3.X Ravenloft Character Advice

[Liriel]

Got a new game coming up. GM said make a level 3 char - anything goes with regard to race, class, ECL, etc. We've already got: druid, psion, chaos mage, and paladin. I've never done a Ravenloft setting before. There's 3 of us who haven't decided what to make yet. Any thoughts on what's needed in the setting...or just random crazy builds to try?

Thanks in advance! :smallbiggrin:

[ryu]

If your dm is going to take advantage of what ravenloft is.... Be evil if possible and neutral if not. I would also recommend a full casting class and one of the classic evil undead. Vampires if I remember correctly loose a few key weaknesses. A bit overgeneralized I know but it's a concept.

[Terraoblivion]

Dude, being evil is the worst thing you can do in Ravenloft. It leads to eternal torment. Also, playing a vampire is kind of completely missing the point. Ravenloft is horror, playing a monster with a lot of immunities negates that some, being what everyone is afraid of will be damn near impossible. In both cases it will also really kill the horror unless the GM bends over backwards to cater specifically to the OP's character, which is a jerk move to everyone.

More generally, play something relatively plain and straightforward. Stay away from anything outlandish and don't focus on powergaming. Doing otherwise will break the atmosphere and hurt the feel of the game. There just isn't any point in playing in Ravenloft if you don't cater to the aesthetics and themes of the setting and horror just doesn't work well with extreme power.

[holywhippet]

I don't know if it carried over to 3.X - but I thought the old rule for Ravenloft with Paladins is to make their life as miserable as possible.

[Ozreth]

Dude, being evil is the worst thing you can do in Ravenloft. It leads to eternal torment. Also, playing a vampire is kind of completely missing the point. Ravenloft is horror, playing a monster with a lot of immunities negates that some, being what everyone is afraid of will be damn near impossible. In both cases it will also really kill the horror unless the GM bends over backwards to cater specifically to the OP's character, which is a jerk move to everyone.

More generally, play something relatively plain and straightforward. Stay away from anything outlandish and don't focus on powergaming. Doing otherwise will break the atmosphere and hurt the feel of the game. There just isn't any point in playing in Ravenloft if you don't cater to the aesthetics and themes of the setting and horror just doesn't work well with extreme power.

That's the stuff. Couldn't agree more. Just roll up a class that you like the feel of, preferably a core class/race, grab some rope and a lantern and dig in!

[ryu]

A druid and a scion were mentioned. Extreme power is already in the group one way or the other and the gm literally said anything goes. Besides vampires do have some weaknesses in ravenloft. They're just more exotic than than the other high tier party members.

[Pigkappa]

Dude, being evil is the worst thing you can do in Ravenloft. It leads to eternal torment. Also, playing a vampire is kind of completely missing the point. Ravenloft is horror, playing a monster with a lot of immunities negates that some, being what everyone is afraid of will be damn near impossible. In both cases it will also really kill the horror unless the GM bends over backwards to cater specifically to the OP's character, which is a jerk move to everyone.

More generally, play something relatively plain and straightforward. Stay away from anything outlandish and don't focus on powergaming. Doing otherwise will break the atmosphere and hurt the feel of the game. There just isn't any point in playing in Ravenloft if you don't cater to the aesthetics and themes of the setting and horror just doesn't work well with extreme power.

All this is true. Don't be evil in Ravenloft. And never be evil when a Paladin is in the party.

A cleric could really be useful. There are some drawbacks (divinations work in a funny way, dealing with dead people is harder...), but that can be fun too.

[wizuriel]

A totemist could be a good addition to that party.

[Liriel]

Yup - he's basically said do as you wish. So it is literally anything goes. He did mention that if you go overly monstrous there may be some problems once we're deep into things. (Dunno if that's Ravenloft setting or his particular story.)

The paladin player knows he's going to be having problems; however, he has played the setting before and said he's comfortable with the hits he takes to his paladin bits. We've already joked about using him as bait. :smallsmile:

I do recall him mentioning some of the cleric spells are strange. Bards get nerfed a bit - bardic knowledge at a penalty and some other class feature took a beating. Summoning spells act strangely. Messing with minds can be dangerous (our poor psi).

Thanks for the answers so far, everyone. I appreciate it.

[Lord Loss]

People in Ravenloft hate nonhumans. They'll mistrsut elves, dwarves and other common races and they'll flat-out lynchmob stuff like minotaurs.

Ravenloft is basically a demiplane that is very grim and dark. It doesn't get much worse for most people, but if you're a bad person, entities that are far more powerful than gods (think the lady of pain) will go out of their way to screw you over and make you utterly miserable without outright killing you.

Human, or a PHB nonhuman is my reccomendation for race, class-wise a skillmonkey seems nice to me. A bard, rogue or factotum seems like a good fit. Alternaitvely, try a beguiler. Don't play a Necromancer, undead or shadowcaster. Seriously. The people will definitely hate you, but depending on the DM it might be just as bad as if you were evil.

[Liriel]

Where can one find beguiler? My buddy just said he's considered factotum, so good to know that's a reasonable choice.

[holywhippet]

Where can one find beguiler? My buddy just said he's considered factotum, so good to know that's a reasonable choice.

I think they are in PHB 2.

[Safety Sword]

Although you have a divine caster, you don't have a cleric! Turn undead is generally useful in Ravenloft :smallbiggrin:

Edit: Damned typos

[Pigkappa]

The paladin player knows he's going to be having problems; however, he has played the setting before and said he's comfortable with the hits he takes to his paladin bits. We've already joked about using him as bait. :smallsmile:

A paladin in a party with a Vampire is just unplayable. A moderately Evil rogue might be bearable, a Vampire is not.

However, Ravenloft is mostly about struggling to be good in a world full of evil. Playing an Evil party could be fun if you really want to be the monsters with all the violence, hate and craziness that you can imagine, but it won't last long and can't be done with a paladin.

[Optimator]

If your party needs a skill-monkey, there is a pretty good rogue prestige class in the Miniatures Handbook that focuses on hunting undead called Skullclan Hunter. It gives you immunity to (undead) fear effects, disease, paralysis, ability drain, ability damage, and energy drain, plus a permanent protection from evil effect. You can sneak attack undead and some other goodies sprinkled throughout.

[Feytalist]

Seems like the party needs a skillmonkey; rogue, bard or even ranger. Any of those could be fun in Ravenloft.

I agree that a evil/monster class would throw the party and the whole game off-balance, especially with a paladin.

As someone else has mentioned, a good way to play Ravenloft is to stay relatively plain and basic and enjoy the ride. That said, I saw chaos mage and immediately thought that sounded awesome in a Ravenloft setting :smallbiggrin:

[Dsurion]

I've always gotten the vibe from Ravenloft that casters, especially divine casters, are somewhat more likely to be screwed over by the setting itself, so I prefer not to play them in Ravenloft.

That said, I always default to Rogue when I'm unfamiliar with a setting. Skillsy guys are always useful.

[Downysole]

I'm always a fan of Clerics. The reason they're nerfed a little in Ravenloft is because they would be too good without the nerfing. Just imagine that Strahd sends you along a host of skeletons and zombies. One lucky roll with a greater turning and Poof, there goes half of them.

But, even nerfed, clerics are a strong member of any party. Try going as a buffing or protective cleric using LOTS of sacred armor when you get to level 7.

[CapnVan]

If your dm is going to take advantage of what ravenloft is.... Be evil if possible and neutral if not. I would also recommend a full casting class and one of the classic evil undead. Vampires if I remember correctly loose a few key weaknesses. A bit overgeneralized I know but it's a concept.

I've got to echo others here when I say: When you know there's a paladin in the party, choosing to be an evil PC is douche-y. You're just setting the whole party up for conflict that could have been avoided. If you're rolling up your PC after the paladin's in, you're just messing it up for everyone else. It's a first come, first served situation.

As to RL: You've got to keep in mind the Outcast Rating. As an evil PC fails Powers Checks, that rating goes through the roof, making it harder and harder to deal with the populace.

[CapnVan]

Where can one find beguiler? My buddy just said he's considered factotum, so good to know that's a reasonable choice.

I'd second bard or cleric there, if one of the others is going factotum.

You need a face; most RL campaigns involve an overarching plot and plenty of interaction with NPCs. And interpersonal skills are one of the areas least affected by the Dark Powers.

And while clerics do suffer some, you're still talking about clerics here. You need one in your party. Turning, healing, yes. But dropping a cure disease in a village that you need on your side? Priceless.

[Fouredged Sword]

I am going to go out on a limb and suggest a high charisma crusader. good tanking ability and attack power, healing, good HD, Cha to willsaves, social skills, and out of combat utility. Really, really hard to kill at level 3.

There are is a feat chain somewhere that lets you ignore negative levels for con modifier min and then the second allows you to take a standard action to remove negative levels from yourself.

Be a good knight who helps others while struggling with the darkness and hopelessness of the world.

[Andorax]

Biggest question is...does your DM "get" Ravenloft? I'm already concerned that your DM might not grasp the setting really well with his "anything goes" comment.

If your DM understands what Ravenloft is all about on even a basic level, then all traditional powergaming/high op strategies are completely out of place here. Evil will be punished severely, and extremes (read Paladin) of Good will likewise suffer.

Neutral, particularly LN, is a good solid alignment, and a character with a fair amount of self-reliance and flexibility is recommended. I like the suggestions of a ranger or rogue as solid choices. Human, unless you have a DANG good reason not to be, is a must.

[Liriel]

*Shrugs* He's DM'd Ravenloft before, but I can't be sure he "gets" the setting because I haven't played it before, so I'm a newbie to it myself.

I believe the others are all CN (not the paladin, obviously). I know a dwarf and an elf are already in the mix. Not sure what other races. Although it sounds like most everyone is in the lean towards human (yay extra feat).

Got a lot of good thoughts and suggestions. Never heard of that rogue prestige either. I'm loving getting all these new-to-me ideas! Ya'll rock! :smallbiggrin:
I always get great help here.

[Donox]

I'd suggest the dread necromancer. With any luck you'd be able to contrast your minor evil to the abomination that is Ravenloft, and make the Pally not try to kill you then. DN's are a very sold tier 3 class, who get turn undead, and a bunch of other cool stuff. (plus you have the whole antihero thing going for you)

Donox

[Cieyrin]

Libris Mortis has plenty of material of interest to you, as does Dungeonscape if you go Rogue, as there's an ACF that let's you still Sneak Attack otherwise immune creatures, though at half damage. Handy if you can't find a Wand of Grave Strike or have access to the Magic Item Compendium and Weapon Crystals.