The New Spiderman?!

[Arrowhead]

I don't know about you, but when I found out that Marvel has killed off Peter Parker in its latest comic to be replaced by another young man, I was actually a little angry. I asked myself "Why can't they just make another hero?" After a bit of thought I realized its all about the money. A new hero does not guarantee cash flow, but KILLING OFF a favorite hero of millions across several generations is SURE to sell comics.

The race/ethnicity of the new Spiderman not withstanding, what are YOUR thoughts? Will it be good for the franchise but bad for the universe? Will this start off another alternate Marvel universe (I think they have like 6 by now) or will it be canon for every Marvel comic in the future? Coming from a woman that only became interested in another hero besides Nightcrawler of the X-Men at 18 (I am now 21), this may sounds like over-reacting. But I'm not just reacting for myself- I'm reacting for the other Spidey lovers. SPEAK, MY BRETHREN!

[KillianHawkeye]

I remember everybody was pissed off when Peter and Mary Jane got divorced a few years ago, too. Haven't heard anything else about it lately, though.

[Mauve Shirt]

I'm no expert, I've only read a few comics, but I can't imagine the death of a character like Peter Parker sticking.

[Zevox]

I don't actually care about Spider Man myself, but something worth noting in case you weren't aware: the killed-and-replaced Spider Man was Ultimate Spider Man, not the main Marvel continuity Spider Man.

Zevox

[Axolotl]

Spider-Man died in 2007 as far as I'm concerned.

Besides they'll just bring him back in a few years anyway. Then they'll either kill the new one or give him a redesign and a new name.

[leafman]

I would say that this is only temporary. Pete has "died" a several times now in the Marvel 616 Universe. It is important to note that the Peter Parker you're referring to is Ultimate Spidey, but I think that once the writers have played out their little fantasy of "what if Spidey was half black/half hispanic?" Peter will come back somehow.

Just remember, in comics, the hero is rarely ever permanently dead.

[Selrahc]

I would say that this is only temporary. Pete has "died" a several times now in the Marvel 616 Universe. It is important to note that the Peter Parker you're referring to is Ultimate Spidey, but I think that once the writers have played out their little fantasy of "what if Spidey was half black/half hispanic?" Peter will come back somehow.

Just remember, in comics, the hero is rarely ever permanently dead.

Bendis has been writing this comic for the past 11 years. There isn't going to be a changeover in writers pulling to return to the status quo. This is an alternate universe, so there won't be the corporate pressure to return to the status quo.

Could stick for quite a while. Probably as long as the Ultimate Universe does.

[Lord Raziere]

eh, peter parker is a little too iconic and stuck to the spiderman concept, too intrinsic. I can't imagine Spiderman not being Peter, its like....imagining Bruce Wayne being Superman, its just wrong....

so yeah, Pete will come back.

[Mauve Shirt]

I'm no expert, I've only read a few comics, but I can't imagine the death of a character like Peter Parker sticking.

[leafman]

Bendis has been writing this comic for the past 11 years. There isn't going to be a changeover in writers pulling to return to the status quo. This is an alternate universe, so there won't be the corporate pressure to return to the status quo.

Could stick for quite a while. Probably as long as the Ultimate Universe does.

What I meant was that when Bendis gets bored with the concept he'll bring Peter back.

[Traab]

Wasnt there a replacement spiderman? The Red Spider or something stupid like that? He had on a jean jacket over his spider suit iirc.

[comicshorse]

Wasnt there a replacement spiderman? The Red Spider or something stupid like that? He had on a jean jacket over his spider suit iirc.

The Scarlet Spider I think. That was Peter Parker's clone (no I'm serious)

[Traab]

The Scarlet Spider I think. That was Peter Parker's clone (no I'm serious)

Yeah thats the one, and I thought it was a clone, sort of like the mary jane hydro clone. Im used to really odd stuff happening in that series.

[Tirian]

I can't believe that they killed Peter Parker (even in an alternate reality) and it isn't splashed all over Google News like something that matters.

[Lord Seth]

I remember everybody was pissed off when Peter and Mary Jane got divorced a few years ago, too. Haven't heard anything else about it lately, though.I don't think they got divorced, though I'll admit I don't keep up too much with Spider-Man. What you're probably thinking of is One More Day, in which their marriage got erased from existence. It was that, along with the way it was done, that got people angry.

[Devonix]

I don't think they got divorced, though I'll admit I don't keep up too much with Spider-Man. What you're probably thinking of is One More Day, in which their marriage got erased from existence. It was that, along with the way it was done, that got people angry.

If they got divorced fans wouldn't have been as upset. We were upset that the comic had Pete and MJ making a deal with the devil sacrificing their marrage together to have said devil save aunt May's life. :smallfurious:

[Lord Raziere]

I can't believe that they killed Peter Parker (even in an alternate reality) and it isn't splashed all over Google News like something that matters.

The Colbert Report covered it at least...

[KillianHawkeye]

I don't think they got divorced, though I'll admit I don't keep up too much with Spider-Man. What you're probably thinking of is One More Day, in which their marriage got erased from existence. It was that, along with the way it was done, that got people angry.


If they got divorced fans wouldn't have been as upset. We were upset that the comic had Pete and MJ making a deal with the devil sacrificing their marrage together to have said devil save aunt May's life. :smallfurious:

Ah, okay. I don't read the comics, I just remember hearing something about it.

[Mando Knight]

If they got divorced fans wouldn't have been as upset. We were upset that the comic had Pete and MJ making a deal with the devil sacrificing their marrage together to have said devil save aunt May's life. :smallfurious:

They didn't just sacrifice their marriage (one of the iconic generally-happily-married couples in comics, by the way), their deal made it un-happen. For an old woman whose main schtick outside of dating Doc Ock and providing Peter with a safety net is to repeatedly become terminally ill.

[Tazar]

No way he stays permanently dead. This is a comic book, nobody ever stays dead.

[Warpwolf16]

If this was to take place in main canon I'd be upset but since its Ultimate Spiderman I've got no problem with it. People who commented on the marriage of Mary Jane and Peter Parker was caused by the deal with Mephistos, the deal was Aunt Mays life for their happiness. Mephistos has always been the guy who hated happiness and rebellion.

I also want to note there are more then one spiderman characters through out the marvel universe. I'm not just talking about carbon copies of Peter Parker or any of his clones. This also applies to spinderwomen as well, maybe even spider girl.

[Arrowhead]

I don't actually care about Spider Man myself, but something worth noting in case you weren't aware: the killed-and-replaced Spider Man was Ultimate Spider Man, not the main Marvel continuity Spider Man.

Zevox

Yes, I did see that, but thank you anyway. ^-^


I can't believe that they killed Peter Parker (even in an alternate reality) ...

I know right?! I mean I know DC slaughtered Superman like 80 bajillion times but still... Spiderman? Really?



I also want to note there are more then one spiderman characters through out the marvel universe. I'm not just talking about carbon copies of Peter Parker or any of his clones. This also applies to spiderwomen as well, maybe even spider girl.

This is true. I wonder why this time its so..dramatic.

Leafman, how many universes are there? Are there really over 600 variations of the Marvel Universe? Which one is The House of M in? What about the Civil- the one where the super heroes had to sign up with the government? o_o

[Dr.Epic]

Dude, it's comics. No one ever dies. There's cloning, alternate realities, time travel, and the underworld. The original Ultimate Peter Parker can easily return.

[erikun]

And here, I came into the thread expecting to talk about he new movies.


The race/ethnicity of the new Spiderman not withstanding, what are YOUR thoughts?
Honestly, I can't be that surprised. After cancelling Spider-Girl and the whole One More Day fiasco (which both retconned their marriage and Spider-Girl) I pretty much gave up on expecting them to handle it well. This strikes me very much as a Captain America 2.0 move, hoping to increase news and sales with Spidey's death. Somehow, it doesn't seem to be working all that well. :smallannoyed:


the killed-and-replaced Spider Man was Ultimate Spider Man, not the main Marvel continuity Spider Man.
Ah, that makes more sense. But isn't the whole Ultimate Marvel universe full of jerks that most people don't care much about? Perhaps killing and replacing Ultimate Parker was a move to introduce a more sympathetic character, not to mention trivia and an extra bonus character for future Spider-Man games.


I have to wonder why there was randomly a guy with spider-like powers that just happens to put on his suit after he dies, though. Then again, we're talking about Marvel comics, so perhaps I shouldn't be too surprised.

[Mewtarthio]

You don't understand, guys! The Ultimate Universe is different! That's one of the big draws: In the Ultimate continuity, people stay oh I can't keep a straight face anymore. :smallbiggrin:

[Viking_Mage]

While Ultimate Peter Parker's death does not bother me, after all, this isn't my Spider-Man, what does bother me is the shoddy story-telling of the replacement.

And no, I don't care that the new Spider-Man is a minority, in fact, it might actually strengthen the every-man nature of the character. At least several writers and critics have said one of the strengths of the character is that it could be anyone under that mask.

But, Bendis dropped this character in with absolutely zero foreshadowing. If he had introduced this Miles Morales (which is actually a good name and I like it), before Parker's demise, it would've been better. The real biter is that there was another minority character in the universe that easily had the canon history and the in-universe means to take the mantle - Ben Reilly. In the Ultimate Continuity, Reilly is an African-American scientist! who had previously been seen with a sample of Parker's DNA and a bit of one of the symbiotes.

Of course, this is symptomatic of Bendis's writing in general - big and flashy, but often lacking in tighter storytelling.

[comicshorse]

Leafman, how many universes are there? Are there really over 600 variations of the Marvel Universe? Which one is The House of M in? What about the Civil- the one where the super heroes had to sign up with the government? o_o

I'm no expert but I think there are 616 alternate universes, which is why the main Marvel Universe is refered to as 616.

House of M was in the main universe, but was then magically changed so it never happened. Civil War was in the main universe as well and did happen, leading into the whole Dark Reign storyline

[Somebloke]

I personally have no issue with a non-white Spider-man, or a non-Parker Spider-man outside of normal canon.

That being said, if this guy turns into a Jaime Reyes expy there will be blood.

[Yanagi]

This is true. I wonder why this time its so..dramatic.

It's not so much the event as the reaction to the event which is making it trend. One media commentator said something, so a bunch of other people made their own comments--so basically a self-inflating bubble. Here's a link to a ComicBookAlliance article that summarizes. (http://www.comicsalliance.com/2011/08/04/drudge-report-thinks-new-spider-man-could-be-gay-glenn-beck-a/)

[leafman]

Leafman, how many universes are there? Are there really over 600 variations of the Marvel Universe? Which one is The House of M in? What about the Civil- the one where the super heroes had to sign up with the government? o_o

Yes and no. The designation 616 implies that there are at least 615 other universes, but the guys who came up with the idea at Marvel decided to start at a high number rather than 1 to be different than DC; the actual number is not significant. There are probably less than 300 alternate universes that have been seen in the comics, most of them being from "What If?" miniseries and oneshots.

[Mutant Sheep]

My favorite Spider Man death was when he was impregnanted by the actually-part spider woman, then died. Way he came back was AWESOME though.:smallcool: (crawls out of his dead body with ORGANIC webslingers, making a terrible comment.)

[Jerthanis]

Well, Ultimate Comics are all kinds of messed up these days. I can't think of even a handful of Mutants who are still alive... (Kitty Pryde... Storm?... Uh...) Hawkeye is a psychopath or dead, Hank Pym was a madman and is dead, Janet is dead, Cyclops, Wolverine and Magneto are dead, I think ironically Jean Grey might still be alive, Dr. Doom is dead, I think the Green Goblin is dead... and the Ultimate Universe is a place where death has tended to be more final than mainstream continuity.

I would really have to wrack my brain to think of characters who are still alive at all. So as far as I can tell, they've got to start coming up with new characters anyway, which might have been a better idea for the Ultimate Universe in the first place... instead of Peter Parker, maybe it should've been Samuel Gray (name picked at random): Spider-Man, whose origin story involves a different call to action than inadvertently causing his uncle to be killed by a burgler. Have Mutants and the same Mutant issues we're familiar with, but have the X-Men be a totally new cast of characters, perhaps even with a new and different Professor X... I just don't see why they had to kill dozens of alternate universe versions of familiar characters over the course of 10 years first.

As far as One More Day goes: I hear main continuity Peter Parker is now dating a girl named after Joe Quesada's daughter. He couldn't make the editorial mandate felt more strongly if he tried I think. (Or made to look that way by writers perhaps? Who knows? Conspiracy theory speculation is always valid evidence!)

I think that when Mary Jane first appeared in comics, she was supposed to play the bad-girl spoiler to the One True Love of Gwen Stacy... but Gwen Stacy was always written as a "Love Interest" in those days and had no personality, while Mary Jane was written as her own character from the start. In her introduction comic, she practically exploded off the page with energy, proclaiming, "I am going to be important, people are going to look at me and say, "Wow"..." (or something like that) She was written with her own qualities and character in mind, rather than merely as a plot device, and because of that, her friendship with Peter developed more naturally than any other relationship Peter ever had. The writers have always to some extent been against Mary Jane being the One, but every time they've tried to get in the way, it seems as if the characters themselves stand up and say, "No." (to say nothing of the fans)

One of my favorite things in the House of M subplot was that Peter Parker was married to a Gwen Stacey who hadn't died... it seems at first as if it undermines his love for Mary Jane... since his greatest wish is to be married to another woman. What really happened, though, is that his greatest wish was to have not failed to save Gwen Stacey, and marriage was simply inevitable in that instance. It's clear from one scene in particular that even in this world, his true feelings lie with Watson.



Ah, that makes more sense. But isn't the whole Ultimate Marvel universe full of jerks that most people don't care much about? Perhaps killing and replacing Ultimate Parker was a move to introduce a more sympathetic character, not to mention trivia and an extra bonus character for future Spider-Man games.

To ME this was part of Ultimate Spider-Man's charm... he was actually the first of the new generation of heroes, and to a large extent he's the one who decided it was going to be a generation of Super Heroes. Everyone else began to capitalize on his success and forged themselves into jerkface celebrities... but meanwhile Peter Parker was still plugging away as kind of a good guy with a certain degree of humility. His biggest jerk moments were just when he was calling everyone else on their hypocrisy.

[Zoomba]

I'm just going to wait and see what happens before passing judgment on it. Overall though, I'm fine with Ultimate Peter Parker dying. Brian Bendis' run on Ultimate Spider-man has been pretty much the only thing holding the entire line together for years now and I'm willing to give the man the benefit of the doubt.

Also, I expect this actually will stick for at least longer than most heroes these days (I used to say everyone gets ressurected in 5 years but lately it's been happening even quicker). the only Ultimate rebirth I can think of is Gwen, and the weird circumstances they used to justify it are nothing like Peter's demise via gunshot and beatdown.

[erikun]

To ME this was part of Ultimate Spider-Man's charm... he was actually the first of the new generation of heroes, and to a large extent he's the one who decided it was going to be a generation of Super Heroes. Everyone else began to capitalize on his success and forged themselves into jerkface celebrities... but meanwhile Peter Parker was still plugging away as kind of a good guy with a certain degree of humility. His biggest jerk moments were just when he was calling everyone else on their hypocrisy.
So, basically, Marvel decided to kill off the only decent person in the Ultimate universe for the sake of drama? That's just about what I would expect.

[slayerx]

There's a good chance spider man will stay dead...
If this were the mainstream universe you could guarantee he'd be back in a couple of years, but this is the ultimate universe which plays by different rules. Characters who die in the ultimate universe tend to stay dead. Hell the fact that wolverine of all people is still dead is representative of that.


Well, Ultimate Comics are all kinds of messed up these days. I can't think of even a handful of Mutants who are still alive... (Kitty Pryde... Storm?... Uh...) Hawkeye is a psychopath or dead, Hank Pym was a madman and is dead, Janet is dead, Cyclops, Wolverine and Magneto are dead, I think ironically Jean Grey might still be alive, Dr. Doom is dead, I think the Green Goblin is dead... and the Ultimate Universe is a place where death has tended to be more final than mainstream continuity.

I would really have to wrack my brain to think of characters who are still alive at all. So as far as I can tell, they've got to start coming up with new characters anyway...

Y'know thinking about it, i wonder if that's what Marvels planning...
Think about it, the whole purpose of the ultimate universe was to attract new readers by giving them comics that did not have DECADES of continuity behind them. Not a bad theory, but the only problem is that everything is relative; the longer the ultimate universe lasts the more continuity there is to catch up on. Right now there is about 10 years worth of continuity... though it would take time, the ultimate universe would eventually fall into the trap that the mainstream universe is stuck in

But maybe this is part of why they have allowed deaths and are letting the characters STAY dead. by letting them die once and for all they can put a finish to that characters story and move on; they won't have the chance to build up decades of continuity. Any new readers who want to read about them can do just that... meanwhile in the main marvel universe the old heroes gradually get replaced by the new. Anyone who wants to read about the new spiderman can read about him without needing to worry about the past 10 years of ultimate continuity.


Though my problem with the ultimate universe is how they handle the deaths... While spiderman went out fighting, many ultimate heroes went out with a "blah"... their deaths felt so utterly pointless and meaningless and did not do justice to such iconic characters

[Zoomba]

Though my problem with the ultimate universe is how they handle the deaths... While spiderman went out fighting, many ultimate heroes went out with a "blah"... their deaths felt so utterly pointless and meaningless and did not do justice to such iconic characters

Except that these versions of the characters aren't iconic. Most of them aren't even likeable. The reason Ultimate Spider-Man died in the first place is that while every other hero was getting into a pissing-contest and slugging it out in public, Spider-Man was the only character actually going around trying to be a hero and save lives.

That's my problem with the Ultimate Universe: the vast majority of the writers have taken the opportunity to tell new and continuity-free stories as an excuse to take a grittier and realistic look as to how such heroes would function, and as a result most of these characters come out looking like jerls or worse.

[Tenno Seremel]

Well, Ultimate Comics are all kinds of messed up these days. I can't think of even a handful of Mutants who are still alive...

Isn't the main universe is where you die and silently replaced by a clone or alternate version of you and everyone carries on? I'm not sure it is any better.

[Jerthanis]

Except that these versions of the characters aren't iconic. Most of them aren't even likeable. The reason Ultimate Spider-Man died in the first place is that while every other hero was getting into a pissing-contest and slugging it out in public, Spider-Man was the only character actually going around trying to be a hero and save lives.

That's my problem with the Ultimate Universe: the vast majority of the writers have taken the opportunity to tell new and continuity-free stories as an excuse to take a grittier and realistic look as to how such heroes would function, and as a result most of these characters come out looking like jerls or worse.

I think part of the problem was that The Ultimates were written intentionally "Big, loud and action packed"... I think they for some reason went with an intentional "Michael Bay" feel, and it was supposed to just be the flavor of that title, with USM still the flagship of the continuity. I think it then infected Ultimate X-Men and shortly afterwards Ultimate Fantastic Four, then started making additional crossover nightmares which all seemed like the Ultimates until "Big, loud and action packed" was the entire universe... except for USM.

My point is, Ultimates wasn't really an "Ongoing" title interested in building its characters or relationships, and it was intended to be a sequestered idea, but this style spread to everything else and became the continuity. It was a bad idea that snowballed into taking everything with it.


Isn't the main universe is where you die and silently replaced by a clone or alternate version of you and everyone carries on? I'm not sure it is any better.

I'm not sure how often this REALLY happens. I mean... Tony Stark was engaged in some shenanigans in the 90s involving alternate universe teenage versions of himself merging with his consciousness and being repeatedly resurrected by Franklin Richards, but that was a whole thing which was just embarrassing and no one really talks about it anymore.

I think the times it HAS happened have been so stand-out restupitarded that it colors peoples' impressions of the whole of comics.

[Friv]

My reaction to Ultimate Spider-Man's death: Meh.


Yes and no. The designation 616 implies that there are at least 615 other universes, but the guys who came up with the idea at Marvel decided to start at a high number rather than 1 to be different than DC; the actual number is not significant. There are probably less than 300 alternate universes that have been seen in the comics, most of them being from "What If?" miniseries and oneshots.

Actually, there have been a freaking ton of alternate universes that have shown up. The highest-numbered Marvel Earth to show up so far, according to Wikipedia, is Earth-1789002, implying that there are several million alternate realities. I feel like Exiles alone (which was a great comic for a while, before inevitably catching Marvelitis and becoming not good) must have covered a hundred or so.

[Tenno Seremel]

I think the times it HAS happened have been so stand-out restupitarded that it colors peoples' impressions of the whole of comics.

Well, yes. Even if I no longer follow this universe (as a whole) and can't really name a single character that has suffered from it I still have those lingering *cough* impressions.

[Traab]

I think half the spiderman cast has been cloned at one point or another. Didnt they clone superman at one point? I know they cloned supergirl, Galatea. I think some bad guys have also been cloned, lex luthor had clones of himself made at one point right?

[ArlEammon]

If they make Ororo Monroe a Blonde, Blue eyed Aryan from Germany then I won't care about Peter Parker being Latino.

[Kindablue]

I think half the spiderman cast has been cloned at one point or another. Didnt they clone superman at one point? I know they cloned supergirl, Galatea. I think some bad guys have also been cloned, lex luthor had clones of himself made at one point right?

Yeah, Conner Kent is a genetically engineered clone of Superman and Luthor.

[Friv]

If they make Ororo Monroe a Blonde, Blue eyed Aryan from Germany then I won't care about Peter Parker being Latino.

False dichotomy. There are already a vast number of white superheroes. The reason people want to turn more of the major ones into minorities is because the major ones have an existing following, and thus are less likely to get cancelled after a week.

It worked quite well for DC (at least, until they started a wave of slaughtering minorities to return the originals to existence. That had some unintentional implications, there.)

*EDIT* Also, X-Men has two other issues - first, it has always been one of the best comics for the purposes of having minority characters who are interesting people, and second, a large number of its characters actually draw concept and nature from their origins. I'd be less suspicious of turning Jubilee white, because her Chinese heritage is essentially a non-part of her character.

[Elrik]

Rumor has it that Bendis was making a homage to Don Glover, who was rumored to be Spiderman for the next franchise a few years back.

I'm not really a fan of "legacy minority characters" simply because it feels like a minority character needs to ride off the legacy of a famous (white) hero, but Black Panther and Luke Cage don't seem to be very popular as minorities without a legacy ID. So I guess this is a better way to create diversity and make it stick, which is nice (considering how hard it is to name even a few Marvel/DC minority characters that sell well).

[Friv]

and the Ultimate Universe is a place where death has tended to be more final than mainstream continuity.

I have to take a moment here to say that Ultimate X-Men made it clear that there's no functioning editorial mandate to this effect, and that anyone who is dead will stay dead until one week after a new writer decides he likes them.

Pre-Ultimatum, Ultimate X-Men lasted 97 issues. In that time, the following characters died and were returned to life:

* Magneto (it turned out his death was psychically faked)
* Sabretooth (really weirdly, too, as upon his return he switched sides from Weapon X to the Brotherhood, and no one commented on this at all, nor did they comment on his revival, despite the fact that they referenced the battle that killed him).
* Hammerhead (returned in Ultimate Spider-Man with no explanation)
* The Hellfire Club as an organization (might be cheating a bit here)
* Psylocke (psychically took over a dead girl's body forever after her death)
* Cyclops (Believed dead, and then turned out to have just been badly hurt the next issue)
* Sabretooth again (beheaded, and then returned unharmed later. With his healing factor, though, this one can be potentially excused. But they thought he was dead.)
* Beast (killed by a Sentinel, buried, and then it turned out his death was faked somehow. Not sure on the details, his return is about where I gave up).
* Mr. Sinister (although only the moment before his death was shown off-panel, so the retcon twenty issues later to it merely being a failed suicide attempt is very slightly believable.)
* Professor X (death faked by Cable)
* Wolfsbane (killed by Sentinels, resurrected by Phoenix five issues later)
* Bolivar Trask (see above)
* Angel (killed at the beginning of a storyline, resurrected by Phoenix at the end of the same storyline)
* Northstar (killed by drugs, then turned out to only be crippled)

That's 13 character resurrections in 97 issues, or an average of one return from the dead every seven months. And that's not counting the Morlocks, who died and were resurrected en masse, or the Hellfire Club's revival after the Phoenix supposedly wiped out its entire membership with her omnipotent powers.

What I'm saying is, for a setting designed for death to stick, Ultimate Marvel was actually worse than its progenitor. Find me another single comic where 13 people have come back to life in a given eight-year period.

*EDIT*


I'm not really a fan of "legacy minority characters" simply because it feels like a minority character needs to ride off the legacy of a famous (white) hero, but Black Panther and Luke Cage don't seem to be very popular as minorities without a legacy ID. So I guess this is a better way to create diversity and make it stick, which is nice (considering how hard it is to name even a few Marvel/DC minority characters that sell well).

Well, the core of the problem is that nearly every popular character in Marvel or DC comics was created in the 60s or earlier, when there were no minorities, and new superheroes almost never succeed these days - in large part because there are so many existing popular ones that the market is crowded. So if you want diversity, you can either have a constant stable of rotating minorities that you drop whenever they stop being popular, or you can go for a legacy character and replace an older character with a new minority. (And then get accused of racism years later when a writer tries to reverse the change to bring back the hero they grew up with.)

[Avilan the Grey]

You don't understand, guys! The Ultimate Universe is different! That's one of the big draws: In the Ultimate continuity, people stay oh I can't keep a straight face anymore. :smallbiggrin:

Hey, Ultimate Spiderman was one of my favorite comices (before Ultimatum) and the issue where he ran into Jean Grey for the first time is one of the funniest moments in comics for me, ever... :smallbiggrin:

[ShneekeyTheLost]

You don't understand, guys! The Ultimate Universe is different! That's one of the big draws: In the Ultimate continuity, people stay oh I can't keep a straight face anymore. :smallbiggrin:

Except for Jean Grey... who would be rolling in her grave... if only she'd stay in it for more than five minutes... (almost direct quote from Wolverine)

Really, though... Spidey was Marvel's kick toy for years. He's been 'killed' a number of times, and always ends up turning up again like a bad penny, only to have even more emo drama thrown at him. His love life is, second only to Rogue's, the worst of any character in Marvel continuity. I don't think he's ever had a friend NOT turn around and try to kill him or steal his girl or otherwise piss all over his cheerios.

Honestly, this is probably the most restful thing that has ever happened to him...

[Metahuman1]

They killed him for the same reason they killed Captain America at the end of the Civil War event. They have an Agenda, Fan interests, continuity, genuine story telling be damned.

I mean, come on, he's a double, hinting at triple (rumor is new spiderman may be gay.) minority who comes out of no where to take up one of if not the most Iconic superhero mantels of all time the split second it became open? Really? And that's not pushing to make the comic as Politially Correct as possible?

If they weren't pushing that, here's an idea. Let the new guy show up, spend a couple of issues with Parker figuring out who he is and where his powers came form. Have Parker sort of take him under his wing for a couple of years, show the new kid the basics and give him some periodic help, but let the kid have his space and get experience. (Don't do Batman and Robin were the one is never around with out the other, but make sure it's clear there working togeather pretty regularly.)

THEN, if you MUST, kill Parker in an amazing spectacular fashion where he both sacrifices himself to save everyone and/or Dies fighting literally to his last breath, and hey, he's dieing, at least let him technically win the fight. Then the new kid can step up as spider-man. Or better, avoid the whole "Dead" thing completely, and make him finally find a way to forgive himself for all the things he blames himself for! Let him finally make enough money to live reasonably comfortably with his family off a couple of invention patents while doing REAL freelance Photography (where he sells to people other then Jameson.), and let him at that point decided that, you know what, I've done my lot, paid my dues, literally saved humanity more then once, and I've taken all the licks I need to take. I can hang up the costume and let that part of my life be over at last!


Let him have his happy ending, and then let the new kid dawn the spider costume, and tell HIS story.

Is that really such bad writing if you break it down and get into all the details over the course of say, 3-5 years? (Yes I know this was a short summery, but my point is, I trust, made.)