Newspaper

[ImperatorK]

Are there newspapers in default D&D worlds like Forgotten Realms or Greyhawk?
I've got inspired by a story about a little local newspaper delivery company, but I don't know how to incorporate such modern thing into D&D. Any ideas?

[hivedragon]

Play Eberron

[HappyBlanket]

Sending spells. Carrier pigeons (Animal Messenger?). Magic items of some sort?

[hivedragon]

IRL the printing press was invented in the 1440s

[ImperatorK]

Play Eberron
Gee, thanks. Very insightful of you. :smallannoyed:


Sending spells. Carrier pigeons (Animal Messenger?). Magic items of some sort?
What does it have to do with a newspaper? :smallconfused:


IRL the printing press was invented in the 1440s
That doesn't really help me, because in default settings it either isn't invented or is highly obscure (if I remember correctly there is printing press in FR, but only in Lantan).
Also, even if it was invented in 1440, it wasn't common for a long time.

Maybe I wasn't clear. I apologize.
What I'm asking for are ideas on how to incorporate something that's similar in function to a modern newspaper delivery company.

[Salanmander]

Gee, thanks. Very insightful of you. :smallannoyed:


It actually was fairly insightful, and I would have posted a similar thing but it would just have been agreeing.

You said you didn't know how to incorporate modern-style things like newspapers into D&D. Eberron is one giant setting full of examples of how to do exactly that. If you want to know how printing presses, banks, and trains can fit into D&D, go read about Sharn.

[ImperatorK]

It actually was fairly insightful, and I would have posted a similar thing but it would just have been agreeing.

You said you didn't know how to incorporate modern-style things like newspapers into D&D. Eberron is one giant setting full of examples of how to do exactly that. If you want to know how printing presses, banks, and trains can fit into D&D, go read about Sharn.
Well, "Play Eberron" and "Eberron has what you looking for" are quite different, don't you think?
Also, I'm asking you how you would do it. Not how it was done in a pseudo-sci-fi setting. Eberron has trains and "robots". Not really default D&D world.

[excruciarch]

There's nothing wrong with creating a spell that duplicates written text and self-writing feather pens with infinite ink. The issue is the material used. Is there paper around FR or just parchment? (which is rather expensive)

[Amnestic]

Eberron has trains and "robots". Not really default D&D world.

(Iron) Golems, Inevitables, Clockwork Horrors...

Trains I'll grant you. Robots? Not so much.

[ImperatorK]

There's nothing wrong with creating a spell that duplicates written text and self-writing feather pens with infinite ink. The issue is the material used. Is there paper around FR or just parchment? (which is rather expensive)
There are spells to copy written text, but one that is writing... I don't remember such spell.
There are books, so maybe they have paper. doesn't really matter, it's just details.


(Iron) Golems, Inevitables, Clockwork Horrors...

Trains I'll grant you. Robots? Not so much.
Warforged. I was gonna say "cyborgs", maybe that would be a better word.

[Rogue Shadows]

IRL the printing press was invented in the 1440s

In Europe.

[The Glyphstone]

Warforged. I was gonna say "cyborgs", maybe that would be a better word.

Doesn't 'cyborg' imply a fusion of living organic and mechanical components? Sure, Warforged use wood as part of their skeletal structure, but unless it's that weird tree that stays alive even when cut down/cut apart, I wouldn't count that as 'living organic".

[excruciarch]

There are spells to copy written text, but one that is writing... I don't remember such spell.
There are books, so maybe they have paper. doesn't really matter, it's just details.
In a world full of magic anyone can invent their spells, right? You can even make an intelligent feather pen which can write an article or two by its own in neat calligraphic way.
Books in FR are made of parchment.

[ImperatorK]

In Europe.
Actually, the first printing machine was made in 600 in China.


Doesn't 'cyborg' imply a fusion of living organic and mechanical components? Sure, Warforged use wood as part of their skeletal structure, but unless it's that weird tree that stays alive even when cut down/cut apart, I wouldn't count that as 'living organic".
That's way I changed it into "robot".

[Salanmander]

Well, "Play Eberron" and "Eberron has what you looking for" are quite different, don't you think?
Also, I'm asking you how you would do it. Not how it was done in a pseudo-sci-fi setting. Eberron has trains and "robots". Not really default D&D world.

Pseudo-sci-fi is pushing it a bit far. Eberron is somewhere between pseudo-industrial revolution and pseudo-modern.

Also, I'm a little confused. Are you looking to add newspapers to your current campaign setting? If so, the style of setting is going to matter a lot. If you've established a world where most people don't travel more than 10 miles from their hometown in their life, then newspapers wouldn't really make sense. Even in a big city like London, the circles of people that would care about such things are going to be too small for newspaper distribution.

On the other hand, newspapers could be plopped down right in the middle of Baldur's Gate (the city) and not feel out of place at all.

[Rogue Shadows]

Actually, the first printing machine was made in 600 in China.

Yes, I was hoping to emphasize the point that they don't originate from 1440 Europe.

[ImperatorK]

Local newspaper.

[AppleChips]

I read somewhere that you can get paper, but it's more expensive than parchment. Ah, PHB says paper costs 4 sp a sheet, parchment costs 2 sp. Also, paper is "made of cloth fibers".

[HappyBlanket]

What does it have to do with a newspaper? :smallconfused:

Maybe I wasn't clear. I apologize.
What I'm asking for are ideas on how to incorporate something that's similar in function to a modern newspaper delivery company.

Sending (and other communication spells): A collection of mages gather information by means of Divination, then relay the information to subscribers by means of Sending. Or Animal Messenger, which... Sends messages. Or any other spell that sends messages, the likes of which I'm sure aren't lacking. I'm pretty sure that Sending wouldn't suffice.

Exactly how much of this do you want to be mundane?

[Ksheep]

A few things:

While the printing press was originally developed in China, those used wood etchings, where the entire page had to be carved by hand first, which was very time consuming. They also had a problem of wearing out after only a few hundred printings (if not less). The European press, on the other hand, used metal type, where it had movable letters, meaning that it was a lot simpler to set up a page for printing. This resulted in faster and (slightly) higher quality prints (as the type could survive many more presses).

Second, if you want an example of how to incorporate it into a (pseudo)-fantasy world, I'd suggest you read the Discworld novel "The Truth" by Terry Pratchett. It is all about the creation of the first newspaper business (and subsequent creation of the first tabloid) on the Discworld. Very good read, and should be able to give you some ideas. Also, while you're at it, if you'd like a postal service, movie theaters, paper money, sports etc. you could read some of Pratchett's other books (Going Postal, Moving Pictures, Making Money, Unseen Academicals, etc) for inspiration.

[ImperatorK]

Sending (and other communication spells): A collection of mages gather information by means of Divination, then relay the information to subscribers by means of Sending. Or Animal Messenger, which... Sends messages. Or any other spell that sends messages, the likes of which I'm sure aren't lacking. I'm pretty sure that Sending wouldn't suffice.
I want it to be local. One city and nearest villages. Spells and magic items are too unusual.


Exactly how much of this do you want to be mundane?
No magic at all.

Okay. From what I gather, a pseudo-modern news-network would need too much magic and would be too prestigious. Only the rich would get news and only if they cared.
In that case I have another question/request: What thing that already exists (or could exist) in D&D (i.e. FR) could substitute for a newspaper delivery company?

[Salanmander]

I want it to be local. One city and nearest villages. Spells and magic items are too unusual.


No magic at all.

Okay. From what I gather, a pseudo-modern news-network would need too much magic and would be too prestigious. Only the rich would get news and only if they cared.
In that case I have another question/request: What thing that already exists (or could exist) in D&D (i.e. FR) could substitute for a newspaper delivery company?

If it's a big city with lots of wealth floating around it /could/ make sense. Drop some gnomish inventors down in a major FR city and you hardly need more explanation.

As for other things, it depends on the aspects you want. If it's public information, town criers or an informant ring. If it's the delivery aspect, a postal service or dairy farming business. Lots of things could work.

[Ksheep]

Okay. From what I gather, a pseudo-modern news-network would need too much magic and would be too prestigious. Only the rich would get news and only if they cared.
In that case I have another question/request: What thing that already exists (or could exist) in D&D (i.e. FR) could substitute for a newspaper delivery company?

It wouldn't necessarily be high-magic. In the example I mentioned above, there was little-to-no magic involved. Quick synopsis:
William de Worde teams up with a number of dwarves who have made a new printing machine that will work much faster than what the Printer's Guild has. They decide to start a newspaper, after realizing how many false rumors are floating around. The paper becomes wildly popular, except by the Printer's Guild. The Guild decided to try to run them out of business by making a tabloid at a much lower cost… although it has no actual news in it and they are losing money on it. The tabloid finally hires thugs to burn down the newspaper's building… forcing the dwarves to break in and "borrow" one of the tabloid's presses in order to make one last issue exposing the tabloid for what it was and bringing down the higher-ups of the Guild.

[excruciarch]

could substitute for a newspaper delivery company?
Town criers are rather common I think. An orphanage using kids as town criers would be ok. Or a company employing kids to do this (company like that can receive money from town's ruler for this public service) But without magic there is not much to cry about. Only local news i think. And belated news on the outer world.

[Malimar]

There's nothing wrong with creating a spell that duplicates written text and self-writing feather pens with infinite ink.


There are spells to copy written text, but one that is writing... I don't remember such spell.


Exactly how much of this do you want to be mundane?


No magic at all.

Amanuensis (SpC) is only a cantrip; that's almost no magic. And it doesn't copy magical writing, only mundane writing, so it's not useful to the average adventurer. I always figured it was intended to be precisely what this thread is looking for: D&D's version of a printing press.

Indeed, a self-resetting trap of amanuensis would be almost indistinguishable from a mundane printing press, if you want to dip your toes into a little bit of Tippyverse.

[ImperatorK]

Criers, huh? :smallconfused: That might work. Anything else? It doesn't necessarily have to deal with news. I'm looking for a similar... "feel", that's all.


Indeed, a self-resetting trap of amanuensis would be almost indistinguishable from a mundane printing press, if you want to dip your toes into a little bit of Tippyverse.
Nah, that would not work in my games.

To give you guys a better picture:
Anyone watched the anime called "Kanamemo"?

[excruciarch]

I'm looking for a similar... "feel", that's all.
You must consider that FR is a world in which almost no one cares about small time news. No one cares about who's marrying who, who had sex with who and etc. There are no trading houses, stock exchanges and etc. And if someone cares- they just learn it via gossiping folk. And commoners, peasants mostly, can't read at all. They are interested in big time news, that what criers are for. Big news tend to fly through the neighbourhood like tornadoes. So criers are the best solution, probably.
PS
Run a lottery company. :D It has that *feeling* I think, tickets of parchment with numbers and all.

[McQ]

I was working on a Newspaper myself, but it was far more global. Halflings traveling the world would write from many different locations on all kinds of things, and would be passed along the many networks of "hostels" to the publisher. This including flying ships, though.

I'd think that the printing press would not be an entirely difficult technology to have developed in a medieval setting? Paper might be expensive, but I think the rules are for the older heavy weight papers back then. Sometime in the Victorian era I think paper started to be made much thinner from mud and pulp of smaller plants like reeds or something?

The town crier is also a great idea, it was common way back even into the classical period to hear formal decrees of laws and news by the crier. The crier would read aloud at a set time, and many people from businessmen to nobles would take this source more seriously than rumor and gossip.

Bards are a good source of news too, though they are generally attributed to tales of legend and grand deeds versus simply that wheat prices are very high due to orc attacks.

It's a tough thing to consider since back in the medieval period, lack of communication and information to the masses was very helpful to the upper classes to keep them in control. During the American revolution, secret carriers of news worked under the nose of the British to print provincial papers. That might function more like a spy network, but even so was distributed to locals not necessarily top ranking officials, knowledge was accessible to the masses.

There could be a billboard? Whomever wished to put up information would just tack it up for anyone to see. Likely upheld by the local government that would put up it's own verdicts on local law change, judicial verdicts of interest, warrants, and even things like advertisements for merchants or want ads.

Hope I helped a little.

[Zonugal]

Amanuensis (SpC) is only a cantrip; that's almost no magic. And it doesn't copy magical writing, only mundane writing, so it's not useful to the average adventurer. I always figured it was intended to be precisely what this thread is looking for: D&D's version of a printing press.

Indeed, a self-resetting trap of amanuensis would be almost indistinguishable from a mundane printing press, if you want to dip your toes into a little bit of Tippyverse.

This is, without actually constructing a mundane printing press, the closest to pulling off a printing press & thus a newspaper system.

Now if you're looking for a way to get information out quickly many have suggested town criers, but this tends to be for important items of news (not most of the stuff that actually make a newspaper a newspaper).

[Thurbane]

Not 3E, but from memory the 2E supplement A Mighty Fortress was full of ideas for running a D&D game set later than the usual psuedo- Dark Ages or Medieval timeline of most D&D campaigns. I think it even had sections on printing presses. The crunch may require some tinkering, but it might offer some good ideas.

[Ravens_cry]

In Europe.
And never took off in China at the time, probably because the thousands of symbols of that language made wood cut printing more practical than mobile type.
Personally, I would like to see the effects of printing press that, unlike Amanuensis, does copy spells and other magical writing. Sure, you still need the super-expensive magic inks, but been able to have hundreds of scrolls of a spell in fairly short order?
It could be . . .interesting.

[Kol Korran]

One of Terry Pratchet's book (The Truth) deals with his world first printing press (mechanical, a new invention of dwarves wanting to make money. you can easily have it as any other race), and thr first trials of funning a local newspaper.

short tail is, i don't think it needs to be that different from a real world printing press. it would moslty be a novel idea, and be used for other stuff such as printing books, printing royal decress and piosters and the like. i dislike the use of major magical means to get information, i think that Journalists (with all the questions rising as to their status, what they can or can't do and the like) would make a very nice addition to the game (maybe even an NPC or two? or a PC?)

i would imagine that the paper, being the only one of his kind would not necesserily adhere to modern day journalism ethics, and might be much more personalized, perhaps vulgar, perhaps audacious, more like a tabloid i'd believe, but that's just how i imagine it. it all depends on the people running it, which might lead to some interesting interactions in game. (the players stop a cult in an old temple- "robbers despoil our nation's past and kill and maim poor acolytes of the old faiths!")

hope this helps!

[Person_Man]

The vast majority of the world was illiterate for most of human history. Prior to the 1500's it was in the 99% range. Then movable type was invented, and the first thing that most people read was a set of stories they were deeply familiar with, the Bible. Whether or not people should actually read the Bible was actually a big deal (see: Protestant Reformation). Around the 1700's paper production started to become a lot cheaper and printing presses became easier to operate, and thus newspapers started to crop up and play an important role. But even then illiteracy hovered in the 80%+ range for the next few hundred years, and didn't meaningfully drop much more until the industrial revolution. As recently as 60 years ago it was still in the 50% range, and still hovers around 15% now.

That's the long way of saying that unless you want to place your campaign in an anachronistic setting like Eberron, or during the Age of Discovery or some later time, the existence of newspapers don't make sense.

[ImperatorK]

That's why I'm not so set on the newspaper idea. If it's too much trouble to incorporate it then I think of something different. Like the criers.

[Ravens_cry]

Practically everyone, including the Commoner, can read in D&D, so it may be safe to assume the printing press already exists and is in quite common use. This would also imply that names like the "Prancing Pony" would not exist except in older inns and taverns as that was based off a picture based signing to help a predominately illiterate population.

[Incorrect]

Of course the paperboys will be a group of adventurers, traveling the world to deliver the papers to the most dangerous regions and dungeons...
Would be an awesome campaign :smalltongue:

[Ksheep]

It makes sense that commoners in D&D can read at a higher rate than commoners in the dark ages, mostly because of the existence of magic. As Person_Man stated, the literacy rate didn't start going up until the industrial revolution, a time which made life for the average person easier. Because they had to work less for the same amount of work (in many fields, at least), they had more free time to devote to other activities, namely reading. In the D&D setting, magic takes this roll, simplifying many hard tasks. Even a 1st level wizard could easily double the production of a fair number of areas. This would again give more people free time, and so all that is needed is the invention of a printing press, which is no difficult feat.