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ILM
2011-07-29, 09:05 AM
Wizard's treatment of direct damage spells leaves me wanting for a little more oomph without resorting to a Mailman build (which relies in great part on stacking metamagic reducers, which is something else I intend to tone down). This leads me to the following thoughts, which I'd like some feedback on.

Before I start, a few notes:
- I realize there's not much incentive to stay in the class for 20 levels as opposed to taking the prestige class option. This is done purposefully, in keeping with the other spellcasting classes released by WotC.
- Bear in mind I will also be nerfing metamagic reduction, possibly going as far as disallowing any two sources to stack or declaring that each reducer works off the total adjusted spell level and not each individual adjustment. I am yet undecided, but there will be no Twinned Maximized Repeating Admixtured Empowered Orbs, I assure you.
- I realize there are other elemental spellcasters on this board or elsewhere (one of which is probably only a couple threads below this one). I'm not looking to write an entire class, just houseruling existing material with as little intervention as possible.
- This aims to make a Warmage in a high tier 3, possibly lower tier 2 character depending on extra spell choices and feat selection (most notably, the Arcane Disciple trick still works on this modified version). If you find this to be high tier 2 or even tier 1 somehow, I have a problem.
- Please also offer any suggestions as to wording: I have tried keeping this as short as possible, meaning I haven't actually rewritten the entire abilities. If you think there's any room for misunderstanding from a RAW perspective, do mention it.

Onto the crunch:

Warmage / Wu-Jen (Complete Arcane)

These two classes are merged into the Warmage. The following characteristics are amended:

Spells: As printed, except a War Mage casts spells which are drawn from the sorcerer/wizard spell list. He is restricted to spells with an energy descriptor (Acid, Air, Cold, Earth, Electricity, Fire, Force, Sonic, Water). He still automatically knows all the spells of any level he has access to.

Normal: A Warmage is restricted to the Warmage spell list provided in CA.
Warmage Edge: Whenever a Warmage casts a spell that deals hit point damage, he adds his caster level divided by four, rounded up, and to a maximum of +5, to the amount of damage dealt per die i.e. a level 14 Warmage would deal an extra +4 points of damage per die. If he can split the damage die across targets, the bonus damage is also split accordingly. This bonus only applies to spells he casts as a Warmage, but not to those he might have by virtue of levels in another class (it does apply to spells he gains from advancing his Warmage spellcasting progression through a prestige class).

Normal: A Warmage addes his Intelligence bonus to the total hit point damage dealt by a spell. If the damage die can be split across targets, the bonus damage can only be applied to one of them, in its entirety.
Advanced Learning: At 3rd, 6th, 11th and 16th level, a Warmage can add any spell from the Sorcerer/Wizard list to his spells known, provided it is of a level no higher than the highest-level spell he can cast. Alternatively, a Warmage may select any metamagic feat he qualifies for. Alternatively, he may gain a cumulative +1 to the DC of any Warmage spell he casts.

Normal: A Warmage can only select Wizard spells from the Evocation school.

ILM
2011-07-31, 10:52 AM
... Anyone? Pretty please? :smallsmile:

Tvtyrant
2011-07-31, 10:53 PM
I'm confused on what the Wu-Jen part is. None of the crunch actually gives it any Wu-Jen abilities.

Darthteej
2011-08-01, 01:42 AM
I'm confused on what the Wu-Jen part is. None of the crunch actually gives it any Wu-Jen abilities.

Seconded. Wu-Jen's ONLY class features are spells and taboos.

jiriku
2011-08-01, 01:51 AM
Are you proposing gestalting the two, like this? I could get behind that. Although I'd suggest allowing any metamagic feat rather than forced selection of the Sudden feats. The only reason the Sudden metamagic feats are riveted into the class progression like that is because the class and the feats were both originally introduced together in Miniatures Handbook and the designers wanted a class to serve as a vehicle to showcase the feats.

TABLE: WARMAGE
{table=head]Level|Base Attack|Fort|Ref|Will|Special
1st|+0|+0|+0|+2|Armored mage (light), warmage edge, watchful spirit, bonus feat
2nd|+1|+0|+0|+3|
3rd|+1|+1|+1|+3|Advanced learning, spell secret
4th|+2|+1|+1|+4|
5th|+2|+1|+1|+4|
6th|+3|+2|+2|+5|Advanced learning, elemental mastery
7th|+3|+2|+2|+5|Sudden empower
8th|+4|+2|+2|+6|Armored mage (medium)
9th|+4|+3|+3|+6|Spell secret
10th|+5|+3|+3|+7|Sudden enlarge
11th|+5|+3|+3|+7|Advanced learning
12th|+6/+1|+4|+4|+8|Spell secret
13th|+6/+1|+4|+4|+8|
14th|+7/+2|+4|+4|+9|
15th|+7/+2|+5|+5|+9|Spell secret, sudden widen
16th|+8/+3|+5|+5|+10|Advanced learning
17th|+8/+3|+5|+5|+10|
18th|+9/+4|+6|+6|+11|Spell secret
19th|+9/+4|+6|+6|+11|
20th|+10/+5|+6|+6|+12|Sudden maximize[/table]

ILM
2011-08-01, 04:38 AM
Ah, sorry; no, no gestalt, just basically saying the new Warmage is what Wu-Jen becomes too. Before taboos and spell secrets, Wu-Jen is supposed to be the elemental blaster class, except it sucks and its spell list pretty much never got any additions after CA (which I think is kind of a **** move by WotC).

So basically, I'm scrapping Wu-Jen and for anyone that would have wanted to play one, I'm pointing at the new Warmage. Granted, there's some significant differences (most importantly, the casting stat) and some spells do get lost in the process, but I thought the basic idea - blasting - is close enough to justify it.

No biggie if you happen to disagree though; just assume I'm only updating the Warmage then :smallsmile:.

Vaynor
2011-08-02, 11:03 AM
Ah, sorry; no, no gestalt, just basically saying the new Warmage is what Wu-Jen becomes too. Before taboos and spell secrets, Wu-Jen is supposed to be the elemental blaster class, except it sucks and its spell list pretty much never got any additions after CA (which I think is kind of a **** move by WotC).

So basically, I'm scrapping Wu-Jen and for anyone that would have wanted to play one, I'm pointing at the new Warmage. Granted, there's some significant differences (most importantly, the casting stat) and some spells do get lost in the process, but I thought the basic idea - blasting - is close enough to justify it.

No biggie if you happen to disagree though; just assume I'm only updating the Warmage then :smallsmile:.

Actually, in the spell compendium it says that any spells may be added to the Wu Jen's spell list at the DM's discretion as long as they fit into the elemental theme (IIRC).

Edit: Here we go: "Wu Jen (Complete Arcane): Add spells with element (except air), wood, and metal themes."

Starsinger
2011-08-03, 03:58 AM
I like the new Warmage's Edge. Are you going to remake the Improved Warmage's Edge feat? Something like +1 total to your Warmage's edge and can go past the 5 cap?

ILM
2011-08-03, 05:46 AM
Actually, in the spell compendium it says that any spells may be added to the Wu Jen's spell list at the DM's discretion as long as they fit into the elemental theme (IIRC).

Edit: Here we go: "Wu Jen (Complete Arcane): Add spells with element (except air), wood, and metal themes."
I know, but that potentially means all sorts of discussions. I thought just expanding the list wasn't going to break the class anyway so I might as well ground it in the (new) rules. Also, element usually only refers to fire, cold and lightning; I tossed in the others as well.


I like the new Warmage's Edge. Are you going to remake the Improved Warmage's Edge feat? Something like +1 total to your Warmage's edge and can go past the 5 cap?
Ooh good point, I'll have to work on that. Your suggestion sounds fine; perhaps even a +2? (Cold Spell Specialization pretty much does the same, but you really have to work for it; on the other hand it's available to any caster while this is Warmage-only. Hmm.)