Eventually, I'm going to start an ice cream shop.

[enderlord99]

It will also sell candy (mostly taffy) and soda. The products will be made on site and will be able to be customized to order (as in "you can have just about any flavor you want"). Anyone have any advice (seeing as I hope for the shop to become a tourist destination in itself, eventually)?

[Tyndmyr]

Where are you planning to have this shop?

[Maxios]

Well, you're going to need to buy a buisness lisence first. I don't know how much they cost, but I'm sure it's more then $40. You're also going to have to go location scouting and lease/rent a building.
Then, you're going to have to get insurance for the building if it doesn't already come with it. Assuming you don't know how to program or make a website, you're going to need to hire a website designer to make it for you.
After the website is done, and you've created a cool logo, you're going to need supplies in the form of lots and lots of ice creams and whatever toppings you want to have (Sprinkles, M&Ms, Chocolate Chips, etc).*

*-I'm not an expert, so my advice may be...crappy.

[Tyndmyr]

TBH, I was thinking...coldstone creamery franchise?

[enderlord99]

TBH, I was thinking...coldstone creamery franchise?

Sort of, but it's going to make the ice cream on site, and sell soda (also made on site). It also will be independent of Coldstone.

[Tyndmyr]

My favorite is pistachio/rose water/vanilla. It's homemade at a little shop around here, and it's epic.

Do you have a location? A lot of stuff starts once you've got that nailed down.

[SamBurke]

Also, note: there has to be something that is jaw-dropping. You can be a themed resteraunt (There's a place called the Hobbit Grill in Downtown Houston. Lots of cool LotR stuff there. Actually sanctioned by the original Tolkien). You can have the best food ever made. You can be a cool joint to hang out at, or a romantic place to take a GF/BF. But there's got to be that one thing that you're famous for: just one thing, here. Doesn't mean the other stuff can't be good, but that one thing must be excellent, memorable. That creates a destination more than anything else.

[enderlord99]

Also, note: there has to be something that is jaw-dropping. You can be a themed resteraunt (There's a place called the Hobbit Grill in Downtown Houston. Lots of cool LotR stuff there. Actually sanctioned by the original Tolkien). You can have the best food ever made. You can be a cool joint to hang out at, or a romantic place to take a GF/BF. But there's got to be that one thing that you're famous for: just one thing, here. Doesn't mean the other stuff can't be good, but that one thing must be excellent, memorable. That creates a destination more than anything else.

Does a float with bubblegum-flavored soda (extra fizzy) and raspberry sorbet sound "memorable?" Because that's going to be one of our signature flavor-thingies. I'm having trouble coming up with anything more unique then that, although the "highly customizable" flavors of soda, ice cream, etc. (someone might, for example, order a banana-flavored, moderate-fizz soda made into a float with jalapeno ice cream. It sounds disgusting, but hey, it's just an example of what's theoretically possible there)

[Jack Squat]

Well, you're going to need to buy a buisness lisence first. I don't know how much they cost, but I'm sure it's more then $40.

Around here, they're only about $20-30. Been a few years, so I don't know the exact cost. It'll vary some with location, but they're generally the cheapest opening expense you'll have.

Before going any further into the idea, do you have experience running this type of shop? If not, I'd look into getting a few years of experience, or getting a partner that has it. Restaurants are harder to manage than your normal stores - I would imagine ice cream shops are especially hard, because it's a fairly seasonal item. Also, can you make really good ice cream, in the manner you want to sell?

First off, you'll need to know your target market. Who do you want to have buy your ice cream and soda? You're going to have this in mind the entire time, as you have to cater the business to be what they want. Knowing your target market will allow you to set your location, your prices, your hours, your theme, and your products.

On location: Pick an area that has a lot of traffic (foot and vehicle). Consult with someone experienced, but I would probably put it within walking distance of either a college or some sort of touristy area. Starting in a strip mall, next to a large, successful chain will work too - but if that store ever moves/goes out of business, there goes your traffic. Besides that, it becoming an attraction is a little harder when you're slammed in next to Wal-Mart (Not that you can't move locations if you become successful).

On themes: Themes are cool, but be sure it meshes with your location and your target market (you do know who your target market is, right?). For instance, I wouldn't put a country style diner in lower Manhattan. If you want the general public to come in, I would probably keep the theme fairly neutral - but that's not really going to make you stick out and become an attraction. Since the general design of the place seems like it'd go well here too, I'll mention that if you're going to have seating, have a majority of it set up for 4 person seating. The most common parties are 2-4 people.

I don't think you're going to need a website. They need to be kept updated, and you'll have more important things to do than that - such as get your ice cream ready for the next day. At some point, the website may help you bring in many new customers, and then you can launch a site, but I wouldn't recommend it when starting out.

On supplies: It's cool that you want to make everything on-site, but remember that the more you make in house, the more time it's going to cost you, and the longer wait time you'll have before you can get back into the game if you run out of something. Also keep in mind that if you end up making too much of something, that's not only the wasted cost of the product, but it's the wasted cost of the time spent making it. Know exactly how much in-house work you want to do, and what you're going to do if you run out (it's either buy outside stuff or stop offering it, which loses sales).

In general: Be prepared to lose money for the first year or two. Also, be prepared to not get any sleep for awhile. Between actually running the place and doing all the paperwork, you're not going to have time for much else.

EDIT:


Does a float with bubblegum-flavored soda (extra fizzy) and raspberry sorbet sound "memorable?" Because that's going to be one of our signature flavor-thingies. I'm having trouble coming up with anything more unique then that, although the "highly customizable" flavors of soda, ice cream, etc. (someone might, for example, order a banana-flavored, moderate-fizz soda made into a float with jalapeno ice cream. It sounds disgusting, but hey, it's just an example of what's theoretically possible there)

It certainly sounds memorable, but I'd have to taste it to see if it would be the in the good way. The high degree of customization that you want to offer seems like it'd be more of an attraction, but you'll definitely want a list of home-run combinations up on a menu for people who are indecisive/want to try your guys offerings.

[Erloas]

Without knowing where you are its hard to say too much. Location, after all, is everything.
Chances are if you are in a smaller city you will have to diversify more, whereas if you are a very large city you can have a lot better chance with a very specialized focus.

The next big question is what is available for retail space in your area? Generally speaking a shop like that will have to have a lot of foot traffic in the area already because it will take a long time to establish yourself as some place people look for and its not likely to have a delivery service. Obviously if a building rents for $600 a month then your target sales will be a lot lower then if nothing in your city rents for less then $2500 a month.

Another big question is how much can you make the product for versus what you can likely sell it for. Very few people will pay $10 for an ice cream, $5-7 it had better be exceptionally good, and for $3-4 you'll get a lot more impulse buys and customer expectations will be much easier to meet. If you're only making $0.50 a cone you'll have to sell thousands a month to even approach a reasonable chance of cover the cost of overhead.

The first step is going over the numbers and seeing what seems possible and reasonable. Find distributors for your raw ingredients and get an idea of what each item you make will cost you, figure out a reasonable profit margin for that and figure out how many items you would need to sell a week to cover the costs of rent in your area. If you find you need to sell a thousand items a week then you had better make sure the area you are in has thousands of people going past it. If you only need to sell a few dozen a week then you have a lot more flexibility in what you can do.

That sort of thing is a lot harder to figure out and a lot more important then what specific flavors you will carry.
Although personally I don't like "bubblegum" flavor much, its usually too much for any decent sized drink.

[Tyndmyr]

Does a float with bubblegum-flavored soda (extra fizzy) and raspberry sorbet sound "memorable?" Because that's going to be one of our signature flavor-thingies.

Bubblegum soda isn't an unusual mix for me...it's one of the staple mixers I use for drinking. So, both items are perfectly normal things to have around...but I haven't mixed them, so I don't know how the combo is.

You'll definitely want to do some testing to determine what kind of oddball combos are really awesome, and which ones are just weird. Enlist local friends to test if possible. Get a nice variety of mixes...at least a couple should involve chocolate in some way. Also, make sure to have a few fairly normal combos on the wall too. Sometimes people like safe things. Vanilla is still the most popular ice cream sold, no?

Be aware that Coldstone doesn't focus on the soda, but they ARE a fairly big chain that offers customizable ice cream. If you're not running one of them...get familiar with them. Don't set up shop near one, etc. Try their stuff out.

Get a solid basic proficiency in accounting, IMO. I grew up in a small business, and was doing payroll before I could drive, so heavy duty number crunching normal for me...but it isn't for a lot of people. And for a business, there's a pretty good amount of it, and it's always sad to see one with good potential fail for fairly simple economic reasons.

By the way, you *need* an advertising budget.

[The Succubus]

As an idea for a recipe perhaps some sort of funky moijito/ice cream drink would be funky. Stick with straightforward flavours, use fresh ingredients....

[Mercenary Pen]

Keep your range at a level where you can keep decent stocks of the more ordinary/popular varieties, at least at first. You certainly shouldn't have a range so diverse that you have hardly anything in of any given variety of your product- Most people will want their first choice of product rather than to spend ages looking over your menu at the counter trying to work out a second option.

Also, make sure you have access to all the relevant experience first, there's gonna be nothing worse than finding out in the middle of your opening week that your set up fails to meet health and safety standards in some critical way, or that you haven't got a fallback supplier you can turn to for your basic ingredients and your regular supplier has just gone bankrupt...

[Dr.Epic]

You should get a TV and have it on in the shop. You could have movie nights! And show movies! Like musicals! About superheroes and mad scientists!

[Partysan]

When I was in Munich ins summer a few years ago I found some nice summer flavors. Lemon-Basil Sorbet was extremely refreshing, Milk-Mint a very smooth taste and Dark Chocolate-Ginger while a bit aggressive still delicious.

[purple gelatinous cube o' Doom]

OP, I hope you have a whole heck of a lot of capital to get that up and running. The minimum cost to get a fast food franchise is generally about $250,000 and up. I think most of the fast food companies require a good chunk of that to be money that you haven't borrowed or gotten a loan for either, so having oodles and oodles of cash is pretty much required to get a business running from the ground up.

[Erloas]

OP, I hope you have a whole heck of a lot of capital to get that up and running. The minimum cost to get a fast food franchise is generally about $250,000 and up. I think most of the fast food companies require a good chunk of that to be money that you haven't borrowed or gotten a loan for either, so having oodles and oodles of cash is pretty much required to get a business running from the ground up.

I don't know, that seems very high to me. Maybe if you had to extensively remodel a building and/or buy upfront a year or more worth of rent. And for a franchise that might be more likely as most require a specific look and a huge chunk of money just for the name and the implied advertising that comes with it.

My brother got his shop open, not food related, for less then about 10k, though that was without a whole lot of remodeling, though at least 1/3 of that is merchandise which would be a lot less for food. Given a large freezer could easily run 5-10k on its own, and a stove and deep fryer (if you are doing normal food) would probably be likewise. But I can say with certainty that many of the independent restaurants here probably didn't go through 250k worth of capitol in several years, let alone startup.

[purple gelatinous cube o' Doom]

I don't know, that seems very high to me. Maybe if you had to extensively remodel a building and/or buy upfront a year or more worth of rent. And for a franchise that might be more likely as most require a specific look and a huge chunk of money just for the name and the implied advertising that comes with it.

My brother got his shop open, not food related, for less then about 10k, though that was without a whole lot of remodeling, though at least 1/3 of that is merchandise which would be a lot less for food. Given a large freezer could easily run 5-10k on its own, and a stove and deep fryer (if you are doing normal food) would probably be likewise. But I can say with certainty that many of the independent restaurants here probably didn't go through 250k worth of capitol in several years, let alone startup.

Yes, in the research I've done, non-food related franchises generally are a whole lot less expensive than food related ones to get up and running (something like H&R Block can be up and running for around $100 k). Now I've really only been looking at fast food facilities here, but most have a franchise fee between $30 and $50K. On top of that, there's leasing space, any construction that may need to be done to said space, equipment, furniture, POS, training, signage, and insurance among others. Doing a bit of digging, McDonalds requires you to have at least $250k, Seattle's Best Coffee is about $200k-$450k (depending on type of store), and Stone Cold Creamery says that most franchisees spend between $300k-$440k to get a store running. I'd be willing to bet even a mom and pop restaurant can easily spend tens of thousands or more on food alone in a year. Running a restaurant of any kind is not a cheap venture by any means.

[enderlord99]

OP, I hope you have a whole heck of a lot of capital to get that up and running. The minimum cost to get a fast food franchise is generally about $250,000 and up. I think most of the fast food companies require a good chunk of that to be money that you haven't borrowed or gotten a loan for either, so having oodles and oodles of cash is pretty much required to get a business running from the ground up.

I'm not going to be part of a franchise, though... :smallconfused:

[purple gelatinous cube o' Doom]

Not saying you were intending to. But aside from the franchise fee, the rest of the costs still remain. So, I was illustrating (poorly it would seem), that if you take the ballpark cost to start a franchise, and then subtract the franchise fee associated with the organization, that should give you a pretty good idea what the cost of starting up a similar place would be. Although since you wouldn't be a known name, that cost may be added back in with advertising to get your name out there. I guess my main point, is that opening anything that has to do with food isn't going to be an inexpensive venture, and generally takes lots of planning and logistics to pull off. I"m not saying that you aren't capable or trying to burst your bubble here, but something as big as starting a business isn't something one just jumps into. Many people who have lots of food/business background have had a hard go of it in that industry, and it's easily one of the hardest industries to stay afloat and turn a profit in.

[Erloas]

On top of that, there's leasing space, any construction that may need to be done to said space, equipment, furniture, POS, training, signage, and insurance among others.
...
I'd be willing to bet even a mom and pop restaurant can easily spend tens of thousands or more on food alone in a year. Running a restaurant of any kind is not a cheap venture by any means.
All of the first stuff is the same regardless of the type of business. Granted a restaurant is likely require more remodeling then many other types of businesses and that can be anywhere from a minor expense to really high.
And while a restaurant might spend 20k on food in a year that is going to be spent, for the most part, on a very regular basis and not as an upfront cost because there is only so long you can store food. And at least a portion of that (whatever can be frozen) is not going to be used/wasted unless it is purchased and therefor the money to replace it is given to you.

Of course most places recommend having the capitol on hand to cover all of your costs for 6 months to a year, and that can easily add up to a lot. And even then it comes down to what you can find for rent, which seems to always be the deciding factor on something will work or not, is how much you can find a place that work for. Around here my brother has found commercial real estate from anywhere between about $500 a month to $3000 a month, which is a range of $6k a year to $36k a year which is a huge difference in how much money you might want to have on hand when starting up.

One big thing about the franchises is that they are going to require a certain look and the remodeling to get that is going to cost a lot. For instance my brothers game shop looks perfectly fine in terms of remodeling for a restaurant, and we did that with a lot of work and maybe $1k worth of material. But while doesn't look like any chain restaurant you've ever seen, it does look much like 3-4 mom-and-pop sort of restaurants that are in the area and have been doing fine for years.