Elder Scroll Elves [3.P][PEACH]

[Othniel Edden]

So I've built these two races based in an attempt to d20ise Elder Scrolls, and need help ensuring a third race is of equal power with them. The goal is to eventually have a full out d&d setting using features that make the game feel more like the Elder Scrolls series. Here is what I have on the Altmer(High Elves) and Dunmer(Dark Elves), and hopefully some input will be given on what the Bosmer (Wood Elves) will be like. If you feel either race doesn't balance out with another please feel free to point that out as well.

Altmer

http://images.uesp.net/6/6d/Lore-race-Altmer.png
Altmer (High Elf)
The High Elves consider themselves the most civilized culture of Tamriel; the common tongue of the Empire, Tamrielic, is based on Altmer speech and writing, and most of the Empire's arts, crafts, and sciences derive from High Elven traditions. Deft, intelligent, and strong-willed, High Elves are often gifted in the arcane arts, and High Elves boast that their sublime physical natures make them far more resistant to disease than the "lesser races".

-2 Strength, +2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, Altmer are quick and smart, but physically weak.

Medium: Altmer are Medium creatures and have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.

Normal Speed: Altmer have a base speed of 30 feet.

+2 racial bonus on saving throws against disease, ingested poisons, and becoming nauseated or sickened.

Vulnerable to Electric, Fire and Cold damage. An Altmer takes half again as much (+50%) damage as normal from the effect, regardless of whether a saving throw is allowed, or if the save is a success or failure.

Keen Senses: Altmer receive a +2 racial bonus on Perception skill checks as if they were actively looking for it

Innately Arcane:Choose a 1st level spell. You may cast that spell once per day as a spell-like ability. Your caster level is equal to your highest class level in a spellcasting class; if you have no caster level, it functions at CL 1st. The spell-like ability’s save DC is Intelligence-, Wisdom-, or Charisma-based (chosen when you select this race, you must have an 11 or higher in the chosen stat to use the spell-like ability)

Arcane Advantage: Altmer gain a +2 caster level bonus when casting spells from the spell list of their choice.
Bosmer
http://images.uesp.net/0/0e/Lore-race-Bosmer.png
Bosmer (Wood Elf)
The Wood Elves are the various barbarian Elven clanfolk of the Western Valenwood forests. These country cousins of the High Elves and Dark Elves are nimble and quick in body and wit, and because of their curious natures and natural agility, Wood Elves are especially suitable as scouts, agents, and thieves. But most of all, the Wood Elves are known for their skills with bows; there are no finer archers in all of Tamriel.

-2 Constitution, +2 Dexterity, +2 Wisdom Bosmer are quick and nimble both in mind and body, but aren't particularly hardy.

Small: Bosmer are Small creatures and gain a +1 size bonus to Armor Class, a +1 size bonus on attack rolls, and a +4 size bonus on Stealth checks, but uses smaller weapons than humans use, and his lifting and carrying limits are three-quarters of those of a Medium character.

Fast Speed: Bosmer have a base speed of 30 feet.

Low-Light Vision: Bosmer can see twice as far as humans in conditions of dim light.

Weapon Familiarity: Bosmer are have Weapon Group (bows) and either Weapon Group (heavy blades) or Weapon Group (light blades) , and treat any weapon with the word “elven” in its name as a martial weapon.

+2 racial bonus on saving throws against common diseases. (This does not include supernatural diseases)

+2 racial bonus on Stealth, and Acrobatics checks

+1 racial bonus on attack rolls with Weapon Group (bows).

Charm Animal: Once per day a Bosmer may use Charm Animal as a spell like ability if their charisma is at 10 or higher. Caster level 1st; save DC 10 + Bosmer’s Cha modifier + spell level.
Dunmer
http://images.uesp.net/3/3e/Lore-race-Dunmer.png
Dunmer (Dark Elf)
In the Empire, "Dark Elves" is the common usage, but in their Morrowind homeland, they call themselves the "Dunmer". The dark-skinned, red-eyed Dark Elves combine powerful intellect with strong and agile physiques, producing superior warriors and sorcerers. On the battlefield, Dark Elves are noted for their skilled and balanced integration of swordsmen, marksmen, and war wizards. In character, they are grim, distrusting, and disdainful of other races.

+2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, –2 Charisma: Dunmer are quick in body and mind, but are inherently strange.

Medium: Dunmer are Medium creatures and have no bonuses or penalties due to their size.

Normal Speed: Dunmer have a base speed of 30 feet.

Low-Light Vision: Dunmer can see twice as far as humans in conditions of dim light.

Weapon Familiarity: Dunmer are have Weapon Group (light blades) and either Weapon Group (heavy blades) or Weapon Group (bows), and treat any weapon with the word “elven” in its name as a martial weapon.

War Wizardry: Dunmer gain a +2 caster level bonus when casting spells from the Destruction or Mysticism spell lists.

Fire Resistance: Dunmer have fire resistance 5.

[NeoSeraphi]

For the Altmer, you should mention that in order to use the SLA, the elf needs at least an 11 in the mental stat he chooses to base it off of.

[Othniel Edden]

It was originally a 0-level spell off of any of the spell lists, but I figured that was a little less useful. I'll put that in, thanks.

[Domriso]

You know, I almost feel like the Altmer are rather weak. Vulnerability to Cold, Electricty and Fire? I know it fits with the Altmer from the games, but, damn, that hurts. Being the most common elemental damages, that could be painful, especially if they're normally casters.

Otherwise, it looks pretty good. Nothing glaring that I can see.

[Othniel Edden]

You know, I almost feel like the Altmer are rather weak. Vulnerability to Cold, Electricty and Fire? I know it fits with the Altmer from the games, but, damn, that hurts. Being the most common elemental damages, that could be painful, especially if they're normally casters. Yeah it hurts, and they are the only ones with potentially crippling disadvantage. Maybe there is someway I could boost them to make the disadvantage worth it? Maybe a caster level boost?


Otherwise, it looks pretty good. Nothing glaring that I can see.
Thank you.

[Domriso]

There's gotta be something they're good at...

In the games, they're better at casting spells, which makes sense why you gave the a spell-like ability. Maybe to accent that, give them a bonus to their spell's DCs? Makes their spells more potent, that way.

[NeoSeraphi]

There's gotta be something they're good at...

In the games, they're better at casting spells, which makes sense why you gave the a spell-like ability. Maybe to accent that, give them a bonus to their spell's DCs? Makes their spells more potent, that way.

I dunno. They did more damage with destruction spells, that's not increasing the DC. I agree with him, a bonus to caster level seems more appropriate.

[Othniel Edden]

Maybe like the war wizardry I have on the Dunmer but made for one spell school of the player's choice?

[Domriso]

That could work. Probably would make more sense based on the fluff, too.

[Othniel Edden]

Anything else until I move on to Bosmer? I'll probably end up doing separate threads for half-elves (Orcs and Bretons) beast races (Khajiit and Argonians) and Humans (Nords, Cryodiil, and Redgaurd.) I'd also except some edits in here when Skyrim comes out, because I want to keep things rather game neutral. You may see a bias towards Morrowind however, because I find it easier to work with.

[Arcran]

I would give Altmer a small Craft (alchemy) boost as well as a +1 on all spell save DC's.

[Arcran]

Bosmer should get Charm Animal 1/day, bonuses to Hide/ Move Silently and Craft (alchemy), normal elf stat boosts, and a bow bonus in some form.

[Othniel Edden]

I'm a little weary on alchemy and enchanting until I've put in the item crafting system for each. I know there are going to be some challenges there, but the systems might not work with racial bonuses.

[Othniel Edden]

Bosmer added and other fixes implemented.:smallcool:

[Arcran]

The Bosmer look good.

[Othniel Edden]

Should I do men, beast races or elvin heritage races next?

[DiBastet]

You should try men. There are enough to work with.

[Arcran]

Since the Orsimer are technically elves you should do them next.

[Othniel Edden]

Men are easy and hard. They have to be flexible enough to fit every concept but narrow enough for each type to be unique. Cyrodiil and Redgaurd are fairly easy, but Nords are going to need some doctoring.

Technically Bretons(Manmer) are also elves:smallwink:, but they are changed enough that I thought the two demanded their own categories. Orcs have also been categorized as beastmen.

I guess this leaves Khajiit and Argonians for last.

[Othniel Edden]

Here's what I got thus far on Orcs;

Orc's ability score modifiers will be +2 Constitution, +2 Wisdom, and -2 Charisma. I know these are a dwarf's stats in pathfinder, but they make sense. Orc's in game have great endurance and willpower for both sexes. They also have the poorest publicity in the game with both minuses to personality and reputation, their history of being monsters before the recent era also puts a damper on their ability to interact with people. There is a reason they are called the Pariah Folk.

Orcs are medium sized and slow. I really hate downing their mobility like this, but I think its for the best, because it is docked in game, and they have some of the best racial features period.

Berserk will be modified type of rage that will become an additional number of rage rounds instead if they chose barbarian. Haven't quite worked that out.

Orcs will get weapon group (axes) as a racial weapon proficiency. I'm also looking at doing some armor penalty reduction stuff for heavy and medium armor, as well as treating Orcish Armor as something special for them. Also given their high block in the game I want to do something with shields. They and Nords should clearly be the two best defensive choices of the races when it comes to melee.

Also Orcs are looking at getting spell resistance 2+ class level to mirror their 25% Magicka Resistance in game.

Thoughts on implementation?

[Seharvepernfan]

Oh, what I would give to play one of these Bosmer in a D&D game! :smallfrown:

[Othniel Edden]

I do plan on having these all playtested at some point. If you played any of these in regular D&D they'd probably have a level adjustment, but for the setting I'm just trying to balance all races against one another for far gameplay.

[palindrome]

I know you've moved on from the bosmer a little bit, but I might consider making them a small race. Yes, it's a limiting feature, but it does offer a little more variety amongst the races. If you want to offset the small you could always give them a climb speed of 10ft or something (I know that opens them up for a whole nasty world of powergaming and whatnot, but if you want to make race a choice that actually has lasting impact, it's a good way to go. But concern about powergaming really changes from group to group)

[Othniel Edden]

I actually really dislike that there are no small races, as small can be seen as an advantage, except maybe the Khajiit. Ohmes look like smaller Bosmer for example, and Bosmer are short enough. If I move down Bosmer to small expect some Khajiit to follow, with the Suthay and Ohmes being the ones to do so. I will definitely consider it. I'm always taking critiques on this stuff.

[palindrome]

I would definitely move some khajit down to small. Racial choices have a lasting impact in the elder scrolls games, and I think it's a serious disadvantage or oversight of core races that they do not make a difference beyond first or second level. Unless, of course, you are a small character, in which case your decision does affect your play for 20+levels. I think if you're going to give the altmer traits that affect them long-term like in the actual games, the other races ought to have some as well, hopefully for better and for worse.

[Othniel Edden]

Bosmer are now small, and Suthay and Ohmes will be made small. Cathay-raht will be made as large. Ohmes-raht, Suthay-raht, and Cathay will be normal sized with the rest of the Khajiit not being accounted for as player characters. Probably make a flexible stat base for each size, but Khajiit are hard.:smalltongue:

[motionmatrix]

I would change the Altmer a bit:

Make their vulnerability a static number; have it scale like elemental resistances, 5 at level 1, 10 at level 5, etc. so it always stays relevant but not automatically mean killed by most elemental spells, I can totally see many Altmer below level 5 getting raped by most offensive spells as it is currently written.

And I would make their "Innately Arcane" racial ability scaling with their actual casting levels. If they can cast 5th level spells, then Innately Arcane can now be used for a 5th level spell. (Just me being nit picky: If its going to be called Innately 'Arcane' then perhaps it should only allow the use of arcane spells, or call it Innately Magical instead)

[Othniel Edden]

I'm doing quite a bit of changes with spells. Most classes will just be able to cast from the six schools from the elder scroll games, and will likely only have one type of magic for the setting. You can see references to the rules I'm using for things like weapon groups and spell school specific stuff in all the entries. Most likely only a few non-full caster classes will have access to tailored lists rather than schools.