AugustNights
2011-08-07, 01:42 PM
In an upcoming pbp game, I have a player who will be playing a medium sized race with powerful build who wishes to take advantage of as much reach as possible.
We have come to a disagreement about the reach of Large sized weapons within the hands of medium creatures. I know the RAW are very clear that a large sized reach weapon in the hands of a medium creature does not extend the reach of the wielder.
Official 3.5 FAQ (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/er/20030221a)
How do reach weapons work if they are of a different
size than the creature wielding them? Say, an ogre wielding
a Small or Medium glaive, or a human with the Monkey
Grip feat wielding a Large ranseur? What is the reach for
each situation?
A reach weapon doubles its wielder’s natural reach, but
only if the weapon is at least of an appropriate size for the
wielder. Wielding a “too-small” reach weapon grants no reach.
An ogre (Large) wielding a Medium or smaller reach
weapon gains no reach from the weapon, and could thus attack
foes either 5 feet or 10 feet distant (as normal for a Large
creature wielding a non-reach weapon).
A human (Medium) wielding a Large or larger reach
weapon could attack a creature 10 feet away (but no further),
and could not use the weapon to attack a creature 5 feet away
(as normal for a Medium creature wielding a reach weapon). A
human wielding a Small reach weapon would gain no reach
from the weapon.
The PH isn’t as clear on this as it could be, although an
example of reach in action on page 113 in the PH provides
pretty strong support: “A typical Large character wielding a
reach weapon of the appropriate size can attack a creature 15 or 20 feet away . . .” [italics added]. While this reference doesn’t
mention the ability to wield a reach weapon larger than the
appropriate size, allowing such a weapon to grant reach to its
wielder is a reasonable extension of the spirit and intent of the
rule.
Great. However, he still maintains that a Larger weapon ought to reach further. Which I don't necessarily disagree with.
I do think that the reach extension would be mitigated by the medium creature's inability to full wield the weapon appropriately, a clumsiness in the arms, a need to grip the weapon further back to get a better balance on it, and the shorter arms of the medium creature. But it isn't Monkey Grip, it's powerful build.
I can see an argument to allow reach weapons for large sized creatures in the hands of medium creatures work with a +5 range reach.... explaining this precisely will be difficult.
A medium creature has a reach of 5 ft.
In this view of the game (desipite it not being RAW) a medium reach weapon increases this by 5 ft.
A large creature has a reach of 10 ft.
In this view of the game (desipite it not being RAW) a large reach weapon increases this by 10 ft.
So a medium creature (reach of 5ft) wielding a large reach weapon would have a reach of 15 feet. (5 medium reach +10 large weapon reach). What could be arguable from here, is the threatening area. Would this creature threaten 15ft away only (I prefer this), or 10-15ft away, and not within 5ft.
Anyhow, what it boils down to is this confusion: I know that a large reach weapon does not increase a medium creature's reach, I know why in RAW it does so, but what I don't know, is why it does not work that way, within game. What's the explanation for it?
Oh wise and learned playground sages, please aid me in my confusion!
EDIT: Possible Solution
GIANT GRIP [General, Fighter]
Prerequisite: Powerful Build, Str 15+
Benefit: When wielding reach weapons sized for a creature one size larger than your size category your reach with the weapon is extended by 5 feet.
Normal: Reach weapons sized for creatures larger than the wielder do not grant more reach than reach weapons sized appropriately for the wielder
We have come to a disagreement about the reach of Large sized weapons within the hands of medium creatures. I know the RAW are very clear that a large sized reach weapon in the hands of a medium creature does not extend the reach of the wielder.
Official 3.5 FAQ (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/er/20030221a)
How do reach weapons work if they are of a different
size than the creature wielding them? Say, an ogre wielding
a Small or Medium glaive, or a human with the Monkey
Grip feat wielding a Large ranseur? What is the reach for
each situation?
A reach weapon doubles its wielder’s natural reach, but
only if the weapon is at least of an appropriate size for the
wielder. Wielding a “too-small” reach weapon grants no reach.
An ogre (Large) wielding a Medium or smaller reach
weapon gains no reach from the weapon, and could thus attack
foes either 5 feet or 10 feet distant (as normal for a Large
creature wielding a non-reach weapon).
A human (Medium) wielding a Large or larger reach
weapon could attack a creature 10 feet away (but no further),
and could not use the weapon to attack a creature 5 feet away
(as normal for a Medium creature wielding a reach weapon). A
human wielding a Small reach weapon would gain no reach
from the weapon.
The PH isn’t as clear on this as it could be, although an
example of reach in action on page 113 in the PH provides
pretty strong support: “A typical Large character wielding a
reach weapon of the appropriate size can attack a creature 15 or 20 feet away . . .” [italics added]. While this reference doesn’t
mention the ability to wield a reach weapon larger than the
appropriate size, allowing such a weapon to grant reach to its
wielder is a reasonable extension of the spirit and intent of the
rule.
Great. However, he still maintains that a Larger weapon ought to reach further. Which I don't necessarily disagree with.
I do think that the reach extension would be mitigated by the medium creature's inability to full wield the weapon appropriately, a clumsiness in the arms, a need to grip the weapon further back to get a better balance on it, and the shorter arms of the medium creature. But it isn't Monkey Grip, it's powerful build.
I can see an argument to allow reach weapons for large sized creatures in the hands of medium creatures work with a +5 range reach.... explaining this precisely will be difficult.
A medium creature has a reach of 5 ft.
In this view of the game (desipite it not being RAW) a medium reach weapon increases this by 5 ft.
A large creature has a reach of 10 ft.
In this view of the game (desipite it not being RAW) a large reach weapon increases this by 10 ft.
So a medium creature (reach of 5ft) wielding a large reach weapon would have a reach of 15 feet. (5 medium reach +10 large weapon reach). What could be arguable from here, is the threatening area. Would this creature threaten 15ft away only (I prefer this), or 10-15ft away, and not within 5ft.
Anyhow, what it boils down to is this confusion: I know that a large reach weapon does not increase a medium creature's reach, I know why in RAW it does so, but what I don't know, is why it does not work that way, within game. What's the explanation for it?
Oh wise and learned playground sages, please aid me in my confusion!
EDIT: Possible Solution
GIANT GRIP [General, Fighter]
Prerequisite: Powerful Build, Str 15+
Benefit: When wielding reach weapons sized for a creature one size larger than your size category your reach with the weapon is extended by 5 feet.
Normal: Reach weapons sized for creatures larger than the wielder do not grant more reach than reach weapons sized appropriately for the wielder