Concealing Weapons

[hobbitkniver]

My DM seems to have a nasty habit of making the party get captured in the main quest. I usually keep a mundane dagger concealed, but the guards stripped us down into prison suits and I there was simply nowhere to hide a dagger. So the questions is, whats the best magical way/ specific weapon to hide in case of emergency. I know of gloves that you can store an item in, but I imagine the guards would take them too. I also wonder if my DM would just tell me no since it would have made everything easier and he's frankly not a great DM and has no versatility.

[Vladislav]

First, Teh Rulez:


You can hide a small object (including a light weapon or an easily concealed ranged weapon, such as a dart, sling, or hand crossbow) on your body. Your Sleight of Hand check is opposed by the Spot check of anyone observing you or the Search check of anyone frisking you. In the latter case, the searcher gains a +4 bonus on the Search check, since it’s generally easier to find such an object than to hide it. A dagger is easier to hide than most light weapons, and grants you a +2 bonus on your Sleight of Hand check to conceal it. An extraordinarily small object, such as a coin, shuriken, or ring, grants you a +4 bonus on your Sleight of Hand check to conceal it, and heavy or baggy clothing (such as a cloak) grants you a +2 bonus on the check.
If they strip you down, it merely means they're taking 20 on their Search. You can still beat it with a good Sleight of Hand skill.

Also, consider the merits of Shrink Item (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shrinkItem.htm). Duration is days/level....

[Luckmann]

Well, if they strip you down and take your clothes, I can see how you'd have a hard time concealing weapons.

When all else fails, there's always Shrink Item and body cavities... :smallwink:

[Knaight]

When all else fails, there's always Shrink Item and body cavities... :smallwink:

One can skip the Shrink Item part for some weapons. Shruiken could be hidden relatively easily, as could shorter slings with thin cords.

[Luckmann]

One can skip the Shrink Item part for some weapons. Shruiken could be hidden relatively easily, as could shorter slings with thin cords.

I look at a shuriken.
I look at my ass.
I look back at the shuriken.

No. We're going to need Shrink Item. Definitely. :smallbiggrin:

[Ravens_cry]

There is also an assassin spell in the Spell Compendium that hides weapons as tattoos, to be recalled at leisure.

[Knaight]

I look at a shuriken.
I look at my ass.
I look back at the shuriken.

No. We're going to need Shrink Item. Definitely. :smallbiggrin:

You have this fancy body cavity called a mouth. Moreover, the shruiken could be placed in what is basically a sheath when hiding it, to avoid the whole sharpness issue.

[hobbitkniver]

You have this fancy body cavity called a mouth. Moreover, the shruiken could be placed in what is basically a sheath when hiding it, to avoid the whole sharpness issue.

Haha no one thinks of that one first.

[theForce017]

Use a Ring of Arming from MIC p. 122 for 5000gp. Put the ring on and have both a dagger or other weapon out and possibly back up armor and store it in the ring by activating it. Then get your standard gear back out. When you get captured, pop the ring into your mouth or something like that until you are in the jail cell and then put the ring on and *poof* your armor and daggers (or other weapons) are back on you without the need to don armor or draw the weapon. Hope this helps.

EDIT: Hiding a ring should hopefully be a little easier than hiding a weapon.

[Luckmann]

You have this fancy body cavity called a mouth. Moreover, the shruiken could be placed in what is basically a sheath when hiding it, to avoid the whole sharpness issue.
Well have you ever tried talking with a shuriken in your mouth? :smallbiggrin:

I honestly think I'd have a hard time fitting that in there, sheet or no sheet. In -any- cavity. :smalltongue:

[Choco]

Step 1: Get some sort of permanent Fast Healing
Step 2: Make an incision around the abdominal area
Step 3: Insert dagger between some vital organs
Step 4: ???
Step 5: Profit

And yes, I did this before.....

[hobbitkniver]

My main weapon is a bow, so that'd be the best thing to hide if its possible.

[Big Fau]

There is also an assassin spell in the Spell Compendium that hides weapons as tattoos, to be recalled at leisure.

Alternatively, Hoard Gullet (Dragon Magic). Turns your mouth into a bag of holding. Those sword swallowers? Yeah.

[hobbitkniver]

We also have a vampire who is immune to all non magic weapons, so we could just make him a walking pin cushion.

[Ravens_cry]

My main weapon is a bow, so that'd be the best thing to hide if its possible.

The delightful thing about shrink item is the flannelgraph option (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/shrinkItem.htm). Place that between linings in your clothing. Sure, you could stuff it in a bodily cavity, but that is what cavity searches are for. Cloth is meant to be around cloth, while finding a cutout of a sword up someone's rectum is immidiate cause for concern by security who know about shrink item.
Oh, and if they do a one over with detect magic after searching you, there is this spell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/magicAura.htm) to apply on top.
Now just pray they don't do a dispel magic or two over you as part of standard procedure.

[hobbitkniver]

Arcane spells are less useful to me because our wizard is pretty new and I don't like to give him extra responsibilities. I'm looking at items, I have a surplus of gold and can buy just about anything I can afford.

[Ravens_cry]

Arcane spells are less useful to me because our wizard is pretty new and I don't like to give him extra responsibilities. I'm looking at items, I have a surplus of gold and can buy just about anything I can afford.
Do you mean new as a player or new as in low level?
The trouble of buying items for this is that you are trying buy items that have a pretty explicit purpose, concealment of weapons. This will set off a lot of peoples alarms and they may, or even by law have to, report it. Or at least gossip about it, people have been gossiping about things as long as we have been.
"Why yes, I did buy that sheath of concealment from Big Bobs House of Magic Items, and now I want to speak to the king, why do you ask?"
That won't look so good.

[hobbitkniver]

Do you mean new as a player or new as in low level?
The trouble of buying items for this is that you are trying buy items that have a pretty explicit purpose, concealment of weapons. This will set off a lot of peoples alarms and they may, or even by law have to, report it. Or at least gossip about it, people have been gossiping about things as long as we have been.
"Why yes, I did buy that sheath of concealment from Big Bobs House of Magic Items, and now I want to speak to the king, why do you ask?"
That won't look so good.

He's a new player and he's having trouble just knowing what to roll. As for items, I honestly doubt my DM would put things together like that. If anything, he'd say "I'm DM and I don't want you to have a weapon".

[Ravens_cry]

He's a new player and he's having trouble just knowing what to roll. As for items, I honestly doubt my DM would put things together like that. If anything, he'd say "I'm DM and I don't want you to have a weapon".
Heh, well, I am a bit of a versimlitude junkie, I like to think of the interactions of ideas.
But such plans are naught before the kind of DM that says "I'm DM and I don't want you to have a weapon".

[Lapak]

Step 1: Get some sort of permanent Fast Healing
Step 2: Make an incision around the abdominal area
Step 3: Insert dagger between some vital organs
Step 4: ???
Step 5: Profit

And yes, I did this before.....Though I hesitate to bring this up, how do you retrieve the weapon while locked up with no weapons or equipment? This seems like a situation where you've locked yourself out of your car with the keys inside.

[Choco]

Though I hesitate to bring this up, how do you retrieve the weapon while locked up with no weapons or equipment? This seems like a situation where you've locked yourself out of your car with the keys inside.

The character in question had claws.

And if for some reason that is not an option (tied up), said character was ALSO a warshaper and could to some degree shift around internal organs (and the dagger) to get it out other ways :smalltongue:

[Ravens_cry]

Yeah, but you have claws, why do you NEED weapons?

[Choco]

We can probably come up with THOUSANDS of ways a masterwork dagger can be useful. It was not for combat purposes, just a "just in case" tool. Even if I can give it to someone else during a prison break it would be worth it.

[excruciarch]

Glove of Storing: This device is a simple leather glove. On command, one item held in the hand wearing the glove disappears. The item can weigh no more than 20 pounds and must be able to be held in one hand. While stored, the item has negligible weight. With a snap of the fingers wearing the glove, the item reappears. A glove can only store one item at a time. Storing or retrieving the item is a free action. The item is held in stasis and shrunk down so small within the palm of the glove that it cannot be seen. Spell durations are not suppressed, but continue to expire. If an effect is suppressed or dispelled, the stored item appears instantly.

Faint transmutation; CL 6th; Craft Wondrous Item, shrink item; Price 10,000 gp (one glove).
Something like that?

[Ksheep]

One thought: Hat of Disguise.


This apparently normal hat allows its wearer to alter her appearance as with a disguise self spell. As part of the disguise, the hat can be changed to appear as a comb, ribbon, headband, cap, coif, hood, helmet, and so on.


You make yourself—including clothing, armor, weapons, and equipment—look different. You can seem 1 foot shorter or taller, thin, fat, or in between. You cannot change your body type. Otherwise, the extent of the apparent change is up to you. You could add or obscure a minor feature or look like an entirely different person.

Use it to make your weapons look like pieces of straw or some such, stuck in your hair. Make yourself look disheveled so they don't question it. Make the "hat" also into such a piece of detritus. Unless they go and comb out your hair while stripping you, you should be OK. NOTE: How much this can change items is up to DM's discretion.

EDIT: Couple this with the Glove of Storing and you'd be set, so long as they don't question whatever you have it disguised as.

[dgnslyr]

Two things about the Gloves of Storing:

1. Gloves of the Master Tactician offer the same benefit at a cheaper price, along with a bonus to initiative, I think, because the price is based on the 3.0 price.

2. Gloves might get confiscated along with the rest of your clothes, unless you plan on doing some custom item shenanigans where you apply that magic effect to something less conspicuous. A magic tooth you can remove to transform into a sword, maybe?

[Ravens_cry]

Two things about the Gloves of Storing:

1. Gloves of the Master Tactician offer the same benefit at a cheaper price, along with a bonus to initiative, I think, because the price is based on the 3.0 price.

2. Gloves might get confiscated along with the rest of your clothes, unless you plan on doing some custom item shenanigans where you apply that magic effect to something less conspicuous. A magic tooth you can remove to transform into a sword, maybe?

Make sure to get Magic Aura (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/magicAura.htm)on that tooth. You don't want your special tooth lighting up if they cast detect magic on you and unless they are super paranoid, they are unlikely to spend 100 gp on an Identify.

[excruciarch]

Two things about the Gloves of Storing:

1. Gloves of the Master Tactician offer the same benefit at a cheaper price, along with a bonus to initiative, I think, because the price is based on the 3.0 price.

2. Gloves might get confiscated along with the rest of your clothes, unless you plan on doing some custom item shenanigans where you apply that magic effect to something less conspicuous. A magic tooth you can remove to transform into a sword, maybe?
Glove of storing is 3.5 SRD wondrous item. Gloves of the Master Tactician are not.
You can make a sword permanently invisible (invisibility+ permanency).

[Ravens_cry]

G.
You can make a sword permanently invisible (invisibility+ permanency).
That isn't going to stop a patdown, however.
Just because you can't see it does not mean you can not feel it.

[excruciarch]

That isn't going to stop a patdown, however.
Just because you can't see it does not mean you can not feel it.
Make it incorporeal invisible. It will be normal only for ya.

[Ravens_cry]

Make it incorporeal invisible. It will be normal only for ya.

I don't think incorporeal works that way. Unless you have, say, gloves of ghost touch, you are not going to be able to use it either. You also can't store it on your person as it would just fall through you.
Also, barring the above, can a spell that makes things incorporeal be permanenced? Things off the list can be allowed with DM discretion, but that is not certain.
And finally, dispel magic suppresses permanency. When meeting important and/or paranoid enough people, it would be a matter of course.

[hobbitkniver]

Why not make the gloves of storing invisible?

[Heatwizard]

Why not make yourself invisible? Then they couldn't put you in jail.

[Kantolin]

Lurk 1 has the 'Dimensional Pocket' power, which is extremely neat and useful for this purpose, letting you store an object that weighs 1lb/level 'elsewhere' for hour/level (And you can respend more pp to make it essentially sustained).

This requires lurk 1, or enough levels in any psionic class to hit second level powers and then take expanded knowledge, so it may not be too helpful. If you just snagged it with one level, it'd only last an hour, so that's probably not enough.

[Ksheep]

Why not make yourself invisible? Then they couldn't put you in jail.

Unless they have: See Invisibility, Anti-Magic Field, Tremorsense, Dispel Magic, Blindsight, Blindsense, etc.

[Ravens_cry]

Why not make yourself invisible? Then they couldn't put you in jail.
One word: dogs. Or anything with the scent ability really.

[Heatwizard]

Unless they have: See Invisibility, Anti-Magic Field, Tremorsense, Dispel Magic, Blindsight, Blindsense, etc.

Well, if they have see invisibility going all the time, invisible weapons aren't going to help you much, and you can just stay out of range of the other ones.

[hobbitkniver]

So there isn't any sort of way to bind a weapon to you so that you can summon it on command?

[excruciarch]

I don't think incorporeal works that way. Unless you have, say, gloves of ghost touch, you are not going to be able to use it either. You also can't store it on your person as it would just fall through you.
Also, barring the above, can a spell that makes things incorporeal be permanenced? Things off the list can be allowed with DM discretion, but that is not certain.
And finally, dispel magic suppresses permanency. When meeting important and/or paranoid enough people, it would be a matter of course.
You can give your weapon ghost touch property. (+1 price) Then you can make it corporeal/incorporeal as you please.

Unless they have: See Invisibility, Anti-Magic Field, Tremorsense, Dispel Magic, Blindsight, Blindsense, etc.
You forgot to mention giving your PCs colonoscopy any time they are captured/arrested. :D

[Ravens_cry]

You can give your weapon ghost touch property. (+1 price) Then you can make it corporeal/incorporeal as you please.

Hmm, that's one way to read the final line.


You forgot to mention giving your PCs colonoscopy any time they are captured/arrested. :D
Actually, I did mention that in an earlier post, under "cavity searches."

[aquaticrna]

you can get called on your armor which is handy, but i don't think there is an equivalent for your weapons...

[Ravens_cry]

you can get called on your armor which is handy, but i don't think there is an equivalent for your weapons...
There is that bard spell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/summonInstrument.htm) that calls instruments . . .
Kabong! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmemBa1HAzU)

[excruciarch]

Hmm, that's one way to read the final line.

Actually, I did mention that in an earlier post, under "cavity searches."


Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as either corporeal or incorporeal at any given time, whichever is more beneficial to the wielder.
I've missed your *cavity search* suggestion. =]

There is that bard spell (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/summonInstrument.htm) that calls instruments . . .
Kabong! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AmemBa1HAzU)

How much damage you can make using the instrument summoned as a weapon? Like 0d0+0? =)

[Ksheep]

Another thing you could do is be a Master of Many Forms and Wildshape into a different humanoid. When you Wildshape:

Any gear worn or carried by the druid melds into the new form and becomes nonfunctional. When the druid reverts to her true form, any objects previously melded into the new form reappear in the same location on her body that they previously occupied and are once again functional. Any new items worn in the assumed form fall off and land at the druid's feet.
At first level of Master of Many Forms, you get Improved Wildshape, which allows you to turn into a humanoid. You just need to time it properly, since it only lasts 1 hr/druid level.

[aquaticrna]

You just need to time it properly, since it only lasts 1 hr/druid level.

Guards: Quick after him! He went around that corner!

*chase ensues, guards round corner and instead of the heavily armored dwarf they were chasing there is now a naked woman*

Woman: OH MY! that handsome dwarf just stole all my clothes! He went that way!

*they leave, immediately wild shape into a rabbit and pull a carrot out of nowhere*

[excruciarch]

If your DM is paranoid to the extent of searching your *cavities* (dispelling something or even using AMF) next time go Pun-pun. =)
Or go anything that does not require equipment to be effective in combat(wizards/druids/monks/shapechangers etc)

[Ravens_cry]

I've missed your *cavity search* suggestion. =]

Probably for your own good.


How much damage you can make using the instrument summoned as a weapon? Like 0d0+0? =)

While the rules in D&D for improvised weapons are kind of thin, they do exist (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm).

Improvised Weapons

Sometimes objects not crafted to be weapons nonetheless see use in combat. Because such objects are not designed for this use, any creature that uses one in combat is considered to be nonproficient with it and takes a -4 penalty on attack rolls made with that object. To determine the size category and appropriate damage for an improvised weapon, compare its relative size and damage potential to the weapon list to find a reasonable match. An improvised weapon scores a threat on a natural roll of 20 and deals double damage on a critical hit. An improvised thrown weapon has a range increment of 10 feet.

[Calimehter]

There's an armour special ability from MiC called "Called" (heh, that was fun to write), which lets you summon your armour to yourself from just about anywhere on the same plane . . . such as a storeroom where guards may stash confiscated items.

I took recently in a seafaring campaign to make retrieving my plate armour from the bottom of the ocean a bit easier (don't laugh, it paid off) but I wonder if you couldn't use this ability to get yourself some weapons too, by attaching them to your armour or somesuch other trick. If nothing else, you could get yourself some spiked armour that way.

[Kojiro]

Well, I don't think it's been brought up yet, but if they take your clothes but give them back, you could use things like the hidden boot compartments from Complete Scoundrel. I doubt most people will dismantle your shoes in paranoia, at least until you use this trick on the DM once and he makes sure to never let it work again.

Apart from that, yeah. Hoard Gullet and the like are the best, probably.

[Slipperychicken]

I recall an item named "alchemical tooth" (300gp, Complete Adventurer 121), it's essentially a means to store doses of potions in a hollow tooth in one's mouth. My thought is that you shrink your items small enough to fit into the thing, pass the search, dismiss the shrink effect and be on your way. DC30 search to find the tooth. Yet another idea would be to work out how much damage your characters digestive system does to items, and whether bags of holding/portable holes could be reasonably swallowed (if the damage is too much, wrap it up in something more resistant, if the bag's too big, shrink item the bag and swallow it). Pass the search with your bag, vomit it up and get your gear back.



However, if the guards suddenly start pulling DC30 searches and wrenching very small bags out of your digestive system, that's your signal to hand the conductor your ticket, sit back, and enjoy the ride (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gXk8y7_qxY).

[Ravens_cry]

"Suddenly"? Yes, I suppose it is railroading. However, if you make a world that tries to maintain verisimilitude, it makes sense that guards for important people should take precautions from the logical dangers of such a world. In a world with fairly extensive magic, this means some very strange seeming, but pretty logical given the circumstances, situations. Look all the precautions taken when people see the US president and we don't have magic like "Shrink Item".

[Slipperychicken]

"Suddenly"? Yes, I suppose it is railroading. However, if you make a world that tries to maintain verisimilitude, it makes sense that guards for important people should take precautions from the logical dangers of such a world. In a world with fairly extensive magic, this means some very strange seeming, but pretty logical given the circumstances, situations. Look all the precautions taken when people see the US president and we don't have magic like "Shrink Item".


Whether the GM just rule-0s it, or NPCs are sufficiently and logically well-defended to stop attempts at smuggling things past them, my point still stands: If your goal simply can't be accomplished with the resources you're willing to spend, you might as well throw your hands up and let the GM read his lines. All you're doing in either case is delaying the inevitable, maybe earning a condescending remark or two for your trouble. Sorta like RL :smalltongue:

[Ksheep]

Just remember, there can be a downside to trying to conceal weapons. In one game I was in, the party was split into two groups. One of the groups (the one I wasn't in) went to talk to the king of one of the countries we were dealing with. The guards of course confiscate all weapons at the door. So, as the party is there, talking with the king, one of the guys, a chaotic neutral guy, just stares at his character sheet and says "I shoot the king".

DM: "… What?"

Player: "I pull my bow out of my glove of storing, and pull out the only arrow in it and shoot the king."

Everyone: *laughs*

Player: "I'm serious. Oh, and it's a Human Slaying Arrow."

DM: "… Roll to hit."

Player: *Rolls, hits, kills the king in a single shot*

Needless to say, the guards quickly took the group into custody. The king's wife, who was slightly more brutal than the king, takes the throne. Our group has to rescue the other party before they get hanged. We are now all fugitives in one of the two main kingdoms of this world.

Moral of the story: Just because you have a hidden weapon doesn't mean you should use it.

[endoperez]

I recall an item named "alchemical tooth" (300gp, Complete Adventurer 121), it's essentially a means to store doses of potions in a hollow tooth in one's mouth.

This would work well with Marvelous Pigments (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#marvelousPigments), which you could use to paint any mundane gear including weapons and armor. It does require a Craft (Paint) check at DC 15, so someone would probably have to spend a few skill points. 1 skillpoint would be enough if someone in the group has +4 Int modifier.

[Ravens_cry]

Whether the GM just rule-0s it, or NPCs are sufficiently and logically well-defended to stop attempts at smuggling things past them, my point still stands: If your goal simply can't be accomplished with the resources you're willing to spend, you might as well throw your hands up and let the GM read his lines. All you're doing in either case is delaying the inevitable, maybe earning a condescending remark or two for your trouble. Sorta like RL :smalltongue:
While the PC can try anything, especially in a sandbox game, that doesn't give it an instant license for success.
A game where the players win all the time no matter what they do is boring, both for players and the GM.
Having said that. I would also tailor the plans for the resources available to the defenders as well.
For example, normal bandits will go for a pat down and strip down to skivvies. Well prepared bandits with a mage of some sort as part of the gang will likely cast detect magic and remove items with auras, but are not going to be throwing up identify or even dispel magic. A wealthy king will likely have a court magician who can cast dispel magic, but identify is reserved for meetings between heads of state, if that. A paranoid emperor on the other hand is going to go all out with all possible measures and if the players come up with a plan that can get past it, more power to them.

In a sandbox game ,I believe in fairness, but that works both ways.
On one hand, things will not go the player characters way simply because they are the player characters, but a clever plan by them will succeed. Simply barging into a kings throne room is a good way to get killed, but a well made plan that bypasses defences can work.
I am not going to tell the players, "You win" simply because they want to win, but I am not going to say "You Lose" because I want them to lose.
Fairness and verisimilitude.
In my view, these are some of the most important elements in a sandbox game. Another is a sense that the worlds wheels still turn when the players look away, but that is a post for another topic.

[NNescio]

I recall an item named "alchemical tooth" (300gp, Complete Adventurer 121), it's essentially a means to store doses of potions in a hollow tooth in one's mouth. My thought is that you shrink your items small enough to fit into the thing, pass the search, dismiss the shrink effect and be on your way. DC30 search to find the tooth. Yet another idea would be to work out how much damage your characters digestive system does to items, and whether bags of holding/portable holes could be reasonably swallowed (if the damage is too much, wrap it up in something more resistant, if the bag's too big, shrink item the bag and swallow it). Pass the search with your bag, vomit it up and get your gear back.



However, if the guards suddenly start pulling DC30 searches and wrenching very small bags out of your digestive system, that's your signal to hand the conductor your ticket, sit back, and enjoy the ride (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gXk8y7_qxY).

On a related note, what happens if you walk into an AMF when you have shrunken objects hidden inside your person? Does your body shield those from the emanation, or do things just go... kablooeey?

[Kojiro]

I think it varies based on the spell. Hoard Gullet, for example, has a description of what happens if you didn't cough everything up by the time it ends, and I assume something similar will take effect inside an anti-magic field. Others, though, are vague, or don't tell you at all, which implies... Unpleasantness, if you were doing the trick of hiding it inside yourself.

[NNescio]

I think it varies based on the spell. Hoard Gullet, for example, has a description of what happens if you didn't cough everything up by the time it ends, and I assume something similar will take effect inside an anti-magic field. Others, though, are vague, or don't tell you at all, which implies... Unpleasantness, if you were doing the trick of hiding it inside yourself.

I meant the use of Shrink Item, to be specific, since Hoard Gullet technically creates a nondimensional/extradimensional space instead.

[Kojiro]

That I can't say. Spell description doesn't mention it, and I'm still a bit confused by anti-magic fields, as apparently there are numerous magic things they don't affect. I'm sure someone else here will know, though.

[kardar233]

There's also the Drop Sheath from some Dragon, which gives you a nice circumstance bonus on SoH checks to hide a light weapon, and allows you to draw it as a free action. Good for assassinating people. Makes you feel like you're in Assassin's Creed.

[Ksheep]

That I can't say. Spell description doesn't mention it, and I'm still a bit confused by anti-magic fields, as apparently there are numerous magic things they don't affect. I'm sure someone else here will know, though.

If I had to rule it, I'd use the ruling from Enlarge Person, although I may modify it slightly (ie. replace "Make a strength Check" with "Deals damage" or some such).


If insufficient room is available for the desired growth, the creature attains the maximum possible size and may make a Strength check (using its increased Strength) to burst any enclosures in the process. If it fails, it is constrained without harm by the materials enclosing it— the spell cannot be used to crush a creature by increasing its size.

[opticalshadow]

Heh, well, I am a bit of a versimlitude junkie, I like to think of the interactions of ideas.
But such plans are naught before the kind of DM that says "I'm DM and I don't want you to have a weapon".

IMO, dm's that dissallow things because youve outsmarted them deserve their game to be broken, and i will do everything from that point forward to do it. after trying civaly to talk it out of course.

there are some other options if you dont mind some exstencive surgery with magic. having your leg replaced with a magical prostetic leg taht can store things is useful. invisibility on the item can work in some situations.

also there is a very very very grey area in the rules about the shape a bag of holding has to maintain...and it could techinically be shoved in a certian cavity given time and discomfort.

[Reluctance]

IMO, dm's that dissallow things because youve outsmarted them deserve their game to be broken, and i will do everything from that point forward to do it. after trying civaly to talk it out of course.

there are some other options if you dont mind some exstencive surgery with magic. having your leg replaced with a magical prostetic leg taht can store things is useful. invisibility on the item can work in some situations.

also there is a very very very grey area in the rules about the shape a bag of holding has to maintain...and it could techinically be shoved in a certian cavity given time and discomfort.

That's cool and all, if you expect your DM to have the free time to consider the interactions of every possible spell and magic item in the game. If the DM comes up with a reasonable countermeasure after the fact (E.G: "they cast Detect Magic on you, too), that's a bit of an arms race. Especially when you can't tell if it really is an asspull, or if the DM actually had that prepared from remembering the last time his plot was undermined by a couple of obscure spells.

As for items stuffed in a body cavity vs. antimagic field, I think it's safe to say that any item secured well enough to stay in and undetectable has enough intervening matter to be blocked from LoE. Any item that does have LoE also has a clear escape path, and shouldn't do more than a bit of flavor damage. The only other option involves using it as a choke pear (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choke_pear_(torture)), at which point you break out the torture rules. And strongly consider getting some new players.

[Vladislav]

Wow, so many convoluted solutions. It almost sounds like it's easier to take a level of Monk or Warlock to be permanently "armed" rather than delve into those obscurities :smallamused:

[NNescio]

Wow, so many convoluted solutions. It almost sounds like it's easier to take a level of Monk or Warlock to be permanently "armed" rather than delve into those obscurities :smallamused:

No, Druid.

Psion will also work.

[opticalshadow]

That's cool and all, if you expect your DM to have the free time to consider the interactions of every possible spell and magic item in the game. If the DM comes up with a reasonable countermeasure after the fact (E.G: "they cast Detect Magic on you, too), that's a bit of an arms race. Especially when you can't tell if it really is an asspull, or if the DM actually had that prepared from remembering the last time his plot was undermined by a couple of obscure spells.



do i exspect my dm to do that? no. but if i did, and took every precaution, the dm shouldnt just invent a reason because i cam prepared. im not saying that just using cheese, most dms i understand stopping that. but if ive genuinly created a character with this specific counter messure (for example a wizard would never allow himself to be apart from his spell book, and ive never played a rouge who didnt always have a dagger and lock pick) then no, a dm shouldnt just fabricate things out of thin air to deal with it. its when they do that, that players begin to iteamize in bold every single precaution they take, and that takes hours.

the problem with the dm type im refering to, is if the OP take advice here, and makes a fool proof way of keeping a hidden weapon, he should be rewarded by having that weapon for the specific occasion he prepareing for, if the dm just creates on the spot bs to why it doesnt work, thats bad dming. part of your job is to tell the story the characters are playing, not enforcing a story that they must play. theres nothing to say the adventurers cant open shop and become farmers. by taking away the rewards of their meticulous planning, you take away any point for the encounters to begin with, or any need to become better.

[John Campbell]

I played a rogue for a while who had Improved Unarmed Strike largely so that he could never be really disarmed.

I found a bunch of other uses for it along the way - it means unarmed trip attempts don't provoke, lets you TWF with a two-handed weapon, lets you threaten adjacent squares when you're wielding a reach weapon, switch from ranged to melee without wasting an action to draw a weapon, comes in handy when you're grappled by a wyvern or otyugh, makes a convenient way to do non-lethal damage without taking an attack penalty, and if you get in a fist fight with someone who doesn't have it (and have Combat Reflexes), every time they swing at you, you get to hit them back first - but never used it for the purpose I intended, because the time we were actually told to leave our gear behind while we waltzed into an obvious trap, I was the only one who had the sense to conceal an actual weapon.

[Tetsubo 57]

One of the advantages of playing a Soulknife or Warlock. There is no 'disarm'.

[opticalshadow]

One of the advantages of playing a Soulknife or Warlock. There is no 'disarm'.

or a druid of atleast 5th level.

go from helpless prisoner, to really big angry creature with enough str to kick that cage door open and destroy the gurads in just a few moments.

[Tar Palantir]

If you can deal with the penalties, you can get a -2 cursed sword, which forces you to draw it whenever you attempt to draw a weapon, and IIRC as a cursed item, you can't get rid of it (otherwise, anyone who picked one up would get someone else to take it away from them).

[Socratov]

If you can deal with the penalties, you can get a -2 cursed sword, which forces you to draw it whenever you attempt to draw a weapon, and IIRC as a cursed item, you can't get rid of it (otherwise, anyone who picked one up would get someone else to take it away from them).

In that case you could just get a cursed adamantium dagger of returning, you can't stop the dagger coming back to you. However, the DM might have humor and say... have the dagger return point first to you :smallwink: or even worse, have you get emo while holding the item, and having the dagger sort of glued to your hand. And Of course have a wizard/cleric to lift those nifty curses so you can't get to your weapon...

If your DM really hates you and jsut want you guys go to prison and stay there/work yourselves out another way let him. Else, shy try and bring weapons with you if you can instead craft them. Just take craft weapon and craft tools and you will be able to craft lockpicks and a dagger for escaping purposes :smallamused: the worth of those materials would probably be worth nothing, and finding materials would be hard, but still... It would work over time...

[Psyren]

1) Be a PF Soulknife/Assassin
2) Have your captors bring you before the king
3) Study him for 3 rounds as you discuss the weather or other inane subject

[Ravens_cry]

1) Be a PF Soulknife/Assassin
2) Have your captors bring you before the king
3) Study him for 3 rounds as you discuss the weather or other inane subject
A king that allows a captive to be brought before him not in manacles (you still have to wield the mindblade) deserves to die a horrible death, as do your captors.

[KerlanRayne]

Did they ever update the Possum Pouch from Song and Silence? That would be perfect.

[hobbitkniver]

I mean even a warlock wouldn't work for my DM, he'd just say that they specifically inhibited my powers with magic.

[Socratov]

then... craft it, there are always bones or twigs around, with which you can make tools/daggers. shank 'em!

[The Random NPC]

Judging by the way people treat that hat of shielding (shrunk hat of adamantite) your body will block the antimagical effect.

[Zale]

I mean even a warlock wouldn't work for my DM, he'd just say that they specifically inhibited my powers with magic.

They have enough money to have anti-magic fields in every cell?

Wait.. do Warlock Invocations work in an Anti-magic field? I'm to sleepy to remember.

[Ravens_cry]

Judging by the way people treat that hat of shielding (shrunk hat of adamantite) your body will block the antimagical effect.
And if not, well, I believe the phrase "self inflicted justice" sums it up well.

[Reluctance]

They have enough money to have anti-magic fields in every cell?

Wait.. do Warlock Invocations work in an Anti-magic field? I'm to sleepy to remember.

In a world where people can use magic, the alternative is allowing any magic using character to stroll out of prison whenever they feel like it. It'd be more cost-effective to kill and/or mutilate any magic using criminal, but that's neither fair nor fun.

[hewhosaysfish]

My suggestion: a psionic tatoo (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/psionicTattoos.htm) of call weaponry (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/callWeaponry.htm).

Costs 50gp to give you a weapon for 1 min. Can be taken from you but I think it's nice and subtle...

[noparlpf]

Get UMD high enough, and I think there's an Assassin spell that absorbs weapons into your body somehow.

[Psyren]

A king that allows a captive to be brought before him not in manacles (you still have to wield the mindblade) deserves to die a horrible death, as do your captors.

If your hands are in front of you, just form the daggers shape and toss.
If they're behind you, DC 30 Escape Artist check. Distract everyone for 60 seconds instead.

[Necroticplague]

A king that allows a captive to be brought before him not in manacles (you still have to wield the mindblade) deserves to die a horrible death, as do your captors.

Doesn't a mindblade have an enchantment value? If so, you could simply make it a mouthpick weapon, then wield it in your teeth.

[Grendus]

One level of Soulknife will let you manifest a short sword mind blade, and you can even maintain it in a null psionics field if you make a DC 20 will save (though granted, with only a 1 level dip you'll have to make that will save every round). Grabbing the Wild Talent feat and taking levels in War Mind will let you learn to manifest Call Weaponry for a more varied weapon selection.

Alternatively, I like the idea of a Ring of Arming. Make it acid proof (I think you can specify what materials it's made of, there's probably something acid proof somewhere), and if you get pinched store your weapons inside and swallow it. Once you're in jail, vomit it back up and re-arm. Works well.

[Groverfield]

Avoiding bodily cavities, a shrunk item or items would work in the hair, unless they do strip searches and shave you down, and full body cavity searches, at which point you should make a rogue with Deformity(Obese) and have your fatrolls enchanted to become extradimmensional pockets. Heward, the Handy Haverfatty.

...

...

Damn, now I need to actually roll that up.

[Ravens_cry]

Doesn't a mindblade have an enchantment value? If so, you could simply make it a mouthpick weapon, then wield it in your teeth.
It does, but you can only include those on the list. Mouthpick (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/psionics-unleashed/classes/soulknife) is not among them.

If your hands are in front of you, just form the daggers shape and toss.
If they're behind you, DC 30 Escape Artist check. Distract everyone for 60 seconds instead.
If your hands are in front of you, I still don't see what kind of throw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzbrIhwGLQM) you expect to get. In the second case, 60 seconds is a long time to keep people distracted who are going to be watching you like a a gaggle (?) of hawks. Remember, you are a prisoner, people aren't going to be distracted by petty talk of weather and other inconsequentialities. Even if they listen and, for whatever reason, don't lose patience with your prattle, they will still be watching. This is just good mundane dealing-with-prisoner logic, I am not even adding the possibilities if they know that you can not be disarmed by normal means, which might include King Bumi style entanglements.
I might allow it with a Bluff check with a pretty steep penalty and some convincing role play though. Because there should always be a chance unless it is completely ridiculous and this IS cinematic.
I don't see how you expect to survive though when and if (Death Attacks a have sucky DC) the king goes down and the guards attack. Heck, even if you fail, the act itself will probably* alert them, and they will take you down regardless for attempted assassination. Maybe try pulling off an Ehud, but the King would have to be terminally stupid to allow it with a prisoner.
*I say probably because the PF Assassin has an ability at 6th level that technically allows them to potentially get away with it. Potentially, there is a lot of DM leeway and it only hides you. There is little assurance that they won't discover the king is dead almost immediately.

[deuxhero]

One of the advantages of playing a Soulknife or Warlock. There is no 'disarm'.

But as a soul knife, you may as well not be armed!

[Morrandir]

If you have access to the Spell Compendium and take 3-4 levels in Assassin, you could pick up Absorb Weapon. The duration would leave you needing to plan ahead a bit with it, but it's there.

[That_guy_there]

I had this problem. Then found I found a first level assassin spell called "Secret Weapon". Its in Cityscape adn gives you a +20 unspecified bonus to hide a single weapon. You get that crafted/ enchanted into the weapon you want to hide and it seems you could hide that wepon on your naked body. Which i plan on doing the next time that game is ru.

[Aerlock]

There is also a weapon enchantment in Races of the Wild called Hideaway, which when activated turns your weapon into something the size of a roll of coins. It's +7,500 gp and gives a +2 Sleight of Hand to hide it.

There's a re-write of it in Magic Item Compendium that's +2,000 gp and shrinks the weapon down to a bundle 2 size categories smaller than you and still gives the +2 to SoH.

- Aerlock


Edit: Checked the books and corrected the description of Hideaway.

[Metahuman1]

Let me take a different approach.

Dip one or two levels of Swordsage, and take stances and maneuvers with an eye toward unarmed combat and nerfing "Your screwed now" situations (Things like Iron Heart Surge are lovely for this.) And take improved unarmed strike. Then Maneuvers that deal fixed damage that won't really be modified by anything.

And then, your a considerable force even if your captured, just don't show off your maneuvers to the people that capture you at the time of capture. Wait till they have you and thus have a lowered guard.

[BlueInc]

Oh, you're just trying to hide a bow? This (http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=922) should work.

WARNING: May require a good bluff check.

[Ravens_cry]

Oh, you're just trying to hide a bow? This (http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=922) should work.

WARNING: May require a good bluff check.
Heh, yeah. The first time I read through DM of the Rings, I nearly died laughing. The little walking sticks just puts it over the top for me.

[Socratov]

I'd say that bluff is what? +10 to their sense motive?

considering a guard is lvl 10 and has full ranks in sense motive, a +1 on wisdom, and rolls an 11 (50% chance) you will need a bluff check of 1+13+10+10=34. nothing a potion of glibness and a few ranks of bluff and cha won't fix :)

[hobbitkniver]

Oh, you're just trying to hide a bow? This (http://www.shamusyoung.com/twentysidedtale/?p=922) should work.

WARNING: May require a good bluff check.

Haha thats great, but I doubt my DM would allow it. He and I share the belief that some things just wouldn't work. I've never been a fan of using bluff to prove something obviously false. It is funny though.

[Socratov]

I'd allow it, just because of the rule of funny...