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View Full Version : [3.x] Balance and Tumble vs. Acrobatics



Ashtagon
2011-08-02, 02:09 AM
I'm considering merging these two skills into one (a la PF). However, before I do so, I was wondering if there are any convincing arguments for not doing so.

I've already decided not to merge Climb and Swim into Athletics, since it is quite easy to find examples of creatures who can do one and not the other, but I'm not so sure about Balance and Tumble.

So, arguments for and against?

lesser_minion
2011-08-02, 02:37 AM
As written, isn't Tumble technically one of the strongest skills already?

I don't see any other problems, but you'd probably have to bring your nerf bat along.

nonsi
2011-08-02, 02:38 AM
This is why (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAVj2IVC9ko).

Incredible balance - no tumbling.

Circle of Life
2011-08-02, 02:45 AM
For: People will actually have ranks in balance now. This could also be taken as an against, depending on how many devious laughs you get out of tripping half the party in a grease spell. :smallwink:

Against: You're making tumble even more obvious a skill choice.

Suggestion: Nerf the tumble aspect hard.

Merk
2011-08-02, 07:53 AM
Edit: Roll them together and do not nerf tumble. You could also merge Climb and Swim (and maybe Ride) into Athletics (Str, ACP).

Ashtagon
2011-08-02, 08:02 AM
Edit: Roll them together and do not nerf tumble. You could also merge Climb and Swim (and maybe Ride) into Athletics (Str, ACP).

I've already stated I'm not making Athletics a skill, and why.

I'm not interested in blind support, so much as reasoning for why I should pick a choice.

I'm also very much NOT in the "minimise the total number of skills" camp, unless there are specific reasons for each merging.

Merk
2011-08-02, 08:22 AM
I've already stated I'm not making Athletics a skill, and why.

I'm not interested in blind support, so much as reasoning for why I should pick a choice.

I'm also very much NOT in the "minimise the total number of skills" camp, unless there are specific reasons for each merging.

Whoops, I missed that.

Tumble is practical low-level mobility for mundane folk, and Balance 5 ranks = Protection against Grease. The people who need these advantages the most (melee combatants) either just plain don't have many skill points to begin with (fighters, monks), or do have a good number of skill points but also have strong demands on where those skill points need to be allocated (rogues).

Rolling them together extends Balance beyond a 5 rank wonder. Maybe adding a slight scaling difficulty to Tumbling would be okay, but not to the extent that (like in Pathfinder) it stops being a great mobility tool.

Edit: That said, Balance and Tumbling are different enough in function that it would be inconsistent to group them together while separating the Athletics functions. So from an "It makes sense" perspective, separating Balance and Tumble may be more what you're going for. My arguments are more metagame-oriented.