny and is possibly insulting. Camouflage and Hide in Plain Sight are both excellent class features that come way, way too late.

In short, the Animal Companion and the spells are the only things the Ranger has that are all that good, and both are strictly-weaker versions of the Druid class features. That leaves very little mechanical reason to take the class.

That's... that's pretty much all there is to say on the matter. It's an OK source of free feats, and that many skill points on a full BAB class is rare, but ultimately a straight Ranger doesn't have enough unique features that are worthwhile.


Although, I suppose Hunter's Eye can fix a lot of the Ranger's problems. There are some good Ranger spells; it's a shame they get so very few per day.

What is Hunter's Eye? Is it a book?

[Veyr]

Spell in Spell Compendium. Gives you some Sneak Attack dice, which will help you do real damage.

Also/alternatively, Swift Hunter in Complete Scoundrel combined with Scout from Complete Adventurer is OK-ish in low-op games, I've heard. I don't think too highly of it, but then I don't think too highly of any class that relies on ordinary attacks, bonus damage or not.

[Milo v3]

If you think Favoured Enemy is a joke then subsitute it with Favoured Terrain (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/classFeatureVariants.htm).

Also its Druid (Pretty Overpowered) mixed with Fighter (Pretty underpowered) and is actually not bad. I played one and it was fine when it comes to Party Balance.

[Veyr]

If you think Favoured Enemy is a joke then subsitute it with Favoured Terrain (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/classFeatureVariants.htm).
Better, but not a lot.

Yes, there's a major problem with Favored Enemy in that it doesn't apply all that often (unless you go with Arcanists), but it isn't that impressive even if you have it applying! +10 damage is nothing at level 20. Hell, +2 damage isn't particularly impressive at level 1, for that matter!


Also its Druid (Pretty Overpowered) mixed with Fighter (Pretty underpowered) and is actually not bad. I played one and it was fine when it comes to Party Balance.
Druid is over-powered, no doubt about that, but it's also far better designed than the Fighter or the Ranger. Also, while the Ranger is marginally better than (non-Dungeoncrasher) Fighters, neither is good. Your anecdote doesn't really mean much; it worked in your party, it would not, for example, in mine.

But I was talking more about the game as a whole, with an eye towards meeting level-appropriate challenges as (poorly, I'll admit) defined by the CR system. The Druid is overpowered because it trivializes supposedly level-appropriate encounters. The Fighter and Ranger are underpowered because they struggle with a great many level-appropriate challenges when those challenges do not involve fighting an enemy on reasonably favorable terrain. Neither's particularly close to the ideal balance, but at least one can "dumb down" the Druid; optimizing a Fighter or Ranger enough to be flexibly competent is a very, very difficult thing to do.


Moreover, my point was that considering that the Ranger is on the lower end of the power spectrum, there is a reasonably high chance that those who are overshadowing him are playing higher-powered, or even over-powered classes. With the Ranger, there's a fair few classes that are worse, but there's quite a bit more classes that are better.

Especially if you aren't optimizing the Animal Companion and those spells pretty hard.

[hobbitkniver]

Better, but not a lot.

Yes, there's a major problem with Favored Enemy in that it doesn't apply all that often (unless you go with Arcanists), but it isn't that impressive even if you have it applying! +10 damage is nothing at level 20. Hell, +2 damage isn't particularly impressive at level 1, for that matter!


Druid is over-powered, no doubt about that, but it's also far better designed than the Fighter or the Ranger. Also, while the Ranger is marginally better than (non-Dungeoncrasher) Fighters, neither is good. Your anecdote doesn't really mean much; it worked in your party, it would not, for example, in mine.

But I was talking more about the game as a whole, with an eye towards meeting level-appropriate challenges as (poorly, I'll admit) defined by the CR system. The Druid is overpowered because it trivializes supposedly level-appropriate encounters. The Fighter and Ranger are underpowered because they struggle with a great many level-appropriate challenges when those challenges do not involve fighting an enemy on reasonably favorable terrain. Neither's particularly close to the ideal balance, but at least one can "dumb down" the Druid; optimizing a Fighter or Ranger enough to be flexibly competent is a very, very difficult thing to do.


Moreover, my point was that considering that the Ranger is on the lower end of the power spectrum, there is a reasonably high chance that those who are overshadowing him are playing higher-powered, or even over-powered classes. With the Ranger, there's a fair few classes that are worse, but there's quite a bit more classes that are better.

Especially if you aren't optimizing the Animal Companion and those spells pretty hard.

Not so much, we have a pool of players too large for a party and only some show up each time. We have a few fighters, another ranger, a rogue played by a very bad player. Even without the LA, the drow all still suck maybe as players if not characters.

[Veyr]

Not so much, we have a pool of players too large for a party and only some show up each time. We have a few fighters, another ranger, a rogue played by a very bad player. Even without the LA, the drow all still suck maybe as players if not characters.
Then I suppose I missed my guess. Carry on.

[Elric VIII]

Just an idea: PrC Ranger.

You can start out with Druid 4/SA Fighter 1/PrC Ranger 15.

If you take SA Fighter with the Hit-and-Run variant you can add Dex and 1d6 SA to your attacks, plus Craven will allow you to add your level to damage as well.

This has the benefit of better spells than a Ranger, at the cost of only 1 BAB. Best of all, you can now cast Ranger-only spells from your Druid spell slots, so Hunter's Eye becomes less of a drain on your resources. Also, your AC has full progression, -1 for that level of Fighter.

You can find the class here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/prestigiousCharacterClasses.htm) at the bottom of the page.