[Eberron] Requesting help making an NPC party.

[Rogue Shadows]

For an upcoming campaign, set in Xen'drik, I want my players to have a rival adventuring party that they run into often. Basically I want them to be the Bellocs to the player's Indiana Jones, with each constantly racing to get to goals first, or else when one group goes on one quest, the other completes a different one.

For that reason, I want the rival party (let's call them the Silver Snakes) to be memorable. I think that can be accomplished two ways - first, by having them have distinct and memorable personalities; but second, for them to have exceptionally good builds given their abilities.

None of my players are precisely powergamers - so I kind of want the Silver Snakes to be *better* than them, at least on paper.

Each member of the Silver Snakes are level 6, except their leader Tsoran, who's level 7.

Tsoran: LE Empty Vessel Psion
Maelgynym: LN Hobgoblin Knight
Rahati: CN Tiefling Battle Dancer
Backpaw: CN Tibbit Beguiler
Augyre: N Half-giant Favored Soul
Cos: N Changeling Shadowcaster

I deliberately chose non-core (and in the case of Backpaw and Rahati, non-WotC, even) classes and races for each character to make them more interesting.

Does anyone have ideas for builds, though? I know that some of the class choices are suboptimal, but still. Anyone getting ideas?

Oh, Tsoran is also my first flirtation with psionics.

[NecroRick]

My humble suggestion is that if they are in Eberron, make heavy use of the material that is new to Eberron in the build of these NPCs. Maybe give each of them an Aberrant Dragonmark... (the least aberrant dragonmarks are kind of meh, but the lesser ones are better and the greater ones are crunchy).

Note also that a globe of invulnerability can protect multiple people...

For the psionic guy, look for the stuff that lets you dump lots of power points quickly to do massive damage.

That will make the players think twice about taking the obvious solution and tangling with the NPCs on the field of fair combat...

[Zonugal]

Oh my a level seven psion... You know what this means? Death Urge!!! (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/deathUrge.htm) You can really make Tsoran a scary villain if you leave a legacy that by merely talking to him he drives people to kill themselves.

I actually had a similiar build over in Brilliant Gameologists in their popular culture thread.

Dr. Hannibal Lecter: Male Old Human Telepath 6; CR 6; Medium Humanoid (human); HD 6d4+0; hp 19; Init +-1; Spd 30 ft.; AC 9, touch 9, flat-footed 9; Base Atk +3; Grp +2; Atk +2 melee (1d4-1/x2, knife); SA; SQ Telepathic Communication (30 ft.); AL NE; SV Fort +2, Ref +1, Will +4; Str 8, Dex 8, Con 10, Int 18, Wis 8, Cha 14.
Skills and Feats: Bluff +11 (9 ranks +2 cha), Concentration +10 (9 ranks +0 con +1 focused), Craft (Writing) +5 (1 rank + 4 int), Diplomacy +16 (9 ranks +2 cha +4 synergy +1 polite), Disguise +12 (8 ranks +2 cha +2 synergy), Forgery +8 (4 ranks +4 int), Gather Information +10 (8 ranks +2 cha), Read/Write/Speak (Common, Draconic and Elven) and Sense Motive +8 (9 ranks -1 wis); Burrowing Power, City Slicker, Deformity (Madness), Hardened Criminal (Diplomacy), Mindsight and Willing Deformity.
Traits and Flaws: Focused and Polite; Shaky
Powers (ML 6; 35 power points/day): Attraction, Aversion, Crisis of Breath, Detect Hostile Intent, Disable, Empathy, False Sensory Input, Mindfire, Read Thoughts, Psionic Charm, Psionic Suggestion, Sense Danger and Telempathic Projection
Variants: Telepathic Communication (Web)
Powers
1st-level
Attraction: Subject has an attraction you specify.
Disable: Subjects incorrectly believe they are disabled.
Empathy: You know the subject’s surface emotions.
Psionic Charm: Makes one person your friend.
Telempathic Projection: Alter the subject’s mood.
2nd-level
Aversion: Subject has aversion you specify.
Detect Hostile Intent: You can detect hostile creatures within 30ft. of you.
Read Thoughts: Detect surface thoughts of creatures in range.
Psionic Suggestion: Compels subject to follow stated course of action.
3rd-level
Crisis of Breath: Disrupt subject’s breathing.
False Sensory Input: Subject sees what isn’t there.
Mindfire: You inflict the disease mindfire upon your foe.
Sense Danger: Retain Dex bonus to AC when flat-footed, manifest another power as an immediate action during the first round of combat.

[Rogue Shadows]

WHAT?!

There is psionic ability that makes a creature attack itself? And it's only 4th level?! And it can be augmented?!

No wonder psionics has the reputation it does!

...

...so Tsoran will be taking that, incidentally. Though despite the alignment I wasn't seeing him as a villain per se. More just a ****.

After all, he's evil but the rest of his party is neutral.

[NecroRick]

WHAT?!

There is psionic ability that makes a creature attack itself? And it's only 4th level?! And it can be augmented?!

No wonder psionics has the reputation it does!

...

...so Tsoran will be taking that, incidentally. Though despite the alignment I wasn't seeing him as a villain per se. More just a ****.

After all, he's evil but the rest of his party is neutral.

In all D&D versions prior to 4 (and possibly even that one), psionics has been tacked on as an after-thought, and it has been well and truly bumped up the power scale. They probably said to themselves "we need to make this really good or no one will use it".

Psionics + anything else typically results in a much more powerful 'anythign else'.

By comparison, disintegrate is 6th level, and finger of death is 7th. I can't think offhand of any other "save or dies" of 4th level or lower.

[Kantolin]

Making Tsoran a telepath is probably the neatest option as a villain, but another neat schtick is to make him a Nomad, and be his party's main source of transportation - he's the one who teleports them places and the like. ^_^


Psionics + anything else typically results in a much more powerful 'anythign else'.

Sigh. Wizards and other arcanists are more useful than psionics. Wizards beat the tar out of psions. Wizards are more powerful than psions. Sorcerors are probably stronger too.


I can't think offhand of any other "save or dies" of 4th level or lower.

First of all, I can think of a few 4th level spells that are 'save or lose', which is just as good. Otiluke's Resilient Sphere, Evard's Black Tentacles, Fear, and Confusion are a few examples. There's then Phantasmal Killer, which is a save or die. And a few spells that are no save, just you suck now, such as enervation and solid fog. And then there's polymorph, greater invisiblity, and shadow conjuration, which are just all kinds of awesome.

Secondly... 'Critical hit yourself', once, is a save or die? Maybe if you have lightning maces or are weilding a scythe or something.

It's useful, mind you, but compare it to confusion, which hits a small AOE and continues to have enemies spend their turns stabbing each other for round/level without you doing much. If you ask me, Death Urge is most useful when you're near a cliff or something for enemies to fling themselves off of.

Both are a will save to negate.

Edit: This then gets more amusing when you look at the spell compendium, in which backbiter is a first level spell which does pretty similar. :P

[Prime32]

Tsoran: LE Empty Vessel Psion
Maelgynym: LN Hobgoblin Knight
Rahati: CN Tiefling Battle Dancer
Backpaw: CN Tibbit Beguiler
Augyre: N Half-giant Favored Soul
Cos: N Changeling Shadowcaster

The primordial giant template (Secrets of Xen'drik) works for Augyre. They're throwbacks to the giants of old, physically weaker but stronger of mind.

As for Maelgynym, the iconic hobgoblin class is warblade, which is probably a better choice (controlling the PCs' actions is annoying).

Consider having Backpaw conjure a "wizard" illusion and passing as its familiar. There's a PrC which lets you Silent/Still illusions for free.



And 3.5e psionics is weaker than Vancian magic for multiple reasons; its "reputation" is because it's different, 3.0's system was terrible (maybe 2e's as well? Not familiar with it), and people don't read the rules on how many pp you can spend on a power.
Kantolin, you seem to have forgotten sleep and color spray as lv1 save-or-lose spells.

[LordBlades]

And 3.5e psionics is weaker than Vancian magic for multiple reasons; its "reputation" is because it's different, 3.0's system was terrible (maybe 2e's as well? Not familiar with it), and people don't read the rules on how many pp you can spend on a power.
Kantolin, you seem to have forgotten sleep and color spray as lv1 save-or-lose spells.

Add to that that fact that many gaming groups still play wizards(and pisons by extension) as blasters. Given the fact that psionc blasting doesn't suck, it makes them appear overpowered compared to wizards.

[Rogue Shadows]

The primordial giant template (Secrets of Xen'drik) works for Augyre. They're throwbacks to the giants of old, physically weaker but stronger of mind.

Hmm...


As for Maelgynym, the iconic hobgoblin class is warblade, which is probably a better choice (controlling the PCs' actions is annoying).

I would have thought the iconic hobgoblin class is their favored class, Fighter (which I'm running a fix for (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=204776))...

...anyway, I do not own, and so won't be using, Tome of Battle. Besides, Knight seems really cool. THere's got to be an optimized build for one hidden somewhere.


Consider having Backpaw conjure a "wizard" illusion and passing as its familiar. There's a PrC which lets you Silent/Still illusions for free.

Hmm, sounds fun.


And 3.5e psionics is weaker than Vancian magic for multiple reasons; its "reputation" is because it's different, 3.0's system was terrible (maybe 2e's as well? Not familiar with it), and people don't read the rules on how many pp you can spend on a power.

Yes, but Vancian magic doesn't really have a spell that states: the target tries to kill itself.

Even if the powers themselves are weaker than spells...they kind of leave an impression.

[Prime32]

I would have thought the iconic hobgoblin class is their favored class, Fighter (which I'm running a fix for (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=204776))...

...anyway, I do not own, and so won't be using, Tome of Battle.ToB has a bunch of stuff on hobgoblins. IIRC they forged the first sword (a legacy weapon named Kamate - "it is death"), invented the Iron Heart discipline and were the first warblades. When Reshar was travelling the world gathering great fighters to found the Temple of Nine Swords, they were the first people he went to. The only reason fighter is their favoured class is because warblade didn't exist when the PHB was printed (and to reduce book dependence, most later favoured classes were either core or in the same book as the race).

And you can run a warblade just from web supplements.
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20060802a&page=2
http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20061225a


Yes, but Vancian magic doesn't really have a spell that states: the target tries to kill itself.

Even if the powers themselves are weaker than spells...they kind of leave an impression.Right, Vancian magic lets them kill themselves automatically. :smalltongue:

[Rogue Shadows]

And you can run a warblade just from web supplements.

I think I'm going to stick with her being a knight.