Pole & Buckler [3.5 Feat]

[Greenish]

I don't know whether people used bucklers with polearms, but I like the image, so here's a feat for it. You could use it to, say, TWF with a halberd and a buckler, but it also allows you to threaten close while wielding a reach weapon. Spiked Chain and an animated shield would be a better option, but I hope this one isn't terrible.

Please do tell if you feel it's horrible, overpowered or plain sucky.

Pole & Buckler [General]

Prerequisites
Base attack bonus +1, proficiency with at least one polearm, proficiency with buckler.

Benefit
This feat grants you three benefits while wielding a polearm (such as halberd, glaive, guisarme or ranseur) and wearing a buckler.

First, you take no penalty to attack from using your shield arm to wield the polearm.

Second, you may bash enemies with your buckler (treat buckler as a martial light weapon that deals 1d3 bludgeoning damage), even while wielding the polearm in your shield hand. After bashing someone with the buckler, you may treat them as flat footed against your next attack with the polearm.

Third, you do not lose the buckler's AC bonus when you use it to bash someone or when using your shield arm to wield the polearm.

Normal
Without this feat, you take -1 penalty to attack rolls when using your shield arm to wield a weapon and lose the buckler's AC bonus for the round you attack with your shield arm. You can't bash with buckler.

Special
A fighter may select Pole & Buckler as one of his fighter bonus feats.

Pole & Buckler can be used in place of Improved Shield Bash to qualify for a feat, prestige class, or other special ability.

Also, do you feel it should be a [Style] feat or have more prerequisites?


[Edit]: Props to Merk for the flat footing buckler bash idea.

[Ziegander]

Well, mathematically, what I see here is a feat that enables a fighting style that is ever so slightly more advantageous than pole & spiked gauntlet (which doesn't require a feat to use). You trade .5 average damage for +1 (or more with enhancement) shield AC. Superficially it's a pretty bad trade and definitely never worth the feat slot.

I would make it a style feat, and I would also specify that it counts as Improved Shield Bash for prerequisites. I don't know how to make it more worth it though...

[Greenish]

Well, mathematically, what I see here is a feat that enables a fighting style that is ever so slightly more advantageous than pole & spiked gauntletYou can't attack with a spiked gauntlet while holding a weapon in the hand, I believe.

Armour spikes, though, are fair game. Good point about Imp. Shield Bash.

[Hiro Protagonest]

You can't attack with a spiked gauntlet while holding a weapon in the hand, I believe.

Armour spikes, though, are fair game. Good point about Imp. Shield Bash.

Switching to holding (but not using) a weapon in one hand is a free action. Same for gripping it in two hands again.

[Greenish]

Switching to holding (but not using) a weapon in one hand is a free action. Same for gripping it in two hands again.True, but you can't threaten with a two-hander you only hold in one hand.

[Ziegander]

True, but you can't threaten with a two-hander you only hold in one hand.

That's what the spiked gauntlet is for.

[Greenish]

That's what the spiked gauntlet is for.The spiked gauntlet has no reach. Did you forget why you have a reach weapon in the first place? :smalltongue:

[Ziegander]

The spiked gauntlet has no reach. Did you forget why you have a reach weapon in the first place? :smalltongue:

Here's the basic concept you're not getting. You hold your Glaive (or whatever) in two hands when you attack with it. At the end of your turn you continue to hold the Glaive in two hands. If someone provokes an AoO in reach of your Glaive you continue to hold the Glaive in two hands. However, if someone gets inside your Glaive's reach, as a free action you let go of the Glaive with one hand, and punch them with your spiked gauntlet. Then, after you make the gauntlet AoO you may grab the Glaive in two hands again, or not, the choice is yours.

EDIT: Also, Armor Spikes. If for some reason you don't think you can do the above with a Spiked Gauntlet, Armor Spikes let you achieve the same effect, and deal 1 more average damage, without letting go of your Glaive.

[Greenish]

However, if someone gets inside your Glaive's reach, as a free action you let go of the Glaive with one hand, and punch them with your spiked gauntlet. Then, after you make the gauntlet AoO you may grab the Glaive in two hands again, or not, the choice is yours.You can't take free actions outside of your turn (except as a part of another action, or speaking), and until you free the hand, you won't threaten with it.

[Ziegander]

You can't take free actions outside of your turn (except as a part of another action, or speaking)

Even if that's your ruling on the matter, like I said, Armor Spikes does the same thing but better (I always forget about Armor Spikes), which makes the Pole & Buckler feat look even worse by comparison.

[Merk]

I'd enjoy seeing this concept extended to Pole & Shield in general, since that's a relatively common thing, but a bit hard to do.

Alternatively, if you land a buckler bash, your next pole attack denies dex mod to AC.

[Ziegander]

Alternatively, if you land a buckler bash, your next pole attack denies dex mod to AC.

That would be really cool, and worth it, in my opinion.

[Greenish]

Even if that's your ruling on the matter, like I said, Armor Spikes does the same thing but betterLike you said? :smalltongue:

Armour spikes, though, are fair game.


which makes the Pole & Buckler feat look even worse by comparison.Well, I've seen Imp. Buckler Defense recommended every now and then, and P&B (it should have a better name) does that better.

But yeah, it might use something more.


Alternatively, if you land a buckler bash, your next pole attack denies dex mod to AC.Hmm, sounds more like a tactical feat, but I like the idea.

[Alefiend]

When I saw the topic, I thought we'd get to talk about Hoplites, who fought with longspears and heavy shields. Alas, this is just another iteration of reach weapon plus gauntlet/armor spikes. You have made me sad. :smallfrown:

Then again, the in-game concept that a pole wielder can't just change his grip or strike with the butt of the weapon to deal with adjacent foes (without spending a feat) makes me even sadder. :smallfrown::smallfrown:

[Greenish]

Alas, this is just another iteration of reach weapon plus gauntlet/armor spikes.Even if that's the only thing people notice, that's not the only thing the feat does.

[eftexar]

Well I like it. Truthfully its too weak to just take, but if your entire build revolves around this concept it is a must have.

[Cieyrin]

This is like a different permutation of Shield and Pike Style (Dragon 338), except you can actually use the shield to threaten and get something nice for doing so. Rolls together Improved Buckler Defense and Improved Shield Bash as well, so I'm not seeing a downside to this if you want to go this way.

While technically this could be a Style, I don't actually understand what benefit that has, as unlike most feat tags, there's no intrinsic value to it other than to say it is.