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Fridrik Bj
2011-06-03, 11:23 AM
Every now and then I see people on this forum ask about GURPS. Generic Universal Role Playing System and can be found HERE (http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/)

As a LONG time player of GURPS I thought I'd do some missionary work and answer questions interested people might have about the system. But I'm not quite ready to start from scratch, so I'm going to recommend the following interview with the line editor (Dr. Kromm) on the Ninja vs. Pirates podcast.
Found HERE (http://ninjavspirates.libsyn.com/nv-p-6x06-gurps-with-dr-kromm-sean-punch-part-1) and HERE (http://ninjavspirates.libsyn.com/nv-p-6x07-gurps-action-with-sean-punch-a-k-a-dr-kromm-part-2).

Now ask away :smallsmile:

EDIT: HERE (http://www.happyjacks.org/?p=871) is an interview with the whole GURPS team. A lot of basic ideas are explained in the early part of the interview.

jmelesky
2011-06-03, 11:43 AM
I haven't played since third edition. I know fourth edition came out and was hyped as simplifying things significantly, but i'm curious to hear how true that ended up being, from a long-timer.

valadil
2011-06-03, 11:54 AM
I'm playing a mage with what I think is the basic GURPS magic system. My information gathering spells are often subverted and my combat capabilities are underwhelming unless I spam cast Tickle. Is this an accurate view of how GURPS magic works or is my GM just opposed to magic? I may also accept that my build sucks, except that every other Mage I've seen play under this guy has been underwhelming.

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-03, 11:55 AM
I haven't played since third edition. I know fourth edition came out and was hyped as simplifying things significantly, but i'm curious to hear how true that ended up being, from a long-timer.

It streamlined everything and packed up the mass of splat book rules into a single book. It's the same system done better. My group moved over with relative ease and no one has talked about moving back to the old system.

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-03, 12:07 PM
I'm playing a mage with what I think is the basic GURPS magic system. My information gathering spells are often subverted and my combat capabilities are underwhelming unless I spam cast Tickle. Is this an accurate view of how GURPS magic works or is my GM just opposed to magic? I may also accept that my build sucks, except that every other Mage I've seen play under this guy has been underwhelming.

Mages in GURPS are a bit of a funny duck. In the base system you pay massive amount of points for your abilities and end up with a character that the average goblin will kill if he ever gets close enough. But at the same time you can do some nasty nasty stuff if given time or opportunity (Read fighter protecting you).

There are some alternative magic systems in the Thaumatology book that are i interesting, Unlimited/Threshold mana is the one we use.

Here is what I would do if creating a mage.

First talk to the GM about information gathering spells. If he thinks they are game breaking then don't take them. There is nothing worse for the GM than a spell that destroys his hard work creating a mystery. I would think that's what's happening in your game is that the GM is trying to do a mystery and you have the find item/person spell.

Second find yourself one kill if you fail save spell and go with that as your combat option. Apportation, Death touch, Invisibility, Lightning stare come to mind. There tends to be one per magic school and it's not the missile spell. Build the mage to have that spell at a useful level and then spells from the same school you are interested in. In summary, specialize.

warmachine
2011-06-03, 01:31 PM
GURPS, being generic, has lots of traits and skills that simply won't apply to any given campaign and genre. It is wise for the GM to produce a cheat sheet of applicable traits. Do you have problems with players using character concepts that make sense in the campaign but have too many traits and skills that are only marginally useful, rendering the PC not that useful? Do you wish GURPS had a better point cost mechanic for varying usefulness of traits and skills in the campaign?

DukeofDellot
2011-06-03, 01:33 PM
First talk to the GM...

This step.

Is the first step to building any character.

Unless your GM puts together a list of templates for the game (which takes enough time that that's not always plausible... I just finished the rough draft for a Character Template that took me ten hours... and now I get to do some editing!) you'll need to talk to him about how he envisions the setting, ask him if a character concept works for it, how he'd go about designing said character concept, and what optional rules are being used that apply for the character proposed. Even if he does build Character Templates and you choose to use one, you should probably ask him how he envisions the template functioning.

If a GM ever says, "Oh anything goes..." don't take that as an answer, you need this information. True anything goes games can be fun, but if the setting has been defined, you'll need to fall into suit, or you won't have nearly as much fun.

Personally, I go through the process of building the characters with my players. If you're Bad Gamer Gil, this process might take up to seven hours, but usually it takes around twenty to thirty minutes... but this is just one of my hang-ups.

The skill-based standard magic system wasn't built for Forth Edition, I love it, but at the same time despise it. It's a direct port from the old ways with a lot (more than any other GURPS 4e product) of mistakes and inconsistencies. Characters built with it tend to be less combat orient and more utility characters (Though the Body Control College turns this concept on its head sometimes). In fact, I would go as far as saying that the Balance between Fighters and Wizards are nearly reversed (as far as combat goes) between GURPS and D&D, unless you know exactly what you're doing...

If the GM presents a power beyond that, you'll almost always be better of choosing that over the Magic System, even if it's the "Standard Psionics System".

I will say that eccentric characters by devious players who enjoy acting out or expressing neurological dysfunctions into their characters can often be presented wonderfully by the "Standard Magic System" however. Having a giant bag of tricks is terrible fun. If you find yourself asking "Would I like to give my opponent some time out or a haircut?" when you should be worried about whether or not you want him to survive, magic is for you!

There is a middle ground though... if given the option, you can mix them. Taking a single "Power Ability" that represents your character's "Signature Spell" like a highly modified Innate Attack, Warp, or Telekinesis, will add a certain edge to your combat ability and help flesh out your character. I often allow this to my Spell Caster players... If Bad Gamer Gil isn't in the room...

Further, I guess one of my hangups with the system is that sometimes there's just oddities that seem too real to be a tabletop game. For example, every time a group sets down to an Old West game, someone wants to play a Swordsman... which is fine, and can be done efficiently... you just might have to compromise some of your focus. The easiest way to go about it, is to build a guy who's not quite the "fastest gun in the west but is known for unusual tactics" (already more flavorful than "I'm a swordsman!" in my opinion, but I degress) simply drop a little off the Guns (Pistol) Skill of a normal gunslinger and drop in some Shortsword and Fast-Draw (Shortsword), while fighting, you stick to cover (don't dash out in open, you twit!) and skip from spot to spot until your right on top of your foe, shooting at them with your pistol until you get there, then when they're about to reload, drop a wait action, and during their reload turn, rush them. Fast-Draw a machete, cut their gun hand off, then choose what to do with them.

Otherwise find a way to get Parry Missile Weapons to work on Bullets, many GMs will allow this with a specific Technique/Advantage, and pump that skill sky high since you'll need to handle a lot of bullets... and even then stick to cover whenever possible and don't charge headlong into battle.

You know what? Don't charge headlong into battle, unless you've got an insane Intimidate skill, or some sort of Innate Attack with Follow-Up applied to your big weapon and reliant on this tactic (or boatloads of Striking ST), you're not accomplishing much. Stand your ground and wait for your foe to make the first move like a real warrior, initiative is for gunmen, tactical defensive maneuvering is what makes a Melee character shine.

... I guess I'm just angry about something... I don't know... Ignore me if you'd like.

valadil
2011-06-03, 01:56 PM
First talk to the GM about information gathering spells. If he thinks they are game breaking then don't take them. There is nothing worse for the GM than a spell that destroys his hard work creating a mystery. I would think that's what's happening in your game is that the GM is trying to do a mystery and you have the find item/person spell.


He actually encouraged more non-combat stuff. I just don't think he was prepared for it. All the previous mages had been combat only, so even though the GM thought he wanted utility, he's had some trouble adjusting to it.

I think the other problem is that he wants mages to be less powerful than melees. Or maybe that's just how it is in his head that mages are withered old men with magic tricks and the real heroes are knights in shining armor. I'm not entirely sure where exactly he thinks mages should fall, but in his head it's the default. Because of that he had no reason to tell us he would be running mages weaker than we expected.

Salbazier
2011-06-03, 02:11 PM
Never played GURPS here.

How does economic is handled in GURPS. Like, do they have stuff similiar to Craft and profession checks in DnD? Do they have something for more complex economics?

DukeofDellot
2011-06-03, 02:34 PM
Do they have something for more complex economics?

They do.

At the start of the game you're given what is the... "Starting Wealth" which has a suggested amount based of the Tech Level of the game... but if your playing say a TL7~9 (Modern) game, you'll receive enough money to buy a home, vehicle, and whatnot in addition to your equipment and whatnot.

Then you have a cost of living, and if your character has a job, you can then calculate your wages which is based off the TL of the location (both where and when) the supply/demand of your job, the difficulty and danger involved, and the economic status of the country your in.

Unless you're say... an full-time adventurer, then you just sell off loot to pay rent. Which you could use the Merchant skill to help get top dollar for your plunder, or a Contact/Ally that you keep around to sell off your stuff for top dollar while you go adventuring!

...

Honestly, I never muck around with it, most of my players want to crash castles, sweep princesses off their feet, and pillage dungeons, not do taxes. But some groups do, and it works fine with or without.

One I do use, is that in the GURPS Magic, the one with the notorious "Standard Magic System" has a funny thing. The magical items have an "energy to create" rather than a price tag. You then use a formula to determine how much a point of energy costs based off of how much labor goes into creating it. If something has a low enough energy cost that it could be enchanted using the "Quick and Dirty" method of enchanting (where it's built all at once) rather than the... whatever the other one is called (where you build it slowly and surely but it might take a month or longer) then the item would cost much less per point of energy (and since it's fewer points of energy anyways, they're far more economical).

Then players have the option of buying second-hand items where they might have dysfunctions or require repairs for cheaper, or maybe commissioning a magic item, which might cost even more and then the PC would have to wait for it to be finished as well.

It all is well thought out and interesting to read even.

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-03, 03:05 PM
Never played GURPS here.

How does economic is handled in GURPS. Like, do they have stuff similiar to Craft and profession checks in DnD? Do they have something for more complex economics?

Well...GURPS is set up to play any game world you want to. Anything from Cave men (There was a 3rd ed book for that), to WW2 with werewolfs , to super-future Sci-Fi game where a player can play a sentient spaceship. The setting that comes with the book is a world hopping one were you can play in all of those at once. So having said that Economics of game worlds changes. But the main job/money system is set up so that a character can utilizes skills to make money. I'm currently playing a character that has the panhandling skill (Begging).

A character is set up into 3 main parts. His stats, His Advantages and Disadvantages and his skills.

His stats define what sort of physical and mental specimen he is.
---Strength, Dexterity, IQ and Health.
His Advantages/Disadvantages define his unusual abilities.
---High Pain threshold, Magery, Luck
His skills define what he knows how to do.
---Hit people with a sword, Sing, Cryptography and so on.

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-03, 03:09 PM
He actually encouraged more non-combat stuff. I just don't think he was prepared for it. All the previous mages had been combat only, so even though the GM thought he wanted utility, he's had some trouble adjusting to it.

I think the other problem is that he wants mages to be less powerful than melees. Or maybe that's just how it is in his head that mages are withered old men with magic tricks and the real heroes are knights in shining armor. I'm not entirely sure where exactly he thinks mages should fall, but in his head it's the default. Because of that he had no reason to tell us he would be running mages weaker than we expected.

Well, it has to be said that the old magic system is not GURPS strong point. You tend to get either lame ducks or gamebreakers out of it.

If your GM is up to it, as well as yourself, then next time maybe you should have a look at the Thaumatology book and find an alternative magic system. The one I am most interested in is a 'verb and noun' system they borrow from Ars Magica.

ShneekeyTheLost
2011-06-03, 03:16 PM
Well, it has to be said that the old magic system is not GURPS strong point. You tend to get either lame ducks or gamebreakers out of it.

If your GM is up to it, as well as yourself, then next time maybe you should have a look at the Thaumatology book and find an alternative magic system. The one I am most interested in is a 'verb and noun' system they borrow from Ars Magica.

Yea, one of the things they took out was being able to reduce the spellcasting time to 0 (although with a limit of one spell per round). This let you do things like load up a 3d deathtouch (again, for free) into a staff attack. So you did 3d6 which ignores DR, assuming you hit. However, he had to Dodge, because parry or block just discharged the spell into him.

Don't even let me get started on Flame Jet abuse... or Powerstone/Manastone abuse.

Trust me, 4e's magic system is much more balanced than 3rd ed's was.

The Cat Goddess
2011-06-03, 06:40 PM
GURPS 3rd edition Magic is...

Weak-to-moderate at low point values. When you're talking a 100-150 point base with 40pts in disads, you can generally build a character who is either good at assiting the party (healing, buffing or general utility) or pretty good with a couple of combat spells (Magic Jet skill 14-16 & Flame Jet spell at 16 means a constant 1d6 damage attack... if you can manage the spell at 21, you have a constant 2d6 damage attack).

Strong at mid-point values. When you're talking a 150-200 point base with 40-60pts in disads, you can build a character who is both magically powerful, and has enough Dex & Health (and fatigue) to maintain yourself in every combat. You've also reached the point where you're no longer required to specialize in either combat, healing, buffing or general utility.

Powerful at higher point values. When you're talking a 250-350 point base, you're at the point where even powerful spells are relatively easy and having most of your spells on a 25 or even 30 isn't too suprising. You're nearing 13th D&D casting in many ways... but if your game allows for Cinematic Rules from Martial Arts, then your fighter-types are keeping up in combat with you.

Weak at superhero values. Assuming you're using GURPS Supers, a 500 point base Super is much better than a 500 point base Magic User. There are some ways around this (Create/Control Elemental at skill 70 is easily do-able at this point value, and can give you a very powerful servant), but generally the maximum values of most spells prevent them from competing with Superpowers.

Lamech
2011-06-03, 08:20 PM
He actually encouraged more non-combat stuff. I just don't think he was prepared for it. All the previous mages had been combat only, so even though the GM thought he wanted utility, he's had some trouble adjusting to it.

I think the other problem is that he wants mages to be less powerful than melees. Or maybe that's just how it is in his head that mages are withered old men with magic tricks and the real heroes are knights in shining armor. I'm not entirely sure where exactly he thinks mages should fall, but in his head it's the default. Because of that he had no reason to tell us he would be running mages weaker than we expected.Well when it comes to inflicting damage of course mages should be worse at it. You're much more versatile. If someone is focused on killing things and you focus on healing/divining/buffing/shooting/utility ect.? And tickle is a death sentence; 60 turns of not being able to fight back?

Captain Six
2011-06-03, 09:18 PM
A question for 4e as that is what I play. Or rather want to play, I've never been able to decide on what rules to use and not use in order to start.

Magic, from what I've seen, is a very unbalanced system if you min-max. Even more-so than anything else I've seen. What are some good rules of thumb to curb abuse? Is it best to throw it out and work with powers instead?(a common suggestion I tend to see) I trust my players but as all newbies to the system accidental unbalancing would probably be very easy to pull off.

valadil
2011-06-03, 10:32 PM
And tickle is a death sentence; 60 turns of not being able to fight back?

It's better than a death sentence. The bad guy doesn't have to die. I can remove the boss from combat and make sure he'll be there for interrogation later. I think it's a good spell for 5 fatigue (I have 15), except that I've stocked up on powerstones (which is the GM's fault because he put nothing else in the setting that makes sense for mages). My problem with it is that it's so much more powerful than everything else. I feel like I'm choosing between tanglefoot and tickle. There's not a lot of middle ground.

navar100
2011-06-04, 12:18 AM
When I first learned GURPS way back when I really liked it. I preferred GURPS Supers over all, but it was still fun to play regardless. However, over time I became less enamored with it, and it's D&D's fault. I really liked in D&D your character can significantly improve in ability over time. In GURPS, you stagnate. Gaining 1, 2, or 3 skill points after a series of adventures is underwhelming. Skills you really, really want to improve are Hard or Very Hard, meaning even with 3 points you get a whole +1 to one particular skill if the math works. You can't gain new advantages or otherwise new special abilities that cost 10 points, 15 points. It became boring to play the same thing over and over.

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-04, 06:22 AM
A question for 4e as that is what I play. Or rather want to play, I've never been able to decide on what rules to use and not use in order to start.

Magic, from what I've seen, is a very unbalanced system if you min-max. Even more-so than anything else I've seen. What are some good rules of thumb to curb abuse? Is it best to throw it out and work with powers instead?(a common suggestion I tend to see) I trust my players but as all newbies to the system accidental unbalancing would probably be very easy to pull off.

I wouldn't go with powers. It's just as easy to break the game with that and more hassle to keep a track of what the player is doing. I would just read the magic chapter of the book or the Magic book and decide what spells are not available at the start of play. The really game breaking once I can think of for combat are Invisibility, Great Haste and Apportation. Don't take them away, just make them part of future treasure.

Invisibility basically makes the make un-hittable so he can just take his staff or sword, walk up behind the enemy, aim for the back of the skull, all out attack and to help his aim and bash the silly sods brain in. If he misses the enemy is at -10 or some such to hit him so he is safe.

Great Haste will do similar things for the mage, but the game breaker is if he casts it on his uber-figher friend.

Approtation is a save or die spell that has no prequests. Even the apprentice can have it. you just cast it on anyone. if he fails a will save you can lift him 1 yard per second for a minute. 60m drop will kill anyone. The way around that one is to just cap the allowed weight you can lift so you can't lift people. Then just create another spell called Greater Apportation that can lift anything.

If you start playing and find out something is broken, just talk to the players and figure out as a group what you want to do about it. Chances are that no one wants to break the game and most people will be happy to alter their characters in small ways.

EDIT: About what rules to use. Start with the basic Character and Champaign book. Then add Magic if you are doing fantasy. Then once you get the hand with that add: Dungeon Fantasy, Thaumatology, Martial Arts and/or Powers as needed. There are a few books that don't really have rules, but are good for specific setting: Low-Tech, High-Tech, Ultra-Tech, Infinite Worlds, Fantasy, Supers, Horror and more probably. Plus a lot of the 3rd Ed books are really good if you want to play in an historical setting (Rome, WWII...)

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-04, 06:27 AM
When I first learned GURPS way back when I really liked it. I preferred GURPS Supers over all, but it was still fun to play regardless. However, over time I became less enamored with it, and it's D&D's fault. I really liked in D&D your character can significantly improve in ability over time. In GURPS, you stagnate. Gaining 1, 2, or 3 skill points after a series of adventures is underwhelming. Skills you really, really want to improve are Hard or Very Hard, meaning even with 3 points you get a whole +1 to one particular skill if the math works. You can't gain new advantages or otherwise new special abilities that cost 10 points, 15 points. It became boring to play the same thing over and over.

If you like GURPS, but not the advancement rate then maybe the trick is to change the advancement rate. We often gave 5 points to players after each long session. It seamed good for us. If you want more then talk about it with your group and make it more. Just make sure that people aren't spending all the points on a single skill or power. You can get ridiculously good at using a spell or a sword if you put 5 points into it per session.

Then again, if you like the way DnD does it then maybe DnD is the game for you.:smallsmile:

Cybren
2011-06-04, 01:18 PM
If you like GURPS, but not the advancement rate then maybe the trick is to change the advancement rate. We often gave 5 points to players after each long session. It seamed good for us. If you want more then talk about it with your group and make it more. Just make sure that people aren't spending all the points on a single skill or power. You can get ridiculously good at using a spell or a sword if you put 5 points into it per session.

Then again, if you like the way DnD does it then maybe DnD is the game for you.:smallsmile:
I can not imagine a world where five points a session is too much

a_humble_lich
2011-06-04, 01:55 PM
I've felt for high powered games you need to give out more points. If you are playing a 500 pt supers game 3 points is nothing. You could probably get away with 10 or even 15 points per session and be OK (that is the same percentage of the starting value as 3pt for a 100 pt character).

As for balance and magic, all of GURPS is highly vulnerable to min-maxing. Balance for point buy systems is hard. GURPS 4e is better, but there can still be problems.

I view GURPS as having 4 different systems of "powers."

The basic system of stats/skils, and mundane advantages
Magic
Super/racial advantages
High tech equipment--specifically guns


Each is fairly balanced by itself, but when things are combined problems can arise. For example, with about 30 pts you can buy a ST of 13 and a sword and do about 2d damage. Or buy an innate attack power and do 6d damage. Or buy an AK-47 doing 5d damage, with a ROF of ten and still have 30pt to spend.

THe only real solution is the GM needs to be involved in the character creation process and be ready to ban thinks and set limits.

valadil
2011-06-04, 07:04 PM
If you like GURPS, but not the advancement rate then maybe the trick is to change the advancement rate.

I've never liked the advancement in any point buy games. Levels are more fun for me. The way to make point buy advancement work is to make it more like levels. At each level/4 session, give the players 10 points towards attributes, 15 towards advantages, and 12 towards skills. Or something like that.

mikeejimbo
2011-06-05, 04:30 PM
For magic, my group uses the Realm system from Thaumatology, except designed it around Mage: The Awakening's magic system. (Admittedly, the Realm system is a generalization of the GURPS Mage: The Ascension system, because White Wolf licensed a GURPS version of their core three WoD back during GURPS 3rd Edition.)

It's actually working out quite well. Rather than specifying everything to detail, we just pretty much use the rules from Mage: The Awakening, "translating" on the fly. It helps that the people playing spellcasters are all familiar with the Mage system, though. And it also essentially requires the Mage sourcebook as well as Thaumatology as additional resources. (You could probably get by without the core World of Darkness book, though.)

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-06, 05:04 AM
For magic, my group uses the Realm system from Thaumatology, except designed it around Mage: The Awakening's magic system. (Admittedly, the Realm system is a generalization of the GURPS Mage: The Ascension system, because White Wolf licensed a GURPS version of their core three WoD back during GURPS 3rd Edition.)

It's actually working out quite well. Rather than specifying everything to detail, we just pretty much use the rules from Mage: The Awakening, "translating" on the fly. It helps that the people playing spellcasters are all familiar with the Mage system, though. And it also essentially requires the Mage sourcebook as well as Thaumatology as additional resources. (You could probably get by without the core World of Darkness book, though.)

That is the main strength of GURPS. Anything you can think up you can model. It's also sometimes a problem, anything is doable and boundaries have to be set.

Lamech
2011-06-06, 05:49 PM
That is the main strength of GURPS. Anything you can think up you can model. It's also sometimes a problem, anything is doable and boundaries have to be set.
Yeah its really easy to break Gurps if you try hard enough. And by try hard enough I mean it breaks if your not careful.

Tael
2011-06-06, 07:03 PM
Yeah its really easy to break Gurps if you try hard enough. And by try hard enough I mean it breaks if your not careful.

Well, so far my group has played in a high fantasy cinematic setting, and a TL 8-9 setting with light psionics, and it's seemed relatively balanced to me. It's hard to make challenging but not lethal opponents, but that's just because GURPS is fairly realistic in it's injuries.

I assume that it breaks when you try and model supers and stuff, but that's only because there is no system in the world capable of modeling supers well.

ShneekeyTheLost
2011-06-08, 07:27 AM
GURPS 3rd edition Magic is...

Weak-to-moderate at low point values. When you're talking a 100-150 point base with 40pts in disads, you can generally build a character who is either good at assiting the party (healing, buffing or general utility) or pretty good with a couple of combat spells (Magic Jet skill 14-16 & Flame Jet spell at 16 means a constant 1d6 damage attack... if you can manage the spell at 21, you have a constant 2d6 damage attack).

Strong at mid-point values. When you're talking a 150-200 point base with 40-60pts in disads, you can build a character who is both magically powerful, and has enough Dex & Health (and fatigue) to maintain yourself in every combat. You've also reached the point where you're no longer required to specialize in either combat, healing, buffing or general utility.

Powerful at higher point values. When you're talking a 250-350 point base, you're at the point where even powerful spells are relatively easy and having most of your spells on a 25 or even 30 isn't too suprising. You're nearing 13th D&D casting in many ways... but if your game allows for Cinematic Rules from Martial Arts, then your fighter-types are keeping up in combat with you.

Weak at superhero values. Assuming you're using GURPS Supers, a 500 point base Super is much better than a 500 point base Magic User. There are some ways around this (Create/Control Elemental at skill 70 is easily do-able at this point value, and can give you a very powerful servant), but generally the maximum values of most spells prevent them from competing with Superpowers.

Even at the 150 point level, you can break things quite easily. It's all about setting up your prerequisites properly.

For example, Int of 15 (60 points), + Magery3 (35 points). Gives you an effective Int of 18 for purposes of purchasing spells. That's 95 points, before disads.

Sure, that's steep, 2/3 your build. But now you can spend 1 point per spell (a M/H skill) to get them at skill 15, which reduces cost of magic by 1 point. So all your one-point spells are now free. And anything you can maintain for 1 point is now infinitely maintainable.

Now, after a point or two in various other areas, you've got close to 50 points to spend on spells. So either you spend 1 point for a 15, or you spend 10 points on a 21 (IQ +3 on a M/H). So if you want, you can be a one-trick wonder with something like Deathtouch, that still has utility within his college.

For example, if you go for Deathtouch, you also have (at skill 15) Spasm (HT check or fumble your spell...), Stun (keep making HT checks until you recover, until then you are locked down), Might (buff for your tank buddies), Strike Blind/Deaf/Dumb (the latter of the two you can maintain for free), Curse missile (to launch the previous trio), Paralyze Limb (beatstick shutdown), and of course, Deathtouch (2d6 damage for free). You can also easily pick up Tanglefoot (trips opponent).

This gives you just enough space for Recover Strength at 20 (for 8 points) so you regain fatigue one every other minute. Which means you never really have to worry about the nova syndrome because first off, most of your spells don't cost that much, and second, you recover rapidly.

From there, you just keep expanding your repertoire. From Body Control, you can head into Movement and Mind Control for more lockdown and buffing ability. You should also pick up Lesser Healing and Greater Healing shortly as well. Until you run out of points.

And that's just at the 150 point level...

You could break a game with magic in GURPS 3e. I've done it. Many times. It is one of the reasons I approve of 4e's nerfing of the magic system, particularly insisting that you can never reduce the cost of a spell, or the casting time, below 1.

ImaginaryGirl
2011-06-08, 06:07 PM
GURPS was actually the very first RPG I ever played...well, unless you count a single session of dnd when I was seven (that didn't work out too well). I still have a lot of the old 2nd ed suppliments. Hey, they're great for research for just about anything!

But I still eagerly await the release of this suppliment. (http://rlfcomic.com/?comic=20101027-beastly) :smallwink:

Fridrik Bj
2011-06-09, 05:52 AM
GURPS was actually the very first RPG I ever played...well, unless you count a single session of dnd when I was seven (that didn't work out too well). I still have a lot of the old 2nd ed suppliments. Hey, they're great for research for just about anything!

But I still eagerly await the release of this suppliment. (http://rlfcomic.com/?comic=20101027-beastly) :smallwink:

Sounds like GURPS Bunnies and Burrows to me.