Which character do you most empathise with?

[Jubal_Barca]

Just out of interest, which character in OOTS do all of us find we have most in common with? Doesn't have to be an order member, or even a good guy (hell, in the empathy stakes for me Redcloak easily beats Elan, Haley, Belkar, and probably Roy).

I'd be interested to see which alignments and which classes of character tend to feature most strongly, too.

I'll make a tally chart here:

Blackwing 1
O-Chul 1

---------------------------

As for myself, I empathise most with Blackwing. I know that's a slightly odd choice but hey... Blackwing's a fairly physically/power-wise weak character whose main attributes are being pretty intelligent and good at advice (often a situation I end up in), and he's also (this is a guess) at the NG end of TN if not fully NG (which I'd say was my own alignment).

[Tanngrisnir]

I'd say Roy if it were not for his treatment of Belkar. I like how Roy attempts to do the right thing, to be the good guy and the hero. I like his outlook on life and his determination, but I really disagree with him on Belkar. Not trying to start a Belkar debate, but I would have killed the little sucker or incarcerated him in a much better way.

Maybe O'Chul then. Same sort of outlook, with the willingness to deal to Belkar if he deems it necessary.

[ORione]

Vaarsuvius. Mainly because I go to great lengths to avoid asking for help (although I think I would stop before I sold my soul).

Edit: I also tend to be the smartest person in the room, which gets to my head sometimes.

[sims796]

Without a doubt, Belkar. For yuo see, I too was the smallest and weakest of my class, never allowing me to play in any gym class games. I had always dreams of growing up as a sucsessful adve- I mean, official, then come back to my home town where I could be accepted...and "arrest" them in their sleep. Arrest them all.

[Zubzub]

Hobgoblin Cleric #2. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0703.html)

[Kish]

Empathize...with an OotS character? I...I don't understand...

If I have to pick one, probably Celia. Not that I empathize with her muchat all really.

[Flame of Anor]

Vaarsuvius, definitely. Though again I don't think I'm quite as bad as s/he was about asking for help.

[Phishfood]

Definately Roy. I'm surrounded by frickin idiots here people!

[ThePhantasm]

Without a doubt, Belkar. For yuo see, I too was the smallest and weakest of my class, never allowing me to play in any gym class games. I had always dreams of growing up as a sucsessful adve- I mean, official, then come back to my home town where I could be accepted...and "arrest" them in their sleep. Arrest them all.

Did they never allow you to play throw the rock, throw the stick, or throw the rock and then the stick shortly thereafter?

I don't know who I really empathize with most. Possibly Roy, since I'm the eldest brother in a large family and that comes with a lot of responsibility. He kinda has that role in the OOTS, and I also like that he always tries to do what is right, even when he fails. He's also got my sense of dry humor. TBH, most of the strips I laugh at are Roy's witty remarks (or Belkar's sarcasm).

[dps]

I'd say Daigo.

[Goosefarble]

It's definitely Vaarsuvius for me. S/he realises too late that s/he has neglected his/her family, but s/he still needs to help his/her friends, and thus can't be with them. And then his/her mate divorces him/her. That's probably the most upsetting thing about the comic for me.

[FujinAkari]

Hinjo. I have to make perfect decisions off imperfect information :)

[Katana_Geldar]

Elan, definitely Elan. And I do use stories and films to try and work out the world.

[Tjarnet]

I'd say Roy. Everyone around me-with a few exceptions-is idiotic, or at least seems that way.

[Gift Jeraff]

I was going to say Roy, because he is a realistic standard of Good. Plus, I always considered him Neutral Good (barely so pre-development), leaning slightly towards Law, which is what I would consider myself if I had to put myself into a two-dimensional alignment system.

But I think I'll have to go with Blackwing. For all the reasons the OP gives (except the advice part, I'm terrible at advice), plus his dialogue just feels the most natural.

[Matticus]

Tsukiko.

Don't judge me!

[Flame of Anor]

Tsukiko.

Don't judge me!

*tries hard not to judge*

*fails*

[H Birchgrove]

Some times Elan, some times Belkar.

[MSK]

I'd say Daigo.
Would that be because you also avoid revealing your family name in case you're mortally wounded and need to give yourself an extra boost of nominal importance? :smallconfused:

[Kish]

*tries hard not to judge*

*fails*
*judges* :miko:

[Blackcloak]

Elan. I'm an exuberant music lover with a happy go lucky attitude towards life. My intelligence/ wisdom scores are higher than Elan's though :elan:

[LrdoftheRngs]

Probably Roy, because sometimes it feels like I'm the only person that's not idiotic, insane, or a combination of the two in my class grade school.

[Demonicbunny]

I'd say Red Cloak. If I was in his metaphorical shoes (although it looks like he isn't wearing any), being a goblin and all, I'd be hard pressed to find an occasion where I wouldn't make the same choices.
Possibly with the exception of Start of Darkness.

[Blue Ghost]

I want to say O-Chul, but I really doubt I can match his level of goodness. Beyond him, I have no idea.

[Eruantion]

I'd say Redcloak. He's had a tough life, but he's done good for himself anyway. He really has to roll with the punches life throws him, and despite his being the high cleric of his god, there have been a lot. I mean, look at his current situation. He's constantly surrounded by idiots and layabouts, one of whom he takes orders from. He could probably destroy Xykon anytime he wanted, but he doesn't because he has a mission. So yeah, I definitely say Redcloak on this one.

[Whiffet]

Vaarsuvius. I hate it when I can't do something on my own, and I find it very difficult to admit when I need help. Often I overestimate what I am capable of doing. Because of this, it's easier for me to put myself in V's place every time he/she gets the spotlight.

[SamBurke]

Elan. It's an odd choice, but I just love 4th wall gags. Heavens, I even use them in real life, where there isn't a 4th wall... at least, I'm fairly sure there isn't.

[Warren Dew]

Miko. Misunderstood by everyone, and perseveres even when the universe/author is against her.

[Flame of Anor]

Miko. Misunderstands the universe, and is against everyone.

Fixed that for you. :smalltongue:

[Francis Davey]

Elan. No doubt about it. He's closest to my natural character in outlook and manner. The main sticking point being that I am Lawful Good, but alignment aside other similarities are too strong.

After Elan, I'd pick Roy (for many of the reasons that others give, not least because I am an eldest child). I would have taken pretty much exactly the same tack with Belkar. His attempts to avoid killing people just because they are a different species are (in my view) admirable and his moral position is almost exactly where I am.

After that Hinjo or O-Chul I guess.

[martianmister]

Miko and Celia (Ironic, isn't it? :smalltongue:)

[squidbreath]

Elan. I'm pretty silly and chaotic in general, just a bit more on the neutral side.

[Psyren]

Fixed that for you. :smalltongue:

*applauds*

OT: Though I can't really think of any characters I don't have a problem with (which is of course a sign that they are all deep characters), I am very quickly getting a soft spot for Malack.

[Warren Dew]

Miko. Misunderstands the universe, and is against everyone.

The first part of that is also true, but not part of what I empathize with; her universe doesn't just misunderstand her, it conspires against her to cause her to misunderstand it - just look at all the coincidences when she's first tracking the Order that are needed to build her misunderstanding.

My universe doesn't conspire against me; it doesn't care. In that particular respect, I most empathize with the Oracle. Once you get past a certain point, the more you know, the less useful that knowledge is.

[Conuly]

Well, now that Belkar's proven himself to be a cat person, I definitely *sympathize* with him whenever something happens to Mr. Scruffy.

But empathize? Most relate to? (Other than the cat thing, that is.)

In real world terms, maybe Durkon, except as an atheist. And I like trees, too, because I like breathing.

[Psyren]

The first part of that is also true, but not part of what I empathize with; her universe doesn't just misunderstand her, it conspires against her to cause her to misunderstand it - just look at all the coincidences when she's first tracking the Order that are needed to build her misunderstanding.

The first meeting with the Order I'll grant you (since Roy detected as strongly Evil due to Xykon's crown and she had little other information to go on.) But her actions after that - especially against Shojo - were all her own fault.


My universe doesn't conspire against me; it doesn't care. In that particular respect, I most empathize with the Oracle. Once you get past a certain point, the more you know, the less useful that knowledge is.

I consider the ability to avoid Xykon to be very useful myself :smalltongue:

[ForrestFighter]

I must say, roy is really who i can empathize with, i always feel like i am the smartest one in the room, commonsense or not. And like there's always someone nagging me.

[The Succubus]

Nale, probably. I tend to have a habit of over thinking things but when my evil schemes do actually work, they can be quite impressive. I lack the level draining demonic girlfriend though.

[Psyren]

I lack the level draining demonic girlfriend though.

For most girlfriends those adjectives are redundant :smallwink:

[Tvtyrant]

Miko, because I too feel the need to be a megalomaniac and judge everyone around me.

[t209]

Elan, because of the clueless characteristics!

[Scarlet Knight]

:durkon: A strange, little man with no charisma & an overblown sense of duty...

[Gnome Alone]

Vaarsuvius. I know what it is to torment yourself with guilt over what you might have done. And I have a child, and can empathize with V's colossal over-reaction (familicide) to his children being attacked. V's family pathos in general really get to me.

[Querzis]

Well I'd be tempted to say Nale but since I'm mostly motivated by what seems fun at the moment, never plan ahead, never remember the name of anyone and got an attention span of 2 seconds, I guess Xykon would actually be a better choice...Should I feel bad about the fact that either way, the character I have the most in common with is totally evil?

[Caractacus]

Well I'd be tempted to say Nale but since I'm mostly motivated by what seems fun at the moment, never plan ahead, never remember the name of anyone and got an attention span of 2 seconds, I guess Xykon would actually be a better choice...Should I feel bad about the fact that either way, the character I have the most in common with is totally evil?

Do you really mean 'empathise with' though?

'Have in common' is a bit easier to achieve, I would have thought, and wouldn't require the amoral killing 'thing'...

[Stormwolf]

MitD... because I know what it's like to have a totally Evil boss ;)

[Querzis]

Do you really mean 'empathise with' though?

'Have in common' is a bit easier to achieve, I would have thought, and wouldn't require the amoral killing 'thing'...

Empathize can and often is used to mean «identify, have the same feelings or have the most in common» with someone, it doesnt just means sympathizing with someone. And when I read the OP post, I'm pretty damn sure that what this thread is about, who you have the most in common with. If we go with who I sympathize the most with though, I would say Roy or Right-eye but thats not what this thread is about.

[Warren Dew]

Vaarsuvius. I know what it is to torment yourself with guilt over what you might have done. And I have a child, and can empathize with V's colossal over-reaction (familicide) to his children being attacked. V's family pathos in general really get to me.
I empathized most with Vaarsuvius through that sequence as well. It's the apparent wimping out afterwards that I don't empathize with.

[FujinAkari]

Do you really mean 'empathise with' though?

'Have in common' is a bit easier to achieve, I would have thought, and wouldn't require the amoral killing 'thing'...

Empathise -means- 'have in common,' lol.

The difference between Empathise and Sympathise is that Sympathy requires the person to have gone through the same experience, Empathise just means that you relate to how they feel.

[BlackZaitan]

A combination of Belkars background, and O-Chul.
But if I only should pick one? O-Chul! Allways fighting for Good

[ORione]

I empathized most with Vaarsuvius through that sequence as well. It's the apparent wimping out afterwards that I don't empathize with.

What do you mean, wimping out?

[Virtu]

Depends how I'm feeling.

Vaarsuvius - Family issues that have led to serious guilt and an attempt to fix things when it may be a little late.

Roy - I often feel I'm at the limit of my patience with people, though I try to be the one to take control and do the right thing.

[Tannhaeuser]

I identify most closely with Clyde the Conjuror and Fruit Pie the Sorcerer. They pretty much live my life.

[Flame of Anor]

Empathise -means- 'have in common,' lol.

The difference between Empathise and Sympathise is that Sympathy requires the person to have gone through the same experience, Empathise just means that you relate to how they feel.

Well,


empathize verb intrans.
Exercise or experience empathy with or with; sympathize.

empathy noun
The power of mentally identifying oneself with (and so fully comprehending) a person or object of contemplation.

So your second definition was pretty good, but your first was off the mark.

[Warren Dew]

I consider the ability to avoid Xykon to be very useful myself :smalltongue:
I suspect the Oracle would have found the ability to avoid Belkar more useful.

[ORione]

I suspect the Oracle would have found the ability to avoid Belkar more useful.

Belkar stabbed him to death, and he was resurrected.

Xykon could...
SoD spoilers
... trap the oracle's soul in a gem if he didn't do what Xykon wanted.

Anyway, maybe the oracle doesn't want Xykon to win. Him trying to give Roy hints suggests that.

[Kish]

I suspect the Oracle would have found the ability to avoid Belkar more useful.
Wow. I knew lots of people on this forum overrated Belkar, but I don't think I've ever seen anyone suggest he's more dangerous than Xykon before.

[Hironomus]

Since, the question is who I empathize with and not who I am most like, I pick Elan (I am nothing like Elan).

Why can't everyone just get along? Why are people such big mean doodoo heads? Will I ever be semi capable or useful and able to effect the outcome of events in some small way(on a good day)?

Aw man I just hope there is a happy ending.

... "I can't... And yet I must!"

[Warren Dew]

Wow. I knew lots of people on this forum overrated Belkar, but I don't think I've ever seen anyone suggest he's more dangerous than Xykon before.
Belkar was obviously more dangerous to the gnome he killed.

Xykon doesn't kill people who are more useful to him alive. The Oracle is easily smart enough to know how to make himself useful to Xykon - or he would be, if he had free will.

[Fitzclowningham]

Durkon. He just tries to do the best he can, and he drinks a lot of beer.

[Sir Conkey]

Durkon all the way. I always end up playing the strait man to my friends wackiness, but do tend to get silly when beer is involved

ps. Also I hate being in the forest and think Thor is the best god out there

[Hironomus]

Belkar was obviously more dangerous to the gnome he killed.

Xykon doesn't kill people who are more useful to him alive. The Oracle is easily smart enough to know how to make himself useful to Xykon - or he would be, if he had free will.

If Xykon ends up inadvertedly destroying the universe, I am not sure the gnome will have been much safer had he been able to avoid Belkar.


Empathise -means- 'have in common,' lol.

The difference between Empathise and Sympathise is that Sympathy requires the person to have gone through the same experience, Empathise just means that you relate to how they feel.

I don't think empathy means that. If you can empathise with someone you are nothing like, I consider that to be a greater act of empathy.

[Querzis]

I don't think empathy means that. If you can empathise with someone you are nothing like, I consider that to be a greater act of empathy.

You are seriously confusing empathy with sympathy. You cannot empathize with someone you are nothing like, it would go against its very definition:
http://www.answers.com/topic/empathy
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/empathy

«the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.»

«This is originally a term used in psychology and aesthetics meaning 'the power of identifying oneself mentally with (and so fully comprehending) a person or object of contemplation'. In general use it tends to replace sympathy or feeling for when these words are sometimes more appropriate; sympathy can be felt without the element of personal experience that is implied by empathy
Read more: http://www.answers.com/topic/empathy#ixzz1OVHMjpUt»

Yes, in general use people tend to confuse the two words and use them as synonym but they have pretty different meaning. Empathy is all about identifying with someone like you or who had the same experience as you. It really does require the same personal experience, personnality traits and feelings matching the other person and can be used to just means «having in common» depending on the situation.

Like for example lets take me and Xykon again. If I would have been born a psychopath and given great sorcerer power? I would be Xykon. All it would require from me would be an alignement change from CG to CE and the ability to make zombies. But do I feel any sympathy for him? No, hes an evil bastard and I'm looking forward to seeing him get defeated by Roy. Because even though my attitude is nothing like Roy, I really admire him. Hes what a real hero should be and he has to put up with a lot.

So I empathize the most with Xykon but I have the most sympathy for Roy. They really mean two different things.

[Kish]

Xykon doesn't kill people who are more useful to him alive.
That information might be surprising and interesting to any number of the goblins Xykon killed.

Xykon doesn't kill people unless it's fun for him to kill them, and his criteria for determining whether it will be fun to kill them is remarkably similar to Belkar's actually.

[Raistlin82]

Poor poor Durkon.

[Toliudar]

You are seriously confusing empathy with sympathy. You cannot empathize with someone you are nothing like, it would go against its very definition:
http://www.answers.com/topic/empathy
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/empathy

«the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.»

Actually, empathy is what actors do all the time. It doesn't require that they be like someone, just that you have analyzed another's situation and can find ways to connect it to your own experiences. It can be an entirely internal intellectual experience, and doesn't require you to be like that person at all.

For me, I'd have to go Durkon.

[Ping Pong Along]

I'm going to go with Haley. I'm smart, have trust issues, and I like to save up money. I also like playing practical jokes on people, which seems Haley-ish.

[Warren Dew]

If Xykon ends up inadvertedly destroying the universe, I am not sure the gnome will have been much safer had he been able to avoid Belkar.
He would have lived longer.


That information might be surprising and interesting to any number of the goblins Xykon killed.
The goblins are just as useful to Xykon as undead as they are alive.

[Hironomus]

You are seriously confusing empathy with sympathy. You cannot empathize with someone you are nothing like, it would go against its very definition:
http://www.answers.com/topic/empathy
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/empathy

«the intellectual identification with or vicarious experiencing of the feelings, thoughts, or attitudes of another.»

«This is originally a term used in psychology and aesthetics meaning 'the power of identifying oneself mentally with (and so fully comprehending) a person or object of contemplation'. In general use it tends to replace sympathy or feeling for when these words are sometimes more appropriate; sympathy can be felt without the element of personal experience that is implied by empathy
Read more: http://www.answers.com/topic/empathy#ixzz1OVHMjpUt»

Yes, in general use people tend to confuse the two words and use them as synonym but they have pretty different meaning. Empathy is all about identifying with someone like you or who had the same experience as you. It really does require the same personal experience, personnality traits and feelings matching the other person and can be used to just means «having in common» depending on the situation.

Like for example lets take me and Xykon again. If I would have been born a psychopath and given great sorcerer power? I would be Xykon. All it would require from me would be an alignement change from CG to CE and the ability to make zombies. But do I feel any sympathy for him? No, hes an evil bastard and I'm looking forward to seeing him get defeated by Roy. Because even though my attitude is nothing like Roy, I really admire him. Hes what a real hero should be and he has to put up with a lot.

So I empathize the most with Xykon but I have the most sympathy for Roy. They really mean two different things.

Thats actually pretty much what I was trying to say :smallredface:
The last part anyway. I still think its totally possible to empathise with someone whose experiences you can never share. I am no etymologist, but I thought the sym in sympathy had something to do with shared or common experience. as seen in symbiotic and other words. Where as empathy was more to do with an abstract ability to accurately imagine what someone else might be feeling.


He would have lived longer.




But he might not get an afterlife.

[ScottishDragon]

Redcloak. He just wants equality for everyone,and to save his people. The humans oppressed him,so he rebelled. .......he's a green spartacus!!:smalleek::smallbiggrin:

[OoTLink]

Vaarsuvius because when I'm tired I sound a lot like him, and when I was going through finals week I had gotten to the part of the comic where he doesn't sleep for ages and stuff.. not unlike myself lol.