Improvised weapon proficiency [3.5]

[SilverLeaf167]

Do Drunken Masters gain it? I think they should, but cannot find it in the class description.
If not, is there some feat etc. to become proficient with improvised weapons, or at least reduce the penalty?

EDIT: Oops, wrong forum. Move to the 3.5 section, please?

[Thurbane]

Oddly enough, even though a large part of the Drunken master's schtick is fighting with improvised weapons, unless I'm missing something obvious, he still takes the full improvised weapon penalties.

I don't believe there is any way under official (WotC) RAW to remove this penalty, but the Pathfinder feat "Catch Off Guard" does the trick:

Catch Off-Guard (Combat) Foes are surprised by your skilled use of unorthodox and improvised weapons.

Benefit: You do not suffer any penalties for using an improvised melee weapon. Unarmed opponents are flat-footed against any attacks you make with an improvised melee weapon.

Normal: You take a –4 penalty on attack rolls made with an improvised weapon.

There's also a couple of community made feats in the Netbook of Feats (http://www.identicalsoftware.com/rpg/dnd/nbofeats009.pdf): Anything Goes Combat and Improvised Weapons.

[Cog]

There's a few ways of reducing improvised weapon penalties to -2 (City Brawler Barbarian ACF or Improvised Weapon Proficiency feat from Dragon Mag, or Hulking Hurler from CWar; thanks to Curmudgeon for that list), though none of those stack; becoming a Bloodbound of the Red Ring (membership, City of Stormreach) gives a stacking reduction for the price of getting to fight in an arena (i.e., you're getting more experience out of the deal).

[Darrin]

I don't believe there is any way under official (WotC) RAW to remove this penalty

There is, but it's fairly obscure: the Brawler PrC from Dragon #295 (3.0 material, same issue as the Improved Weapon Proficiency feat Cog mentions) gains complete proficiency with all improvised weapons. A 2-level dip also allows you to use weapon-specific feats such as Weapon Focus/Improved Critical/etc. with improvised weapons.

The only other way without resorting to Dragon material would be Hulking Hurler (reduces penalty to -2) + Bloodbound of the Red Ring membership (City of Stormreach, as Cog notes).

[Kefkafreak]

I'd just houserule it, it's not like it would break anything.

[panaikhan]

Houserule the Pathfinder feats in. it's not like they are game-breaking, and the 'cap' feat gives a little bonus to boot.

[Person_Man]

I would add the caveat that improvised weapon proficiency should not be treated as proficiency with all weapons. In my games, player's who attempt to use martial or exotic weapons without proficiency take the normal -4 penalty to hit, but also treat the weapons as clubs (with piercing, slashing, and/or blunt damage as appropriate).

[Alabenson]

There's a few ways of reducing improvised weapon penalties to -2 (City Brawler Barbarian ACF or Improvised Weapon Proficiency feat from Dragon Mag, or Hulking Hurler from CWar; thanks to Curmudgeon for that list), though none of those stack; becoming a Bloodbound of the Red Ring (membership, City of Stormreach) gives a stacking reduction for the price of getting to fight in an arena (i.e., you're getting more experience out of the deal).

Which issue of Dragon was the Improvised Weapon Proficiency feat from?

[Cog]

Which issue of Dragon was the Improvised Weapon Proficiency feat from?
As Darrin pointed out, 295, along with another source of proficiency I was unaware of.

[Darrin]

As Darrin pointed out, 295, along with another source of proficiency I was unaware of.

Despite it's name, the feat doesn't confer complete proficiency, just reduces the penalty to -2, same as Hulking Hurler or City Brawler Barbarian.

A dip into Brawler is the easiest way to become completely proficient with all improvised weapons. The prereqs are highly annoying, however: BAB +7, Alertness (WTF?), Combat Reflexes, and Improved Unarmed Strike (why yes, for a class designed around using improvised weapons, we want to hit things with our fists!)

[Thurbane]

If you're willing to turn to an issue of Dragon, which may be hard to track down, maybe just consider allowing the Pathfinder or NBoF feats...

I like the clause in Catch off Guard that anyone who is unarmed that you whack with an improvised weapon is considered flatfooted. I have this mental image of Rogues and Iaijustu Masters carrying around a shovel, disarming people with it, then walloping them for massive damage. :smalltongue:

[Psyren]

(why yes, for a class designed around using improvised weapons, we want to hit things with our fists!)

Maybe they're forcing you to prepare for the moment when you run out of barstools and rocks...

[Doughnut Master]

Catch off Guard and Improved Disarm could make for a neat sneak attacking build.

hmmmm

EDIT: Swordsages....