Pimp my omnimental

[Nich_Critic]

Hey all. My players, please stay out :smallwink:.

I ended my last session with an encounter with an omnimental. They haven't actually fought it yet. For some reason, I thought that the omnimental was much, much cooler, but it looks like it just has slams and a ranged attack that damages it when used. It does plenty of damage, but seems like kind of a lame enemy when faced alone. I mean, it's just going to kill one person, and then get killed by the combined damage of the party in two rounds. Kind of a lame boss. It feels like any one of the other elementals would be more interesting. So I need the playground's help.

The monster is CR 15, and I'd like to keep that about the same (the monster doesn't need to be any more lethal, just more varied). Preferably, it needs some abilities that can threaten multiple enemies at once, since it seems sorely lacking in that department. It could also probably use some defenses that it doesn't already have (It's already immune to crits and mind affecting, but it could stand to have SR.). It would also be nice to have some abilities that target other things then AC.

How much extra oomph can I give this thing before it's simply unbeatable?

The party is 4 level 13's, with 4 level 11 cohorts. They're all fairly high op. They managed to drop a 200 hp monster just prior in one round, so I expect this 400 hp monster to last for 2 without some kind of modification.

[Woodzyowl]

IMHO, drop a few greater storm elementals (MM3) either behind or instead of it. 1. They cause decent base damage 2. Thunder and lightning causes more damage than a meteor swarm (it would be the druidic version, summon nature's ally 8 or 9), but with a fort save and 3. They can heal themselves and the other ones with their thunder and lightning.

And they fly. What else could you want from a cr10 monster?

EDIT: I have never DMed, I simply think that this could theoretically work from my player's perspective.

[Nich_Critic]

Unfortunately, I've already used storm elementals against the party. I think that even refluffed, they would recognize them. Two of the things were almost a TPK for the reasons you said (The ability to deal some 20d6 damage every couple rounds and heal half that amount).

[Morph Bark]

(the monster doesn't need to be any more lethal, just more varied).

Awww, and here I thought I could promote one of the first monsters I've ever made: the Omnimental Monolith (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19544022/Creature_Omnimental_Monolith?post_id=332123106).

[Nich_Critic]

Unfortunately, that would be all but unkillable for the party. The attack/damage isn't what I'm worried about. In two rounds, the omnimental can already kill one of my PCs. It just wouldn't be interesting (Slam slam! Slam slam! You're dead).

[Woodzyowl]

Perhaps you could give it some elemental-themed (but not direct damage) spell like abilities? Just things to slow down their damage output.

[Nich_Critic]

Yeah, I was considering hitting up the shujenga list for things like that.

I'm thinking:

- Give it the spellwarped (MM3) template. I know it doesn't qualify, but it's interesting and covers the SR problem. Reduce the SR to 23 since 43 SR would just be unfair. I love the idea that roughly 1/2 the time, spells make it stronger.

- Give it the fire elemental's 2d8 damage/save to catch fire ability when it's attacked, and add a save to catch fire to the slam and ranged attacks

- Give it the ability to spawn a large elemental of any of the 4 types, for losing 30 hp (The elemental will have 60 hp). Free action, once every 1d4 rounds.

[Woodzyowl]

Does the wizard have spell penetration or greater spell penetration? If so, adjust accordingly. But yeah, I would definitely be afraid of a spellwarped omnimental. In fact, spellwarped might even be close to pixie. Or at least within 5 miles.

EDIT: The other things would sure make it tougher. Good thing he can't spawn storm elementals :)

[Runestar]

I guess you won't be interested in giving it improved rapidstrike then. :smallamused:

If you ask me, the solution to any boring monster would be to "tobify" it by giving it martial adept lvs. Even 1 lv in warblade would already give it 6 maneuvers (including 3 feats spent on martial study), which should give it enough versatility to add some variety to the battle.

[Woodzyowl]

Even better, if he wants it to be tougher, he can add a few levels of Crusader. Add a few levels on the spawns too. DDP+tank maneuvers+high base HP=win

[supermonkeyjoe]

Is exploding into an earth, air, water and fire elemental upon death not interesting enough? Because I always thought that was pretty cool. maybe have it so that if the elementals aren't killed within a couple of rounds then they can reform into another omnimental

[Draz74]

Change all its feats to Incarnum feats? Use those to throw around some more varied attacks and gain some Fire Shield-style defenses?


If you ask me, the solution to any boring monster would be to "tobify" it by giving it martial adept lvs. Even 1 lv in warblade would already give it 6 maneuvers (including 3 feats spent on martial study), which should give it enough versatility to add some variety to the battle.

Those three Martial Study feats would largely be wasted, since it could still only Ready three maneuvers.

[Morph Bark]

I guess you won't be interested in giving it improved rapidstrike then. :smallamused:

If you ask me, the solution to any boring monster would be to "tobify" it by giving it martial adept lvs. Even 1 lv in warblade would already give it 6 maneuvers (including 3 feats spent on martial study), which should give it enough versatility to add some variety to the battle.

http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/1/19552/775428-tobi_1_super.jpg

Make it a Swordsage level and give it mainly Desert Wind and Shadow Hand for fire and cold damage and some utility. Don't forget also that you get 16 initiator levels from your Omnimental HD, so with that level you have 17 initiator levels, so you could get a 9th level maneuver too.

Giving it some Incarnum or Binding feats could work some good too.

[Epsilon Rose]

If it doesn't already have them I'd recommend giving it some alternate modes of movement (particularly burrowing and flight).
Those added to some of the other suggested fixes seem like more than enough. Especially the burrowing (tunnel closes behind it), I imagine a hulking monster diving into the ground for a round would be pretty unnerving if you can't tell where it's going to come up, even if it's only going to slam you and especially if it's going to slam you with a tob maneuver.

[Otherworld Odd]

I don't see anything wrong with slam attacks.

As long as you fluff them right. :smallamused:

Left hook, right hook, uppercut into elbow drop! Four hit combo, ten billion damage!

[Nich_Critic]

For the same reason I don't like playing a charging fighter, I don't like monsters where the only thing they can do is hit (at a really high attack bonus) really hard, and then do the same thing next round. I admit I really like the "explodes into 4 elementals" bit.

ToB might help. I'll look up the maneuvers again and see if I can find any to fit. I'm sure there's so excellent desert wind stuff at the HD we're talking about.

[Tvtyrant]

Give it levels in DFA so it gets a rainbow of breath weapons. Or have it cast Prismatic Ray on the party as a breath weapon.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

It has a few things going for it, namely size and speed. Use those things to make it a bit trickier:

1. Give it the Elite Array, which is 25 point buy stats, which technically adds +1 CR. Its base stats with 25 point buy should be 11, 16, 10, 10, 11, 13; it only gets Dex +6, Cha +2.

2. Feats! It qualifies for epic feats, and it can get the Snatch line of feats in the Draconomicon, plus (Improved) Rapidstrike. It gets eleven feats, seven normal and four epic. Here's what I'd do:

Power Attack, Improved Bull Rush, Knock-Back (RoS), Combat Reflexes, Snatch, Multisnatch, Fling Enemy (RoS, using the Elemental Ball ability to qualify), Rapidstrike, Improved Rapidstrike, Spellcasting Harrier, Flyby Attack. Possibly add in two flaws for Suppress Weakness and Overcome Weakness from the Draconomicon, or maybe give him Awaken Spell Resistance despite it requiring the Dragon type to gain SR 32.

Flyby Attack, Snatch, carry opponent up, use Multisnatch to not be considered grappled himself. On the following round make four grapple checks for slam damage with the slam holding them, then make four attacks from outside the grapple with the slam that's not holding them, using the fourth one to Knock-Back the opponent removing them from the grapple and hopefully sending them over a cliff. Even if they survive they'll be out of the fight for a while. Alternatively use that last attack to Knock-Back them straight up, their movement away doesn't provoke AoOs but falling back toward it will, and it can AoO and Knock-Back again to either juggle them or just knock them away horizontally. If anyone provokes an AoO use Knock-Back or Snatch with Multisnatch. If he gets two opponents Snatched he should Fling Enemy both of them, again preferably somewhere that keeps them out of the fight. Anyone with Freedom of Movement can't be Snatched but Knock-Back will still work.

Depending on where they're fighting definitely include a cliff or chasm (doesn't even have to be very deep, just enough to hinder someone from rejoining the fight), or a lake (of liquid-hot magma!), or something for it to throw/knock opponents into. Include the Impeded Magic (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/planes.htm#impededMagic) trait for cold spells.

[Nich_Critic]

Looks good, except that sending my players against that would be akin to throwing them in a blender. They're fairly high op, but I don't know if they could take two rounds of the 2 attacks from this beast, let alone 8 + AoOs.

[erikun]

What about having it spawn elementals as it loses HP? For example, at 75% HP, its right arm falls off and becomes a seperate earth elemental... at 50%, the flaming leg breaks off and becomes a fire elemental... and so on.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Seriously? It only averages 30 damage per hit. Then get rid of Rapidstrike and Improved Rapidstrike, and give it Epic Will and Awaken Spell Resistance (and make it always Power Attacking for -10/+10). It only gets two attacks/round then, it can AoO with Knock-Back and Snatch opponents then Fling Enemy. With SR 32 and not letting anyone full attack it the fight should last quite a bit longer.

[Runestar]

Those three Martial Study feats would largely be wasted, since it could still only Ready three maneuvers.

The maneuvers you gain via martial study are actually tracked separately from warblade, assuming you take them before going into martial adept.

For example, I could start with a human fighter1, and have him spend his 3 feats on 3xmartial study, nabbing steel wind, burning blade and steely strike.

Then at 2nd level, I take 1 lv of warblade, and choose sapphire nightmare blade, wolf tiger fang and sudden leap.

I now know 6 maneuvers. The 3 selected via martial study can each be initiated 1/encounter without possibly of refresh, the other 3 are tracked as per normal for a warblade. Within the context of a 5-round encounter for a typical monster, that should be plenty, even if it can't be bothered to recharge his maneuvers. :smallbiggrin:

[Draz74]

The maneuvers you gain via martial study are actually tracked separately from warblade, assuming you take them before going into martial adept.

Ah, yes, I suppose that's true. I forgot about that, since I've never made a build that took the feat, then became a martial adept subsequently.

[faceroll]

Let it do its range attack(s) as free actions/part of it's full attack routine.

Give it an AoE centered on itself that does acid, cold, fire, and electricity damage damage, doing 2d6 damage of each type, and players must make a fort save to avoid being slowed, a reflex save to avoid being set on fire, a reflex save to avoid being knocked prone, and a fort save to avoid being sickened.

[OldFart]

Unless you think your PCs need it, just remove the vulnerability added solely to give the critter an Achilles heel. I'd up DR to 15/- to match Elemental Monolith (the other well-known gargantuan elementals), but honestly it's not likely to matter. Do the elite array as Biff suggested up-thread (it needs Dex to utilize the number of AoOs it could get)

Replace elemental ball w/ Orb of Fire/Cold/Acid/Electricity as SLA. Possibly add Summon Monster VI for Large Elemental as 2nd SLA.

Juggle/replace feats and give it Quicken SLA(s) for above. You may also want to check out Power Dive and Large and in Charge in Dragonomicon.

After the omnimental "dies," have the 16 HD elementals run away, preferably in as many directions and through as many media as possible. Give these elementals a special version of fast healing 5, which can take them above their normal max HP. If/when they reach the HP total of greater elementals, they become them. If/when they reach the HP total of elder elementals, they become those. If all four elementals manage to maintain HP totals greater than or equal the normal max HP of elder elementals, they form Voltron re-merge into the omnimental regardless of distance from each other, the gestalt forming at the location of one of the components parts (either DM's choice, or make it random).

Whoever it attacks should have trouble closing, ranged attacks and summons should give other PCs something to do, and encounter will hopefully switch from big fight to chase scene.