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View Full Version : Need advice on an Epic-level gestalt character



Hawkflight
2011-06-04, 04:14 PM
Alright, so I've never played an epic-level game before, much less a gestalt one, so I need some advice on this character. I'm trying to make a Samurai, here's my considered class progression:

Half-Fey (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20040213a) 2 / Frank and K's Samurai (http://www.dnd-wiki.org/wiki/Samurai,_Tome_(3.5e_Class)) 19 / Iaijutsu Master (http://www.angelfire.com/realm3/migdalia/Iaijutsu-Master.html) 8 / Swordsage 1 // Warblade 20 / Kensai 10

I might consider taking another level of Swordsage in replacement of a level of Kensai, if the DM rules that I can use Carmendine Monk to let Int apply to AC instead of Wis for Swordsage. If another class comes up that looks like it would work well with this build, I'll start ditching Kensai levels for it.

My problem here is MAD. There are feats (some homebrew) that can let me dump Con (a feat from Dragon Mag to let HP be based off Int instead of Con, for example), but I'm still seeking a way to let Int (or Cha or Dex) apply to Concentration instead of Con. I'm also seeking away to let Dex apply to katana damage instead of Str. I thought I could use Shadow Blade, but katana isn't a Shadow Hand weapon. But maybe I can get my DM to let me use it as a Shadow Hand weapon. If not, maybe I can convince him to let the Iaijutsu Master's abilities apply to a wakizashi as well as a katana. (The second option looks like my best bet.) Or ... maybe I can just find a way to get Str to apply to AC as opposed to Dex. Long shot, but ... *shrugs* (I also thought about a couple levels of Swashbuckler, but I'm not sure it's worth it, and it doesn't fir the flavor of the class I don't think). Int and Cha are indispensable, as class abilities are based off it, as well as Iaijutsu Focus. Wis is already a complete dump stat, so no worries there.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that I'll be taking a homebrewed "Signature Maneuver" feat in order to keep Inferno Blade constantly active. Also, I may end up homebrewing a 3.5 version of the Iaijutsu Master, I'll post here if I do.

EDIT 2: Thought I should mention my fluff. Basically, she's the daughter of a famous samurai lord. Due to her fey nature, she's smart and charismatic but rather on the petit side (4'5"). She has used her smarts, charisma, and exceptional dexterity, as well as her studies of the exotic 'sword sages', to overcome her paltry strength via the practice of iaijutsu and devotion to the wakizashi and become an exceptional samurai in her own right. She was betrothed to a young man, a student of her father's, at a young age and together they underwent the Faerie Mysteries Initiation, a sacred rite involving ... well we don't talk about that part.

Hawkflight
2011-06-05, 11:06 PM
Bump. 10chars

Tvtyrant
2011-06-05, 11:18 PM
I have never played epic either, but I question the lack of a casting option. That is the single strongest thing in D&D.

Divide by Zero
2011-06-05, 11:21 PM
Agreed. It's hard for non-casters to keep up pre-epic, but this is a whole different ball game. You should really aim for 9th level spells, especially if Epic Spellcasting is allowed.

Hawkflight
2011-06-05, 11:28 PM
I dunno. The ability to ignore armor, natural armor, cover, and force effects is pretty strong. As is the ability to deal literally over 1,000 damage in a single round.

Tvtyrant
2011-06-05, 11:31 PM
I dunno. The ability to ignore armor, natural armor, cover, and force effects is pretty strong. As is the ability to deal literally over 1,000 damage in a single round.

Right, but that is a linear ideal. Everytime your damage goes up so does their HP. It is the same reason that uberchargers that do even more than that pre-epic aren't as good as less "powerful" casters, because they basically get one trick. The Warblade gives you options, but not like a Rainbow warsnake or other tier 1.

Divide by Zero
2011-06-05, 11:32 PM
I dunno. The ability to ignore armor, natural armor, cover, and force effects is pretty strong. As is the ability to deal literally over 1,000 damage in a single round.

AC stops being important well before epic levels, and everyone and their mother can do that much damage. I think you're underestimating epic power levels.

Hawkflight
2011-06-05, 11:35 PM
Well, I was hoping not to do too much spellcasting. Mostly because i find keeping track of spells and such to be a losing battle, generally resulting in snapped patience, a deleted character sheet, and no more me in said game.

Divide by Zero
2011-06-05, 11:38 PM
Well, I was hoping not to do too much spellcasting. Mostly because i find keeping track of spells and such to be a losing battle, generally resulting in snapped patience, a deleted character sheet, and no more me in said game.

Then play a spontaneous caster (or better yet, a manifester). Very little bookkeeping.

Hawkflight
2011-06-05, 11:46 PM
Eh ... I dunno. I think I'd prefer to stick to my maneuvers. I also kind of value flavor, and major spellcasting doesn't really mesh with my character concept.

Maneuvers are just easier to keep track of.

Divide by Zero
2011-06-05, 11:53 PM
Eh ... I dunno. I think I'd prefer to stick to my maneuvers. I also kind of value flavor, and major spellcasting doesn't really mesh with my character concept.

Maneuvers are just easier to keep track of.

Flavor is mutable. At epic levels, everything you do is going to break the laws of physics in half anyway, so if you don't do much with a visible effect (e.g. focus on buffs and stuff), the difference between magical and extraordinary is mostly a mechanical one. Finger of death? You intimidated the opponent so hard that they were scared to death. Shapechange? Calling on the beast within.

As for keeping track of them, I suppose that's pretty subjective, though I'd personally think that tracking 9 levels of spells (or one pool of PP) would be easier than expending/refreshing dozens of maneuvers.

Hawkflight
2011-06-06, 12:14 AM
Hmmm ... well, is there a way to get access to a few 9th-level spells, that fit the flavor? I still gotta figure out the flavor of how she learned these techniques, but....

Divide by Zero
2011-06-06, 12:24 AM
The arcane variant swordsage is usually considered horribly cheesy, but then this is epic gestalt, so maybe not. Alternately, something like sorcerer or wilder could be fluffed as a combination of her fey nature and sheer willpower through training.

Hawkflight
2011-06-06, 12:27 AM
Hmmm. Well, I need a Shadow Hand maneuver so I can get Dex to damage with my wakizashi via Shadow Blade. So I'm not sure Arcane Swordsage would work. The rest ... perhaps.

Hawkflight
2011-06-06, 10:53 PM
So which spells should I choose?

Mystic Muse
2011-06-07, 09:53 AM
So which spells should I choose?

Gate and time stop are really nice in terms of 9th level spells. Time stop would even kind of make sense for this character.

Mind blank may be a good 8th level spell and I think it would make sense for the character as well.

I'll try to help more later.