Assistance on Barbarian/Fighter build needed

[KingWinter]

Gentlemen, I could use some second opinions.

Our Barbarian player has moved to another city for a new job.
And as my Ranger bit the dust in the last session, I have decided to take up the role. I have made a Dwarf Barbarian3/Fighter6 character.

I have now finished my first draft of it, and I could like to know if there is something I should improve on.

For my statline, I rolled (to the groups laughter and disbelief) STR 22, DEX 18, CON 20, INT 12, WIS 10, CHA 7. This includes racial bonuses and additional points for leveling.

As our games has moved from the "social" part for now and has become more combat heavy, I decided to use my gold on the following:

+5 Mithral Full-plate. (With abilities I have +4max dex bonus and only -1 check penalty in addition to getting the +10 speed) Providing a total AC of 28.
+2 Elven Curveblade (With feat I crit on 15+)
Cold Iron Elven Curveblade
And a heavy wooden shield I almost never use (Heirloom of my clan)

For feats I have the following:
Step-up
Power attack
Cleave
Improved crit curveblade
Improved initiative
Toughness
Exotic wp proficiency curveblade
Extra rage
Weapon focus curveblade


So what do you think? Do you see something to improve or have better ideas on the build?
All C&C is welcome.

[grarrrg]

*in before "Use Tome of battle"*

[Cespenar]

If this character really represents the power level your group is generally about, use this. Otherwise, the optimizers will come and rip this build apart, since it's an extremely "weak" one.

[Rimeheart]

Not allowed to use the prestige class frenzied berserker?

Also, is curveblade one handed? If it is one handed... could potentially turn your self into a two weapon fighting build. Won't benefit from power attack...but with your crit range.

[KingWinter]

If this character really represents the power level your group is generally about, use this. Otherwise, the optimizers will come and rip this build apart, since it's an extremely "weak" one.

Well, I hope they do.
I made this character with the resources I have available. The Pathfinder core rulebook and the advanced players guide. And I am asking for help to improve the build or maybe find some better alternatives.

The nature of the campaign we are playing, is that we are a group of dwarves, who are the first to leave our keep, outliving an ice-age.

Now we have ended up in the middle of a war between religious fanatics defending their ruin-city from a barbarian horde...
Ti'll now we've been playing for both sides, to benefit ourselves. (aka pressing our luck). We have a cleric, a sorcerer, a cavalier and a rogue/wizard.

I'm sure my gm will allow quite a few things from the 3,5 books. Though I do not have them myself. Though I have friends I can borrow just about all of them from.

I'll have a look into the "Frenzied Berserker", sounds interesting :)

EDIT: got answer from my GM 2 minutes ago. Quote: "Frenzied berserker? Is that when you're preactically invulnerable when you rage?" "Yeeeees....?"
"How about....hmm....NO."

:(

[Keld Denar]

There really isn't a big difference between your Dex and Con, so at this point my usual suggestion of Deepwarden is kinda lackluster.

Question: What about this character are you ABLE to change? Class levels? Feats? Skill points?

I'm guessing that what you call an Elven Curveblade is actually a Courtblade. Thats fine, just confirming.

If it is, consider downgrading from the Courtblade to the Thinblade. Its the Longsword equivalent, rather than the Greatsword equivalent. It'll do slightly lower damage, but check this out. CWarrior has a really short PrC called Exotic Weapon Master. One of the tricks of EWM is Uncanny Blow, which allows you to get 2x Str bonus when wielding a 1handed exotic weapon in both hands. You actually probably already qualify for the class, given that you have EWP and WF with the weapon. That'll boost your damage an extra 3 points with your current Str value (4 while raging), and an extra +2 Str from that point will result in +2 more damage, rather than +1.5. Its a very lightweight easy addition to your character.

EDIT: Don't worry about Frenzied Zerker. Its strong, but IMO it lands into the realm of too strong. Things you touch disintegrate, and unless you build one VERY carefully with regards to your Will save, some of those things you'll touch are your allies. Thats generally perceived as a "bad thing".

[KingWinter]

There really isn't a big difference between your Dex and Con, so at this point my usual suggestion of Deepwarden is kinda lackluster.

Question: What about this character are you ABLE to change? Class levels? Feats? Skill points?

I'm guessing that what you call an Elven Curveblade is actually a Courtblade. Thats fine, just confirming.

If it is, consider downgrading from the Courtblade to the Thinblade. Its the Longsword equivalent, rather than the Greatsword equivalent. It'll do slightly lower damage, but check this out. CWarrior has a really short PrC called Exotic Weapon Master. One of the tricks of EWM is Uncanny Blow, which allows you to get 2x Str bonus when wielding a 1handed exotic weapon in both hands. You actually probably already qualify for the class, given that you have EWP and WF with the weapon. That'll boost your damage an extra 3 points with your current Str value (4 while raging), and an extra +2 Str from that point will result in +2 more damage, rather than +1.5. Its a very lightweight easy addition to your character.

EDIT: Don't worry about Frenzied Zerker. Its strong, but IMO it lands into the realm of too strong. Things you touch disintegrate, and unless you build one VERY carefully with regards to your Will save, some of those things you'll touch are your allies. Thats generally perceived as a "bad thing".

Hi. At this point I am creating a new character, so I can change whatever I want. Even gear. Since it is hard to find a good enchanter in-game, I chose to spend a lot on the armour to begin with. And maybe get better enchants on my weapons as I go.

The curveblade is a two-hander. it's like a bastard sword but with better crit.

The deep-warden sounde quite nice. I can more-or-less skip dex, and move it somewhere else. And I can also skip the mithril plate for something which becomes cheaper and better.

I appreciate your advice :) And if you have the time, I'd love to hear more of your ideas on how to build/play it.

[Cespenar]

You can always consider the Dungeoncrasher alternate class feature for the Fighter, from the book Dungeonscape. Trading away your 2nd and 6th level Fighter bonus feats, you gain some bonuses against traps, breaking things, and most importantly, you gain the ability to inflict lots of damage if you bull rush an opponent into a solid object. 8d6 + (three times your Str modifier) kind of damage.

[Keld Denar]

Ah, so you can do a complete rebuild. I like it. You wanna hear a little trick I learned a while back for a good non-ToB dwarf character?

Start with 1 level of Ranger. Just 1, you need the skill points.

Then tack on 2 levels of Fighter. You need the feats

Then add 2 levels of Barbarian. Cause you need 2 full BAB levels, and...why not?

That'll qualify you for Deepwarden. Take 2 levels of that for Stonewarden. This allows you to dump Dex and pump Con.

For your weapon, use a Dwarven Urgrosh. Don't laugh, hear me out. Its a double weapon, but nothing in the rules says you have to use it AS a double weapon. You CAN use it as a 2handed weapon wielded in both hands. Sure, it'll do a little less damage than a Greataxe (d8 vs d12), but here's the trick. Exotic Weapon Master's Flurry of Strikes ability states that when you are using a double weapon or spiked chain, you can make an extra attack at highest BAB, but all other attacks suffer a -2 to hit. Kinda like a Monk's Flurry of Blows ability, except that instead of a piddly little fist, you have a big 2handed Power Attacking SoB to the face. Damage increases geometrically with # of attacks, so this combined with Haste will give you 3 strong hits at what is nearly full BAB.

Other misc things. You need Endurance to qualify for Deepwarden. You also need Endurance to qualify for Steadfast Determination (PHBII). So...why not take Steadfast Determination! That allows you to dump Wisdom without a hit to your Will save. That leaves you dependant on only 2 stats...Str and Con.

So, all in all: Ranger1/Fighter2/Barbarian2/Deepwarden2/EWM1

From there, you have a couple of options. I personally like 5 levels of Occult Slayer. You get a few nice bonuses from it. Its not a mage "slayer" class, its a mage "resistor" class. The Spell Reflection is kinda nice, but the wording needs a slight change to "immediate action" rather than "free action", since technically you can only use free actions on your own turn, and its not very useful otherwise. The personal Mind Blank, however, is the real gem, because at high levels, Charles' always tryin' ta get in yer head. The other abilities are kinda fun, but not overly amazing.

All that is pretty moot, however, if you can use Tome of Battle. If so, just play a straight Warblade9 or Crusader9 for all your dorfy tanky goodness.

Also, one last thing...don't get Mith Full Plate +5. Yea, the extra 4 points of AC are nice, but look in BoED for the Soulfire enchant. Mith Full Plate +1 Soulfire is the same price and gives you PERMANENT immunity to negative energy and [Death] effects while you wear it. [Death] effects will kill you to death, and most negative level energy drain effects don't allow an initial save to resist it. Keep those spectres away!

[Ardantis]

I agree. Dungeoncrasher gives you damage bonuses which go above and beyond your weapon, and all you need is an enemy and a wall in which to bull rush him.

With Dungeoncrasher, consider the Shock Trooper tactical feat from Complete Warrior. With it, you can bull rush enemies into each other, and then you get to trip them. Fun feat. It requires Improved Bull Rush, and Power Attack, but IBR helps with Dungeoncrasher a lot so it's a great synergy.

You'll have to discuss with your DM whether or not the guy you bullrushed can trip another guy and then keep going, then hitting a wall for Dungeoncrasher damage.

Anyways, my two cents.

[Metahuman1]

If you have Tome of battle, a single dip into Warblade would be nice since you get Iron Heart Surge as an emergency bail out. A 1 lvl dip in swordsage will give you the ability to defend yourself if disarmed, which helps the awesome warrior image.

Unearthed Arcana gives you whirling Frenzy, which stacks with the above trick for getting extra attacks.

Complete Champion let's you loose the fast movement for pounce. Which is good in conjution with being able to close and hit them fast and hard. Also works well for Dungeon Crasher.

If you go Dungeon Crasher, look at Races of Stone, as Knock Back and Rampaging Bulls rush might be helpful.

And Dungeonscape also gives you the Trap killer AFC, which let's you act as a the party's Trap Monkey when not in combat.

[Tvtyrant]

Dungeoncrasher+Cube of Force+Cohort to use it. They make a wall, you smack people into it.

[Delcor]

I was just curious as to how you bought a +5 mithril full plate and still had money left over with the wealth of a 9th lvl character?

[tacho101]

it all depends on where you wanna take the character,

if you wanna make full use of your stellar con, and forget armor, dip 2x into deep warden as stated, and then ddip into fist of the forest from complete champion. with your con as it is that would be a +10 to your AC, and to top it off, bear warrior it from complete warrior for ridiculous strength bonuses.

if your planning on staying more barbarian, go for a charge build, ferocity (rage) from cityscape, which ups your dex and strength instead of con, better initiative, better ac. top it of with ACF Street fighter from the same book, and you have a charger that can turn and charge like 4x his speed, and increased crit range on charged and flat footed opponents. it all depends on what you want to do

[KingWinter]

Thanks a lot for all the help and good ideas :)
I asked my GM for his opinion on these ideas and he allowed me to use the idea Keld Denar presented.
And in addition, I manged to get enough skill points needed without taking the extra class of Ranger.

So now, I feel I have a far stronger character to play with :)