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Rossebay
2011-07-18, 11:58 AM
I was looking for a bit of a new system... I've been playing 3.5 for a year, maybe a year and a half, and among my fellow party members I've been known to usually have the strongest characters, even when I try to dumb it down.

So I've decided to remove myself from the playing scheme and try my hand at DMing. Our previous DM's have had troubles with character creation or creativity, and one of them had terrible work ethic.
I can create a character on the fly, so I don't need any help with that. Work ethic isn't something we can work on...

But I need ideas. I have a new character-creation system, giving players less choice, but making the game overall much more balanced. One of the players has been working with me on this system, and today we start a test run. It's looking like everything will work out on the balance end, and our new 'body sunder' system we've been creating should work pretty well. I've even created some pretty cool alignment-based and/or legendary weapons. They're not game breaking, but they have enough extras to make them useful to players.

So we come to my major dilemma... I have no idea what to do for story. I don't know how to bring them together. I do have a simple starting point:
Every player starts out as a level 1 commoner of a basic race. After going on a small adventure, they'll receive a reward (in gold), and however much they have left after training will be their exact starting gold as the class. This training converts their level of commoner into a class level. I want to focus on character development, as the party tends to have difficulty fitting into their roles. At that point, they'll go on their real adventure.

As far as being commoners, the races define the backstory. Orcs are slaves, humans take simple apprenticeships and are pushed out into the world... etc.
I just need something to bring them all together.
I'm also open to campaign ideas. Creativity isn't my strong suit.

tl;dr:
How do I bring a bunch of low-lives together? And after they've been brought together, what's a simple set of beginnings I can give them?

OracleofSilence
2011-07-18, 12:33 PM
well as starting idea's good, that is okay, but before you even start this you need a plot. If it is your first time DMing, then my personal suggestion is this. Don't use a campaign setting, since to much information leads to tangled plot lines. Choose something simple: a hellish invasion, a tyrannical empire, a dark sorcerer with a doomsday device, or (if you don't mind taking thoughts from the forums) a circular timeline ala The Dream of Metal (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=121334). Then, create only 1 or 2 important NPC's, and a lot of anonymous quest-givers (since you can make NPC's quickly). The PC's are les likely to mess this up, and if all else fails, take a reliable PC and use him as a plant character. If the party strays from the course, use the Random Adventure tables and use that to get them back on course. finally, just for fun, find some little used or sometimes banned mechanic (psionics, ToB, Binders, Incarnum, or even something from third party sources) to add some extra flavor and introduce something new (or at least something they don't use much) to characters.

lets say that all of the characters are from a similar nation. One is deposed royalty with only his loyal orc bodyguard/elf scribe/halfling entertainer/human companion to aid him. he meets a something or other con artist who says that he knows how to get him into power again and he will even help him do it. Along the way they save a young healer of <insert race here> ancestry and they to join them out of gratitude. And there you have it. A party of 3-5 ready with flavor and conflict among them for a new and fresh delve into the unknown.

how is this for a start?

WarKitty
2011-07-18, 12:37 PM
For a simple idea, what we've done is a simple "you've been drafted to go bring back X from the dungeon." Key word there is drafted - for whatever reason someone has decided to grab them for the task and dump them into the dungeon. It's simple and keeps them from asking why their character is there and why work with the party - they're there because they don't have a choice.

Rossebay
2011-07-18, 01:07 PM
well as starting idea's good, that is okay, but before you even start this you need a plot. If it is your first time DMing, then my personal suggestion is this. Don't use a campaign setting, since to much information leads to tangled plot lines. Choose something simple: a hellish invasion, a tyrannical empire, a dark sorcerer with a doomsday device, or (if you don't mind taking thoughts from the forums) a circular timeline ala The Dream of Metal (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=121334). Then, create only 1 or 2 important NPC's, and a lot of anonymous quest-givers (since you can make NPC's quickly). The PC's are les likely to mess this up, and if all else fails, take a reliable PC and use him as a plant character. If the party strays from the course, use the Random Adventure tables and use that to get them back on course. finally, just for fun, find some little used or sometimes banned mechanic (psionics, ToB, Binders, Incarnum, or even something from third party sources) to add some extra flavor and introduce something new (or at least something they don't use much) to characters.

lets say that all of the characters are from a similar nation. One is deposed royalty with only his loyal orc bodyguard/elf scribe/halfling entertainer/human companion to aid him. he meets a something or other con artist who says that he knows how to get him into power again and he will even help him do it. Along the way they save a young healer of <insert race here> ancestry and they to join them out of gratitude. And there you have it. A party of 3-5 ready with flavor and conflict among them for a new and fresh delve into the unknown.

how is this for a start?

I've really got to thank you for this post.

While I don't fully understand this 'dream of metal' timeline, one thing that makes a lot of sense to me is hiding a phylactery in a large shared dream. I can easily work in some lich-caster who was able to do all of this and then some, and the players will need to locate all pieces of this dream (the dreamers) and kill them to end the phylactery's existence, and then the Lich's existence itself.

This will work for an overall plot VERY well, thank you.

Now then, I need to work on minor details. Drafting them will also work well, say the entire country is after this enemy and these adventurers are being told that they're finding some old key that they must bring back, only because the government wants bargaining chips with the Lich.

Alright, thanks, guys. This helped a ton.

Engine
2011-07-18, 01:14 PM
How do I bring a bunch of low-lives together? And after they've been brought together, what's a simple set of beginnings I can give them?

Instead of using Commoner I suggest you to use the NPC's classes. so they could already flash what type of character they would play in the future. For example, the one who wants to play a Fighter could go for the Warrior class, and so on. They will be more durable, have a few tricks to pull off but the overall feeling will be the same.

You could draft them in the military, anyway: they could be a scouting party, a garrison, you decide. Let's say they're the garrison of a small village, one that seems so boring that anyone wonders why it needs a garrison. One evening, at the local inn, a traveler tell them that nearby villages get attacked by goblin raiders. A couple of days after a villager tell them that she saw goblins in the forest.

Then it's up to your players: maybe they could start fortifying the village, or investigate the truth of those stories. Anyway they will repel the attack (hopefully) and some officer in the military notice them and send them to advanced training.

Rossebay
2011-07-18, 01:43 PM
All of this helps, thanks.

Now I need two things: An informant, to help them out with finding the pieces of the dream, and I don't know how much I should reveal...

I plan on having them towards the end of the Dream of Metal timeline, so time will reset on them soon and they might not exist at the end of it. They have to stop it. First, kill the dreamers. Then, the Lich. After that, they'll have to safely disarm the doomsday clock as they're constantly attacked by the Lich's minions, now driven into madness by a series of spells set off at his ultimate demise.
Then they'll be free.
I just need to know how much of that to tell them.

OracleofSilence
2011-07-18, 02:07 PM
well as an informant, you can use the Traveler himself. While he wants to destroy the lich himself, he needs people to hunt for the dreamers. or you can say that (due to the predestination of the dream) the players are gifted in visions (read: plot checks) from their past lives in the pre-dream world. Flashes of places, warnings about some ancient and predestined evil, insane fragments of the plot. and most of all, shards of the consciousness of their loved ones. This will be RP heavy, and will give them a great and easy way to get into their character, since you said that that was a major goal for you.

Other ideas: as the date of ascension approaches, start time hoping and temporal accelerating the players, NPC's and enemies, as the Clock starts to "leak" time. Use the rules for elder evils. it starts once per week, then once per day, then once per hour, then once per encounter... if you handle this right, it will create a a great sense of urgency and suspense. will they be next? will the BBEG they are fighting get hit? what if its the bridge thy are crossing?

but as for the informants, use the Traveler if you are desperate, and the vision fragments if the players cooperate. as for the amounts to give them just let the plot determine it. if they need to know about a "dream" then use a a dream fragment encounter to introduce them to it. or (for something different) have them start in it. their initial adventure could be them trying to escape the hellscape of the Dream of Metal, as they desperately search for the Traveler and his way out... i would say the deserve PC levels after that.

Rossebay
2011-07-18, 03:05 PM
Elder Evils? Explain, or just tell me which book.

Anyway, I'm liking the way this is going...
They'll start out as average joes, unaware that their world is about to collapse, but they'll find out soon enough. I'm thinking I'll reveal things through the main enemy at first, then through a horrified celestial later on.

Larpus
2011-07-18, 03:16 PM
Starting with something simple is the best, actually, even if you do have a bigger plot in mind, it's most probably better to start small, after all, who can seriously expect a lvl1 to try to punch Cthulhu?

From there you have the basic stuff, invading Goblins, cattle missing, robbers, etc, etc. Do as many of these "small time quests" as needed for them to get together as a group, since a bigger plot can often be a bit overwhelming or end up dealing with delicate concepts or ideals of the PCs/Players, which sometimes can hurt or destroy a forming group.

As for bringing the players together, it's always a good idea to require some of them to have some positive relationship already, such as being related, friends, etc. It allows you to have one less PC to worry about since either he or the related PC will tag along "naturally", just don't go overboard with it.

McSmack
2011-07-18, 04:15 PM
You can always do a jailbreak scenario. Have the PC's be captured and taken as slaves. They're forced to work together in order to escape.

Personally though I don't do any of that.

I make the PC's do it.

Have them tell you how it is that they know each other. Takes a lot of the work off your hands.

OracleofSilence
2011-07-18, 11:35 PM
eh, i must agree with that last post. let them figure that crap out. it saves time and effort. and elder evils can be found in the "Elder Evils" book.its not SRD but is WOTC. i'm sure it can be found somewhere. it is a great template for a campaign like this.