Soulknife: to improve the light armor proficiency rule or not to improve

[Mithral88]

Having heard complaints that soulknives are underpowered, I've been trying to make them up to scratch. I was wondering, since some of their class skills are roguelike, would it be a good idea or not to improve their armor proficiency to include medium armor? Also, since I've never played a soulknife before, would it be a good idea to include some martial weapons with their weapon proficiency, considering they already have a mind blade?

Another thing: I've already decide at level 1 they should already have a +1 Fort save, including their +2 Ref save and +2 Will save, and their BAB should be +1, along with power points/day 1, and powers known 1, and I'm going to try to design a couple feats specifically for soulknives.

[Amphetryon]

Having heard complaints that soulknives are underpowered, I've been trying to make them up to scratch. I was wondering, since some of their class skills are roguelike, would it be a good idea or not to improve their armor proficiency to include medium armor? Also, since I've never played a soulknife before, would it be a good idea to include some martial weapons with their weapon proficiency, considering they already have a mind blade?

Another thing: I've already decide at level 1 they should already have a +1 Fort save, including their +2 Ref save and +2 Will save, and their BAB should be +1, along with power points/day 1, and powers known 1, and I'm going to try to design a couple feats specifically for soulknives.My opinion:
Soulknives probably don't need any better armor proficiency. They DO need full BAB, and all good saves are probably not overpowering for most campaigns. I generally grant any of the "Mindblade acts as [other weapon]" feats as bonuses, as well.

[Psyren]

The Pathfinder Soulknife (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/classes/soulknife) addresses both of these: Full BAB, and Medium Armor Proficiency, along with a number of other improvements. I would start with that one and then assess where the other players in the party stand tier-wise.

[FMArthur]

Soulknives generally need a lot of work to fix, because the class doesn't have much to work with. With a couple late and mostly lackluster exceptions, the entire class concept is "has a weapon", and it doesn't even keep up with normal weaponry for warriors of equal level. There is no quick fix to a soulknife besides using extensive rewrites that others have made (such as the Psionics Unleashed Soulknife), and proficiencies/saves/BAB don't change the need for a fix at all. You can't fix the soulknife by tweaking numbers: it needs class features because the class itself is incomplete even at the conceptual level. There is no small fix for that if you intend to keep the class as it is. However... there is an option in actually dismantling the class to give its one defining feature to other classes.

Consider the Psychic Warrior's Soulbound Weapon ACF (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070214a): they can trade one power known and one bonus feat for a very similar ability to a Mind Blade. Using this precedent, you could just make the Mind Blade a couple of feats, or just one feat requiring some existing feat.

[Hunter Killer]

Put me down for a second on using the Pathfinder Soulknife. Theirs is the best fix for the class, in my opinion.

[Psyren]

Other PF improvements:


Balance and Search as class skills.
You can shape your mind blade at 1st level, instead of level 5.
It stays shaped in the last form you left it at, instead of needing actions to shape it every time it is drawn.
Instead of being stuck with only short/long/bastard sword forms, you gain a much wider variety of shaping options, including the previously inaccessible bludgeoning damage.
The blade is advanced by "+1 manifesting" classes such as Elocater.
The enhancement bonus and ability pool tracks are combined, giving you more freedom in allocating abilities to your mind blade. (For instance, you can have a +4 ability total on your mind blade as early as level 9, instead of waiting until 18 as with the standard Soulknife.)
Acquisition of most abilities is accelerated - both those of the blade itself, and techniques like Bladewind and Knife to the Soul.
Brand new abilities such as giving the mind blade reach, charging both blades with one action (if dual-wielding), getting extra 5-foot steps etc.


For more details, see the handbook in my sig.

[faceroll]

Soulknives generally need a lot of work to fix, because the class doesn't have much to work with. With a couple late and mostly lackluster exceptions, the entire class concept is "has a weapon", and it doesn't even keep up with normal weaponry for warriors of equal level. There is no quick fix to a soulknife besides using extensive rewrites that others have made (such as the Psionics Unleashed Soulknife), and proficiencies/saves/BAB don't change the need for a fix at all. You can't fix the soulknife by tweaking numbers: it needs class features because the class itself is incomplete even at the conceptual level. There is no small fix for that if you intend to keep the class as it is. However... there is an option in actually dismantling the class to give its one defining feature to other classes.

Consider the Psychic Warrior's Soulbound Weapon ACF (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/psm/20070214a): they can trade one power known and one bonus feat for a very similar ability to a Mind Blade. Using this precedent, you could just make the Mind Blade a couple of feats, or just one feat requiring some existing feat.

The OP gives the soulknife powers known and pp/day.

[Psyren]

The OP gives the soulknife powers known and pp/day.

Hidden Talent gives them 1 power known also, that doesn't fix them.

[faceroll]

Hidden Talent gives them 1 power known also, that doesn't fix them.

Balance doesn't fix them either. What's your point?

[Psyren]

Balance doesn't fix them either. What's your point?

You said the OP gave them "powers known and pp/day" She said she was giving 1 each of those things at level 1, and no sign of a progression of any kind. If she leaves it at that, they aren't fixed, simple as that.

And I never said Balance fixed them, so I can't see how that's relevant.

[Flickerdart]

But it does make them
:smallcool:
balanced.

[Lateral]

But it does make them
:smallcool:
balanced.

http://i134.photobucket.com/albums/q100/TheSteveslols/csi_miami_yeah.jpg?t=1296484899
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I'll third the PF soulknife. It really is quite awesome.

[Psyren]

But it does make them
:smallcool:
balanced.

*Takes 3d8 groaning damage*

[MeeposFire]

PF soulknife is a great start putting them at around tier 4. If you want to make them better these are some suggestions.

I like giving them the hidden power feat just like in the ACF article and allowing them to get bonus PP based on an ability score (choose which one you think fits best). Pick something like dimensional hop and it will help you get full attacks). Then allow them to automatically get the ability to make a full attack with knives at ranged at level 6 for free or allow them to take that ability at any time instead (no reason to force them to wait until level14). Lastly my games operate under a houserule for standard action attacks to deal extra damage so you may want to consider an option to make standard action attacks better.

These suggestions help in 3 areas.

1) Gives them minor psionic powers which adds to the cool factor.

2) Ranged attacks being fixed since they are restricted for no reason that I can see (thus allowing for more types of character sooner).

3) Having effective standard actions helps bridge the gap to tier 3.

[Psyren]

Another good way is to gestalt them with an incarnum class like Soulborn (with Meldshaper level = class level, and faster access to chakra binds, of course.) This gives them some much-needed utility toys, and really puts the "soul" in "soulknife." And you still won't feel like a caster.

[VarianArdell]

In the group I play with, the DM makes the soulknife a lot more multiclass-friendly: instead of the default damage that is given, you can instead shape the mindblade into a form matching any weapon with which the soulknife has proficiency. Is this particularly broken?