Undead Mount and Related Questions

[Elric VIII]

Recently some threads here have brought to my attention some interesting things about mounts and mounted combat...

The most interesting is that the mount I've had for 12 levels so far should have been getting feats.


I currently have a Warhorse Skeleton from the Bone Knight PrC ability Skeletal Steed. I have a Battle Bridle that will soon be upgraded to Riding Boots and the Mount is equipped with Chain Shirt Barding that has +1 Smoking Armor Spikes and Horseshoes of the Zephyr. Now, I have potentially one personal feat to dedicate to my mount, but unless it's something really good I'm going to go with the feat I originally planned.


Does the fact that my mount gains an Int score after being mindless grant it retroactive skill points, or just skill points for the HD after gaining Int?


Is there a way to use the feat Airy Gallop* with a charge/ride-by attack or does it only work the the Run action?


Do I get to reassign its 1st HD feat now that it has Int (previously lost due to Skeletal template)?


Since the mount is using its own move action, theoretically I could perform a separate move action, how can I make the most of this?


Does the Holy Mount** feat work with classes that have special mounts that have the same features as a Paladin special mount?


If a healing ability (such as the Healing Collar from MIC) does not specify that it harms undead, can it be used to heal them?

*Airy Gallop has the following (I will remove this if it causes a problem):
Mounts with the Airy Gallop feat have the ability to gallop over chasms, run "downhill" from a sheer cliff to the ground below, or even be convinced to gallop "uphill" into the air itself.
To achieve these unbelievable tasks, the mount's rider must make a successful Ride check (DC 15) at the beginning of the action, and every 10 minutes thereafter with a cumulative
-2 circumstance penalty to each successive check. Mounts cannot stand still while performing an Airy Gallop; if forced to move slower than a run or stop, they immediately fall
**Holy Mount has the following prerequisite:
Ability to gain a paladin special mount, any other divine spellcasting class level 1st.

[Abaddon87]

Well I can answer #6 for sure. ANY "Healing" or "Cure" spell uses positive energy which harms undead. As far as items that dont say, I would look at the required spells to make the item. If its a Cure spell or so forth I would say that item deals in positive energy as well.

As far as #5 goes I would ask your DM. Same would probably go for #2

[Elric VIII]

Well I can answer #6 for sure. ANY "Healing" or "Cure" spell uses positive energy which harms undead. As far as items that dont say, I would look at the required spells to make the item. If its a Cure spell or so forth I would say that item deals in positive energy as well.

Makes sense.


As far as #5 goes I would ask your DM. Same would probably go for #2

That's about what I figured for #5, but I thought I'd ask.

For #2, is there some way to combine a charge with the run action, to remove any obscurity?


One more thing, would my mount taking Travel Devotion allow me to move (swift), full attack, then move (normal) away, or does the line that says "Essentially, you have to wait until the mount gets to your enemy before attacking, so you can’t make a full attack." prevent this even though you have swift action movement?

[Yorrin]

1. It only gets the skill points of the HD that it has an Int score for, not retroactively.
2. As much as it saddens me, you can only use Airy Gallop while Running.
3. You can only reassign this feat if your DM allows feat retraining.
4. I'm not that great at optimizing mounter characters, tbh. My best though is performing full round actions while your mount moves.
5. RAW no, but as a DM I'd let you do it. Ask your DM.
6. If it doesn't specify then I'd allow it to heal him, but Abaddon87's answer for this one is pretty good too. Once again, it's up to your DM.

[Elric VIII]

1. It only gets the skill points of the HD that it has an Int score for, not retroactively.
2. As much as it saddens me, you can only use Airy Gallop while Running.
3. You can only reassign this feat if your DM allows feat retraining.
4. I'm not that great at optimizing mounter characters, tbh. My best though is performing full round actions while your mount moves.
5. RAW no, but as a DM I'd let you do it. Ask your DM.
6. If it doesn't specify then I'd allow it to heal him, but Abaddon87's answer for this one is pretty good too. Once again, it's up to your DM.

Thank you. I can find no personal objections to those answers and they seem to make sense.

[Yorrin]

Thank you. I can find no personal objections to those answers and they seem to make sense.

You're quite welcome :smallsmile:
As someone who's been DMing for several years I've tried to develop the ability to give rules answers in a sensible and clear way. And while my expertise with Mounted Combat is limited (none of my players have wanted that particular headache) I've got a lot of experience with all sorts of undead, if you've got any more questions pertaining to that side of things.

[Elric VIII]

You're quite welcome :smallsmile:
As someone who's been DMing for several years I've tried to develop the ability to give rules answers in a sensible and clear way. And while my expertise with Mounted Combat is limited (none of my players have wanted that particular headache) I've got a lot of experience with all sorts of undead, if you've got any more questions pertaining to that side of things.

Actually, I do have one question: Do you know of any feats that can grant an undead creature the ability to fly?

I know I can do it with Grafts/maigic items but I would like a way to do it essentially for free.

[Vizzerdrix]

Maybe with Hidden Talent(Expanded Psionic: Pg 67)? You can pick up Dimension Hop from the Freedom mantle in Complete Psionic. I know it isn't flight, but at least it's a way to get more maneuverability.

OR: Hidden tallent for Astral Construct, and the Skin of the construct feat. One of the options for a 1st level construct is a 20 foot flight speed.

Both are rather poor choices, though. :smallfrown:

[Elric VIII]

Maybe with Hidden Talent(Expanded Psionic: Pg 67)? You can pick up Dimension Hop from the Freedom mantle in Complete Psionic. I know it isn't flight, but at least it's a way to get more maneuverability.

OR: Hidden tallent for Astral Construct, and the Skin of the construct feat. One of the options for a 1st level construct is a 20 foot flight speed.

Both are rather poor choices, though. :smallfrown:

Wouldn't Dimension Hop just make my horse disappear from under me?:smallbiggrin:

[Cog]

Wouldn't Dimension Hop just make my horse disappear from under me?:smallbiggrin:
To be fair, you did only ask about the mount, not the rider. :smallcool:

[Fouredged Sword]

There is a soulmeld that grants an effect like skin of the contrstruct when bound to the arms, except all the time. Also gives TWO slams to your mount for when it gets into melee.

[Yorrin]

Feats that grant flight are not the most common. As off-topic as Fouredged Sword's comment was, it reminded me that there is a Soulmeld that gives very limited flight (Cerulean Sandals, iirc. and by limited I mean that if I'm remembering it right it's like a 10ft speed), which you could pick up with the Shape Soulmeld feat. (Get a Cleric or Psion to open your feet Chakra to get the most out of it.)

Aside from that... I can't think of anything that a sane DM would allow. If you mix some obscure 3.0 feats with some FR material you could pull it off in 3 feats, I guess. (Old Blood + Infernal Bloodline + Outsider Wings). But I've never heard of any DM besides me that allows Old Blood (and few enough that have even heard of it).

If you had a DM that allowed some of the more ridiculous PF alternate systems (specifically Wordcasting) you could get it for the price of a 4th level spell. But PF Wordcasting is just completely broken when you start figuring out the permanent buffs that are possible.

[Elric VIII]

There is a soulmeld that grants an effect like skin of the contrstruct when bound to the arms, except all the time. Also gives TWO slams to your mount for when it gets into melee.


Feats that grant flight are not the most common. As off-topic as Fouredged Sword's comment was, it reminded me that there is a Soulmeld that gives very limited flight (Cerulean Sandals, iirc. and by limited I mean that if I'm remembering it right it's like a 10ft speed), which you could pick up with the Shape Soulmeld feat. (Get a Cleric or Psion to open your feet Chakra to get the most out of it.)

Don't you need a Con score to take Shape Soulmeld?


Aside from that... I can't think of anything that a sane DM would allow. If you mix some obscure 3.0 feats with some FR material you could pull it off in 3 feats, I guess. (Old Blood + Infernal Bloodline + Outsider Wings). But I've never heard of any DM besides me that allows Old Blood (and few enough that have even heard of it).

If you had a DM that allowed some of the more ridiculous PF alternate systems (specifically Wordcasting) you could get it for the price of a 4th level spell. But PF Wordcasting is just completely broken when you start figuring out the permanent buffs that are possible.

Well, my cleric is FR. Were any of those feats updated in 3.5?

And where can they be found?