[3.5] Best air CC spells ?

[Ruinix]

wich are the best crawl control aerial spells ? up to spell level 7.
the target are 10 juveniles black dragons, so how i stop at least half of them ?
my char is a wizard lev 13, and has acces to all splat books plus SpC.

[dextercorvia]

If Chain spell is available: Bands of Steel (Immobilized or Entangled), Wingbind(Entangled), Earthbind (loss of flight)

Great Thunderclap(Stunned, Deafened, knocked Prone), Radiant Assault(Damage and Dazed for 1d6 rounds on a failed save)

Darkbolt is hard to get, but can daze up to 7 targets (depending on CL)

Cyclonic Blast (Damage, Bull Rush)

[LansXero]

If you want to control flyers, Control Weather or anything that causes high speed winds would work too, right?

[Keld Denar]

Solid Fog.

No, really!

First, check out the rules for arial combat, specifically maneuverability class and minimum forward movement. Now look at Solid Fog. SF reduces movement speed to 5' while inside of it. If you cast it on a dragon's square, so that 10' of it overlaps with the back of the dragon, on the dragon's next turn, it's only option really, will be to double move 10' foward, which is generally less than its minimum forward movement, which will induce a stall, resulting in falling ~120' in the first round, with a ref save to prevent the dragon from falling another ~360 or so feet as it reaches terminal velocity.

The only minor flaw in the plan is that Solid Fog is Range: Close (25 + 5/2 levels), which means it has a range of 55' to the center for your wizard, which means you could concievably use it on a dragon flying 70' above you and still get the overlap you need.

Also, doesn't work on fire breathing dragons, since they could burn away the fog as a standard action and still have a move action available to achieve minimum flight. Also doesn't work on dragons with FoM running.

[dextercorvia]

A creature or object brought into being or transported to your location by a conjuration spell cannot appear inside another creature or object, nor can it appear floating in an empty space. It must arrive in an open location on a surface capable of supporting it.


Effect: Fog spreads in 20-ft. radius, 20 ft. high

This might restrict it's usefulness for fliers.

[Keld Denar]

Its questionable where or not fog is an object. Glitterdust is similar, and there is no problem bringing Glitterdust into being off the ground. Fog does not need to be supported normally, I don't see why the spell would be required to be touching the ground.

[ShriekingDrake]

Downdraft from the Spell Compendium is another option.

[dextercorvia]

Its questionable where or not fog is an object. Glitterdust is similar, and there is no problem bringing Glitterdust into being off the ground. Fog does not need to be supported normally, I don't see why the spell would be required to be touching the ground.

Can you support that ruling?

[Keld Denar]

Can you summon an Air Elemental or other creature that can fly in the air? Technically, air can support a flying creature (or else it wouldn't fly). Can you summon an aquatic creature in the middle of a lake, or does it have to be summoned on the lake bed? What about an ocean? What about on the Elemental Plane of Water?

And then there is whether or not fog is even considered an object.

EDIT: When you cast an Orb of Fire, does the orb appear on the ground in front of you before racing toward your target? What about an Acid Arrow?

No, that rule applies when it makes sense, such as not summoning a whale overhead and dropping it on a creature. Saying you can't summon a CLOUD in the SKY is kinda asinine.

[dextercorvia]

I guess that makes sense. I just think of fog as being on the ground. Once it is in the air, its, as you said, a cloud. But, you're right, air can definitely support more air (Fog in this case).

But, I reserve the right to be asinine some time later.

[Keld Denar]

And I respect that right. When the time comes, you may exercise it again. Now is not that time! :smallcool:

[pilvento]

Just an opinion but the solid fog concept is that being more dense than the air it stays on the ground level.

I would allow it but if your dm wants to kill catgirls solid fog wont be a good choice...

[Keld Denar]

Ah, but while Cloudkill specifically mentions that it is heavier than air, Solid Fog doesn't. That seems like pretty good evidence to me that the magic involved keeps it relatively fixed in location.