Shenanigans with illusions!

[Psiona]

Hi everyone!

I'm planning my new character for our next campaign, and my DM has agreed to let me play The Killer Gnome. Shadowcraft Mage here I come! :-D

But until I can break the game and spam very-real-illusions of fireballs and summon a long-lasting army of whatever-I-feel-like on a whim, I need to get inspired. I've never played with illusions before, so I'd like to know some nasty tricks to pull. Doesn't have to include Shadow Evocation/Conjuration, although that's very welcome too ;-)

For example, I read in another thread:

1) Illusionary Wall against pursuers
2) Prismatic Wall right behind it
3) Laugh

Any thoughts? :-)

[graeylin]

i think the easiest and simplest way to begin with illusions (and to get a feel for how the DM will let them work) is just to mix them in with real.

Use magic missiles round one.
then, silent image of magic missiles round two. You may catch the other guy trying to dodge, hide, take cover, dispel, or even just ready an action, which lets you control his place and position a bit. (fyi, this works better with higher spells, of course).

or reverse: a bad silent image of a fireball, really poor. Next round, a real one. Perhaps the guys figure it's a fake, so they don't dodge. That may cost them a reflex save.

Remember that many of your higher level spells can be imaged early on.. silent image is a poor man's blink. Or mirror image.

add extra effects to other spells: brighter lights, more flames, extra colors, more oomph.

[Psiona]

That's a good start! It's awkward that Silent Image requires concentration though.

Hmmm...I could use Silent Image to put a "Wall of Stone" between us and our foes, informing my allies that the wall is fake. Suddenly we can see the foes, but they can't. Arrows away!

...but then they see the arrows go through the wall, thus they have perfect proof that the wall isn't real, automatically succeeding their saves. Dammit.

Maybe wall of fire instead of wall of stone?

[AmberVael]

I feel it is worthwhile to note that illusions can be useful even when it is obvious that they're illusions- you can use them for signalling, to pass along messages, construct elaborate 3d maps, or simply use them as proxies so you don't have to go into danger yourself.

Also, a thought I've been playing with is that, properly executed, you can use the Shadow line of spells to work against anyone who passes their save. That wall of stone made bridge is fine as long as you willingly suspend your disbelief, but if your enemy interacts with it and makes their save... whoops, no bridge for them. :smallamused:
You could also use this the other way around, to create walls with the intention of making your own save and manipulating them against your opponent- only thing better than an impassable wall is a wall that is only impassable to your enemies.

Ultimately, I find that illusion is at its full potential if you are capable of creative improvisation- you can work ahead of time to come up with some clever tricks and apply them to situations where they're useful, but it will be a much more powerful school of magic if you can tailor your illusions to the situation, taking advantage of how your enemies are thinking, what the battlefield is like, and what you need at the moment. Illusion is what I would call the least defined school, because its mechanics can be so broadly and unusually implemented.

[Psiona]

That shadow wall idea is brilliant ^_^

Mind you, I would have to cast it with very little shadow reality, as those who make their saves can still cross 20%/40%/whatever% of the time if they succeed their saves.

As for your second idea: I can automatically make my save against my own Shadow Wall of Stone illusion, so it's only, say, 50% real for me. My foes fail their will saves, so it's 100% real to them.

End results:
1) My foes can't pass the wall.
2) I can only pass through my own wall 50% of the time.
3) If my foes decide to shoot arrows or poke the wall with a 10-foot pole, the arrows/poles have a 50% chance of getting through, because they're objects and automatically make their saves against illusions.

Did I get all that right?

[graeylin]

remember to use Presti as often as possible too, to add some substance here and there to your illusions.

Concentration is a bummer here and there, but on the other hand, you can really layer your illusions too (again, DM approval on how this works); image of a fireball, they disbelieve. So, next round, have the fireball turn around and explode in front of them, leaving a flaming wall of fire. they disbelieve. The wall of fire turns into two archers taking aim with bows, and they disbelieve.

oops, that last was your party. No dex bonus for the bad guys, they walked straight into it.

[Psiona]

I'll try to mess with their minds for sure ;-)

Still not 100% clear on how shadow illusions however. /more research

[GuyLoki]

One of my favorite things to do is to fake my own death... repeatedly.

If you are good at hiding, make an illusion of yourself that battles against your foes (or of the party's rogue). Let the illusion 'die' but keep concentrating on having it react by falling down dead and bleeding out. When your enemies gather around your 'corpse' to collect your loot, that is when you pull out the fireballs.


I have also used a Silent Image once to create a temporary base for my entire group. Being chased by baddies we got a lead on them went down an alleyway and I put up a wall to make it look like there was no alley at all. Of course I had to concentrate on it while the rest of the party relaxed, healed up, and formulated new plans.

[The Gilded Duke]

Illusions do not give an immediate will save, they must be interacted with first. Interaction usually requires a move or standard action. Mindless creatures cannot make will saves to disbelieve.

This makes Illusions devastating against constructs and undead.

If you make an illusionary one way mirror, your party can see through it and your enemies cannot. This allows your party to act as an invisible attacker, and can make enemies flat footed.

As enemies usually can't disbelieve until their turn, you can use this quite effectively to disable enemies, stopping attacks of opportunity, or enabling sneak attacks. Even if they make their save every time.

Example:
Wizard casts Silent Image around the Boss, Boss is now flat footed.
Rogue full attack sneak attacks the boss.
Boss spends move action to disbelieve the illusion. Can only make single standard action attack on the rogue.

If you play the Gnome Illusionist ACF, Silent Image becomes a level 0 spell. A 0 level spell you can use to stagger and flat foot opponents for one round on a successful saving throw.

If you can get your familiar the ability to use wands and UMD, it can become even more powerful.

You cast 0th level Silent Image creating a one way mirror around the boss.
Your familiar casts 1st level Silent Image from a wand, creating a one way mirror around the boss a few inches farther out.

The boss should still be able to beat the DC, but they would have to spend both their standard and move action to do so.

[Yanagi]

Remember that illusions can edit out stuff as well as add it. Cover up traps, conceal trenches and ditches so pursuers don't know to jump over them or go around them. Combine this with caltrops, tanglefoot bags, et cetera.

Many of the best uses of illusion are pre-combat rather than in the engagement proper: using images and sounds to split the party you're attacking, using disguises and fake messages to set up ambushes, using invisibility to spy and or steal from opponents. Read up on the spells that cause the fascinated status (DMG 301)--it doesn't work alongside immediate threats, but it might give your party a few extra rounds to getting ready/get into position before a fight.

I don't know the Killer Gnome build: could someone point me to a layout of it?

[Grey Knight]

That wall of stone made bridge is fine as long as you willingly suspend your disbelief, but if your enemy interacts with it and makes their save... whoops, no bridge for them. :smallamused:

Ah yes, the "Wile E. Coyote" clause!

[LansXero]

There was a spell that made you believe the entire world was an illusion. Would it also make you believe illusions are real? :O

[erikun]

Remember that if the targets don't interact with the illusion, they don't get a save. Making an illusion that is either out of their reach, or something they wouldn't want to touch, is a very good way to keep it effective.

Illusionary concealment works just as well as real concealment, so Silent Image bushes covering your archers works just fine. Create an image of a pit or chasm, or a pillar over something you want to hide. Place an illusionary wall over your party to avoid notice. When being chased, open one door then run in a different one, and place an illusionary blank wall in front of the door you went through.

If you can get your opponent to fail their saves, you have even more options. Place an illusion wall on top of your party, automatically allowing them to save but preventing opponents from striking back. Illusionary difficult terrain will slow movement and prevent 5' steps. Illusionary ice requires balance checks or else fall prone. Illusionary wolves can (arguably) trip.

As someone mentioned, mindless creatures automatically fail will saves and thus automatically fall for illusions. Place a Silent Image wall in front of a skeleton, and it can't get at you.

You could also try some trickier uses to get people to move around. An illusion of someone running away can get guards to give chase. Make an illusionary falcon fly at the guards, then fly away with the keys seen in its claws (great way to get guards to leave the keys behind). An illusion of an ally, directing them down the wrong path, can divert pursuers or split up reinforcements.


I don't know the Killer Gnome build: could someone point me to a layout of it?
It basically uses the Gnome Illusionist substitution (0th-level Silent Image) with Heighten Spell and Shadowcraft Mage. ScM grants 10% reality for each level the spell is Heightened, so just fill your spell levels with heightened Silent Images for 10% real effectiveness per spell level.

Other tricks include Earth Spell - the spell is considered Heightened by an extra level without a higher spell slot - and various feats/prestige class abilities that add to the reality of Shadow Spells.

[Psiona]

Illusions do not give an immediate will save, they must be interacted with first. Interaction usually requires a move or standard action. Mindless creatures cannot make will saves to disbelieve.

This makes Illusions devastating against constructs and undead.

If you make an illusionary one way mirror, your party can see through it and your enemies cannot. This allows your party to act as an invisible attacker, and can make enemies flat footed.

As enemies usually can't disbelieve until their turn, you can use this quite effectively to disable enemies, stopping attacks of opportunity, or enabling sneak attacks. Even if they make their save every time.


I'm not sure I can get my DM to let me do a one-way mirror unless such a thing already exists in the world in a non-magical way. But I'll be sure to ask him, that sounds like a killer strategy.


Remember that illusions can edit out stuff as well as add it. Cover up traps, conceal trenches and ditches so pursuers don't know to jump over them or go around them. Combine this with caltrops, tanglefoot bags, et cetera.

Many of the best uses of illusion are pre-combat rather than in the engagement proper: using images and sounds to split the party you're attacking, using disguises and fake messages to set up ambushes, using invisibility to spy and or steal from opponents. Read up on the spells that cause the fascinated status (DMG 301)--it doesn't work alongside immediate threats, but it might give your party a few extra rounds to getting ready/get into position before a fight.

Those a good suggestions, but silent image is a figment, it can't cover up anything, you need a glamer for that. So as much as I like your "cover up the caltrops" idea, I can't use it unless I put the caltrops in a depression and use SI to cover up the depression.


Remember that if the targets don't interact with the illusion, they don't get a save. Making an illusion that is either out of their reach, or something they wouldn't want to touch, is a very good way to keep it effective.

They can make a disbelief check if they spend a move action to examine the illusion. It could be argued that they don't need to touch it (although that is the surest way), that they can just examine it at a distance looking for out-of-place details. Still, making illusions of stuff they don't want to touch? Great idea!


Illusionary concealment works just as well as real concealment, so Silent Image bushes covering your archers works just fine. Create an image of a pit or chasm, or a pillar over something you want to hide. Place an illusionary wall over your party to avoid notice. When being chased, open one door then run in a different one, and place an illusionary blank wall in front of the door you went through.

If you can get your opponent to fail their saves, you have even more options. Place an illusion wall on top of your party, automatically allowing them to save but preventing opponents from striking back.

Love the man-made concealment. Why would you disbelieve that pile of rocks? :-D


Illusionary difficult terrain will slow movement and prevent 5' steps. Illusionary ice requires balance checks or else fall prone. Illusionary wolves can (arguably) trip.

Now that I'm having a problem with. No matter how real they believe my images are, they won't physically affect them. They'll slow down for illusory difficult terrain, but once they step in it, they'll automatically disbelieve it, as their feet will go through. The ice won't really be slippery. And the wolves, while appearing threatening, will never be able to trip.




As someone mentioned, mindless creatures automatically fail will saves and thus automatically fall for illusions. Place a Silent Image wall in front of a skeleton, and it can't get at you.

You could also try some trickier uses to get people to move around. An illusion of someone running away can get guards to give chase. Make an illusionary falcon fly at the guards, then fly away with the keys seen in its claws (great way to get guards to leave the keys behind). An illusion of an ally, directing them down the wrong path, can divert pursuers or split up reinforcements.

I'm stealing all those ideas ;-) Thanks for your input guys, keep them coming!

Also: if I make a shadow-illusion wall 50% real and automatically disbelieve it, do you think I can automatically pass through it myself, or only 50% or the time?

[erikun]

Now that I'm having a problem with. No matter how real they believe my images are, they won't physically affect them. They'll slow down for illusory difficult terrain, but once they step in it, they'll automatically disbelieve it, as their feet will go through. The ice won't really be slippery. And the wolves, while appearing threatening, will never be able to trip.
Illusions have tactile senses as well, unless they only incorporate a specific sense (Ghost Sound, Silent Image). By the time you reach Major Image, the terrain will feel solid, the ice will feel slippery, and you will feel the wolf's teeth and drool against your legs. (If you've ever had a big dog running around your legs, you know that they don't need to bite and drag your leg to knock you down.)

And if you disbelieve your own shadowy wall, it is still a real object and you cannot pass through it. It is still real, and still actually there. Shadow illusions have real effects. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#shadow)

[Psiona]

Illusions have tactile senses as well, unless they only incorporate a specific sense (Ghost Sound, Silent Image). By the time you reach Major Image, the terrain will feel solid, the ice will feel slippery, and you will feel the wolf's teeth and drool against your legs. (If you've ever had a big dog running around your legs, you know that they don't need to bite and drag your leg to knock you down.)

*Please* let me know where it says illusions have tactile senses. Me and my DM had a big disagreement over this. If it's not a shadow illusion, it's just an image. A loud, smelly, warm image, but still just an image.

If it were to have tactile senses, then what's the point of having Shadow Conjuration at all? Just imagine the monster you want, cast Major image and maul away.


And if you disbelieve your own shadowy wall, it is still a real object and you cannot pass through it. It is still real, and still actually there. Shadow illusions have real effects. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#shadow)

If my shadow wall is a real object and I can't pass through it, then the above suggestion to use it above a chasm and make disbeliever fall doesn't work anymore.

I was under the impression that it would only be solid 50% of the time it's interacted with.

[Psiona]

"Quote from the d20SRD:

Shadows

A shadow spell creates something that is partially real from extradimensional energy. Such illusions can have real effects. Damage dealt by a shadow illusion is real. "


This implies that non-shadow illusions do not have real effects.

[aquaticrna]

the way we've worked it in our games is that if you fail your will save it will basically be a mind over matter thing. Because your brain is so convinced that there is a wall there it will tell your body what you're feeling, instead of the other way around, so as you reach out to touch the wall you're fully convinced that it's there and believe that you're feeling a hard solid surface that you can't push through. Granted that means you can still be pushed through the wall or blindfolded and lead through the wall, but you can't make yourself walk through, because as far as you're concerned there is a wall.

Fun thing is this is a very real effect in the world, do some google searching on top down knowledge for more info.

[Vandicus]

A shadow conjuration monster is partially solid and a shadow evocation is partially real in what some people term "quasireality". I believe that PRC specifically changes illusions to operate like those two(expanding to cover greater shadow evocation as a higher level class feature) in which case both of those have a certain quasireality to them. Since shadow conjuration doesn't change the rules for tumbling past a monster who is only 20% there(and therefore being a smaller size category), we can only conclude that these effects are treated as solid for such purposes, so even a bridge created by the PRC's effect combined with silent image would not allow people to fall through if it was disbelieved.

Silent image on its own is of course never solid.

[Eldest]

Without houserules, none of the Figment spells have any sort of tactile form. You could make an argument for a Major Image of a Wall of Flame working like a wall of flame, because Major Image can create thermal effects (and so damage). But none of the Image line are real. Exept with the Shadowcraft Mage.

[Psiona]

the way we've worked it in our games is that if you fail your will save it will basically be a mind over matter thing. Because your brain is so convinced that there is a wall there it will tell your body what you're feeling, instead of the other way around, so as you reach out to touch the wall you're fully convinced that it's there and believe that you're feeling a hard solid surface that you can't push through. Granted that means you can still be pushed through the wall or blindfolded and lead through the wall, but you can't make yourself walk through, because as far as you're concerned there is a wall.

Fun thing is this is a very real effect in the world, do some google searching on top down knowledge for more info.

That was the opinion of my DM. If we go by that, then illusions suddenly become IMMENSELY powerful. Get a high enough DC, you can trap someone inside an image. Furthermore, all illusions would have to become [Mind-Affecting] spells wouldn't they? Mind over matter?

It would also imply that you can make a major image fight for you. The opponent will believe he's wounding your image, and he'll also believe the image is injuring him.

I don't know...everything about that feels WRONG :smallannoyed:


A shadow conjuration monster is partially solid and a shadow evocation is partially real in what some people term "quasireality". I believe that PRC specifically changes illusions to operate like those two(expanding to cover greater shadow evocation as a higher level class feature) in which case both of those have a certain quasireality to them. Since shadow conjuration doesn't change the rules for tumbling past a monster who is only 20% there(and therefore being a smaller size category), we can only conclude that these effects are treated as solid for such purposes, so even a bridge created by the PRC's effect combined with silent image would not allow people to fall through if it was disbelieved.

Silent image on its own is of course never solid.

I like that. It's real and solid, just not as good as the real thing.

[Psiona]

Without houserules, none of the Figment spells have any sort of tactile form. You could make an argument for a Major Image of a Wall of Flame working like a wall of flame, because Major Image can create thermal effects (and so damage). But none of the Image line are real. Exept with the Shadowcraft Mage.

Quoted for truth.

[AmberVael]

And if you disbelieve your own shadowy wall, it is still a real object and you cannot pass through it. It is still real, and still actually there. Shadow illusions have real effects. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicOverview/spellDescriptions.htm#shadow)

To quote Shadow Conjuration:

Shadow objects or substances have normal effects except against those who disbelieve them. Against disbelievers, they are 20% likely to work.
There is no clarification or qualification... your DM may rule that they are always solid, but RAW does not necessarily support this. I will grant that it is vague, but it seems to me it is a quite reasonable interpretation to assume that there is a large chance (80%) that a shadow conjuration object has no bearing on your actions whatsoever.

[Psiona]

To quote Shadow Conjuration:

There is no clarification or qualification... your DM may rule that they are always solid, but RAW does not necessarily support this. I will grant that it is vague, but it seems to me it is a quite reasonable interpretation to assume that there is a large chance (80%) that a shadow conjuration object has no bearing on your actions whatsoever.

I think my DM might go with this interpretation.

[Vandicus]

I think my DM might go with this interpretation.

Shadow conjuration states that shadow conjurations are only 20% strong as the real thing when disbelieved, so perhaps that means when disbelieved the shadow bridge is only 20% as sturdy?(more likely to break)

[Psiona]

Shadow conjuration states that shadow conjurations are only 20% strong as the real thing when disbelieved, so perhaps that means when disbelieved the shadow bridge is only 20% as sturdy?(more likely to break)

Good one, that's reasonable too.

[Ceric]

Major illusion includes thermal effects, so make a really REALLY hot fire. No one's going to touch it to make sure it's real or not, even if it were possible to touch fire.

[Zale]

Just make the illusionary barrier look like something no one wants to go near.

Fire. Or a monster of some kind.

After all, to the untrained eye, you may have seemed to just summon something.

[erikun]

To quote Shadow Conjuration:

There is no clarification or qualification... your DM may rule that they are always solid, but RAW does not necessarily support this. I will grant that it is vague, but it seems to me it is a quite reasonable interpretation to assume that there is a large chance (80%) that a shadow conjuration object has no bearing on your actions whatsoever.
I'm not going to say what a DM might rule (since it could be anything), but I have a hard time seeing existing as an "effect".

[Psiona]

Illusory wall of fire is definitively going in my bag of tricks.

[AmberVael]

I'm not going to say what a DM might rule (since it could be anything), but I have a hard time seeing existing as an "effect".

Wall of Stone:

Effect: Stone wall whose area is up to one 5-ft. square/level (S)

Wall of Iron:

Effect: Iron wall whose area is up to one 5-ft. square/level; see text

Also, how else would you explain ignoring the effects of say... Obscuring Mist? Or Web? Or Glitterdust or Solid Fog or just about every other Conjuration (Creation) spell? :smallconfused:

[Psiona]

Vael: 1, erikun: 0

[bloodtide]

*Please* let me know where it says illusions have tactile senses. Me and my DM had a big disagreement over this. If it's not a shadow illusion, it's just an image. A loud, smelly, warm image, but still just an image.

None of the core Figments have this, but the Glamer Mirage Arcana does. And Mirage Arcana is great for all sorts of area modifications.



Now that I'm having a problem with. No matter how real they believe my images are, they won't physically affect them. They'll slow down for illusory difficult terrain, but once they step in it, they'll automatically disbelieve it, as their feet will go through. The ice won't really be slippery. And the wolves, while appearing threatening, will never be able to trip.

Figments and Glamors will never harm someone directly. If you want direct harm, that's what Phantasms, Patterns and Shadow type illusions are for...

Note that Figments and Glamors can harm indirectly though. You could cover a hole or icy ground with an illusion that makes it look safe. You can make an existing object look 'bigger' and take up more space, for example if you put an illusion of a boulder right next to a real boulder it will look like two boulders and they can even touch the real one.

Illusions of smoke, dust or such are great for blocking sight. And you can make a thin 'wall' of smoke to hide a pit or wall or such and get someone to run into it.

You can also make your own effects on the environment. Take a couple spells that let you move around real things that you can then use your illusions to cover and trap folks with. An unseen servant is good to have around. It can dig holes for example, or move rocks or logs.

[Pippa the Pixie]

The Chains of Disbelief is a great ability:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#chainsofDisbelief


Also a useful trick for Figment Illusions is to use greed. Make an image of something of value to them. You can easily get someone to stop for at least a round. Gold coins can stop bandits, for example. Even better is when you throw the gold crown of kings up in a tree, in a pit dangling from a root or such.

[Psiona]

None of the core Figments have this, but the Glamer Mirage Arcana does. And Mirage Arcana is great for all sorts of area modifications.


A glamer with tactile sensations?! That's awesome, thanks! :smallbiggrin:


The Chains of Disbelief is a great ability:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/specialistWizardVariants.htm#chainsofDisbelief


Also a useful trick for Figment Illusions is to use greed. Make an image of something of value to them. You can easily get someone to stop for at least a round. Gold coins can stop bandits, for example. Even better is when you throw the gold crown of kings up in a tree, in a pit dangling from a root or such.

Already taking Chains of Disbelief. Didn't think of using greed though, good idea! :smallsmile:

[Grey Knight]

Shadow conjuration states that shadow conjurations are only 20% strong as the real thing when disbelieved, so perhaps that means when disbelieved the shadow bridge is only 20% as sturdy?(more likely to break)

Another interpretation I like is that the wall is "20% solid"; if you push hard against it you can squeeze through as if through a curtain of stiff fluid and come out the other side (then the hole closes up behind you). Or you can say the wall is to you like an image painted on a heavy curtain which you can haul aside to get past. And if a person's weight is sufficient to bloip them through the barrier, you can do that bridge trick mentioned earlier! :-D Imagine two ogres and a gnome walking down a corridor. The ogres both clomp over the trap, but then the gnome (the only one with a high Will) whiffs through it as if he'd stepped on a blanket!

Regarding illusory ice sheets; one interpretation is that, while they don't actually slip (because it's not really slippery) they do have to spend extra movement (because they are treading carefully, since it looks slippery). Of course they get Will saves to see if they notice the trick.

As well as greed you can use other forms of attachment. Make an illusion of something (or someone!) they care about in trouble. Even if the real such thing is miles away it may give them pause to investigate. Of course low-level image spells can't do intelligible speech so if you're making a person then perhaps make them unconscious or paralyzed.

[Nameless Ghost]

You can use Silent Image to mimic a Fog spell pretty effectively. The best part is that it's almost impossible to disbelieve because there's almost no way to really interact with it.

If you make the fog look hazardous, you can dissuade foes from entering it. Once they do, odds are that someone's first response will be, 'oh, it isn't dangerous after all' rather than 'maybe the fog is an illusion!'.

If you're not aware, there's a few Skill Tricks (Complete Scoundrel) that you might benefit from if you can meet the requirements and have the points available:

False Theurgy lets you spend a Swift Action to make it look as though you're casting a different spell of the same level, while Swift Concentration lets you maintain concentration on a spell as a Swift Action.

[Kurald Galain]

2E had an explicit rule that trying to disbelieve an effect that is not actually an illusion means you automatically forfeit your saving throw against that effect. This may be a nice suggestion to your DM.

[Psiona]

If you're not aware, there's a few Skill Tricks (Complete Scoundrel) that you might benefit from if you can meet the requirements and have the points available:

False Theurgy lets you spend a Swift Action to make it look as though you're casting a different spell of the same level, while Swift Concentration lets you maintain concentration on a spell as a Swift Action.

Fog`s another good idea. I had completely forgotten about skill tricks, those you mentioned might get me around those pesky concentration images, and I was worried about spellcasters instantly knowing if I was casting an illusion or a real spell. Thanks!


2E had an explicit rule that trying to disbelieve an effect that is not actually an illusion means you automatically forfeit your saving throw against that effect. This may be a nice suggestion to your DM.

Yes, we talked about it, if I mess with their minds enough, they just might willingly jump into a very real wall of fire :smallamused:

[Grey Knight]

I was worried about spellcasters instantly knowing if I was casting an illusion or a real spell.

It's also worth noting that they need to observe the verbal and somatic components in order to identify the spell. You can take care of one or both with a little metamagic, and of course you can stop them observing by mundane means (e.g. casting from outside their line of sight means they can't see somatic components; if they're deafened or in a very noisy environment they'll have trouble making out verbal components). Oh, and of course your illusions can themselves be used to mask the components of further spells! (e.g. cast from behind an illusory wall; you still have line of sight and effect but they can't see your hands!)

[Endarire]

Cast silent image. Surround your teammates with 9 mirror images each. Drop the mirror images if they're hit, but refresh them each round.

[Endarire]

Cast silent image. Surround your teammates with 9 mirror images each. Drop the mirror images if they're hit, but refresh them each round.

[Eldest]

That doesn't work, since you need to concentrate on each one. Maybe if your DM let you make all the mirror images with silent image?

[kharmakazy]

I put darkened arrow slits in my illusiory walls, that way arrows coming out of them is not impossible.

[King Atticus]

False Theurgy lets you spend a Swift Action to make it look as though you're casting a different spell of the same level, while Swift Concentration lets you maintain concentration on a spell as a Swift Action.

These skill tricks are cool but they can only be used once per encounter so you have to pick your moments with them.