What is this wizardry?

[Das Platyvark]

I have heard tell of these magic missile shenanigans, something to the effect of 200 unblockable damage. How might one pull this off?

[AmberVael]

I have heard tell of these magic missile shenanigans, something to the effect of 200 unblockable damage. How might one pull this off?

Well, a lot of how difficult it is or isn't will depend on your level. So, when answering this question, should one assume that you're asking about a level 20 build?

Personally, one of the better ways to maximize such things that I've found is to go Sorcerer and use Arcane Fusion spells (from Complete Mage) and Arcane Spellsurge to get off tons and tons of spells each round. With metamagic reduction and Twin Spell, you can theoretically get off about 12 spells per round this way... average of 3.5 damage per missile, five missiles per spell- oh hey, you're doing 210 damage on average, and that's assuming you don't add metamagic to the higher level spell slots (or use something like Force Missiles instead).

[DoctorGlock]

also using reserves of strength to uncap damage from spells. Just get stun immunity and you're gold.

[Bakkan]

Also, I have heard of a prestige class called "Force Missile Mage" that specializes in magic missiles and can do cool things like cause them to ignore spell resistance and so forth. It's from a Dragon magazine issue, I'm afraid I don't have the issue number.

[Silva Stormrage]

I don't know the exact dragon magazine but here is a link to the class.

http://raugh.net/marhaven/notebook/missilemage.pdf

[Necroticplague]

Remember that magic missile has two variable, numeric effects that can be influenced by metamagic. 1:Number of missiles and 2:damage rolled. So if you were to intensify it, you would get a spell where each missile did 10 damage (1d4+1 maximized is 5,doubled is 10), and shot 14 missiles (assuming force missile mage). A quick 140 damage, limited only by SR.

[Gardener]

Remember that magic missile has two variable, numeric effects that can be influenced by metamagic. 1:Number of missiles and 2:damage rolled. So if you were to intensify it, you would get a spell where each missile did 10 damage (1d4+1 maximized is 5,doubled is 10), and shot 14 missiles (assuming force missile mage). A quick 140 damage, limited only by SR.

For such feats, "Variable" means it can vary between two successive castings; that is, rolled. You don't roll for number of missiles, so Intensify won't double it.

[Yuki Akuma]

Magic Missile isn't unblockable.

At all.

It's SR: Yes and is negated completely by Shield.

[Gardener]

Magic Missile isn't unblockable.

At all.

It's SR: Yes and is negated completely by Shield.

Well, to be fair, Force Missile Mage auto-ignores any shield of their CL or lower, with a good chance of ignoring stronger ones (CL check, DC = shield caster's CL).

Isn't Dragon Magazine great?

[Yuki Akuma]

Well, to be fair, Force Missile Mage auto-ignores any shield of their CL or lower, with a good chance of ignoring stronger ones (CL check, DC = shield caster's CL).

Isn't Dragon Magazine great?

I guess I'd better start casting nightshield instead!

Isn't Spell Compendium great? :smallwink:

[Necroticplague]

For such feats, "Variable" means it can vary between two successive castings; that is, rolled. You don't roll for number of missiles, so Intensify won't double it.

It doesn't say anything to that effect, it simply says



All variable, numeric effects of an intensified spell are maximized, then doubled.

Let us take a look at the number of missiles fired. Is it a numeric effect? Yes, it certainly is. No argument their. Now, does it count as a variable? By at least a definition I know of,it is. Can the number be changed under circumstances? Yes, it can (by increasing your caster level). More specifically, it is a dependent variable, based upon your caster level (which in and of itself is dependent variable based upon your levels in a spell casting class+ bonuses from other sources).



a variable in a logical or mathematical expression whose value depends on the other variable; "if f(x)=y, y is the dependent variable"

Magic missiles missile can indeed be represented this way, and is done so in the description of the spell.

if f(x)=y
if your caster level is 9 or higher=you shoot 5 missiles.

Since it is a specific type of variable, it counts as a variable (in the same way my pet is a dog since it is a great dane, which is a type of dog).

[Yuki Akuma]

The number of magic missiles you create is not variable. It depends on your caster level.

Variable, numeric results are only the ones you roll dice for. This is how it's always worked. Intensify Spell doesn't increase range, either, despite that also changing as your CL increases.

Sorry, you're extremely wrong. Metamagic has never worked like that.

[Gardener]

*snip*

Empower Spell uses exactly the same wording - all variable numeric effects of the spell are increased by one-half. As the example in the PHB, they use magic missile, and specify that you roll 1d4+1 and multiply it by 1.5 for each missile. No mention is made of multiplying the number of missiles by one-half, or its range, which is also varies nonrandomly with level and is expressed as a number. Thus, in this contect, "variable numeric effect" means something more than the strict mathematical definition (which I am quite aware of). It means "randomly generated numeric effect".

[Urpriest]

Force Missile Mage also made it into the Dragon Compendium, IIRC.

[Divide by Zero]

Every time I see Force Missile Mage, I feel sad. The flavor is cool, and it looks like it could be made to be a good blaster, but by the level you can take the class, magic missile sucks, and the bonuses it gives aren't enough to make it not suck.

[holywhippet]

I wouldn't say magic missile sucks. It has the benefit of being perfectly accurate unless it is blocked with a shield spell - no to hit roll, no saving throw, just a spell resistance check and not that many enemies can make those. It's also force damage which most monsters have no resistance or immunity to.

[Divide by Zero]

I wouldn't say magic missile sucks. It has the benefit of being perfectly accurate unless it is blocked with a shield spell - no to hit roll, no saving throw, just a spell resistance check and not that many enemies can make those. It's also force damage which most monsters have no resistance or immunity to.

Yes, but by mid levels, the damage is so low that it really doesn't matter how easy it is to hit, because you're basically wasting your turn anyway.

[Yuki Akuma]

Yes, but by mid levels, the damage is so low that it really doesn't matter how easy it is to hit, because you're basically wasting your turn anyway.

It's a first level spell. That you, a full-caster, specialises in.

There's a ton of room for metamagic.

How about Energy Admixture? Now you're dealing double damage.

Twin Spell? Now you're casting it twice!

How about a nice Quicken Spell to get off two in a round? You have the spell slots for it!

[AmberVael]

How about Energy Admixture? Now you're dealing double damage.

Magic Missile does not deal energy damage, and therefore Energy Admixture does not apply to it.

Empower would be fine though. Not quite as potent, but cheaper.

[Doc Roc]

Combust + war Mage Prc is so much better it is dumb. Or reserves of strength.

Mmissile is a very poor mm seed spell. Your best bet is War Mage Prc + reserves, empowered spell shards, a mitigation effect for twin spell, then trying to fire off as many as you can.

[Urpriest]

Combust + war Mage Prc is so much better it is dumb. Or reserves of strength.

Mmissile is a very poor mm seed spell. Your best bet is War Mage Prc + reserves, empowered spell shards, a mitigation effect for twin spell, then trying to fire off as many as you can.

IIRC, Spellweaver Shapechange shenanigans are only fully exploitable with magic missile or the like. Not that that's a particularly important concern.

[Doc Roc]

IIRC, Spellweaver Shapechange shenanigans are only fully exploitable with magic missile or the like. Not that that's a particularly important concern.

Actually, it was a thing I was thinking about... You can get some pretty good mileage out of them with combust though. You'll need to do something about its range but, you know, I hear you're into the mitigation of metamagic.

Let's see...
What are the requirements for force missile mage?

[MountainKing]

Magic Missile does not deal energy damage, and therefore Energy Admixture does not apply to it.

Empower would be fine though. Not quite as potent, but cheaper.

Actually, Force Missile Mage allows you to add an energy descriptor of your choice when you're casting Magic Missile. They get the ability after only two levels of the PrC.

[I, Dashing Cube]

Magic missile isn't a great damage spell, but put Fell Drain on it and it becomes a great debuff (cheap too, especially with metamagic reducers), and frankly that is really what you should be doing.
But if you want damage, be Sorcerer for more spells/round, stack metamagics and go War Mage (Dragonlance). Go into Force Missile Mage if you only use magic missile because you'll lose a lot of versatility.

[Yuki Akuma]

Magic Missile does not deal energy damage, and therefore Energy Admixture does not apply to it.

Empower would be fine though. Not quite as potent, but cheaper.

We're talking abotu Force Missile Mage.

They get a class feature that gives their Magic Missiles an energy descriptor.

[GoodbyeSoberDay]

Fell Drain helps on the 'weak offense' front, but a lot of enemies are immune to negative energy styled attacks.

To pile on, if you're able to cherrypick your favorite definition of a word and put it into D&D instead of using the RAW definition, you haven't just broken the game - you no longer have a rule system at all.

[Darth Stabber]

Magic missile is no match for crystal swarm. 20ft cone, 3d6 +1d6 per additional pp, no to-hit, no save, SR:no, and it doesn't have the rider "rediculously common defensive buff on every freaking spell list negates this". Of course it's piercing damage, but what ever, it is so close to being the perfect blasto spell (if only the cone was bigger).

[SiuiS]

A lark Shows that you can have all 5 levels of Force Missile Mage at level 6, but it requires shenanigans and a lenient DM.

requires combat casting (available @ 1st level) and ability to cast magic missile (also available @ 1st level). Requires 2 class skills at 9 ranks.

Since it's skill only, you can retrain wizard/cleric/sorcerer/warmage levels into FMM levels. Get access to AEG books, use the Skill specialization feat which, Among other choices, grants you +2 ranks to any skill you have ranks in. That's 2 levels earlier entry for 2 feats, which can be replaced when you level.

I know what my next mid-level character is going to be :biggrin: