(PF)/(3.5) Bard/Berserker: Bashing skulls with the guitar

[APersonAmI]

I am a player new to Pathfinder who finds the idea of being able to do other things without interrupting my bard guitar solo intriguing... such as screaming blood rage at the top of my lungs while using the guitar I am playing my performance on to bash in my listeners skulls. Which, thanks to Catch off-guard, means that opponents who didn't take the facial tattoos that look like Kiss make-up, the ridiculous amount of black cloth and shiny metal bits in both clothing and skin, the look of barely contained anger and the general state of the proffered instrument as a sign that this not a person around which relaxation can be expected to happen, literally will not be ready for my "performance".

Now, there are a few things here I need help with.

First: Does randomly thrashing guitar strings quicker the speed of light (takes no time, remember) like a crazed metal nut count as an art form that requires patience and concentration? that could hamper my plans considerably, after all. It might force me to actually be aware of my surroundings and any applicable philosophical conundrums, and we do not want that, now do we. No, not at all.

Second: are there feats, base classes or prestige classes in 3.5 and/or Pathfinder that would allow me to further the blood-curling rage, the general bashing, the quality of the performance and my extremely vocal spell hurling? Or, at least, as many of these as components as possible? Because, simply put, this idea seems fun, and if there is a way of actually playing this kind of crazed character, it would be lovely to try.

[The Gilded Duke]

Not sure about Bard/Barbarian synergy, but have you ever considered Warchanter from complete warrior?

Full base attack bonus bardic music prestige class. Has some of the better bardic music effects around.

Inspire Recklessness allows you to take penalties to ac to add to your attack (up to your bab)

Inspire Legion lets your entire group use your character level for their base attack bonus.

You can also combine songs.
Tie this together with Ronin, who can take a penalty to ac up to their bab to gain bonus damage on a charge and the standard Shocktrooper Leap Attack Power Attack build and you can do an extreme amount of power attack damage on a bard chassis.

[BillyBobJoe]

WOOOT!!!!1!! Finally, someone wishes to bask in the glory that is the Bardarian! It is specifically mentioned in the gestalt rules, that you can use bardic music while raging. Suggestion can be quite interesting, depending on your level of imagination.

[Coidzor]

So, if you like making Barbarians into Barbarian-casters, then Champion of Gwynharwyf or Runescarred Berserker combined with a dip of Warrior Skald and some Heartfire Fanner and some feats for the bardening (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=9830.0)process can get you something fun. Probably... And since Heartfire Fanner can give himself (and his party!) some bonus feats, it's not quite as rough to have all them feats.

Words of Chaos - Aura of Chaos + "Practiced Spellcaster" for Bardic Music
Words of Creation - Double Inspire Courage
Song of the Heart - +1 IC bonus
Masterwork Instrument - various bonuses, make into weapon as well somehow and you're gold there, just whack people as either part of the music or to help indicate rests.

[Doorhandle]

I double-checked.

Apparently, you cannot use charisma-based skills while raging... but bardic performance isn't a skill, is it?

Also, if you're doing Pathfinder, I suggest you use moment of clarity so you can cast the occasional spell inside a rage. Shout is always handy.

..Depending on how much of each class you need, consider dragon disciple for extra strength and protection.

Also read up on this (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/community-creations/treatmonks-lab/test2). Has a guide to a pure-melee bard if not a bardbarian.

edit: completey forgot: if your making a bardbarian in pathfinder, Savage Skald is THE alternate class for you.

[Cerlis]

yea, you just need to be able to have that level of skill to use certian bardic abilities. though i'd think some abilities (like countersong, and fascinate) that require a perform check (as a DC) might be an issue. but you dont need a check for buffs.




also



What the heck is wrong with you. how can you say "barbarian" and "Bard" in the same sentance and use the word "guitar"?! the proper item is "Axe"

[Darrin]

Second: are there feats, base classes or prestige classes in 3.5 and/or Pathfinder that would allow me to further the blood-curling rage, the general bashing, the quality of the performance and my extremely vocal spell hurling?


You must obviously be talking about my bestest favoritest PrC ever:

Battle Howler of Gruumsh.

From Dragon #311. Full BAB, 5/5 bard casting, full martial/armor proficiency, advances bardic music, and rage 2/day. Slap that on a Desert Half-Orc chassis with the Magic-Blooded template (-2 Wis, +2 Cha, Dragon #306) and a battle pipe organ or a couple of 200-lb church bells, and you should be ready to rock. (Although I usually start by giving them Perform: Battle Yodeling, which is sort of a nod to H.O.L.)

[APersonAmI]

WOOOT!!!!1!! Finally, someone wishes to bask in the glory that is the Bardarian! It is specifically mentioned in the gestalt rules, that you can use bardic music while raging. Suggestion can be quite interesting, depending on your level of imagination.

Awesome! My first possible conundrum, averted! Only problem is, I do not know anything about gestalt, so further information on what book or other source this might be found in would be greatly appreciated.


I double-checked.
Also, if you're doing Pathfinder, I suggest you use moment of clarity so you can cast the occasional spell inside a rage. Shout is always handy.

..Depending on how much of each class you need, consider dragon disciple for extra strength and protection.

Also read up on this (http://www.d20pfsrd.com/extras/community-creations/treatmonks-lab/test2). Has a guide to a pure-melee bard if not a bardbarian.

edit: completey forgot: if your making a bardbarian in pathfinder, Savage Skald is THE alternate class for you.

Aha! Savage Skald! Thanks for that one, I had missed that option entirely. The Dragon Disciple is an interesting option, although the sacrifice of bardic performance is a sad thing. Treantmonks guide is quite awesome, yes.


You must obviously be talking about my bestest favoritest PrC ever:

Battle Howler of Gruumsh.

From Dragon #311. Full BAB, 5/5 bard casting, full martial/armor proficiency, advances bardic music, and rage 2/day. Slap that on a Desert Half-Orc chassis with the Magic-Blooded template (-2 Wis, +2 Cha, Dragon #306) and a battle pipe organ or a couple of 200-lb church bells, and you should be ready to rock. (Although I usually start by giving them Perform: Battle Yodeling, which is sort of a nod to H.O.L.)

YES! The Battle Howler is exactly what i was looking for. The rest of your suggestions, I am not quite so sure about, but the Battle Howler is just what I wanted.

Also: Thanks for all the suggestions, they have been most helpful.

[Darrin]

YES! The Battle Howler is exactly what i was looking for. The rest of your suggestions, I am not quite so sure about, but the Battle Howler is just what I wanted.

Desert Half-Orc (Unearthed Arcana, environmental variant) doesn't have a Cha penalty. Assuming Battle Howler means Dragon Magazine material is in play, the LA +0 racial templates from Dragon #306 may be available. Magic-Blooded adds Wis -2, Cha +2 as ability modifiers.

Heavy Metal/Detroit Rock City version: The City Brawler Barbarian variant (Dragon #349) trades proficiency with medium armor, shields, and martial weapons for Improved Unarmed Strike, TWF (unarmed strike only), and more importantly reduces the penalty for improvised weapons to -2. (It also still has fast movement, which you can swap for Spirit Lion Totem.) Get a really high Str, and an extremely loose interpretation of summon instrument might allow you to summon a very heavy instrument that you could still conceivably hold in your hands: kettle drum, harpsichord, gong, hanging bell, pipe orgran, etc. Make sure your "church bell" is at least 201 lbs, and it does 5d6 damage when thrown as an improvised weapon (preferably while queueing up AC/DC's "Hell's Bells" on your MP3 player). Add Dragonfire Inspiration to make it flaming.

Other instruments that can also be used as weapons: steel flute (Secrets of Sarlona) and of course the almighty lute-bow (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070314a). Add an instrument blade (10 GP, Complete Scoundrel p. 110) for piercing/slashing damage.

[APersonAmI]

Desert Half-Orc (Unearthed Arcana, environmental variant) doesn't have a Cha penalty. Assuming Battle Howler means Dragon Magazine material is in play, the LA +0 racial templates from Dragon #306 may be available. Magic-Blooded adds Wis -2, Cha +2 as ability modifiers.

Heavy Metal/Detroit Rock City version: The City Brawler Barbarian variant (Dragon #349) trades proficiency with medium armor, shields, and martial weapons for Improved Unarmed Strike, TWF (unarmed strike only), and more importantly reduces the penalty for improvised weapons to -2. (It also still has fast movement, which you can swap for Spirit Lion Totem.) Get a really high Str, and an extremely loose interpretation of summon instrument might allow you to summon a very heavy instrument that you could still conceivably hold in your hands: kettle drum, harpsichord, gong, hanging bell, pipe orgran, etc. Make sure your "church bell" is at least 201 lbs, and it does 5d6 damage when thrown as an improvised weapon (preferably while queueing up AC/DC's "Hell's Bells" on your MP3 player). Add Dragonfire Inspiration to make it flaming.

Other instruments that can also be used as weapons: steel flute (Secrets of Sarlona) and of course the almighty lute-bow (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20070314a). Add an instrument blade (10 GP, Complete Scoundrel p. 110) for piercing/slashing damage.

That huge instrument build might acctually make four levels of the Dragon Disciple prc Doorhandle suggested (Found here (http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/prestigeClasses/dragonDisciple.html#dragon-disciple),) handy. +4 Str, 3/4 BAB, 3/4 spellcasting, d12 HD, a potentially useful feat and other goodies, including +3 nat armor, seems pretty good if high Str is the goal. The huge instrument build might be very epic. What is the damage:weight ratio for thrown massive objects?

[Darrin]

What is the damage:weight ratio for thrown massive objects?

See Complete Warrior p. 159 (Improvised Weapon Damage table).

I believe most of the really obscene Hulking Hurler builds abuse this table (extended via exponential progression) by hurling anti-osmium planetoids for umpteengazillion-d6 damage.

Bard 4/Crusader 1/Battle Howler 4/Jade Phoenix Mage 1/Sublime Chord 1/JPM +9 gets BAB +18, 9th level spells, can audition for the drummer spot in Spinal Tap complete with Spontaneous Combustion Finale, and still finish his drum solo 1d6 rounds later.

[9mm]

ulti-combat has some options that make bardic proformence selfish (they only effect him) for extra combat bonuses, like a haste effect at 6th level. You may want to look into the dervish dancer archetype. there is also a Barbarian Archtype that loses alot of the benifits of rage to also lose the penetlies; which could get you around any questions of rage/perfomance interactions.