Ultimate Marvel Vs Capcom 3 [Archive] - Giant in the Playground Forums

Zevox

2011-07-20, 05:42 PM

Heard about this already. I'm not surprised at all. While I definitely don't approve of Capcom's business practice here - it's obvious they intended this from the start, given this is being announced only half a year after the release of the original, and the fact that the only DLC released were characters and costumes that were on the disk already - I like MvC3 too much not to wind up getting this.

That said, I am genuinely ticked at the lack of Mega Man. He was the one glaring omission from the starting roster, easily one of the most heavily requested DLC characters, and they didn't even add him to this version of the game? What the hells?

I do really like what I saw of Ghost Rider, and to a lesser extent Strider (surprising since I didn't like him in MvC2), in the released videos though. And having just played DMC3, Vergil has me excited (my main team already uses Trish and Dante, with him added in I can play a Devil May Cry team and probably be pretty good at it!). Doctor Strange should be awesome too - they have a lot of options for a moveset with such a powerful magic user. Though I am scratching my head at the "Rocket Raccoon" guy, and have never heard of Nova or Nemesis, so I don't know what to expect out of them. (Also never heard of Firebrand, but the videos show me what to expect out of him.)

I am confused by the decision to add Hawkeye though. With Taskmaster having his archery skills covered I figured he'd be rejected if he was considered at all, and even having watched his videos I'm not convinced he really brings anything that other characters, especially Taskmaster, don't already.

So yeah, a few characters I'm excited for and a few I don't know anything about, which is about what I expected. Lack of Mega Man is a big black mark for me though. Nonetheless, as I said, I'm sure I'll end up buying it.

Zevox

Starwulf

2011-07-20, 05:47 PM

and have never heard of Nova or Nemesis, so I don't know what to expect out of them. (Also never heard of Firebrand, but the videos show me what to expect out of him.)
Zevox

My guess is that it's Nemesis from Resident Evil, ie, a form of the Tyrant more or less.

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-20, 06:16 PM

With this news, I have experienced the largest range of simultaneous emotions that I have in a long while.

One the one hand, screw Capcom. My fiance bought me the pre-ordered collector's edition of Marvel VS Capcom 3 as a belated anniversary gift. We both got the game under the assumption that Capcom would eventually reward us for our loyalty and give us the story and character content we overpaid for. Instead? The only story the game had were the four trailers advertising its so-called "story," the only 2 extra characters were the DLC that really no one cared about, and we were left completely hanging with the only DLC being a handful of costumes and some Shadow Battle nonsense.

On the other hand, Phoenix %*&$ Wright. The one character I wanted to be in the game actually has a chance now (I won't confirm anything until I see an official trailer for him, lest I jynx his appearance). I don't care if he's completely useless, I will play him almost all the time. He is the one reason that Capcom is getting my money come November. If for some reason he gets cut, I might be able to get hold of enough common sense to stop myself from buying this game.

On the other other hand, STILL no Cyclops or Mega Man. I know everyone has their favorites they'd like to see in the game, but, come on, Mega Man can't make the cut?! Zero and Tron Bonne get to be in the game, but not a single version of Mega Man is allowed? That's just a travesty...

And we finally get a Capcom VS game with Jean Grey, only for Cyclops to be completely absent. Marvel hates those two as a couple so much, they're not even allowed in the same franchise anymore.

But, hey, don't worry! At least we get favorites like Nova and Rocket Racoon! ::facepalm::

And yet, Capcom is still getting my money for this game, along with my seething hatred, even if they do just add the latter to the big pile of it in the back.

Zevox

2011-07-20, 07:02 PM

My guess is that it's Nemesis from Resident Evil, ie, a form of the Tyrant more or less.
And I've never played Resident Evil, hence my lack of knowledge of the character.

On the other hand, Phoenix %*&$ Wright. The one character I wanted to be in the game actually has a chance now (I won't confirm anything until I see an official trailer for him, lest I jynx his appearance).
The character roster seems very genuine. Whoever acquired it had images of each character of the sort that always go up on the MvC3 site after a reveal. Here (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3phoenixwright.png) is Phoenix Wright's. (Others: Nemesis (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3nemesis.png), Frank West (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3frankwest.png), Vergil (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3vergil.png), Doctor Strange (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3doctorstrange.png), Nova (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3nova.png), Iron Fist (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3ironfist.png), Rocket Racoon (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/UMVC3rocketraccoon.png).) If those are fake, they're the best damn fakes I've ever seen.

Zevox

Illieas

2011-07-20, 07:31 PM

well it was expected with capcom being who they are.

character roster is okay. sure i would have like some other marvel characters and capcom characters. but i am glad for phoenix wright(even if his inclusion is the most obscure) made the fact we are still missing the newest miles edgeworth game hurt a little less.

I am more interested in the game system changes. looking at GUI , that took a nose dive. you can't see the assist characters life bars at all. the pulsing x-factor is an annoyance. I don't really understand the GUI change at all other than the need to increase the x size so we know if they have xfactor or not.

as for mechanics looking the matches shown you can x-factor in the air now and also this new side air exchange. which if you hit with it it depletes your opponents super gauge( wow i get phoenix is tough to deal with but i don't think this is the fix).

but this quite a bit of change for the series. i guess this means after evo competative Mvc3 will be a ghost town.

link (http://www.joystiq.com/2011/07/20/entire-ultimate-marvel-vs-capcom-character-roster-leaks-phoeni/)

for video proof
x factor in the air is first video 28 seconds mark

side air exchange last video 23 second mark

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-20, 07:43 PM

character roster is okay. sure i would have like some other marvel characters and capcom characters. but i am glad for phoenix wright(even if his inclusion is the most obscure) made the fact we are still missing the newest miles edgeworth game hurt a little less.

2nd most obscure at worst. There's no way he's more obscure than Rocket Raccoon.

I don't really care about the Miles Edgeworth game. I bought the first one, and it just lacked the awesome translations and witticisms of the rest of the genre and was kind of boring IMO.

The real travesty is we aren't getting the Phoenix Wright VS Professor Layton game...

Illieas

2011-07-20, 08:27 PM

2nd most obscure at worst. There's no way he's more obscure than Rocket Raccoon.

I don't really care about the Miles Edgeworth game. I bought the first one, and it just lacked the awesome translations and witticisms of the rest of the genre and was kind of boring IMO.

The real travesty is we aren't getting the Phoenix Wright VS Professor Layton game...

obscure along the lines of everyone shown in the game had fighting concept in their respective games or comic series. phoenix wright has no fighting what so ever. it is true about the first miles one. but i don't like missing out on the series as it sets the precedent. it took way too long to get a new tales game for example.

wait phoenix wright vs professor layton isn't coming?. I don't see why that could be gamers all around like this cross over and layton is fairly popular at least in england. that really depresses me. hopefully they will change their mind.

Green-Shirt Q

2011-07-20, 09:43 PM

When I first heard about this, I said a very loud swear word for a very long period of time. I have actually just stopped and am catching my breath.

Anyway, this has a few of things going for it. Frank West, Phoenix Wright, Doctor Strange and the alternate costume of M.O.D.O.K from Nextwave: Agents of HATE. As well as one new background. Then I realized it was an old one, just with snow.

Everything still looks the same. Stupid characters, lack of the important ones like Megaman and Venom. Same terrible looking backgrounds. Same uninteresting and boring "flashy" special moves. Same frustrating lack of a story mode so that it would be fun for more than a week. Still a lack of notificationj for when I'm able to use an assist character so I would be furiously trying to do it while fighting and getting my ass kicked.

I still feel so absolutely ripped off by MvC3, paying full price for, let's face it, a BARELY finished game with the BARE MINIMUM, that I probably won't be getting this game for a while unless I can find some way to sell my old MvC3 for enough to pay for it. And even then, I probably won't buy it as protest to Capcom to finish their games before releasing them and stop breaking their friggen promises. Even though I know any form of protest will do diddly squat, because everybody is going to buy this. Probably even me.

Still, I would like to save my pennies, because you just know that they'll release Ultimate Marvelous Marvel vs. Capcom 3 Alpha Turbo Supreme or whatever eventually, and have 4 new characters nobody's ever heard of. Capcom's marketing is plain criminal. :smallsigh:

[EDIT] When I say "uninteresting and boring 'flashy' moves" and bad backgrounds, I mean they feel like they lack something to them. Compare MvC3 to Tatsunoko vs. Capcom, with the backgrounds of deapth and insainity and the fact every move was outrageously unbelievable and hilariously cheesey, and you'll see what I mean.

[EDITEDIT] Just found out MODOK's Nextwave costume is only a Pre order bonus. F that. :smallannoyed:

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-21, 08:31 AM

obscure along the lines of everyone shown in the game had fighting concept in their respective games or comic series. phoenix wright has no fighting what so ever. it is true about the first miles one. but i don't like missing out on the series as it sets the precedent. it took way too long to get a new tales game for example.

wait phoenix wright vs professor layton isn't coming?. I don't see why that could be gamers all around like this cross over and layton is fairly popular at least in england. that really depresses me. hopefully they will change their mind.

That's not really what obscure means, but okay...

But that's why playing as Phoenix Wright will be the best. His entire moveset will be utterly ridiculous. Will he whack people with his briefcase? Will he summon other allies to help him? Will his main moves be throwing evidence at opponents? Just how awesome will "OBJECTION!" be? Not to mention we get some full recognition for Phoenix Wright as a major character for Capcom, which is the real benefit to his inclusion as a playable character.

And yeah, last I heard, PW VS PL was only being released in Japan. It still might make it to Europe. But us in the U.S.? s*** out of luck.

Psyren

2011-07-21, 08:43 AM

Glad I never got around to picking up MvC3 (always played at a friend's.) Now I can get this instead :smallbiggrin:

But this shouldn't surprise anyone, this is the same crap they pulled strategy they employed with SSFIV.

(Also never heard of Firebrand, but the videos show me what to expect out of him.)

You might know him better as Red Arremer - his original name, and the name he used as a hidden (and freaking difficult) boss in SNK vs. Capcom.

He goes way, way back with Capcom - originally debuting in Ghouls and Ghosts as the villainous Red Arremer, then getting his own spin-off game Demon's Crest on the SNES.

MoelVermillion

2011-07-21, 08:51 AM

Honestly I don't really understand everyone's anger about them releasing this as a new game as DLC, considering how Capcom prices DLC I think we will save money getting it as a new game.SSFIV launched at like half price (~$40 to my recollection) so theres a chance this will launch at that price too. Shuma and Jill launched at like $5 each or something absurd so if we multiplied that by 12 for all the new characters we'd be getting here that'd be $60 so if we got this at $40 like Super then this would end up cheaper.

The only real argument I could see about this being better is if you didn't plan to buy the new characters, which I can understand. I guess we'll have to see how UMvC 3 prices.

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-21, 09:07 AM

MoelVermillion

2011-07-21, 09:32 AM

Unless you were one of the people who already spent $60+ on the first game because you foolishly had faith that Capcom would actually deliver on their promises.

Nope, because $60 + $60 of DLC is more than $60 + $40 of game.

Psyren

2011-07-21, 09:44 AM

While we don't know that it will be $40 yet, I do agree that 12 new characters might as well get a new release. I mean, Blazblue did and it only had what, 4? 5?

And to the folks saying $60 + $60 - you're ignoring time value of money. $60 when MvC3 came out is no longer worth $60 today, and hopefully we've all gotten paid since then to boot. It's just one of the risks that comes with being an early-adopter.

Dragonus45

2011-07-21, 10:45 AM

Honestly i see no one there i really want, so until megaman comes out im just gonna sit back and wait.

Airk

2011-07-21, 11:10 AM

While we don't know that it will be $40 yet,

no, we pretty much DO know that it's $40. Siliconera announced a price point in the same article (http://www.siliconera.com/2011/07/20/sorry-ultimate-marvel-vs-capcom-3-is-disc-only-you-cant-upgrade-via-dlc/) where they said "no it won't be available as DLC"

And to the folks saying $60 + $60 - you're ignoring time value of money. $60 when MvC3 came out is no longer worth $60 today, and hopefully we've all gotten paid since then to boot. It's just one of the risks that comes with being an early-adopter.

That nonsense about the money is silly. It's not like we're talking about a 5 year old game or something here .$60 a couple of months ago is pretty much the same as $60 now. What do you want to do, adjust for inflation? :P

I don't agree it's one of the "risks" of being an early adopter either. This is Capcom we're talking about, and they BLATANTLY HALFASSED MvC3. Anyone who bought it without anticipating this must've been living under a rock.

Psyren

2011-07-21, 11:55 AM

That nonsense about the money is silly. It's not like we're talking about a 5 year old game or something here .$60 a couple of months ago is pretty much the same as $60 now. What do you want to do, adjust for inflation? :P

Actually, TVM exists even if inflation is zero. It has to do with the opportunity cost of consuming your $60 (i.e. buying something with it) instead of, say, putting it towards your credit card bill. That's the rate that matters, not rate of inflation (though that is a factor.)

I don't agree it's one of the "risks" of being an early adopter either.

It is, particularly with Capcom. Look at RE5 Gold. Look at SSFIV. Look at DMC3:SE. And they're far from the only publisher to do this (Bethesda is another "bundle-all-the-good-stuff-later-and-throw-in-extras" company.) The turnaround is a bit short but as long as the market doesn't send them the right message (i.e. by not buying the first one) they'll keep doing it.

Zevox

2011-07-21, 12:07 PM

You might know him better as Red Arremer - his original name, and the name he used as a hidden (and freaking difficult) boss in SNK vs. Capcom.

He goes way, way back with Capcom - originally debuting in Ghouls and Ghosts as the villainous Red Arremer, then getting his own spin-off game Demon's Crest on the SNES.
Nope, sorry, I've just plain never played any games he's been in.

Honestly I don't really understand everyone's anger about them releasing this as a new game as DLC, considering how Capcom prices DLC I think we will save money getting it as a new game.SSFIV launched at like half price (~$40 to my recollection) so theres a chance this will launch at that price too.
That much is true at least (and they confirmed that UMvC3 will be priced at $40 when it was announced). Releasing this content as DLC would make it collectively more expensive than the new disk - although if they did then at least some of it (balance patch) would likely be free, and you could then just skip parts you weren't interested in, so there's also that.

While we don't know that it will be $40 yet, I do agree that 12 new characters might as well get a new release. I mean, Blazblue did and it only had what, 4? 5?
Three (Makoto, Valkenhayn, and Platinum), although at $7 apiece compared to MvC3's $5.

Zevox

Airk

2011-07-21, 12:47 PM

It is, particularly with Capcom. Look at RE5 Gold. Look at SSFIV. Look at DMC3:SE. And they're far from the only publisher to do this (Bethesda is another "bundle-all-the-good-stuff-later-and-throw-in-extras" company.) The turnaround is a bit short but as long as the market doesn't send them the right message (i.e. by not buying the first one) they'll keep doing it.

That's my -point-. It's a "risk" the same way dropping an anvil on your foot "risks" broken bones. People shouldn't be going into this with their eyes closed at this point, and pretending it's a "risk" rather than a certainty just encourages them.

Jibar

2011-07-21, 12:57 PM

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-21, 01:57 PM

Things that are bugging me about the fan response:

1. "Why can't it be DLC"
-Because it's a little more than a balance patch and some new characters. Compare SF4 to SSF4 and SSF4 to AE. AE was 4 new characters and a balance patch. Not the 3 times more characters added, new visual style, new menu systems, what appears to be more support for colours and DLC costumes, extra game modes, extra moves for some characters and a total rebalancing for everyone that UMvC3 is.

I would like to know what exactly new besides the new characters is going to be in the UMvC3. If it's honestly a bunch of new, good features, then my rage might be at least somewhat quelled. But so far, all I've seen is the new characters and a hint at game balance. Granted, it's still very early though. As for the game balance issue, I guess I just can't care about that since I don't play online at all. I'm just not into that aspect of video games in general. Admittedly, that fact makes me not quite the target audience, and again, I admit the fact that I (or rather my fiance) shelled out the money for the collector's edition makes me the fool.

Now if it really ends up being everything you say (I honestly doubt it given the track record here), then I'll feel less bad about buying the game and I might forgive Capcom somewhat. Heck, if we're really lucky, we might get that epic plot the original failed to deliver. Granted, I'll still have a $70 paperweight complete with a small poorly written comic book.

2. "Only 9 months later what sellouts"

-Why is everyone forgetting the whole TSUNAMI DEAL that struck at the EXACT TIME that Marvel vs Capcom 3's future was in motion? That's why we only got two characters who were premade and one costume pack. Everything on the game got shut down, simple as. After all this time, releasing the characters in stages as would have been originally planned would just be swept under by AE and MK9. UMvC3 gets interest in the game going again, let's them do far more to it than they could have with just DLC and as has been pointed out so many times now, IT'S CHEAPER THIS WAY

Chances are if not for that disaster, we might have gotten some more DLC stuff, but I didn't complain and am not certainly not going to say that a tsunami isn't a valid reason.

If by cheaper, you mean it would be cheaper for Capcom to produce the game this way, I won't pretend to understand the economics behind that sort of thing. But as for cheaper for the consumer as a game instead of DLC, I have to at least question that. Mostly because we can't ever really be sure how much said DLC would have cost. They might have come in packs of 2 or 3, or have been cheaper than Shuma or Jill. We don't know. We'll never know.

3. "Why no Megaman/Gambit/Venom/Whoever"

-Relevance. Venom is a secret agent now, Gambit is a supporting character in X-23's ongoing after being a nobody for years and I can't even remember when Megaman was last in a mainstream release, something that's even less likely to happen now Inafune's left. Nova and Rocket Raccoon though? Hugely popular in Marvel circles. Every one of these leaked characters is someone fans demanded and they've got them at last.

Okay, no. I'm sorry, but this argument is BS. First of all, relevance of characters means absolutely nothing when the game features Phoenix (who's been dead for how long without a resurrection now?), MODOK, Dormammu, and that's just on the Marvel side. What is currently going on in the Marvel universe is completely irrelevant to the game. Venom, Gambit, not eligible because they're not relevant? Load of crap. Mega Man, not relevant? The original Mega Man has, like, 4 different games in production. There's Mega Man X, Mega Man.EXE, the Legends version, the Starforce version, the Mega Man Zero version, and already has TWO of his supporting characters as playable in the game.

And now there's the reverse of that. Nova and Rocket Raccoon, hugely popular? No. They are unheard of characters. The only reason I knew about Nova, was because I picked up some obscure New Warriors comic about a reality show (which of course just happened to be the precursor to Civil War), where he was a minor character. Rocket Raccoon? No. Follow any, and I mean ANY site that had requested characters for MvC3. You will not find either of these characters in any list. Heck, you will not find them in the TOP 100 of any Marvel list. This goes even for Marvel sites. If I'm wrong here, please give me a link, because I thought I'd searched every DLC request list out there.

Now do I have a problem with either of them in the game? Not really, no. Sure they wouldn't be my picks, and there could be better choices, but I actually like obscure characters getting picked for the game. Keeps the game an unknown. Though I can't honestly say I'm interested in Nova, he seems to be the most generic of generic superheroes from what I've seen.

But their getting picked for the game was not because they were "relevant," that's for sure.

Zevox

2011-07-21, 02:28 PM

I would like to know what exactly new besides the new characters is going to be in the UMvC3. If it's honestly a bunch of new, good features, then my rage might be at least somewhat quelled. But so far, all I've seen is the new characters and a hint at game balance. Granted, it's still very early though. As for the game balance issue, I guess I just can't care about that since I don't play online at all. I'm just not into that aspect of video games in general. Admittedly, that fact makes me not quite the target audience, and again, I admit the fact that I (or rather my fiance) shelled out the money for the collector's edition makes me the fool.

Now if it really ends up being everything you say (I honestly doubt it given the track record here), then I'll feel less bad about buying the game and I might forgive Capcom somewhat. Heck, if we're really lucky, we might get that epic plot the original failed to deliver. Granted, I'll still have a $70 paperweight complete with a small poorly written comic book.
According to the news article (http://www.blisteredthumbs.net/2011/07/ultimate-mvc3-announced/) I first read about this on - well here, I'll just quote the relevant paragraph:

Announced earlier this morning, Ultimate Marvel Vs. Capcom 3 will host 12 new characters to pick over for your three man fighting team, refinements to the fighting system as a whole in terms of game play, presentation, and online functionality, eight new stages to destroy your opponents in, and new modes of mayhem including the fan requested Spectator mode!
Also, one of the released videos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rphhEtWzXfg&feature=player_embedded) definitely shows some of the old characters using moves they didn't have in the original game, so there's that for sure.

Mega Man, not relevant? The original Mega Man has, like, 4 different games in production. There's Mega Man X, Mega Man.EXE, the Legends version, the Starforce version, the Mega Man Zero version, and already has TWO of his supporting characters as playable in the game.
I am in total agreement with you here. There is no reason for Mega Man not to be in MvC3. He's a classic icon of gaming comparable to Mario or Sonic - heck, he's second only to Mario in the number of games he has to his name. He was in both previous MvC games, and Tatsunoko vs Capcom. He has five different versions to choose from minimum (classic, X, Legends, .exe, Star Force - Mega Man Zero was about Zero, with X only showing up as a ghost or a copy of the original), all of which have diverse options for movesets they could be given. His original series, which had been abandoned for a decade, just had two new entries released via Wii Ware, PSN, and XBLA in the past couple of years. Moreover, he was easily one of the most requested DLC characters - the poll that was set up on Capcom's own site had Mega Man X as the top requested Capcom character, and classic Mega Man in the top 15 to boot (can't remember exactly where), so X got to the top even with voters splitting on which version should be in.

And really, the "relevant" argument completely fails when you notice that Tron Bonne, a supporting character from a small handful of his more obscure titles, got into the game from the get-go. If such an argument made any sense, she definitely wouldn't be in.

Zevox

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-21, 03:11 PM

*snip*

And really, the "relevant" argument completely fails when you notice that Tron Bonne, a supporting character from a small handful of his more obscure titles, got into the game from the get-go. If such an argument made any sense, she definitely wouldn't be in.

Zevox

I will watch that video when I get home from work, but if that's the case, then, okay, that's cool.

And yea, Tron Bonne's pretty irrelevant, but I didn't argue her because there are two halfway decent arguments for her: 1) She was in MvC2, and was pretty boss there, and 2) They were planning to make a Mega Man Legends 3 game at the time. Recently cancelled the project, but still would've given her a bit of relevancy.

On the other hand, Arthur. When was the last game with him involved again?

Jibar

2011-07-21, 03:36 PM

Okay, no. I'm sorry, but this argument is BS. First of all, relevance of characters means absolutely nothing when the game features Phoenix (who's been dead for how long without a resurrection now?), MODOK, Dormammu, and that's just on the Marvel side. What is currently going on in the Marvel universe is completely irrelevant to the game. Venom, Gambit, not eligible because they're not relevant? Load of crap. Mega Man, not relevant? The original Mega Man has, like, 4 different games in production. There's Mega Man X, Mega Man.EXE, the Legends version, the Starforce version, the Mega Man Zero version, and already has TWO of his supporting characters as playable in the game.

Obscure characters get sales from appearing in the game. At the time of release MODOK was appearing in a... Captain America story? Dormammu had appeared not too long ago in Doctor Strange. The Phoenix Force is always relevant, and Jean Grey herself was last alive in 2005. Gambit meanwhile hasn't been relevant for years. Venom isn't anything like the Venom from MvC2, either. He's a secret agent now. Spy gadgets and everything.
And what is going on in the Marvel Universe has complete relevance, or at least the Marvel company. Thor getting added when his movie is coming out and he had a big event happening, Hawkeye getting added with the Avengers looming and appearing in an event himself, it certainly wouldn't be a stretch as well to say Doctor Octopus was considered with his at the time appearing in Iron man and Ghost Rider appearing with his second movie on the way.

Frankly, Mega Man is kind of done. Of all those series you've mentioned of his, I can't find one that has been updated since 2007 apart from downloadable marketplace games, and most of those games up until 2007 seem to be on portable consoles.
Mega Man hasn't had a big budget, mainstream release in a very long time now and with Inafune leaving the company, he's pretty much done. His last two games were sprite games for the retro crowd, Capcom clearly isn't willing to invest too much in him. I know people love the series and all, but you have to accept that Megaman is either dead or dying. Putting him in MvC3 isn't going to help. He was crap in 2 and would just get ignored in 3. What he did Arthur does and better, while Zero and Tron still represent the franchise while having decent movelist options available.
Though please, if there is anything more relevant than the 2007 games let me know. His history is a gorram mess to sort through.

And now there's the reverse of that. Nova and Rocket Raccoon, hugely popular? No. They are unheard of characters. The only reason I knew about Nova, was because I picked up some obscure New Warriors comic about a reality show (which of course just happened to be the precursor to Civil War), where he was a minor character. Rocket Raccoon? No. Follow any, and I mean ANY site that had requested characters for MvC3. You will not find either of these characters in any list. Heck, you will not find them in the TOP 100 of any Marvel list. This goes even for Marvel sites. If I'm wrong here, please give me a link, because I thought I'd searched every DLC request list out there.

Do you follow many comics at all?
'cos the New Warriors comic sounds like the lead in to Civil War which was like 2006 (God, Civil War, feels like centuries ago). Since then Nova and Rocket Raccoon have been appearing in the Cosmic Marvel comics, which have been described as the most consistently good thing Marvel is putting out there. Comic communities went nuts at their announcement, every comic fan I know is flipping their lids with excitement that they're here.
As for requests, both were options in that DLC poll Capcom Unity did, I know that much, and were doing pretty well for themselves to my understanding, and there was no one poll or request site that got these results in. If anything, they must've just taken a general collection of the weeping of the internet and worked from there alongside Marvel.
I'd say if they didn't appear on those requests, it's because they weren't requests by comic fans but video game fans. That Capcom Unity poll is heavily skewed on the Marvel side to a lot of characters who aren't relevant and aren't popular in comics today (Carnage, seriously?).

And really, the "relevant" argument completely fails when you notice that Tron Bonne, a supporting character from a small handful of his more obscure titles, got into the game from the get-go. If such an argument made any sense, she definitely wouldn't be in.

Zevox

And yea, Tron Bonne's pretty irrelevant, but I didn't argue her because there are two halfway decent arguments for her: 1) She was in MvC2, and was pretty boss there, and 2) They were planning to make a Mega Man Legends 3 game at the time. Recently cancelled the project, but still would've given her a bit of relevancy.

It's my understanding Tron Bonne and Zero were Inafune's choices for the game. Tron Bonne was moderately popular in MvC2 I guess and Zero was popular from Tatsunoko vs Capcom. Both games also featuring a version of Megaman who got largely ignored.
Though don't quote me TvC version of Megaman as I've not played it, I've just heard he's not good.

On the other hand, Arthur. When was the last game with him involved again?

Funnily enough, 2006-2007, with some similar budget games in 2009 and 2010. Which makes him just as relevant as Megaman if we're talking timeline.

Zevox

2011-07-21, 03:55 PM

Frankly, Mega Man is kind of done. Of all those series you've mentioned of his, I can't find one that has been updated since 2007 apart from downloadable marketplace games, and most of those games up until 2007 seem to be on portable consoles.
And the problem with DLC and handheld games is...?

Frankly, if that's your argument that he's "irrelevant," and you're completely ignoring his iconic status, then you don't have an argument. Capcom leaving Mega Man out of MvC is like Nintendo leaving Mario out of Super Smash Brothers - it makes no sense on any level.

Mega Man hasn't had a big budget, mainstream release in a very long time now
And of course big budget releases are the only measure of "relevance" in video games. That's why we got Mike Haggar and Viewtiful Joe. :smallsigh:

He was crap in 2 and would just get ignored in 3. What he did Arthur does and better, while Zero and Tron still represent the franchise while having decent movelist options available.
If you're seriously attempting to argue that he couldn't have a unique moveset, I can only conclude that you haven't actually played his games at all. The original series alone was based on him acquiring a different weapon for every boss he beat, and there were 8 such bosses per game (6 in the first). Other versions have had similarly varied arsenals over time, especially the Battle Network (.exe) version. It would be trivial to give any version of him I'm familiar with a moveset with the size and variety of Dante's if you wanted to.

Zevox

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-21, 05:55 PM

The Capcom Unity poll top 50 Marvel choices.

1.Venom - 2034
2.Gambit - 1704
3.Ghost Rider - 1132
4.Cyclops - 1120
5.Carnage -992
6.Psylocke - 967
7.Ms Marvel 792
8.Dr Strange 758
9.Nightcrawler - 757
10.Green Goblin - 748
11.Iron Fist - 553
12.Juggernaut - 538
13. Daredevil - 500
14.Cable - 497
15.Rogue - 496
16. Silver Surfer - 459
17.Blade - 399
18.Black Panther(T'challa)-366
19.Emma Frost - 356
20.Thanos - 320
21.Dr Octopus -307
22.Squirrel Girl - 254
23.Moon Knight - 241
24.Elektra - 223
25.Black Cat -217
26.Howard the Duck - 215
27.Blackheart - 181
28.Iceman - 179
29.Hawkeye- 166
30.Apocalypse - 159
31.Songbird - 140
32.Omega Red - 129
33.Sentry - 128
34.Spider-Woman - 127
35.Nico Minoru - 126 (tie)
35.Bishop - 126 (tie)
37.Jubilee - 125
38.War Machine - 120
39.Luke Cage - 118
40.Beast - 112
41.Scarlet Witch -108
42.Mr Sinister - 108
43.Namor - 103
44.Nick Fury -101
45.Colossus - 93
46.Archangel - 90
47.Professor X - 79
48.Galacta - 76
49.Black Widow - 75
50.Ultron - 74

Do you see Nova or Rocket Raccoon on this list? It is because they are obscure. If you can find a different list, please by all means link to it.

Also your standards for relevancy are based on a few recent obscure storylines that you and some people that you know are fans of do not overwrite years of iconography. Ask a few comic book fans who their top 5 favorite X-Men are. Chances are a great deal, if not most of them, will mention Gambit. Ask some of them to name some Spider-Man villains. One of the first choices will probably be Venom.

Dragonus45

2011-07-21, 11:12 PM

Frankly, Mega Man is kind of done. Of all those series you've mentioned of his, I can't find one that has been updated since 2007 apart from downloadable marketplace games, and most of those games up until 2007 seem to be on portable consoles.
Mega Man hasn't had a big budget, mainstream release in a very long time now and with Inafune leaving the company, he's pretty much done. His last two games were sprite games for the retro crowd, Capcom clearly isn't willing to invest too much in him. I know people love the series and all, but you have to accept that Megaman is either dead or dying. Putting him in MvC3 isn't going to help. He was crap in 2 and would just get ignored in 3. What he did Arthur does and better, while Zero and Tron still represent the franchise while having decent movelist options available.
Though please, if there is anything more relevant than the 2007 games let me know. His history is a gorram mess to sort through.

Uhhh, megaman is one of the most successful capcom series ever. It has a huge fanbase and to say that not having a release in a few years justifies taking him out of the MvC, what with his long standing in the series and the fact he is the most requested char from the capcom side.

Psyren

2011-07-21, 11:16 PM

I'm all for the Blue Bomber too, but I'm more excited that Red Arremer made the cut :smallbiggrin:

Deth Muncher

2011-07-21, 11:56 PM

I've been waiting for Dr. Strange since...oh, MvC1? Me gusta.

deuxhero

2011-07-22, 12:09 AM

No Gene? Meh.

Psyren

2011-07-22, 12:20 AM

I've been waiting for Dr. Strange since...oh, MvC1? Me gusta.

VERY MUCH THIS TOO

I mean, Blackheart and Dormammu were great magic-users and all, but they're no Sorcerer Supreme.

Otherworld Odd

2011-07-22, 12:31 AM

... Nightcrawler or Toad would have been cool... =[.... I would have actually gone out to buy the game again if even Nightcrawler was in it. The blue gets no love.

Edit: On a side note, does EVERYBODY have a freaking OTG now? I dislike the new HUD. Sure, the healthbars are bigger but likewise your ally's are smaller and more difficult to see. The X is also way too big.

So Rocket Raccoon is uh... Starfox pretty much, huh?

Zevox

2011-07-22, 12:50 AM

VERY MUCH THIS TOO

I mean, Blackheart and Dormammu were great magic-users and all, but they're no Sorcerer Supreme.
Dormammu is much of the reason I'm actually looking forward to Doctor Strange. I don't actually know anything about the character outside of his "Sorcerer Supreme" title, but I know they did a fantastic job with Dormammu, another powerful magic user - to the point where he's one of my favorites in the entire game, and the lead character of my main team. I'm hoping that having another magic user they can get creative with will result in another great character for me to play.

Zevox

Deth Muncher

2011-07-22, 12:57 AM

Dormammu is much of the reason I'm actually looking forward to Doctor Strange. I don't actually know anything about the character outside of his "Sorcerer Supreme" title, but I know they did a fantastic job with Dormammu, another powerful magic user - to the point where he's one of my favorites in the entire game, and the lead character of my main team. I'm hoping that having another magic user they can get creative with will result in another great character for me to play.

Zevox

Fact: Dormamu is a Dr. Strange enemy. Fact: So is Shuma-Gorath.

Thus - pairing them with Doctor Strange is both cruel and hilarious. Do it.

Starwulf

2011-07-22, 01:12 AM

The Capcom Unity poll top 50 Marvel choices.

Do you see Nova or Rocket Raccoon on this list? It is because they are obscure. If you can find a different list, please by all means link to it.

Also your standards for relevancy are based on a few recent obscure storylines that you and some people that you know are fans of do not overwrite years of iconography. Ask a few comic book fans who their top 5 favorite X-Men are. Chances are a great deal, if not most of them, will mention Gambit. Ask some of them to name some Spider-Man villains. One of the first choices will probably be Venom.

hehe, I wasn't really going to get involved in this argument, but I have to chime in after reading this, and say: I haven't read ANY new X-Men stuff, but I do still watch any new movie that comes out, and I might occasionally watch one of the older cartoon(2000ish). I can tell you, right off the top of my head, who my Top Three X-men are, and have been since I was a kid: Wolverine, GAMBIT, Morph.

So, yeah, just because Gambit isn't relevant in any new stuff(or any of the movies, which I really hated) doesn't mean old-timers like me don't still love him! I used to emulate him when I was a kid, picking up cards and pretending to charge them then throw them.

Edit: Also...since I've already chimed in, I'll go one further: Megaman..Not relevant? what? Umm, what planet are you from again? I'm assuming you obviously are younger(not calling you a kid or anything, just..younger). Megaman is one of the most Iconic video game characters of all time. As a matter of fact, as far as legendary video game characters go, here are the top 5: Mario, Sonic, Link, Megaman, *insert 5th not-so-important person here* All 4 of those have been around since the earliest days of their respective systems, and most have more games released right now, then most of the current crop of "well-knowns" will probably have in the next hundred years

2nd edit: realize I should clarify that my megaman comment isn't aimed at the person I quoted, it was aimed at the person trying to claim megaman isn't really relevant in this day and age.

Jibar

2011-07-22, 01:29 AM

And the problem with DLC and handheld games is...?

Frankly, if that's your argument that he's "irrelevant," and you're completely ignoring his iconic status, then you don't have an argument. Capcom leaving Mega Man out of MvC is like Nintendo leaving Mario out of Super Smash Brothers - it makes no sense on any level.

Remember when Captain Commando was Capcom's figurehead?
And when we thought Sonic and Mario were on the same level?
This stuff changes, and it changes based on the sales. Mario is still getting headline games on Nintendo console, even Sonic has been releasing games since Sega's console crash. Megaman hasn't had a current generation big budget game.
Things change.
Downloadable games are fine, but you can't ever call that the same level of success of say Dead Rising 2 or Lost Planet 2, other Capcom games who have been represented in the Vs games (Or are going to be in Dead Rising's case). Hell, Dark Void had a downloadable game too, which was just as well received as Megaman 10, same with Bionic Commando which has had 2 as well.
The point here isn't necessarily big budget games, but what they're willing to invest in a series. Two sprite games and cancelling his next big game... does that sound like a series they're willing to invest in to you? Is that a future they're supporting?
And the part you seem to be ignoring here is Inafune is gone. Do you realise what happens when the creator leaves a series? Devil May Cry 2. They tried to get that same level of success and did well with 3, but when 4 didn't give them the profit they wanted they handed the series to a crap Western developer. Do you want that to happen to Megaman? Because that's his future. 4 wasn't even a failure either, all the fans bought it, but because it wasn't the gigantic profit coming through in other games they deemed it a flop. Same thing would happen to Megaman: the fans buy the game, not many others, Capcom thinks its a failure.

And of course big budget releases are the only measure of "relevance" in video games. That's why we got Mike Haggar and Viewtiful Joe. :smallsigh:

Haggar is part of Final Fight, which also has two characters in SSF4 and now Poison in SFxT. I'd say that's clear enough evidence that Final Fight is either being pushed as an iconic franchise for them or at the very least a successful addition to Street Fighter. Viewtiful Joe sold well on the Gamecube, has had four games and an anime. As well it's part of the beloved Clover studios, who also got Amateratsu from Okami in there.

If you're seriously attempting to argue that he couldn't have a unique moveset, I can only conclude that you haven't actually played his games at all. The original series alone was based on him acquiring a different weapon for every boss he beat, and there were 8 such bosses per game (6 in the first). Other versions have had similarly varied arsenals over time, especially the Battle Network (.exe) version. It would be trivial to give any version of him I'm familiar with a moveset with the size and variety of Dante's if you wanted to.

Zevox

The point isn't giving him a unique moveset, but giving him one Arthur couldn't already do. It's projectiles with lots of variations, sure. But then Arthur also has a unique jump mechanic and Super Armour Hyper, while stilling filling the retro NES slot in the character list, without any troubles of going to Inafune and asking permission. People complained about She-Hulk and X-23 being clones, and oh that uproar at Akuma. You really think Megaman wouldn't have got the same thing if he shows up looking like Arthur?

Look, I'm not arguing that Megaman isn't iconic, I'm arguing he was and due to whatever internal shenanigans are going on in Capcom, maybe they don't want him to be and are having to fight tooth and nail with the fans about it.

The Capcom Unity poll top 50 Marvel choices.

Do you see Nova or Rocket Raccoon on this list? It is because they are obscure. If you can find a different list, please by all means link to it.

Look at that. Galacta is on there. Galacta. You think this list is really a sign of what's popular? Or anything official? Two of the top ten made it into UMvC3. This is a fan vote by people on a video game messageboard. I want to see the results if this had been done on Marvel.com.

Also your standards for relevancy are based on a few recent obscure storylines that you and some people that you know are fans of do not overwrite years of iconography. Ask a few comic book fans who their top 5 favorite X-Men are. Chances are a great deal, if not most of them, will mention Gambit. Ask some of them to name some Spider-Man villains. One of the first choices will probably be Venom.

Again, do you actually read comics? Annihilation was by no means an obscure storyline, nor was Annihilation Conquest or the Thanatos Imperative. I can't believe I'm going to do this but go to 4chan, go to the Comics board, find an UMvC3 thread. These aren't obscure. Those are comic fans there and absolutely bloody thrilled that those characters are there.
As for Gambit and Venom, we have 6 X-Men already. 6. More than any other franchise. And we have 5 current (and 1 Sentinel) characters. Do we really need another one who hasn't done anything in years?
And they already tried Venom and they scrapped him due to RAM issues. His fabulous morphing in MvC2 does not translate well into a 3D model. So even ignoring that the MvC2 Venom was Eddie Brock and hasn't been since, even if you wanted Mac Gargan Venom, he'd need to be very changed and chances are couldn't have any of those fancy symbiote effects.
Those same fans would have likely also nominated Green Goblin and Doctor Octopus, who was considered so they clearly wanted a Spider-Man villain and knew they couldn't make Venom work.

I'm assuming you obviously are younger(not calling you a kid or anything, just..younger).

Been playing video games since 1994. I have a problem and should really cut down.

Edit: Okay, seriously, read this, (http://www.siliconera.com/2011/07/21/why-doesnt-ultimate-marvel-vs-capcom-3-have-mega-man/) look at the Capcom Unity Poll. Clearly this isn't a matter of popularity, it's company politics. Something more is going on with Megaman here, and I believe it's an attempt to end the franchise.

Starwulf

2011-07-22, 01:54 AM

..... If they shut down the Megaman Franchise for good, I'll never buy another capcom game in my entire life, no matter how awesome the game is >< Honestly, I can't imagine that I would be the only person to institute such a ban on capcom games, Megaman/X/Zero are so Iconic and massively loved, I just can't imagine them getting rid of them going over very well.

Also, I have you beat by...8 years :) (Honestly, I know some people who make ME feel young. They start talking about the Original Pong and stuff, the literal barebones beginning of video-gaming that began in the 70's. 1986 is my start date(5 years old) I just figured anyone arguing against Megaman not being relevant obviously hasn't been around since his very beginning, considering he literally has the second most amount of video games with his name in it, period.

edit: I do have to ask though: Are you talking about Arthur, as in, Super Ghouls and Ghosts(or is it goblins? I can never remember) Arthur? The Knight in the armor, who lost said armor the first time he got hit and then went around his skivvies? If so, I really don't understand how you can argue that Megaman and Arthur would compete for the same slot. The two are NOTHING alike, whatsoever. Not even close, to be honest. One's a robot with feelings, the ability to modify(depending on Megaman or X) ALL the various pieces of his armor(feet, head, legs, body, arm cannon), his various attacks, and can wall jump, the other is a flesh and blood human who threw a lance around(or a fiery lance when he got upgrades)

Zevox

2011-07-22, 02:02 AM

Remember when Captain Commando was Capcom's figurehead?
No, I don't. All I know about him is that he was in MvC2, and had some arcade game way back when.

And when we thought Sonic and Mario were on the same level?
In a sense, they still are. They're both two of the most widely-known, iconic video game characters - a list you could round out with Mega Man and Pac Man (and maybe Pikachu or Link).

This stuff changes, and it changes based on the sales. Mario is still getting headline games on Nintendo console, even Sonic has been releasing games since Sega's console crash. Megaman hasn't had a current generation big budget game.
Things change.
And where you get the notion that having recent big-budget games in any way matters to a fighting game that includes characters like Mike Haggar, Viewtiful Joe, Arthur, or come UMvC3 Firebrand and Strider (who has all of two not-"versus Capcom" titles to his name, both obscure titles from before the turn of the millennium), I'll never know.

Haggar is part of Final Fight, which also has two characters in SSF4 and now Poison in SFxT.
And yet Haggar himself has never been in those games, nor is Final Fight getting any sort of revival. This would be like me claiming that Mega Man should be in if his series had ended after game 3 but Proto Man, Gutsman, and Airman had been brought over to some recent Capcom games.

The point isn't giving him a unique moveset, but giving him one Arthur couldn't already do.
Which would be equally easy. Unless you honestly think that all characters with projectile moves are similar to Arthur - in which case most of the cast of MvC3 wants a word with you, since only a small handful of them don't have some kind of projectile move, and there's plenty based around them (Doom, Dormammu, Chris, MODOK, need I go on?). Heck, with Mega Man's move variety, you don't even need to make him a zoner - he could be made to fill any role other than grappling (and even there you could get him a command grab based on Gutsman's power from his very first game), particularly if you go for the Battle Network version, who has as many close-range weapons as projectiles.

without any troubles of going to Inafune and asking permission.
I seriously doubt that's even a consideration. Inafune may be the original creator, but surely Capcom owns the rights to the franchises. That tends to be how things work - for a similar example, the original creator of Final Fantasy is no longer at Square-Enix (has his own company now, Mistwalker), but that hasn't impeded Square-Enix from continuing to produce that series in the least.

Look, I'm not arguing that Megaman isn't iconic, I'm arguing he was and due to whatever internal shenanigans are going on in Capcom, maybe they don't want him to be and are having to fight tooth and nail with the fans about it.
Expect fans to fight back, then. You can't change the fact that he's an icon with a ton of fans, nor that leaving him out of this game makes no sense from any perspective.

Zevox

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-22, 08:53 AM

Remember when Captain Commando was Capcom's figurehead?
And when we thought Sonic and Mario were on the same level?
This stuff changes, and it changes based on the sales. Mario is still getting headline games on Nintendo console, even Sonic has been releasing games since Sega's console crash. Megaman hasn't had a current generation big budget game.
Things change.
Downloadable games are fine, but you can't ever call that the same level of success of say Dead Rising 2 or Lost Planet 2, other Capcom games who have been represented in the Vs games (Or are going to be in Dead Rising's case). Hell, Dark Void had a downloadable game too, which was just as well received as Megaman 10, same with Bionic Commando which has had 2 as well.
The point here isn't necessarily big budget games, but what they're willing to invest in a series. Two sprite games and cancelling his next big game... does that sound like a series they're willing to invest in to you? Is that a future they're supporting?
And the part you seem to be ignoring here is Inafune is gone. Do you realise what happens when the creator leaves a series? Devil May Cry 2. They tried to get that same level of success and did well with 3, but when 4 didn't give them the profit they wanted they handed the series to a crap Western developer. Do you want that to happen to Megaman? Because that's his future. 4 wasn't even a failure either, all the fans bought it, but because it wasn't the gigantic profit coming through in other games they deemed it a flop. Same thing would happen to Megaman: the fans buy the game, not many others, Capcom thinks its a failure.

Count of points missed: 1

The last major Mega Man game to be released was last year, Mega Man 10, on the various WiiWare/PSN franchises. Did it get a disc release? No. It didn't need it. The style was done in the classic 8-bit style for nostalgia purposes, and the character is iconic enough that he does all his own marketing.

Not even counting all the spinoff games that came out via Mobiles and such (of which there were three this year), admittedly we haven't seen much mainstream in 2011, but that's only because the two big Mega Man games this year, Mega Man Universe and Mega Man Legends 3, only recently got canceled. There hasn't been enough time for the next big Mega Man game to get drawn up of. Oh, also there's Rockman Online, which so far has only hit South Korea, but what else would you expect of a universe-crossing Mega Man MMO?

Haggar is part of Final Fight, which also has two characters in SSF4 and now Poison in SFxT. I'd say that's clear enough evidence that Final Fight is either being pushed as an iconic franchise for them or at the very least a successful addition to Street Fighter. Viewtiful Joe sold well on the Gamecube, has had four games and an anime. As well it's part of the beloved Clover studios, who also got Amateratsu from Okami in there.

Count of points missed: 2.

Your argument is that these characters were included not because they are relevant but because they are icnoic and that's what matters, but your argument against Mega Man is that he is not relevant which matters but he is iconic.

The point isn't giving him a unique moveset, but giving him one Arthur couldn't already do. It's projectiles with lots of variations, sure. But then Arthur also has a unique jump mechanic and Super Armour Hyper, while stilling filling the retro NES slot in the character list, without any troubles of going to Inafune and asking permission. People complained about She-Hulk and X-23 being clones, and oh that uproar at Akuma. You really think Megaman wouldn't have got the same thing if he shows up looking like Arthur?

Count of points missed: 3

Nope. Wouldn't have looked like Arthur. No matter what version they've used. Heck, they've already done 2 different Mega Man versions already for previous games in the franchise. The one in MvC and MvC2 played vastly different from the way Arthur does now, and they only used THREE special weapons. People only complained about X-23, She-Hulk, etc. because they hadn't played them yet (For the record, I was not one of those people).

Look, I'm not arguing that Megaman isn't iconic, I'm arguing he was and due to whatever internal shenanigans are going on in Capcom, maybe they don't want him to be and are having to fight tooth and nail with the fans about it.

Capcom is not going to sweep Mega Man under a rug. Okay, they might sweep classic Mega Man under a rug for a little while, but only because they have about five other versions to make games out of.

Look at that. Galacta is on there. Galacta. You think this list is really a sign of what's popular? Or anything official? Two of the top ten made it into UMvC3. This is a fan vote by people on a video game messageboard. I want to see the results if this had been done on Marvel.com.

Count of points missed: 4, 5

No. That is not what I argued at all. This is the list that YOU said included Nova and Rocket Raccoon as evidence of their popularity. And yes, I do think a popular vote poll is a sign of popularity. You know, by definition. And GALACTA made it on the list before Nova or Rocket Raccoon. Please, by all means, go to any, ANY site with a similar poll and link me any entry for Nova or Rocket Raccoon, because it will have been one that I haven't seen before and would very much like to read. I already googled the first item of "proof" you vaguely mentioned in a post. Your turn.

Again, do you actually read comics? Annihilation was by no means an obscure storyline, nor was Annihilation Conquest or the Thanatos Imperative. I can't believe I'm going to do this but go to 4chan, go to the Comics board, find an UMvC3 thread. These aren't obscure. Those are comic fans there and absolutely bloody thrilled that those characters are there.

First of all, no, I don't. I said that already. I'm sure Nova and Rocket Raccoon have their own fanbase who are thrilled, and good for them. Maybe they've been included in recent storylines, also good for them. Civil War had a lot of obscure characters star in it and a lot of iconic characters find an excuse to stay far away.

As for Gambit and Venom, we have 6 X-Men already. 6. More than any other franchise. And we have 5 current (and 1 Sentinel) characters. Do we really need another one who hasn't done anything in years?
And they already tried Venom and they scrapped him due to RAM issues. His fabulous morphing in MvC2 does not translate well into a 3D model. So even ignoring that the MvC2 Venom was Eddie Brock and hasn't been since, even if you wanted Mac Gargan Venom, he'd need to be very changed and chances are couldn't have any of those fancy symbiote effects.
Those same fans would have likely also nominated Green Goblin and Doctor Octopus, who was considered so they clearly wanted a Spider-Man villain and knew they couldn't make Venom work.

All right, now you're actually using good arguments. Not including a character because they have enough representatives of the franchise already is a good reason, (better to make room for more franchises), and not including a character because of technical reasons is fine too. I have full confidence that Capcom could make Venom, GG, or Doc Ock work, but I'm fine if they don't spend forever on them.

Been playing video games since 1994. I have a problem and should really cut down.

Edit: Okay, seriously, read this, (http://www.siliconera.com/2011/07/21/why-doesnt-ultimate-marvel-vs-capcom-3-have-mega-man/) look at the Capcom Unity Poll. Clearly this isn't a matter of popularity, it's company politics. Something more is going on with Megaman here, and I believe it's an attempt to end the franchise.

Not going to get in the age thing, since it's irrelevant on both sides of the argument here.

It's an interesting theory, one that I'm sure is false, just because it's Mega Man. As I said, Mega Man's going through a rough patch right now, but give it a year. Maybe not classic Mega Man, but we'll see some Mega Man franchise left. And the only thing the article says is that Niitsuma apologizes and admits they chose other characters. It's a creative decision, albeit an odd one that not many would agree with, but anything else about Mega Man is speculation.

Otherworld Odd

2011-07-22, 09:02 AM

You guys must spend a lot of time separating quotes. O.o.

On a side note, that 5th legendary character you're looking for has to be Earthworm Jim.

>.>.

Trollface.

Cogwheel

2011-07-22, 09:51 AM

I'm not buying this until the Capcom side lets me play this guy.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5DmXhhjDaow/Sb1d0nkWy4I/AAAAAAAAAKg/U3nJW0sX3Cc/s320/Crazy+Guys+killing+Lao+Shan+Lung+I.png

He's the brown one in the background.

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-22, 10:14 AM

On less argumentative notes, saw the video. The only new thing I really noticed was Ryu's Shinku Hadoken bouncing off the wall which was pretty cool. If there were other moves, I didn't notice them, but then again I didn't use the featured characters often.

Also, Hawkeye was kind of meh to me until I saw his super...
He fires an arrow with Ant-Man riding the tip, who promptly goes into huge mode on impact. Epic...

Dragonus45

2011-07-22, 10:20 AM

Psyren

2011-07-22, 10:45 AM

DiscipleofBob

2011-07-22, 10:59 AM

It's a bit stagnant though. Megaman X may as well have been called "The Legend of Sigma." Battle Network is just... ehhh. And surely they can mix up the Rock-Paper Scissors-boss formula a little...

And sorry to not show solidarity with you, but nothing is going to stop me from buying Resident Evil games at this point :smalltongue:

I wonder what a TPS shooter style Megaman game would be like? Along the lines of Gears of War, or better yet the much more mobile Vanquish. Maybe combined with platformy elements like Enslaved.

I've personally always wanted to see a Mega Man game where you instead get to control one or a team of the Robot Masters, and could even upgrade and customize them to better suit you.

Zevox

2011-07-22, 11:30 AM

On less argumentative notes, saw the video. The only new thing I really noticed was Ryu's Shinku Hadoken bouncing off the wall which was pretty cool. If there were other moves, I didn't notice them, but then again I didn't use the featured characters often.
There were also Spencer using a diving attack he didn't have before, Taskmaster using a stab attack he didn't have before, and Storm using a wind power she didn't have that seems to work like Rachel's drive from BlazBlue - that is, it covered the whole screen, was very fast, and pushed her opponent (Akuma) towards her.

Zevox

Starwulf

2011-07-22, 01:54 PM

You guys must spend a lot of time separating quotes. O.o.

On a side note, that 5th legendary character you're looking for has to be Earthworm Jim.

>.>.

Trollface.

Ya know, oddly enough Earthworm Jim was the only other character I could think of that might fit that 5th slot, but I wasn't sure if he was Iconic ENOUGH to sit beside the other 4, thats the only reason I didn't write his name ^^

Psyren

2011-07-22, 07:17 PM

There were also Spencer using a diving attack he didn't have before, Taskmaster using a stab attack he didn't have before, and Storm using a wind power she didn't have that seems to work like Rachel's drive from BlazBlue - that is, it covered the whole screen, was very fast, and pushed her opponent (Akuma) towards her.

Zevox

Yeah I noticed that too - Storm with Rachel's drive gives me the willies. :smalleek:

Selrahc

2011-07-22, 08:30 PM

Look at that. Galacta is on there. Galacta. You think this list is really a sign of what's popular? Or anything official? Two of the top ten made it into UMvC3. This is a fan vote by people on a video game messageboard. I want to see the results if this had been done on Marvel.com.

I'm not sure anyone can really call Rocket Raccoon a popular or iconic marvel character. He is a minor character running through the Cosmic Marvel books, but not even very important there. My bet is that he got put in because they wanted a nice wacky character and they thought up a good moveset for him.

Nova is also primarily hanging around the Cosmic Marvel storylines these days. Although he is at least a fairly major figure in them. Back when he was interacting with the more mainstream marvel continuity he was a New Warrior, which is almost the definition of C-list Marvel Hero.

I think it's fine if they want to just include some of these less mainstream characters.

hehe, I wasn't really going to get involved in this argument, but I have to chime in after reading this, and say: I haven't read ANY new X-Men stuff, but I do still watch any new movie that comes out, and I might occasionally watch one of the older cartoon(2000ish). I can tell you, right off the top of my head, who my Top Three X-men are, and have been since I was a kid: Wolverine, GAMBIT, Morph.

So, yeah, just because Gambit isn't relevant in any new stuff(or any of the movies, which I really hated) doesn't mean old-timers like me don't still love him! I used to emulate him when I was a kid, picking up cards and pretending to charge them then throw them.

Gambit in comics is just a confusing mess of tangled backstories. Due largely to how overexposed he got during his massive popularity. It's hard to use him in a comic or a movie nowadays due to al the plot threads snarled around him. Plus, he didn't really have a great storyline associated with him.

(Also, Morph as a favourite? How can the guy who dies 10 minutes into the series be your favourite?)

DiscipleofBob

2011-08-17, 07:28 PM

So, new gameplay trailers for Dr. Strange and Nemesis.

I'm no expert when it comes to analyzing play styles for characters, but Dr. Strange seems to remind me a lot of Dormammu from the videos, being a zone controlling type of thing.

Nemesis is friggin' huge. Like I think as tall as Sentinel huge. Mix of the big, brute attacks and some tentacle moves I was not expecting. His level 3 Hyper is just frightening.

Zevox

2011-08-17, 07:54 PM

Relevant video links:

General trailer featuring new moves and characters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p73vsHDHe_g&feature=player_embedded).
Nemesis Trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=crD3lSVLo1s&feature=player_embedded)
Doctor Strange Trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U6amXU58gI&feature=player_embedded)
Three (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3XTcq9B6SFQ) fight (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_0i7vGlrdw&feature=player_embedded) videos (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=M6KMUs3l0N4) featuring Doctor Strange and Nemesis.

Strange is definitely a zoner, though of a different kind than Dormammu. Some of his moves are actually very reminiscent of Mu-12's signature abilities in BlazBlue: Continuum Shift, which is quite interesting. He's also reasonably fast and has a quick teleport, so he has some rushdown potential too. He seems to be right up my alley honestly. I'd even consider replacing someone on main team with him. Though it is a bit disappointing that some of his animations seem to be recycled from Magneto.

Nemesis is, well, much what I expected after seeing the picture of him. Big brute type. Not my kind of character, but the game is low enough on those that I can see why Capcom wanted to add him. And it's certainly not often that you see a big guy type with a projectile like his bazooka - particularly not in both special and super form. That rushing super of his has a lot of invincibility on it too, if he can plow right through Chun-Li's kikosho super with it.

Also, pre-order bonuses (http://www.marvelvscapcom3.com/us/order) have been revealed. Three different costume packs, depending on where you pre-order from.

Gamestop gets an all-female pack featuring X-23 in her original X-Men: Evolution outfit, Storm in her punk/mohawk look, Morrigan in casual wear, and Chun-Li in her Street Fighter Alpha look. Impressively, all of these are actually much less revealing than their normal outfits (except Chun-Li, but all her outfit bares is her arms). I'll probably go with this - I'm an X-Men: Evolution fan, and would love to have that X-23 outfit. Plus honestly the Storm one might be worth using - even with how silly the mohawk looks, at least she's wearing pants and a shirt, instead of oversized boots and a one-piece swimsuit.

Amazon gets a set called the "New Age of Heroes pack." It's Dr. Doom with giant spikey shoulder pads, classic Sentinel, classic Strider, and Cyborg Akuma. Not interested myself. Even though Akuma is the only character in these packs that I play a lot, I don't like the cyborg look for him, nor do I care about any of the other characters in the set. I will say that classic Sentinel looks good though.

Best Buy gets a "villain" pack that oddly includes one non-villain. And it's goofy. It has Super Skrull in a bathrobe, Wesker and C. Viper in outfits that I'm kind of at a loss to describe (maybe someone familiar with those characters would recognize them?), and the goofiest thing you'll ever see: Elvis MODOK. If I played MODOK at all, I'd go for this one just for that ridiculous image; but he's probably my worst character, so as goofy as that outfit is, I'd almost never get any use out of it, nor am I big on playing any of the others.

Zevox

Green-Shirt Q

2011-08-18, 08:40 AM

... and the goofiest thing you'll ever see: Elvis MODOK. If I played MODOK at all, I'd go for this one just for that ridiculous image; but he's probably my worst character, so as goofy as that outfit is, I'd almost never get any use out of it, nor am I big on playing any of the others.

Zevox

That's MODOK how he appeared in the incredibly popular series NEXTWAVE: Agents of Hate. And honestly, despite my rage at the whole situation and wanting to boycott this game, as a NEXTWAVE fan, I almost considered buying the game for that. :smallbiggrin:

Still, it's an even bigger kick to the nuts then when you realize that this means they are aware of the series, and are using it's popularity to get pre-orders rather then add characters from it (who, despite their relative levels of obsurity, are certainly more deserving then Rocket Racoon.)

DiscipleofBob

2011-08-18, 11:56 AM

Given the choice, I'd probably have to go for the Gamestop pack, since that's where I shop for video games mostly anyway. X-23 is one of my main team, even though her alt costume doesn't do much for me, but I do really like Morrigan's alternate costume.

As for the other alternate costumes, Akuma's is badass, and I love the reference to his Marvel VS Street Fighter boss mode fight. (At least I think that's the one with Cyber Akuma. It could've been X-Men VS Street Fighter.) Don't really care one way or the other about the rest.

Zevox

2011-08-18, 12:01 PM

Still, it's an even bigger kick to the nuts then when you realize that this means they are aware of the series, and are using it's popularity to get pre-orders rather then add characters from it (who, despite their relative levels of obsurity, are certainly more deserving then Rocket Racoon.)
No it isn't. If Marvel were putting characters in this game based strictly on popularity, we'd be seeing guys like Venom, Gambit, or further X-Men and Spider Man characters, not characters from an obscure one-shot mini-series.

Really though, it seems to me that Marvel is mainly treating the game as free marketing. Once their biggest names and must-haves were out of the way (Captain America, Spider Man, etc), we started getting characters they wanted to promote, like X-23, who had a comic series of her own start shortly after her announcement for the game. I'd wager that's why Hawkeye got in as well - advertising for the one major character of the upcoming Avengers movie who didn't get his own movie. Rocket Racoon is probably in that boat too. Same with Nova and Iron Fist I'd wager. (Doctor Strange and Ghost Rider are big enough names that their presence is probably at least partly fan-demand fueled - especially after Strange already had two of his villains playable.)

And obviously, from that point of view, there's no reason they'd want to use NEXTWAVE characters here either - it's a done series, not an ongoing or future one.

Zevox

Airk

2011-08-18, 01:01 PM

Pretty much exactly.

Everything that has been said in all the interviews from Capcom about which Marvel characters they pick has basically been "Marvel gives us a list of who we're allowed to put it, and they don't tell us why they're on it." But it's OBVIOUS to me that they are doing exactly what Zevox said - putting in their TOTALLY OBVIOUS leads (Captain America, Spider Man, The Hulk) maybe a COUPLE of obscure choices just for fun, and then packing the roster with characters that they WANT people to know about. X-23, Hawkeye, blahblah etc.

And it's smart from their perspective. They've got The Avengers coming out next year, and unsurprisingly, every single hero from it is in UMvC3. Basically, UMvC3 is Capcom's property - they're the ones paying to make it, produce it, sell it, etc. So from Marvel's perspective, it's a PERFECT vehicle to get out 'news' of their characters. People play UMvC3, and go "Huh, I don't know who the heck Dormammu is, but he sure is cool." and then they see a comic or something, and suddenly Marvel has a sale. But there's not much reason to do this for characters that don't have any properties coming out.

Oh, and shock of shocks (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1211837/).

Jibar

2011-08-18, 02:13 PM

Best Buy gets a "villain" pack that oddly includes one non-villain. And it's goofy. It has Super Skrull in a bathrobe, Wesker and C. Viper in outfits that I'm kind of at a loss to describe (maybe someone familiar with those characters would recognize them?), and the goofiest thing you'll ever see: Elvis MODOK. If I played MODOK at all, I'd go for this one just for that ridiculous image; but he's probably my worst character, so as goofy as that outfit is, I'd almost never get any use out of it, nor am I big on playing any of the others.

Zevox

C. Viper is an antagonist in Street Fighter and even in MvC she doesn't exactly get along with anyone, that's why she's there.
Super Skrull's is his outfit from Annihilation, Wesker's is his S.T.A.R.S uniform (standard alternate costume affair for RE), and according to Seth at E3 C. Viper's costume is her outfit from some new game she's appearing in but he's not allowed to say anything about. Can't wait for the UK pre-orders to appear because I know which pack I want.
I'm kind of at a loss how you can't describe Wesker's though, it's just a police uniform.

And for those who still doubt Rocket Raccoon, not only are he and the Guardians of the Galaxy appearing in Season 2 of Earth's Mightiest Heroes, rumours have it they've got a film in the negotiations stage.

Zevox

2011-08-18, 02:19 PM

C. Viper is an antagonist in Street Fighter and even in MvC she doesn't exactly get along with anyone, that's why she's there.
Odd, I'd heard she was a protagonist, if a bit of a loner. Then again, it's not like any game she's been in actually has a story in it, so I guess she can be whatever the developers feel like calling her at the moment.

I'm kind of at a loss how you can't describe Wesker's though, it's just a police uniform.
:smallconfused: Doesn't look like any police uniform I've ever seen.

Zevox

Jibar

2011-08-18, 02:28 PM

Odd, I'd heard she was a protagonist, if a bit of a loner. Then again, it's not like any game she's been in actually has a story in it, so I guess she can be whatever the developers feel like calling her at the moment.

Her and Chun-Li are supposedly rivals, working for different departments and what not and she does work (undercover) for Seth's SIN corporation. I've not seen it but I understand in the anime they produced for IV she's strictly an enemy.

:smallconfused: Doesn't look like any police uniform I've ever seen.

Zevox

http://fast1.onesite.com/capcom-unity.com/user/bthr_zero_x/resident_evil_collection/resident_evil_gc/374804c96a48cc9a8663207c5c813542.png?v=118350
http://m.gmgrd.co.uk/sbres/699.$plit/C_67_article_2040106_body_articleblock_0_bodyimage .jpg?26%2F11%2F2008%2009%3A37%3A14%3A830
Dark blue trousers and shirt set with a tactical vest over it? That's classic Police.

Zevox

2011-08-19, 11:54 AM

Huh. Apparently Marvel was extremely picky (http://kotaku.com/5832488/guess-which-character-marvel-worried-capcom-would-get-wrong) about how Doctor Strange would work in the game - to the point of sending Capcom illustrations showing exact hand positions they wanted him to use. Odd - why would they get that picky about him specifically? :smallconfused:

Edit: Ooooo, and this video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yRp3sQCIZc&feature=player_embedded) points out something I hadn't noticed about Doctor Strange: his beam hyper appears to be a counter hyper, activating only to counterattack enemy projectiles. Which will make him uniquely suited to beat on other zoners, as well as characters with abuseable projectile hypers (Ryu, Akuma, Storm, etc). Now that's an interesting twist.

Zevox

DiscipleofBob

2011-08-19, 12:23 PM

Huh. Apparently Marvel was extremely picky (http://kotaku.com/5832488/guess-which-character-marvel-worried-capcom-would-get-wrong) about how Doctor Strange would work in the game - to the point of sending Capcom illustrations showing exact hand positions they wanted him to use. Odd - why would they get that picky about him specifically? :smallconfused:

Zevox

They mention the possibility of a Dr. Strange movie. Could be one reason. Or maybe it's just that the magic gestures and techniques of Dr. Strange are unique enough that Marvel wanted to be very specific or risk some Dr. Strange fanboy flipping out over him.

Psyren

2011-08-19, 01:00 PM

:smallconfused: Doesn't look like any police uniform I've ever seen.

Zevox

The S.T.A.R.S. outfit is meant to invoke a S.W.A.T. uniform:

http://images.wikia.com/residentevil/images/1/18/Albert_wesker.jpg
http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQj3aE5OMKusTNBEuL1at32D231BxoDo TVj6YUKtLOYZGSGgESa9w

Remove the helmet/logos and you're pretty much there.

Zevox

2011-08-19, 03:33 PM

Been watching some videos from a guy who got a lot of hands-on time with the game at Evo. Things worth noting that he mentioned/I saw in the videos:

General:
- Many characters apparently received a health nerf, which was responsible for an early perception that damage output had been increased overall.
- An exception to that is Arthur, who has more health now.
- X-Factor has supposedly been nerfed, but level 3 is still devastating.
- Apparently plans were originally to have the character roster get up to 58 total (counting Jill and Shuma), but time constraints due to Capcom wanting to get the game out before the holidays forced a reduction to the 50 we'll ultimately have. Speculation: the 8 cut characters could easily end up as DLC (or part of a third release in the future, ala Super Street Fighter 4: Arcade Edition).

Captain America:
- Can double jump now.
- One of his shield slashes hits OTG now.

Dante:
- His "style change" specials no longer require repeating the entire special input, just the button part. So for instance going from Crystal to Million Carats only requires 236M~M, not 236M~236M. Think Deadpool's ability to change from his gunshots to his grenade/shuriken/bolos, just requiring more specific inputs.
- Increased hitstun decay apparently means he'll have to change a lot of his BnB combos (though I get the impression that he was referring to the advanced ones pros use, not the basics casual players would be used to).

Deadpool:
- His bolo loop in the corner no longer works.

Doctor Doom:
- His jumping S causes groundbounce now.

Ghost Rider:
- His normals do chip damage (!).
- His jumping S is massive, covering most of the screen's length.

Hawkeye:
- Has a move that has him jump across the screen quickly before firing some arrows, which gives him excellent mobility when covered by an assist.
- He has some tricky abilities, such as an arrow that sits in the ground for a few seconds, then explodes.
- He can cause a number of status effects, including poison and slow.

Ryu:
- Has a new level 1 passive hyper that improves all of his moves, even supers.
-- It is responsible for his Shinku Hadoken bouncing off walls, and apparently makes his hyper spin kick massive and adds a suction effect to it.
-- It also allows his to charge up his regular hadokens.

Strider:
- His health is very low. As in "a basic ground - launch - air - super combo will take out 75%+ of his health" low. So not quite Phoenix bad, but worse than anyone but her.
- His ground dash is similar to Zero's.
- His quarter-circle forward specials on the ground are sword slashes that cause groundbounce.
- His teleports (reverse dragon punch motion) all track. One deposits him above and in front of opponents, one above and behind, and the third is actually an attack teleport that appears to cause groundbounce (at least on airborne foes). The guy who made the videos said he believes Strider's teleports were probably the best in the game.
- His OTG options are apparently hard to combo after, even with assists.
- A possible bug caused his Ouroborous (satellite hyper that shoots projectiles when he does attacks) to fail to come out when he activated it at the same time as his opponent (Firebrand) activated his passive hyper.

Wesker:
- Got a health nerf, but doesn't seem to have been nerfed in any other way.

Zevox

Zevox

2011-09-24, 12:33 AM

Well, two more characters were revealed and, more important, had videos released at the Tokyo Game Show. Vergil and Iron Fist.

Vergil Trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zS3DpnJC9Y)
Vergil Fight #1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4kO3e_IDbw)
Vergil Fight #2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VvxwQaPsrgE)
Iron Fist Trailer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn8nNdaH2rk)
Iron Fist Fight #1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SDPriEHpNNc)
Iron Fist Fight #2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_pmGy4OMmpQ)
Bonus: Breakdowns of the characters (http://shoryuken.com/2011/09/15/umvc3-seth-killian-explains-vergil-and-iron-fist/) by Seth Killian and a couple of MvC3 players.

Vergil looks just as awesome as I'd hoped. He has some similarities to Dante (for instance his jumping down hard is very similar to Dante's jumping S, and his jumping S is basically Dante's killer bee special), but just like in DMC3 has plenty of his own abilities and overall much fewer moves than his brother (in fact, he seems to have pretty close to all of his DMC3 moves). His normals are enormous (his standing H and S attacks can literally hit you from halfway across the screen!), probably second only to Ghost Rider's in that regard, and he seems even faster than his brother, has teleports akin to Phoenix and Strider's, and some very interesting specials and supers, especially his summoned swords super. (Interesting note, his level 3 super is apparently only available to him in Devil Trigger mode, which like with Dante is a super itself, so you actually need 4 meter to use his level 3. On the plus side his Devil Trigger seems more useful than Dante's, giving him an air dash and suping up his specials almost like Arthur's armor does for him). Seeing Seth's breakdown of some of his tricks makes me really want to play him. On the downside though I get the impression from beatings he takes from Doctor Strange and Iron Fist in those videos that his health is kind of bad - I just hope it's closer to Akuma bad than Strider or Phoenix bad.

Iron Fist honestly looks pretty basic to me. The only particularly interesting thing I'm seeing from him is a set of passive specials (not supers, just specials) that Seth explained can boost his offense, defense, or meter gain. Not that I was expecting to like him, but I was hoping he'd seem more unique than he does. Oh well.

One other bit of news though: apparently, UMvC3 will be available on the PS Vita. As a launch title no less. Did not see that one coming.

Zevox

DiscipleofBob

2011-09-24, 12:58 AM

The Iron Fist videos remind me of Fei Long of the Street Fighter series.

Zevox

2011-09-24, 01:50 PM

The Iron Fist videos remind me of Fei Long of the Street Fighter series.
Not familiar with the character I'm afraid. What's similar about them? :smallconfused:

Zevox

Illieas

2011-09-25, 09:50 PM

Not familiar with the character I'm afraid. What's similar about them? :smallconfused:

Zevox

fei long is the street fighter 's version of the bruce lee clone.

i only see very basic similarities between fei long and iron monk. mainly them using the bruce lee screams and the one inch punch ultra. otherwise i don't see that much in terms of similar skill set. missing the rekkas and the burning kick though they have flying kick but they are different in how they hit.

deuxhero

2011-09-25, 10:19 PM

8 more characters possible in the future?

Hmm...
Capcom
Gene
Megaman (classic)
Fou-lu
(Plus if a Wii U port is done, OoX/MC Link)

Marvel:
Dr. Randall Pierce (assist character based)
Daredevil (Pair with She Hulk and Wright for a team of lawyers)
Mephisto
???

Illieas

2011-10-13, 11:54 AM

Phoenix Wright has been revealed as well as character trailer

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-LILhai7IHI

interesting tibbits from the trailer. he has modok shield with maya and maya does a OTG

you start off investigative mode as seen at the start once you get enough search for evidence (which you can hold 3 and use as a projectile)
once you reach 3 pieces of evidence and inspiration that little spark charge move.
you can enter trial mode which is the yellow glow then you need the evidence to make a super strong lvl 3. doing the lvl 3 auto end the trial mode and your back into search. trial mode also has a time limit.

Zevox

2011-10-13, 12:38 PM

More completely, Phoenix Wright and Nova (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/13/umvc3-phoenix-wright-and-nova-reveal-videos/) character trailers and fight videos.

Phoenix Wright is... weird. Just weird. Aside from his evidence-collecting being comparable to the seals Bang gets after hitting with his drive in BlazBlue, I have no idea what to compare him to. I do have to say that his normals look like they have absolutely pathetic range, but beyond that, I don't know what to make of him. Guess I'll have to wait and see what happens when the game is out to know what I'll think of him.

Nova looks like a pretty standard character. A few interesting mobility moves that cause wallbounce or OTG, a standard beam super, an aura super, and a Wesker-esque super, and not much else that stood out to me. I guess I'll have to play around with him to see if I'll like him or not. The only interesting thing was the lack of a straightforward projectile other than his beam super, which is rare in this game.

Also, pro player Maximilian apparently had Capcom ask him to do a web series on the new characters promoting the game, and got an early edition of it to do so. The result are these awesome videos covering Strider and Hawkeye (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/05/umvc3-assist-me-tutorial-featuring-strider-hiryu-and-hawkeye/) first, and Ghost Rider and Firebrand (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/12/umvc3-assist-me-ghost-rider-and-firebrand-tutorials/) second (plus a Q&A (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/11/how-did-maximilian-get-umvc3-early-for-ultimate-assist-me/) video followup to the first one). More videos are to come, presumably featuring the characters in the order Capcom revealed them given the first two covered the initial four reveals (so Doctor Strange and Nemesis next, then Vergil and Iron fist, then Phoenix Wright and Nova, and finally Frank West and Rocket Raccoon after their official announcement).

And finally: a hint of Mega Man's return (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/13/umvc3-mega-man-hint-in-trailer-background/)?! Please let it be so!

Zevox

Deth Muncher

2011-10-13, 04:08 PM

Phoenix Wright looks absolutely dumb - then again, I like Band in BlazBlue, so maybe he's gonna be awesome like that.

Nova is some kind of insane Captain Falcon/Captain America/Magneto hybrid, and I love every minute of it.

DiscipleofBob

2011-10-16, 01:36 AM

Zevox

2011-10-16, 01:46 AM

Thank you, Zevon and Deth Muncher, for downplaying Phoenix Wright in your posts. When I actually got to watch said trailer, the doubt you placed in my mind made it awesome when PW delivered on the awesomeness.

"OBJECTIONABABLE!!!"

Now I just wonder if his level 3 hyper will work on Galactus. Probably not, but it'd be cool nontheless.
I don't think any level 3 hypers work on Galactus. They're all cinematics, which just don't work on him, for obvious reasons. Unless you count She-Hulk's car hitting him, but that's much less damage than the actual throw does.

And I "downplayed" Phoenix Wright because I'm not familiar with the character. I've never played his games. So when I look at those trailers, all I see is a weird character.

Zevox

MoelVermillion

2011-10-16, 01:54 AM

Zevox

2011-10-16, 02:08 AM

I thought the latest posts in here would be about Heroes and Heralds (http://iplaywinner.com/news/2011/10/15/nycc-umvc3-panel-reveals-heroes-and-heralds-mode.html) mode but they weren't!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfzBAnk09W0

Thoughts? I have no interest in this at all, but thats just me!
Huh, looks like a good mode to goof off in, since they're giving you so many broken new options in it. Guess I'll probably enjoy it every now and then.

Zevox

DiscipleofBob

2011-10-16, 09:13 AM

Yeah, at the very least, it looks like a lot of the cards will be the cameos and characters who didn't make it in, so it'll be interesting to see who makes the card format.

Zevox

2011-10-22, 01:35 AM

For those interested, some information on changes to the game from its predecessor gameplay/balance-wise:

The guy who is making those "Assist Me" videos detailing the new characters has a video up explaining general system changes (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/20/assist-me-special-episode-gameplay-changes-in-umvc3/) between the two games, from the ability to use X-Factor in the air to assists now suffering from hitstun decay just like regular moves.

Even bigger, a comprehensive list of changes made to each character on the Marvel side was released by Capcom, and can be read here (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/21/umvc3-official-change-log-for-marvel-side-characters/). There's quite a lot. A few notable ones:
Magneto's light and medium EM Disruptors are now slower.
Phoenix has even less health (yes, seriously - they dropped her from 420k to 375k).
Sentinel's health has been set at 900k (was at 905k after the patch that nerfed him, presumably this is correcting a typo there or something).
Dormammu can chain all three of his ground normals together now, and charge and release his hand spells in the air.
Captain America received a healthy number of buffs, including having light shield slash hit OTG and getting some invincibility frames on his backflip.
Iron Man can apparently use Proton Canon in the air now.
Storm can apparently use Ice Storm in the air now (as if that move wasn't good enough already...).
Oddly, MODOK alone seems to have had practically no changes whatsoever.

Lots of interesting stuff to see - I hope they release a list like that for the Capcom side too, as I'd really like to know what's happening with Dante and Trish (though just seeing Trish's air Maximum Voltage hit OTG in that "Assist Me" video was plenty to put a smile on my face :smallbiggrin: ).

Zevox

Zevox

2011-10-28, 01:31 PM

Uh, guys. Phoenix Wright's level 3 (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/26/umvc3-assist-me-featuring-phoenix-wright-and-iron-fist/) is probably the single best hyper in the game. 600,000 damage, 0 frames of startup, hits fullscreen (ala Magneto's gravity squeeze). That's just... crazy :smalleek: .

Looks like his principle drawback is being rather bad in investigation mode and only decent in courtroom mode, but once he reaches turnabout mode, he's apparently a real beast.

In other news, Maximilian (the guy behind the "Assist Me" videos like the one linked above) is also now providing raw footage of actual UMvC3 fights featuring the new characters, I'm presuming fought between him and a friend. Whoever it is fighting, they're very good, and it's a great way to see the new characters in action. The first video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUACJHjV-6g&feature=channel_video_title) has teams of She-Hulk/Doctor Strange/Firebrand vs Ghost Rider/Nemesis/Strider, while the second (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwgRrEdwPi0&feature=channel_video_title) has Dormammu/Hulk/Iron Fist vs Hawkeye/Doctor Doom/Vergil. I'm particularly impressed by some of that Vergil play myself - can't wait to get my hands on him.

Finally, the official list of character changes (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/27/umvc3-character-change-log-capcom-side/) for the Capcom side is up now. As I did with the Marvel side, a few highlights:

All of Dante's moves have had their knockback increased, their hitstun and float times adjusted, and all non-hypers have had minimum damage scaling decreased. While they don't specify how the histun/float times were adjusted, I'd imagine that all these together amount to nerfs for him. Sounds like they're designed to make his combos harder and less effective, since he was such a beast in that regard before.
Also on Dante, his style change moves can now be performed with just a second press of the button used to execute the special, rather than a full second input.
Trish's air Maximum Voltage (electric hyper) now hits OTG.
Akuma's health was decreased to 750k. Exactly double Phoenix's new health, funnily enough.
Wesker's health nerf was smaller than I thought, dropping him to only 1 million (from 1.1 million - I expected him to be at 900-950k now). Other than that, he oddly seems to have been buffed, which I did not expect at all.
Amaterasu can now change weapons in mid-air.
Arthur gained hp (went from 800k to 850k), his jumping S can OTG now (that's weird), and his "heavenly slash" moved gained some startup invincibility.
Tron Bonne's Gustaff Fire assist no longer has its invincibility. Bye-bye, best assist in the game.
Zero gained a little bit of hp (went from 800k to 830k), but also seems to have been given some slight nerfs, like reduced hitstun on his ground normals and a change to how his charge shot works.

Zevox

Illieas

2011-10-28, 03:35 PM

Zevox

2011-10-28, 03:43 PM

virgil is like dante so he will see plenty of play.
Um, no, not really. Vergil has completely different moves than Dante (and much fewer), with the sole exceptions of Stinger and Devil Trigger, both of which differ from Dante's versions. His normals are slower but much larger than Dante's (he seems to be second only to Ghost Rider in terms of the reach of his normals), while his specials are completely unique to him (and are all taken from his abilities in Devil May Cry 3). Aside from both being rushdown characters, they're not alike - and half the cast is rushdown characters, so that doesn't make them very alike.

Also, Vergil seems to have less health than Dante, which would likely act as a deterant to him getting widespread use.

Zevox

Illieas

2011-10-28, 04:18 PM

Um, no, not really. Vergil has completely different moves than Dante (and much fewer), with the sole exceptions of Stinger and Devil Trigger, both of which differ from Dante's versions. His normals are slower but much larger than Dante's (he seems to be second only to Ghost Rider in terms of the reach of his normals), while his specials are completely unique to him (and are all taken from his abilities in Devil May Cry 3). Aside from both being rushdown characters, they're not alike - and half the cast is rushdown characters, so that doesn't make them very alike.

Also, Vergil seems to have less health than Dante, which would likely act as a deterant to him getting widespread use.

Zevox

they are still closer than others point being that he is teleport character that rushes down and has long range normals. This was the implication that he has a strong game like dante.

with the changes to air dashes teleporting has gotten stronger and that is why i think he will be used often.

Zevox

2011-10-28, 05:41 PM

they are still closer than others point being that he is teleport character that rushes down and has long range normals. This was the implication that he has a strong game like dante.

with the changes to air dashes teleporting has gotten stronger and that is why i think he will be used often.
There are plenty of other teleporting characters though - Dormammu, Phoenix, Doctor Strange, Strider, Wesker, and Deadpool - and I don't think you'd call them similar to Dante. Strider in particular also fits having long-range normals with that big sword of his, and is definitely rushdown in style (as are Phoenix and Wesker).

Zevox

Illieas

2011-10-28, 07:44 PM

There are plenty of other teleporting characters though - Dormammu, Phoenix, Doctor Strange, Strider, Wesker, and Deadpool - and I don't think you'd call them similar to Dante. Strider in particular also fits having long-range normals with that big sword of his, and is definitely rushdown in style (as are Phoenix and Wesker).

Zevox

i can point to supers. which two he shares with dante. devil trigger and the level 3. he has at least two moves that are exactly the same as dante the diagonal dive attack and the spinning in the air move knock down which dante added an ice element to it. His j.S is also the exactly the same.

there are no other characters closer in similiarities to vergil than from vergil to dante. it isn't a ken ryu situation to be sure but they do share similiarities. long range, teleporting, rush down. wesker isn't long range and doesn't use any similar moves other than maximum wesker. phoenix, doctor strange, deadpool, dorm are more projectile based (shoot something and teleport to cross up and pressure and they all don't have long range). dorm really isn't rush down. we dropped down to 3 of 60. strider vergil and dante. 5%. throw in a couple exact same moves and supers . I can safely say he is like dante.

game plan is the same run in use your long range. teleport for some cross up or surprise attack. build an obsurdly large combo which employs a ground bounce to relaunch to super of some sort. vergil has some dynamics that are different such as his dashing cross up which is wolverine like. and dante with his huge amount of cancels into another attack move.

Zevox

2011-10-28, 09:49 PM

i can point to supers. which two he shares with dante. devil trigger and the level 3. he has at least two moves that are exactly the same as dante the diagonal dive attack and the spinning in the air move knock down which dante added an ice element to it. His j.S is also the exactly the same.
The only super he shares is Devil Trigger, which is out of necessity - they're brothers and both have that ability as a result of their father. His level 3 is not the same as Dante's - Dante's is an elaborate, super-stylish version of Stinger, while Vergil's is a series of sword slashes followed by a barrage of his summoned swords. Vergil's also requires that he be in Devil Trigger in order to use it.

Their spinning specials are also different. Dante's is Revolver, where he spins in the air twirling the ice-nunchuk weapon Cerberus, while Vergil's is a forward leap attack where he strikes with his feet using the gauntlet and greave weapon Beowulf.

And actually, you have those jumping attacks backwards. Vergil's j.S is the dive kick Killer Bee which Dante has a special, while Vergil's j.2H is basically Dante's j.S, though it seems to be faster since, unlike Dante, he can combo into it from a basic air combo.

You also forgot one move they also have in common out of necessity, stinger (6H). Which also differs between them since Vergil can cancel his, and Vergil's appears to cause wallbounce when used on airborne/bouncing opponents.

All told, that gives them all of four moves in common, each with changed properties for Vergil.

there are no other characters closer in similiarities to vergil than from vergil to dante. it isn't a ken ryu situation to be sure but they do share similiarities. long range, teleporting, rush down.
The "long range" part is hardly comparable. Dante's normals are a little longer in reach than much of the rest of the cast's (mainly because most of the rest of the cast fights unarmed), but if he tries to take advantage of that too much he'll be out of reach when he tries to do his launcher (especially if the increased knockback on Dante's moves mentioned in the character changes list I linked earlier is at all significant). Vergil's attacks are much longer, and his launcher takes up half the screen. That's a difference they've imported from Devil May Cry 3 - Dante wields Rebellion, a pretty standard-size longsword, while Vergil's signature weapon is the massive katana Yamato. You just can't zone with Dante's normals the way you'll be able to with Vergil's.

And as mentioned, teleporting and rushdown are traits that plenty of characters have in common.

throw in a couple exact same moves and supers . I can safely say he is like dante.
If sharing that few moves was enough to call characters "like" each other we'd be calling plenty of characters "like" Ryu for having projectiles similar to his hadoken and anti-airs similar to his shoryuken. And I don't mean Akuma, I mean characters like Morrigan, Spider Man, Viewtiful Joe, Zero, and so on.

Edit: a third (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgBghxQ5ZWE&feature=channel_video_title) of those match videos from Maximilian just went up. Phoenix Wright/Ghost Rider/Vergil vs Iron Fist/Strider/Firebrand. Shows off some good play from Iron Fist and Phoenix Wright in particular (except in the second fight, where the lawyer went down fast), including just how crazy Phoenix Wright's level 3 is.

Zevox

Illieas

2011-10-28, 10:45 PM

i understand there are lore reason to explain their similarities and their differences. Just like they have to keep dark phoenix to keep with her lore.
I was only making an observation they look as if they play pretty close.

If sharing that few moves was enough to call characters "like" each other we'd be calling plenty of characters "like" Ryu for having projectiles similar to his hadoken and anti-airs similar to his shoryuken. And I don't mean Akuma, I mean characters like Morrigan, Spider Man, Viewtiful Joe, Zero, and so on.

In fact they do call characters that share a few moves "like". the name i point you to is called shotos in Street fighter series. sakura, akuma, oni, evil ryu, ryu, gouken, and ken are examples of shotos. they have a couple moves in common the tatsumaki, the shoryuken, and the hadoken. they are all different in slightly or drastically different ways but they all fall under the umbrella of shoto

Zevox

2011-10-28, 11:05 PM

i understand there are lore reason to explain their similarities and their differences. Just like they have to keep dark phoenix to keep with her lore.
I was only making an observation they look as if they play pretty close.
And that's the thing - they don't look as if they play pretty close. Vergil will be using his massive range normals much more than Dante ever could, and he doesn't have the huge variety of combo-extending specials that Dante does, so for those he'll be using just a few moves and tricks, like his ability to cause both ground and wallbounce or his ability to teleport out of Rising Sun (his uppercut-like kick attack). His summoned swords super is also an extremely versatile tool that Dante doesn't have anything remotely like - the only move at all comparable to that is Strider's level 3 satellites, and obviously there are plenty of differences between those as well - which will likely be a key to his game. I could go on too, with things like Dante's main hyper being a projectile vs Vergil's being a screen-size sword flurry and what that probably means, but I hope you get the point.

The main actual similarity will be that they're both rushdown by preference and have teleports to facilitate that - which you can say of several other characters. (Plus even with the teleports they have important differences, with Vergil having three different options for his teleports while Dante has only one, and Vergil being able to cancel at least some of his specials into his teleports. )

In fact they do call characters that share a few moves "like". the name i point you to is called shotos in Street fighter series. sakura, akuma, oni, evil ryu, ryu, gouken, and ken are examples of shotos. they have a couple moves in common the tatsumaki, the shoryuken, and the hadoken. they are all different in slightly or drastically different ways but they all fall under the umbrella of shoto
To my understanding most of those characters are genuinely very similar to each other, with Ryu, Ken, and Akuma in particular having been genuine clones at one point and remaining rather close to each other outside of specific move properties. Which is much closer than Ryu is to Spider Man or Viewtiful Joe. I admit to not being familiar enough with Street Fighter to say for sure how that is applied, however; but if anyone would call Ryu, Spider Man, and Viewtiful Joe alike because of those somewhat similar moves, I would have to disagree with them, just as I am disagreeing with you over Vergil and Dante now.

Zevox

MoelVermillion

2011-10-31, 10:20 AM

http://www.4gamer.net/games/137/G013710/20111031054/

Rocket Racoon and Frank West trailers. As far as we know thats the entire roster now. Enjoy.

Zevox

2011-10-31, 10:58 AM

Eeyup (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/31/umvc3-frank-west-and-rocket-raccoon-trailers-gameplay-and-screenshots/). Also, Seth Killian walkthroughs (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/31/umvc3-frank-west-and-rocket-raccoon-character-walkthroughs/) for them. Edit: And gameplay videos (http://shoryuken.com/2011/10/31/umvc3-frank-west-vs-rocket-raccoon-gameplay-clips/).

Honestly, they both just look goofy to me. Rocket Raccoon especially - it seems like he'll be relying on his tiny size (he's easily the smallest character in the game) to make him harder to fight than other characters, and other than that he's mostly a gimmicky "trap" character.

Frank West at least has something interesting in the form of his "level up" mechanic - yeah, apparently Capcom taking a cue from Battle Fantasia here, oddly enough - but I can't say I think much of him.

Yeah, with the full cast now revealed, I'd say the order of interest I have in them goes:

Vergil, Doctor Strange, Ghost Rider - Very much so looking forward to playing them.
Phoenix Wright, Strider, Hawkeye, Nova - I'll try them out, but they don't interest me all that much.
Firebrand, Iron Fist, Frank West, Rocket Raccoon, Nemesis - Meh. I'm unlikely to use 'em, unless they turn out to be much more fun than they look.

Edit: And Maximilian's fourth video of raw gameplay (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2uoVi4t_8k0) is up. Strider/Nemesis/Hawkeye vs Doctor Strange/Strider/Iron Fist. Pretty much everyone gets some highlight moments (except Strange, who mostly gets his ass handed to him by Strider).

Zevox

Zevox

2011-11-02, 11:18 PM

Ultimate Assist Me for Vergil and Nova (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=p8qwNZvAvBE) is up.

Wow, I so want to play Vergil now. Incredibly, in spite of requiring him to be in Devil Trigger mode to activate, his level 3 may actually give Phoenix Wright's a run for its money as the best in the game - it does just as much damage as Phoenix's (600k), can hit OTG, and leaves the enemy in a crumple state, which means you can easily combo after it for even more damage. That means it can be used to extend combos well beyond what any other character could do! Plus the one meter you need to spend to enter Devil Trigger is probably easier to do than getting Phoenix Wright into turnabout mode. Phoenix's still remains a strong contender for best though due to the 0-frame startup and ability to hit no matter where the target is - Vergil's probably just has the standard level 3 startup invincibility and charge-forward hitbox.

Also, he has a move that no previous preview covered, Round Trip. If you don't know that from the Devil May Cry series, it's basically the boomerang sword toss that Trish has (the special, not the hyper). Unlike her though he can probably get some great abuse out of it in conjunction with his teleports.

Edit: Oh, and his version of Stinger is so much better than Dante's. Takes him basically full screen, can be special cancelled (which includes his launcher) rather than requiring something as tricky as Dante's bold cancel to actually use, and as we knew causes wallbounce on an airborne/juggled enemy. And I think it may be faster than Dante's. Awesome.

Oh, and Nova. Apparently his big advantage is that all of his specials, in addition to being very mobile, are great for extending combos - he can wallbounce, groundbounce, cause crumple, and OTG. And his flight mode is possibly the game's fastest. Also, a few of his specials also benefit from charging with his red health like his beam hyper does, though it looks like the benefit likely isn't worth the loss of the chance to heal in their case. Oh, and his charging assist actually has a purpose - it is completely invincible against projectiles, so you can use it like Cap's hyper charging star to beat out enemy projectile hypers. Honestly, he still seems bland to me, but at least he sounds like he'll be fairly solid.

Zevox