[PF] Question on Summoner Archetype = Synthesist

[Drothmal]

Hi folks!

It'd seem that this archetype has interested a lot of people, so I wanted to open the floor to more questions on the archetype. Basically, feel free to ask any doubts on this archetype, since the idea is cool, but sometimes the wording might seem confusing

EDIT: This was the original post and the original question that started the thread

One of my players wants to make a synthesist summoner and he has asked me about having 4 arms and attacking with 2 greatswords

1) Looking at multiweapon fighting, it would seem that he could do both attacks at -2 each. Is this right?

2) I've also seen monsters like Xill with multiweapon expertise (no penalty). Could this be homeruled as a feat? Basically, it would take away the -2 penalty. And I know he can grow a lot of arms, but he doesn't have THAT many evo points


And, for clarification

-This is for a lvl3 to lvl 5 adventure (maybe continuing if things go well)

- I've read the fantastic guide on summoners by Saph. This question is more focused on the synthesist, which works a bit different from the standard summoner


Thanks!

[IthroZada]

Their is precedence for this with Diopsids in the Dragon Compendium, it pretty much works the same as Two-Weapon fighting, and the character still gets Strength and a half on damage rolls. He suffers the standard penalty for fighting with two weapons and carrying a non-light weapon in its off hand, though. So with the Two-Weapon fighting feat, -4 and -4. It isn't -2 because the off-hand weapon is not light.

[Drothmal]

Thanks! That is certainly a good guideline...

Could he use a two-handed weapon in the first set of arms and 2 light weapons in the second set for -2 penalties?

[IthroZada]

Thanks! That is certainly a good guideline...

Could he use a two-handed weapon in the first set of arms and 2 light weapons in the second set for -2 penalties?

If he takes the Multiweapon fighting feat, I believe that is how it would work out.

[Drothmal]

Fair enough. I'll discuss this with the player

Thanks for all your help! (and thanks to all the lurkers, it would seem that the page was quite visited)

And, any opinions on homebrewing multiweapon expertise?

[FMArthur]

I don't have any suggestions relating to Multiweapon Mastery. I don't know if it would be unbalanced to get it as a feat, but it would certainly be out of line with Paizo's (hilariously misguided) ideas on the value of such abilities. It takes a Two-Weapon Warrior fighter 11 levels to reduce such penalties, for example.

One thing you could consider in the combat style you choose is fighting with two one-handed weapons. If you take the Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting feat from Complete Adventurer you could TWF with one-handed weapons and hold them in two hands each while only taking the -2/-2 set of penalties. This has the advantage over light weapons because you could get all the benefits of wielding a weapon in two hands, such as Power Attack, and the advantage over two-handed weapons in that your penalties won't be as bad (and you still come out ahead of greatswords in average damage w/ longswords using Power Attack while having the choice of not taking extra penalties in order to hit).

[Drothmal]

Mmmm.. Interesting. I was trying to keep to PF only, but you make a good point (I guess I was willing to homebrew, so adapting a 3.5 is a lot less sketchy)

Actually, it'd seem that this archetype has interested a lot of people, so I wanted to open the floor to more questions on the archetype (I'll update the OP as such).

For example, I'd like to make sure I read it correctly

a) The summoner would get Darkvision at lvl 2. The PFSRD says that the eidolon does not have skills on its own, but that the summoner perceives through the eidolon's senses, gaining the Eidolon abilities

b) Can the skilled evolution still be taken? I'd say no, since eidolons don't have skills and a +8 to skills like UMD and perception to the main character would be really broken, IMO