Arena Tournament Round 101: Dare vs Pyhrric

[ArenaManager]

Arena Tournament, Round 101: Dare vs. Pyhrric

Map:http://i876.photobucket.com/albums/ab330/ArenaManager/Arenas/03-river_arena.png

XP Award: 300 XP
GP Award: 300 GP

Dare (http://www.coyotecode.net/profiler/view.php?id=9139) - Psionic Dog
Pyhrric (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=250696) - candycorn

All Combatants, please roll initiative and declare final purchases, if any

[candycorn]

Purchases Pending.

Init: [roll0]

[Psionic Dog]

:smallbiggrin: Dare made it! He'll level and medal! :smallbiggrin:
Three chears for the improbable flaw-less Duergar DragonBorn bard! :smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin:

Now to try for the even more improbable gold.
With Pyhrric acting first.
Hmmm.

1 Tent - 10 gp
5x MW sling stones - 30.05 gp
1 CL2 Scroll: (BeastLandFerocity, Expeditious Retreat) - 100 gp
1 Archivist crafted CL1 Scroll: (2x InvisibilitySwift, 1x CureLight, 1x Sleep) - 100 gp
----------------
240.05 gp

I touch pricey, but I think that covers all the basics. At least I'm spending less than a swim potion this time.

That's it for purchase round #1. Reserve right to reactionary buys.

[candycorn]

Purchase: Scroll: See Invisibility, Invisibility (300 gp)

Craft: Scroll: Magic Missile x6 (75 gp, -6xp)

[Psionic Dog]

Purchasing masterwork swim tool.

Oh, I'm going to be traveling next 4 days. no DQ please.

[candycorn]

Purchase: Scroll (Silent Image, Expeditious Retreat) -50gp

[TheFallenOne]

:smallbiggrin: Dare made it! He'll level and medal! :smallbiggrin:
Three chears for the improbable flaw-less Duergar DragonBorn bard! :smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin:

well, guess I have to pay the price then. Half-elf Ardent with knowledge mantle it was? For two Rounds, though I consider my part fulfilled if he happens to level after one

ANTE will hit the Arena once I have my 5th character slot. With two characters in the finales through the winners bracket, that will be in the foreseeable future unless I lose four out of four matches

[Psionic Dog]

*Dig dig dig*

Yep that was it.

Basically I was just restating your Dare.

I join your challenge of playing one of the most impaired creature you've imagined: A flawless Dragonborn Duergar bard. If it levels (and I'm betting it will in no more than two rounds) you Role Play a character dedicated the wisdom and example of yours truly, Psionic Dog. To reflect the Confucius nature of the character and pay tribute to my own psionic theme I'd prefer it be an Ardent with the Knowledge Mantel, although if you don't have access to the source a Cleric with Knowledge devotion would do, just don't go worshiping me. You'd be free to select the other Mantel/domain.

Actually, that does seem a little tame. Make it a PHB half-elf for the race, and fight in at least two rounds before retiring.

Mostly, I was just renaming the stakes if I won (was the first to complete) your challenge in return for the extra penalty, but if you would prefer a more personal challenge I'm sure we can come to an agreement. :smallcool:


http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3310/chaly.jpg

you must have some awesome idea if you think you can level a flawless dragonborn duergar bard in 2 Rounds... Let's see what you cook up

Well, for my stake, Ardent would fit better since you're Psionic Dog, plus I never played a psionic class before, would be a good opportunity.
Though cleric with Spell Thematics(Psionic Dog) would be interesting, attack spells that look like I'm throwing psionic dogs at my enemies, Summon Monster to actually summon psionic dogs(well, wolves that look like your avatar). Your choice, if you indeed make it.

@Candycorn
... no counters. Your start.

[candycorn]

I shall begin in: (open if you have LOS to my starting location):Y10, scroll in hand.

Please announce your starting disposition, or at least, what's visible from my starting location.

[TheFallenOne]

*Dig dig dig*

Yep that was it.

well, I think I came up with a solution somewhat decent
Meet ANTE, Dragonborn Heart Aspect Half-Elf Ardent dedicated to Knowledge and Time (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=310139)

Time and Knowledge is a kinda fluffy combination, Dragonborn fits as well since the lore of dragons is maybe the most ancient knowledge. You may complain about a knowledge guy with 8 int, but if you wanted more you should've given me a class that actually needs it :smalltongue:

[candycorn]

@Dare/Ante:I'd have personally made it a Flawless Half Elf Archivist, myself, with Skill Focus: (Knowledge-Local [Rules and procedures]).

Dark knowledge seems fitting...

[Psionic Dog]

ANTE/DARE commentary:
Eh, have you seen Dare's charisma? I'm not going to say anything about Ante's intelligence.

A dargonborn heart like Dare is totally unexpected, and yet somehow fitting.
I look forward to seeing what you do with it, but remember dragonborn costs 100 gp.

Good luck. :smallcool:

Dare - Round T-1
Starting with horse A11/B12, Tent B10/C10.
No starting LoS to Dare. (He does want to last the first round... :smallwink:)

@Refs (Starting Preparations/Equipment held)
The west tent-flap has been rolled up for easy entry/exit on that side.
All shields left at home.

<Pending waiting room question>
If hiding is a mundane preparation start hidden in A-10, Taking 10 for 13. (which Pyhrric can't beat with a 20 from her starting point
Else start inside tent at B-10.

Start holding new scrolls and bow.

[candycorn]

Horse, eh?

Hm.

Refs/LOS:Cast Spell from scroll (DC17):Invisibility.

CL: DC 4
Wis (If necessary): [roll1] DC 5

Not done.

Stats:Location: Y10
HP: 5/5
AC: 13 (FF 10, T 13)

Spells Prepped:Burning Hands, KFB
Ray of Frost x3

[candycorn]

Refs/LOS: I vanish.

Remainder:move to U8.

Done.

Stats:Location: U8
HP: 5/5
AC: 13 (FF 10, T 13)

Spells Prepped:Burning Hands, KFB
Ray of Frost x3

Effects Active: Invisibility 1/30

[Psionic Dog]

Assuming neither the horse nor tent are on fire...

Dare - Round 1

LoS
Swift: Cast invisibility on self.
Free: 5-ft step out of tent to A-10.
Move/Free: Mount horse. [roll0]

Not done, LoS useful.

[Sallera]

Refs:Nyar.

Dare:No LoS.

Pyhrric:No LoS.

[candycorn]

Posting to remind; still Psionic's turn.

Note to Refs: Please do not DQ my opponent. As this is a finals match, the only person that it delays is me, and I would not like to win the match that way.

[Psionic Dog]

Hmm. Right.

LoS
Ride to O-11/P12
Horse: Autosucceeds jump
[roll0] DC 15, on failure fall of in middle of jump.
Else dismount into O-13 [roll1]

Either way, try to fall/dismount sneaky-like to avoid giving away position.
[roll2] (including +20 invisible bonus)
Intent: hide self once invisibility wears off and the dwarf-shaped water hole until then. I believe assorted fell-mist precedent says concealment effects (like a fellmist robes, blur, or the empty water spaces) are also hidden along with the hider so long as other cover/concealment exists.

Contingencies
If fall: No damage (less than 20ft)
Sink to bottom.
Use remaining move action to walk along bottom to O-13/bottom.

If dismount fail:
[roll3]. (to avoid sinking)
Hold onto wall shore if swim fails.

If dismount succeeds:
Sink to bottom.
Move: Climb half speed 5ft back up.
[roll4]


The horse moves to G11/H12. O11/P12.

Done

Stats
HP: 9/9
AC: 16

[candycorn]

Pyhrric, Round 2

Refs/LOS:Cast Spell from Scroll:See Invisibility
CL: [roll0] DC 4
Wisdom: [roll1] DC 5

Not done.

[candycorn]

Refs/LOS:Move Invisible to V-12.

Hide: [roll0] (Include penalty for moving over half and bonus for invisibility)
MS: [roll1]

Done.


Stats:Location: V-12, Invisible
HP: 5/5
AC: 13 (FF 10, T 13)

Spells Prepped:Burning Hands, KFB
Ray of Frost x3

Effects Active: Invisibility 2/30, See Invisibility 1/300

[Sallera]

Refs:Spot for Pyhrric: [roll0]
Listen for Dare: [roll1]

Pyhrric:After casting your spell, you see Dare in O13-5, holding scrolls and bow. You may revise your turn from this point.

Dare:No LoS.

[candycorn]

@Refs:No change to turn. Need to set up my buffs before engaging, and the closest he has to see invis is Scent on his horse.

EDIT: Doesn't hold anything up. You're up, Psionic.

[Sallera]

Pyhrric:Are you making a Swim check to stay afloat or just sinking?

[candycorn]

@Refs:Swim, huh?

...Crap. I meant W-12, but misread the line.

If the amendment is allowed, then I'd like to go with W-12. If not, then:

Swim: [roll0]DC 10

[Sallera]

Refs:Almost forgot about that verbal component.

Pyhrric:The movement appears to be legal, so no revision. Dare's horse is in O11/P12.

Dare:You heard speech to the northeast, but couldn't make out the words.

[TheFallenOne]

ANTE/DARE
eh, I've been tempted to use a Heart Aspect build for a while, but the result didn't convince me compared to other builds I had in mind. With the Dare though it all works out, since breath weapon focus + decent strength is actually the best way to make my conscript character competent I could find :smallbiggrin:

edit: huh, I just noticed that warhorses come pretrained for combat riding, how convenient. Nevermind what was written here

[Psionic Dog]

@Refs
Did the horse gain scent to anything before Dare dismounted?

[Sallera]

Dare:Yes, at O11/P12.

[Psionic Dog]

Dare - Round 2

LoS
@Spectators
Lets gamble that Pyhrric just cast a spell.
Ie: no readed action.
Say, invisibility + see invisibility active.

Move Mount Horse.
[roll0]
[roll1]

Assuming Scent, ride to T7/U8, or until scent pinpoint.

Need LoS to continue.

[candycorn]

@Refs:Well, the move into the water was accidental, but at least I hid.

Question: while invisible creatures in water normally leave a 'hole', I still have concealment, which allows me to hide. Does that hide obviate all signs of my presence? (i.e. the me-shaped hole in the water effect which still grants concealment)

[Sallera]

Refs:Spot for Dare: [roll0]

Pyhrric:Looks like it, yes. You don't get the +20 bonus for invisibility while your location is revealed by the water, though. Dare mounts his horse in O11/P12.

Dare:Your horse doesn't have scent any more. You may revise your movement.

Apologies for the delay; had to work out something with the refs.

[Psionic Dog]

Hmm.

Revised

LoS (Dare)
Dare is mounted on horse.

Rest of turn pending new los/scent info. Will proceed to ride destination if no location pinpoint made.

LoS (Horse)
Horse moves to S4/T5 by way of P5/Q6.


Need los/listen/detection information to continue.

[Sallera]

Refs:Nyar.

Pyhrric:Dare rides to S4/T5.

Dare:No LoS.

[Psionic Dog]

Finali

LoS to Dare
Dismount into water (U5)
[roll0]
[roll1]
[roll2]

if quick dismount success and no sinking, ready action
Cast BeastLand on self if LoS gained or injured

Done

Stats
HP: 9/9
AC: 16

[candycorn]

Pyhrric, Round 3:

Refs/LOS:Swim: [roll0] DC 10
Climb: [roll1] DC 10
Where I end up depends on the success of the swim. Even if climb is a failure, I am attempting a climb.

[candycorn]

Pyhrric, continued:

Refs/LOS:Move to V13, Climb out into V14.
Drop expended scroll into V13.
Move: from V14 to S19.

Done.


Stats:Location: S-19, Invisible
HP: 5/5
AC: 13 (FF 10, T 13)

Spells Prepped:Burning Hands, KFB
Ray of Frost x3

Effects Active: Invisibility 3/30, See Invisibility 2/300

[Psionic Dog]

Dare - Round 3

LoS (Horse)
No change

LoS (Dare)
[roll0]
Ready action
Cast BeastLand on self if LoS gained or injured

Done

Stats
HP: 9/9
AC: 16

[candycorn]

Pyhrric, Round 4

LOS:Move: Draw Scroll (Exp Retreat/Silent image)
Standard: Cast Expeditious Retreat.

5 foot step from S19 to R19

Done.

Stats:Location: R19, Invisible
HP: 5/5
AC: 13 (FF 10, T 13)

Spells Prepped:Burning Hands, KFB
Ray of Frost x3

Effects Active: Invisibility 4/30, See Invisibility 3/300, Expeditious Retreat 1/10

[Sallera]

Refs:Listen for Dare: [roll0]

Pyhrric:Dare is in U5-5. Horse is in S4/T5.

Dare:Prior to your Round 3 turn, you see a scroll appear in V13. You may revise your turn if you wish.

[Psionic Dog]

@refs
Assuming nothing heard either Rewind declined.

Dare - Round 4

LoS to Horse
Horse starts to graze.

LoS to Dare
[roll0]
Ready Action
Cast BeastLand on self if LoS gained or injured

Done

stats
HP: 9/9
AC: 16

[candycorn]

Pyhrric, Round 5:

LOS:Move: Draw scroll (Magic missile)
Standard: Ready action: Move if my opponent ends turn, or he leaves LOS.

Done.

Stats:Location: R19, Invisible
HP: 5/5
AC: 13 (FF 10, T 13)
In Hand: 2 scrolls (Silent Image) (Magic Missile x6), Hand 2 Empty
Spells Prepped:Burning Hands, KFB
Ray of Frost x3

Effects Active: Invisibility 5/30, See Invisibility 4/300, Expeditious Retreat 2/10

[Psionic Dog]

Dare - Round 5

LoS to Horse
Horse starts to graze.

LoS to Dare
[roll0]
Ready Action
Cast BeastLand on self if LoS gained or injured

Done

stats
HP: 9/9
AC: 16

[candycorn]

Pyhrric, Round 6:

Refs/LOS:Ready action trigger (opponent attempts to end turn), Round 5: Move from R19 to X8 (70 feet).
Hide: [roll0]
Move Silent: [roll1]

Round 6:
My Turn: Move to X4.
Hide: [roll2]
MS: [roll3]
Swim: [roll4]

If the swim fails by more than 4:Drop scroll
attempt to climb (DC 10) onto the wall (not leaving the water, but getting to the surface): [roll5]

Not done.

[candycorn]

Relevant rules section:
Attacks from Land

Characters swimming, floating, or treading water on the surface, or wading in water at least chest deep, have improved cover (+8 bonus to AC, +4 bonus on Reflex saves) from opponents on land. Landbound opponents who have freedom of movement effects ignore this cover when making melee attacks against targets in the water. A completely submerged creature has total cover against opponents on land unless those opponents have freedom of movement effects. Magical effects are unaffected except for those that require attack rolls (which are treated like any other effects) and fire effects.
If my reading is correct, you do not benefit from improved cover vs opponents that are swimming.

Provided this is true, and you are still on the surface in U5:Sudden Maximize, Sudden Empower Kelgore's Fire Bolt, with overcome resistance. Target: Dare.

30 damage + (0.5 x [roll0]), Reflex DC 15 half.
After this, I become visible in X4(-5).

[Psionic Dog]

Er... yes. Agreed.

However...
1)
An invisible creature in the water displaces water, revealing its location. The invisible creature, however, is still hard to see and benefits from concealment.
A creature with concealment (unless hiding) is still in LoS, so Dare's readied action would trigger.

2) Since the water surface still blocks LoE for fire spells Dare would still benefit from at least basic cover (+2 reflex)

On a successful save Dare takes 'only' 19 damage so... so without evasion none of the above actually help. Hmmm.

I do believe Pyhrric just rolled the absolute minimum needed for a no-save KO. Good game. :smallsmile:

[candycorn]

The hide check was 14. (it was ruled that displaced creatures don't benefit from invisibility's +20 hide bonus, but they can use the concealment to hide, and if hidden, the hole isn't visible either).

And I really enjoy playing against you. Even with a clear disadvantage, you force me to use every trick at my disposal to get the win. A lot of players viewed my character as "I'm just eating a loss". You actually give it a go, and you nearly took me down last round. I really look forward to our next match, hopefully in the Lv2 FFA.

[Psionic Dog]

And I really enjoy playing against you. Even with a clear disadvantage, you force me to use every trick at my disposal to get the win. A lot of players viewed my character as "I'm just eating a loss". You actually give it a go, and you nearly took me down last round. I really look forward to our next match, hopefully in the Lv2 FFA.

Thanks, That... means a lot. You've a knack for potent builds, and I'm glad my bard was at least a little challenging. In fact, I may have to sig that if I can find space. :smallsmile:

[candycorn]

Thanks, That... means a lot. You've a knack for potent builds, and I'm glad my bard was at least a little challenging. In fact, I may have to sig that if I can find space. :smallsmile:

A little? Last match, with a 20 speed and clever maneuvering, you forced me to give you a coin toss shot at winning by AoO/grapple. It could have just as easily been me in the loser's bracket entering this match.

To be honest, I knew you had tricks, but I didn't anticipate being pressed that hard in the semifinal. It's a big reason why I was so cautious this match.

[Sallera]

Looks like this one slipped through the cracks a while back... I was going to point out that while it should indeed be possible to negate the improved cover by casting the spell while swimming in that fashion, it ought to require the Spellcraft check for casting a fire spell underwater. While the swimming abstraction we use for location does create some odd situations with the characters not properly in a single square, in this case, I believe the spell must be considered to be cast either from above the surface, thus functioning as a spell from land, or below the surface with the check, thus functioning as a spell from the water.

An alternate and stricter reading would probably force the latter, but as I said, the odd case of swimming on the surface does strange things to LoE.

[candycorn]

That seems to be a very logical interpretation, but I don't think it's a pure interpretation of the rules. The rules make a distinction for casting/attacking underwater, yes. They also make a distinction for attacking from land (which we have expanded to "attacking from out of the water").

But if you're in the water, and not under the surface, the rules don't assign a single bonus or penalty.

[Psionic Dog]

Unfortunately (for me) precedent holds that improved cover can't be assigned when logical, only when explicitly stated.

There is no argument against Dare having cover when Pyhrric casts since the surface blocks LoE against fire, but while logically this should be the same improved cover enjoyed against landbound aggressors I can't find any rule that says such. This is a problem for Dare since while the +2 reflex bonus afforded by cover may help him make his save, against that kind of damage output he still dies on a successful save without improved cover evasion.

[Sallera]

Pyhrric burns water for the victory.