Catfolk Sorcerer

[Lordof Dorkness]

The possibility of a Catfolk sorcerer is a great one.
40ft speed- get away from the enemy fast and cast in the back of the party.
+2 Cha- stronger casting.
+4 Dex- better AC.
+1 natural armor- even better AC.
Low -light vision-Meh.
+2 on listen and move silently- good for sneaking
+1 LA-Meh.

[Ormur]

I'm not going to say you shouldn't do it but I doubt catfolk are that good for sorcerers. They're decent for a +1 LA and it gets better with LA buy-off but you're already loosing one level of spell progression compared to a prepared caster and another will hurt if there are any such in the party. The charisma, dexterity and speed bonus doesn't compensate for that. I think they're better for roguish characters than spellcasters. There are some 0 LA +2 charisma races although I can't remember who they are, maybe a bit more obscure than catfolk.

[Thurbane]

If level buyoff is available, I say go for it. People get far too hung up on not taking level adjusted races, and miss out on a lot of interesting character opportunities. Unless you're playing in a fairly high op group, you should be fine. A sorcerer that's one level behind the party Fighter or Monk is honestly not going to feel like a spare wheel.

I've thought about making a Catfolk Binder/KotSS (Paimon) myself.

[Talya]

If you're playing with level adjustment buyoff, the +1 LA is almost a non-factor. I'm not convinced that makes the catfolk a spectacular sorcerer, though, just a good one. For a sorcerer, I'd still pick Human, Lesser Aasimar, Star Elf, Strongheart Halflings, or Spellscales before taking a catfolk.

Regardless of race, always always always apply the magic-blooded template. :smallsmile:

[HappyBlanket]

LA +1 and LA +2 Player Race List. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=189980)

Try looking for something that benefits Sorcerers instead. Okay, okay, that was mean. The fact is that Catfolk doesn't benefit Sorcerers very well.

+Dex? That's for roguish types. You increasing your AC is a very lackluster way to spend your very limited resources.
+Cha? 2 Cha? Very small benefit. Not worth +1 LA on it's own.
Sorcerers don't need Move speed; they have teleportation instead. Try Abrupt Dimensional Jaunt, or Overland Flight.
Low Light Vision is not a factor.
+Listen and +Move Silently. Again, that's for rogues.
+1 Natural Armor. Not significant considering a Sorcerer's Hp. Also not worth the LA. Plus, you have Stoneskin instead.

There must be some alternatives on that list, but there are templates that will also help.

Ninja'd

[NecroRick]

I like it. The Dex will help you hit with rays if that is your thing.

An even better fit for the Catfolk might be Artificer? The Artificer often ends up smacking people from distance with a crossbow, and dex helps with that. Cha will help the UMD checks, around which virtually your entire class revolves...

[Thurbane]

I like it. The Dex will help you hit with rays if that is your thing.

An even better fit for the Catfolk might be Artificer? The Artificer often ends up smacking people from distance with a crossbow, and dex helps with that. Cha will help the UMD checks, around which virtually your entire class revolves...
Catfolk make decent Warlocks, for similar reasons.

[AngelisBlack]

I've played a catfolk sorcerer before, and it was actually pretty nice. They actually do make great gishes with their movement speed and their increased NA. The +1 LA hurts, although I played catfolk with a draconic templete and a +2LA in games without buyoff. Its surprizingly doable.

[Lordof Dorkness]

A multiclass Sorcerer/rogue/ranger seems decent.
sneaking+Spellcasting+combat.
Anyone?
though the spell progression will be diluted, even a true strike+Sneak attack is a respectable option.
add favored enemy, and your cooking orc.

[Jude_H]

I'd probably go for a Bard archer before Sorcerer, but it's not a bad combination. Especially with buyoff.

[Lordof Dorkness]

I think that plain sorcerer is good.
it depends on the type of sorcerer you want to play.
A sorcerer with Silence, Invisibility and an attack spell excels better than a rogue of the same level at sneaking and killing.
A sorcerer/rogue Gestalt works best for that type of character because of sneak attack.

[Divide by Zero]

Even without buyoff, a decently optimized catfolk sorcerer will still be way ahead of any noncasters. So it's not exactly going to cripple you.

[TheOOB]

Sorcerers are already a level behind on their spells, and catfolk just make it worse. +2 Cha isn't worth losing a caster level, and the other benefits can be more than made up for with spells.

[ericgrau]

His spell save DCs will actually go up because the LA drops them by 0.5 on average while the cha adds +1. There are a lot of good low level spells. Especially as you get into higher levels and for all but damage a level 6 spell isn't that much worse than a level 7 outside of the save DC. At lower levels, when rays can and do miss, he can increase his chance of hitting with them quite a bit. So the LA isn't that bad. It's a tradeoff, sure, but I wouldn't immediately nix the class.

The speed is nice for getting away but getting ambushed in the back or charged still sucks. You have a nice enough dex and getting a "mere" 35' away is passable so maybe try cross-class ranks in tumble. By ECL 6 you're at 6 + rolled dex mod, enough to succeed at least most of the time. Likewise with your hitpoint total I wouldn't risk sneaking around, unless you also use invisibility for added safety & stealth.

[Greenish]

Sorcerers don't need Move speed; they have teleportation instead. Try Abrupt Jaunt, or Overland Flight.I'd love to know how a sorcerer could get Abrupt Jaunt.

[HappyBlanket]

I think that plain sorcerer is good.
it depends on the type of sorcerer you want to play.
A sorcerer with Silence, Invisibility and an attack spell excels better than a rogue of the same level at sneaking and killing.
A sorcerer/rogue Gestalt works best for that type of character because of sneak attack.

A wizard/rogue would decrease MAD, but yes; a caster usually has the means to replicate another class' role. Being a sorcerer will benefit you especially if your selection of spells is very specialized.


I'd love to know how a sorcerer could get Abrupt Jaunt.

It was a typo. No need to be so condescending. -.-

Speaking of forgetfulness: I should've added that being a Catfolk won't exactly ruin you. If you want to be a Catfolk, by all means, go for it. It's not going to ruin your gaming experience. Especially since you're a Sorcerer (and a gestalt one, apparently).

[BlueInc]

I would talk with your DM about it. I've let players play catfolk with no level adjustment by nerfing them slightly (something like +2 dex instead of +4 dex) or even not at all; depending on how optimized everyone is, a catfolk sorcerer might be perfectly even with other characters.

[Doktor Per]

A Catfolk Spellwarp Sniper (sneak attackin' with my fireballs holmes!) would be a pretty cool set up, starting with rogue, ofcourse, before going into sorceror.


I think I have to roll this now.

[Lordof Dorkness]

It wouldn't make a bad Ranger/Paladin Gestalt with charisma,
it would work best if i could work out a substitution level that give ranged smite evil similar to the elf paladin.

[Thurbane]

You can also get ranged smite evil with a feat in BoED.

[marcielle]

Tibbits from the dragon compendium are basically small and catfolk get rouge as favored class so no multiclass penalty for sorc/rouge
No LA
Increase to DEX. Penalty to STR but thankfully thats one of the few attributes you WON'T need so long as you get weapon finesse.

[Talya]

rouge

Please, please, please...Rogue. Pronounced like the first syllable of "Toga." Rouge is French for the color red, or English for a type of cosmetic.

Anyway, the races of the wild catfolk have favored bard, as I recall. They'd take precedence over the dragon compendium ones...

[HappyBlanket]

Please, please, please...Rogue. Pronounced like the first syllable of "Toga." Rouge is French for the color red, or English for a type of cosmetic.

Anyway, the races of the wild catfolk have favored bard, as I recall. They'd take precedence over the dragon compendium ones...

Ranger, actually. Not that it matters anyway, since most gms do away with favored classes entirely.

[ericgrau]

Please, please, please...Rogue. Pronounced like the first syllable of "Toga." Rouge is French for the color red, or English for a type of cosmetic.

Biggest fluff mistake in 3.5. Rule 724 of gaming, never use complicated or easily distorted names. We would have been better off with thieves, heck even scoundrels. Screw naming accuracy.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Rouges are overpowered. (http://www.darklegacycomics.com/41.html)

[ericgrau]

Rouges are overpowdered. (http://www.darklegacycomics.com/41.html)
Fixed. And some white space.

[Divide by Zero]

I would talk with your DM about it. I've let players play catfolk with no level adjustment by nerfing them slightly (something like +2 dex instead of +4 dex) or even not at all; depending on how optimized everyone is, a catfolk sorcerer might be perfectly even with other characters.

I like to determine whether a race should have a level adjustment by comparing it to a human. Outside of specialized builds, would I rather have these bonuses than an extra feat and skill points? If the answer is not definitely yes, then it probably doesn't need any level adjustment. Catfolk could work as +0 easily.

[marcielle]

Please, please, please...Rogue. Pronounced like the first syllable of "Toga." Rouge is French for the color red, or English for a type of cosmetic.

Anyway, the races of the wild catfolk have favored bard, as I recall. They'd take precedence over the dragon compendium ones...

Lol typo. But I'm glad I did:smallbiggrin:. Anyway , I think tibbit is a completely seperate race that also happens to be sentient cats. Not sure though. Don't actually own the Compendium. Just saw it in another forum.

[Lonely Tylenol]

Well, we already have a Batman Wizard and Joker Bard, so why not?

[HappyBlanket]

Well, we already have a Batman Wizard and Joker Bard, so why not?

There wouldn't happen to be a Penguin race, would there?

[The Dark Fiddler]

Catfolk could work as +0 easily.

With a net +6 stat bonus?

Anyway, let this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Lk138R6ShE) serve as inspiration for any catfolk sorcerer you play.

[Lordof Dorkness]

With a net +6 stat bonus?

Anyway, let this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Lk138R6ShE) serve as inspiration for any catfolk sorcerer you play.This goes without saying but :smallbiggrin:.

[Tsuzurao]

Please, please, please...Rogue. Pronounced like the first syllable of "Toga." Rouge is French for the color red, or English for a type of cosmetic.

Anyway, the races of the wild catfolk have favored bard, as I recall. They'd take precedence over the dragon compendium ones...

Catfolk and Tibbits are two different races, though they are both feline. One is a Small-sized Monstrous Humanoid (Shapechanger) with two forms and an LA of 0, the other is a Medium-sized Humanoid (Catfolk) with only one form and an LA of +1.

And both of those are different from Hengeyokai (Cat) from Oriental Adventures, which is a Medium Humanoid (Shapechanger) with three forms and LA 0 (this data comes from the 3.5 update to Oriental Adventures in Dragon 318).