[3.5/PF] Golem + Two Shields/Weapons + Dungeoncrasher = ?

[Fenryr]

Hello! 'm preparing an encounter that will take place in a maze. When the party arrives to the final room, once all of them are inside, the door shuts. Then, they see a large, stone statue. The statue has two shields and attacks them almost immediatly. It's actually a stone golem with Dungeoncrasher (Fighter variant from Dungeonscape). It's a one trick pony. Once he pushes someone, he walks backwards right into the center of the room to repeat the process of bull rush.

The type of golem is know undefined, it will be changed in the future to match the party CR (probably 5 or 6).

What I need to know:

a) Is it possible to make two bull rush checks, to attempt to push two creatures that are in adjacent spaces? Probably no because it's limited to one attack per charge. And if I add Pounce? Is it possible now?

b) The Powerful Charge feat from Eberron, will be added to the damage of the charge? As I understand, it only applies to melee attacks, not to the bull rush part.

c) Once he pushes someone and backs off, should I give him Movility to avoid AoO or is it too much? Maybe the players need the AoO to improve their damage to the golem or to reduce the CR. I assume my players will spread to make the golem choices more critical.

Thanks. Any further advice is also welcome.

[Greenish]

A) It's not possible to bull rush to people at once (at least without some special ability, but I can't think of any), and pounce doesn't help, since bull rush isn't an attack action.

B) No, unless you have at least three levels in Warforged Juggernaut.

C) Your call, we don't know how powerful the golem or the PCs are. Eating the AoO is probably good enough.


I suggest looking into Knockback, from Races of Stone. Aforementioned Warforged Juggernaut is also something you can use as an inspiration.


[Edit]: I don't see anything in the SRD saying that the bull rush attempt would replace your attack from charge. It looks like by RAW, you can both attack and bull rush when you charge, though I'm probably missing something.

[HunterOfJello]

You need to check out Shock Trooper from COmplete Warrior. It gives you lots of extra Bull Rushing options and is a fun feat to use in combat.

[MeeposFire]

You could use the shield slam feat. This gives you free bull rushes on every hit. Add in shield master and power attack and you will have one nasty golem.

[Greenish]

You could use the shield slam feat. This gives you free bull rushes on every hit.Yeah, the 3.0 version. 3.5 version gives charge attacks with shield save vs. daze.

[MeeposFire]

Yeah, the 3.0 version. 3.5 version gives charge attacks with shield save vs. daze.

No the pathfinder version sorry.

[TwylyghT]

You might be able to make it work mechanically with the Great Swing feature of the Warhulk Prc combined with the Knockback feat from Races of Stone. You can move and make one attack that targets 3 adjacent squares with in your reach(or full attack hitting 3 squares each time if you have not moved 0_o), and Knockback gives a free bull rush, with bonuses, against anything you hit in melee while using the Power Attack feat.

Also 2 or more attacks, pounce, and Knockback would work as well without dipping into the Mini Handbook.

[Groverfield]

To elaborate, it cannot work because it involves moving into the square occupied by the target of the bull rush, even with pounce. It would go as such: charge, attack>bullrush, then you push them back, then you can't move again. With pounce you can add extra attacks before the bull rush, but once you knocked them out of reach, you won't be able to continue moving into the square to do another bull rush. If you failed to move them back with the first, then it might be possible to do a second bull rush with pounce, but I can't say for certain.

Also note that golems (or most) cannot have INT scores without dropping a 9th level bomb, so they cannot have feats or class levels. There's other constructs out there that can, however.

[Runestar]

I think a warforged barb1/fighter4/juggernaught5 would be a great cr10 challenge. You can also use the bloodspiked charger feat from PHB2. Not entirely optimised, but who cares? :smallbiggrin:

[Fenryr]

Thanks a lot for the ideas. Probably it will be a Large Warforged (without players knowledge because we are at Forgotten Realms) to keep it simple and the Int factor.

Two push two people at once, I only see it possible with Shocktrooper: push someone to the right or the left and keep pushing until it crashes a party member. And then the wall. Obviously, penalties for pushing two at once.

Thanks again, gonna compare your ideas and write it down.