Overpowered Builds

[enderlord99]

lets list all the ridiculous TO builds. I'll start:


Pun-pun
The Wish
The Word
Twice betrayer of Shar

[RaggedAngel]

Chuck E. Cheese, the fastest metal man in the world is a good one. However, errata killed that, so I don't think it still counts.

The Omnificer is also TO and overpowered; infinite knowledge is just too useful to be allowed in any real game.

[HappyBlanket]

Dark Chaos Shuffle, Natural Spell, Ubercharging, Bluffomancy, Wizards, etc. Okay, okay, it's tame by comparison and Wizards is too generalizing. Just laugh at the joke and move on, kthanks.

[Silva Stormrage]

I was never quite sure what it did but isn't the Cheater of Mysteria (Spelling?) in the realm of TO?

[2xMachina]

Cheater of Mystra is quite basic. More like broken than TO.

Get feat (Initiate of Mystra), cast in AMF. Done.

[Silva Stormrage]

Cheater of Mystra is quite basic. More like broken than TO.

Get feat (Initiate of Mystra), cast in AMF. Done.

Ah... Well thats basic...

[2xMachina]

Googling Cheater of Mystra.... it appears that someone has named a more fleshed out build as Cheater of Mystra.

Other than that feat, they added Persist cheese

[Gandariel]

jumplomancer? need to write something...

[maximus25]

I forgot the name, but it was some build that used robilars gambit and something else to hit you a thousand times for every hit you get on him.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Cindy

Hulking Hurler

Mailman

Shadowcraft Gnome (That Damn Gnome)

[Sitzkrieg]

Necropolitan Tainted Scholar

Jack B. Quick (what maximus25 is thinking of)

[darksolitaire]

I forgot the name, but it was some build that used robilars gambit and something else to hit you a thousand times for every hit you get on him.

Jack B. Quick? Gets ~8 attacks of opportunity when you attack him. Strong, yes, but overpowered? Depends on what you consider overpowered. He is certainly not there with spellcasters.

Edit: was I just ninja'd?

[Hiro Protagonest]

D2 crusader.

The ubërcharger (not just a Spirit Lion Totem Barbarian with Shock Trooper).

[Geigan]

Twice Betrayer of Shar
Cancer Mages

Does the emerald legion count? They're definitely TO though more on the DM side of the screen.

[maximus25]

Jack B. Quick? Gets ~8 attacks of opportunity when you attack him. Strong, yes, but overpowered? Depends on what you consider overpowered. He is certainly not there with spellcasters.

Edit: was I just ninja'd?

That's what I was thinking of.

No, you were swordsage'd.

[Hiro Protagonest]

Mailman

I thought the Mailman was supposed to be PO.

[Sitzkrieg]

And there's one I can't find right now that uses shapechanging and deformities to get thousands of natural attacks per round. I think it's on the wizard boards or brilliantgameologists.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Fluffy

The Borg Cube

[tyckspoon]

Chuck E. Cheese, the fastest metal man in the world is a good one. However, errata killed that, so I don't think it still counts.


The mechanic behind it still works, AFAIK*, it's just a couple orders of magnitude less powerful- instead of circling the world and using Tornado Throw to pitch a guy into orbit, he jogs a couple of miles in a single action and throws his victim several hundred feet.

*Assuming the Divine Recovery/Divine Impetus/Quicksilver Motion loop functions correctly the way I remember it being described last time I actually saw Chuck's thread, the amount of ground Chuck can cover is only limited by the number of turn attempts he can scrap together.

[mootoall]

X of Smack. Varies from high level PO to definite TO. (King to God, I think it went?)

[WinWin]

The Nasty Gentleman

The H.I.V.E

Little Red Raiding Hood

[enderlord99]

The Nasty Gentleman

The H.I.V.E

Little Red Raiding Hood

I've never heard of those. What are they?

[Shadow Lord]

Mailman is PO

That Damn Gnome is PO, isn't it?

Also...

The Lizzipede, for your enjoyment! (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=146.0)

[WinWin]

The nasty gentleman stacks symbionts and abuses share spells. Can inflict more damage than an optimized hulking hurler if venomfire is up and running.

The H.I.V.E is an optimized hivemind that summons other hiveminds and can eventually have sorcerer casting that requires a log table to calculate.

Little red raiding hood is a compilation of different teqniues for abusing the battle jump feat in order to garner multiple full attacks per round. By multiple, I mean a lot.

[Hiro Protagonest]

That Damn Gnome is PO, isn't it?

What gnome?

[Shadow Lord]

What gnome?

The Shadowcraft Gnome.

[Greenish]

Little red raiding hood is a compilation of different teqniues for abusing the battle jump feat in order to garner multiple full attacks per round. By multiple, I mean a lot.Also stacks damage multipliers to have 'round 1000 damage a hit before PA.

It also has scaled-down applications for PO, I seem to recall.

[TroubleBrewing]

Fluffy

The Borg Cube

Haven't heard of these two. Maybe they're among the many broken links on the "handy CO links page" on the Wizards board?

[Greenish]

Haven't heard of these two. Maybe they're among the many broken links on the "handy CO links page" on the Wizards board?I forget Fluffy (the Terrible!) but the Cube is a commoner with Landlord feat, with all the money from it spent to customize a flying cube with enough defenses to annihilate anything it comes in contact with (up and including an actual sphere of annihilation).

[Shadow Lord]

I forget Fluffy (the Terrible!) but the Cube is a commoner with Landlord feat, with all the money from it spent to customize a flying cube with enough defenses to annihilate anything it comes in contact with (up and including an actual sphere of annihilation).

What'd I tell you? Commoner's are the most overpowered thing in D&D!

[gorfnab]

The A**plomancer

The Master of Cluck-Fu a.k.a. Colonel Sanders - Not exactly TO or PO

Chicken Infested Necromancer - More TO than PO

[tyckspoon]

I forget Fluffy (the Terrible!) but the Cube is a commoner with Landlord feat, with all the money from it spent to customize a flying cube with enough defenses to annihilate anything it comes in contact with (up and including an actual sphere of annihilation).

I probably don't actually have to say it, but the Commoner part is in no way essential to the Cube, it's just funny; it's a lot easier to set up internal defenses for the pilot/give him a comfortable cabin to pilot from if the driver is a decent build on its own as well.

In short, the Cube is a flying fortress. Its walls are constructed from layers of Permanent Walls of Force, Permanent Prismatic Walls, the hardest material you can get your hands on (magically-treated Obdurium is the toughest I know of), and the occasional oblative layer of just plain dirt. The inside cockpit is covered with defenses against scrying and teleportation (I think you can pretty well cover it with Forbiddance on the area itself and Mind Blank on the driver, but there are other effects with names I've forgotten that can and probably were used.) So, what you have right now is a cube that can't be gotten into (Forbiddance blocks teleport and similar attempts to get inside, Walls of Force prevent incorporeal and ethereal access, solid material prevents burrowing.. IIRC, the only reliable way to punch through it is to find a way to cast like 3 Disjunctions and 3 Disintegrates in the same turn. Number of spells of course depends on just how many layers the Cube builder was able to afford.) and that is almost impossible to strike directly at the pilot- you need something that ignores both line of effect and line of sight. For reference on the amount of cheese that requires, Mind Raping some random commoner -> Love's Pain with the Cube pilot as the subject is one of the only reliable ways I can remember to hurt whoever is inside the Cube.

For offense, the simplest method is to just make a Prismatic Wall the outermost layer of the Cube. Then you just fly it into whatever you want to destroy. The more complicated (and classier, IMO) method is to put a solid layer on the outside and mount it with spell turrets or similar spell traps, which lets you arm the Cube and make it a proper battleship.

[Eldariel]

What gnome?

Killer Gnome (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19864158/Shadowcraft_Illusionist_=_Killer_Gnome!), actually. It's just a Shadowcraft Mage that can (arguably) cast Miracles from Cantrip slots though.

And basically can also cast any Evocation or Conjuration: Creation spontaneously from said level 0 slots, and they're more real than reality (he reaches about 120% reality on his spells.


Cindy

Cindy is basically just a blaster Incantatrix. Technically not TO but probably at the very edge of PO. Now, see Doc Roc's Spock (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-117251.html) for funkiness you can do with casting; it's slightly more on the TO side with basically infinite spells of any type available. It can also access some relatively simple infinite action loops, of course.


Mailman

Very much similar to Cindy, actually. Not really TO; just a rather high damage, hard-to-block direct damage Sorcerer again using Incantatrix and Metamagic Reducers. See here (http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19868534/The_Mailman:_A_Direct_Damage_Sorcerer)


Fluffy

The Borg Cube

These are both from the old Test of Spite (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150821). Lots of good stuff came out of there; much like Char Ops boards of the old, actually (from where most of the rest of this stuff comes).

[drakir_nosslin]

I've forgotten the name (If it ever got one), but there's the crit build that (ab)uses Lighting Maces, aptitude weapon and stacking crit-range increases (via disciple of dispater etc.) to get near-infinite to infinite attacks.

They did a matlab calculation to find the correct number of attacks and the average damage, and back then I think it held the record for most damage in one round after the d2 crusader (which has inf damage, kind of hard to beat).

[Olo Demonsbane]

I've forgotten the name (If it ever got one), but there's the crit build that (ab)uses Lighting Maces, aptitude weapon and stacking crit-range increases (via disciple of dispater etc.) to get near-infinite to infinite attacks.

They did a matlab calculation to find the correct number of attacks and the average damage, and back then I think it held the record for most damage in one round after the d2 crusader (which has inf damage, kind of hard to beat).

I created the upgrade version of this...the Bolt Spammer. Slightly worse crit range, but got 16 extra attacks from each crit.


The Borg Cube

Actually, only the first version was a commoner. And, still, no one could defeat that. The later versions included some ways of targeting without LoE, and an optimized Batman Wizard inside of it.

[Grendus]

Bubbs the Commoner (A.K.A "abusing the handle animal rules and WBL to control animals way above my ECL")

Hi Welcome (A.K.A "abusing templates and animal companion rules to make an animal companion ridiculously above my CR... oh, and I'm still a druid, I have class features more powerful than your entire class").

Rainbow Warsnake going by the text (A.K.A "wait... there's a cleric spell for that... somewhere... in one of these splats... hold on a second"). Also listed is any cleric using a loose reading on Versatile Spellcaster to spontaneously cast from their entire list (granted, it's RAW legal, it's just pretty clearly not intended - no game designer in his right mind would let a player spontaneously cast from the entire cleric list).

[Dusk Eclipse]

The King of Smack is more PO than TO in my opinion, and I am pretty sure everything made by KellKheraptis count.. just a taste of it (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=11952.0)

[Ason]

Would a PC that ends up going Beholder Mage count, or is there a specifically broken build with that PrC somewhere? That class is all kinds of ridiculous, from what I recall.

[Sactheminions]

CO, PO, TO, definitions please?

I think Exemplar has to be on there.

[PirateMonk]

CO, PO, TO, definitions please?

I think Exemplar has to be on there.

Character Optimization, Practical Optimization, Theoretical Optimization. PO is powerful but intended to be used in an actual game. TO breaks the game to the point of unplayability. CO is a general term.

[tyckspoon]

CO, PO, TO, definitions please?

I think Exemplar has to be on there.

CO: Character Optimization. The general practice of optimizing in D&D; also the shorthand name for the optimization boards on the Wizards forums before they blew the whole forum system up.

PO: Practical Optimization. Covers most things; this is functionally defined as "things you intend to actually play with." A practical build usually produces something that still has a reason to interact with the game world, although you do need to tune that to what your DM and playgroup can work with.

TO: Theoretical Optimization. This is playing with the system just to see what weird things you can make it do; this is the domain of infinite loops, absolute invulnerability, and most notoriously Pun-Pun, among other things. Actually bringing one of these to a table without explicit permission of the DM is considered very poor form.

[LordBlades]

TO: Theoretical Optimization. This is playing with the system just to see what weird things you can make it do; this is the domain of infinite loops, absolute invulnerability, and most notoriously Pun-Pun, among other things. Actually bringing one of these to a table without explicit permission of the DM is considered very poor form.

Bringing most of the TO tricks to the table is pointless anyway, 'cause they already won the game the moment it starts.

[Arundel]

TO tends to serve one of two purposes. To some people it becomes a way to ridicule the convoluted insanity that is the rules of 3.5. I tend to use it the other way, which is to incorporate bits of them into your builds. TO builds tend to be built on a series of neat tricks, but on their own these tricks usually aren't completely gamebreaking.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Would a PC that ends up going Beholder Mage count, or is there a specifically broken build with that PrC somewhere? That class is all kinds of ridiculous, from what I recall.

There was a build that did this, with Dewomerkeeper and UrPriest thrown in to the bag...

[Radar]

Another build from ToS, that I know in name only: Hounds of Tindalos (yes, they were stated).

I'm not sure where Commodor Guff should be placed, but TO is a safe bet. It was a core-only single-class Wizard made by Doc Roc to compete in a series of tasks against a single-class Monk build by Giacomo. Regretably the competition did never start. Important feature was a Magic Jar trick, that allowed the Wizard to permanently possess a body of a Stone Golem (if I remember correctly).

There was also an elegant contestant to the early Pun-Pun versions. A third level Wizard/Cleric/Wizard abusing Ice Assasin with Eschew Material, who then Fuses with a clone of a Psion and goes from there up.

Neoterminators would qualify as well. It most likely abused Forced Dream and some PP regeneration tricks to go back in time along someone's timeline to kill them, when they were weak. If I remember correctly this was the build that had about 50% chance of taking down fully powered Pun-Pun (on condition, that Pun-Pun doesn't outright ban psionics).

[mootoall]

If we're doing tricks as well as builds, psionics has the Save Game trick, several PP battery tricks, and, my favorite, the Erudite Concierto.

[Dusk Eclipse]

If we're doing tricks as well as builds, psionics has the Save Game trick, several PP battery tricks, and, my favorite, the Erudite Concierto.
As far as pSionic tricks go I prefer the mad minute :smallbiggrin:

[fryplink]

I think I'll throw an necropolitan tainted scholar on here. (aka: my primary casting stat is >50)

[Grendus]

Chicken Infested Necromancer - More TO than PO

Works better with warlock, you can take Corpsecrafter feats and turn your infested chickens into suicide chickens of doom for free. At the first level you can take The Dead Walk, you can animate 12 at a time. Each deals 1d6 cold damage on a peck, plus probably 1 point of physical damage (can't find the stats for a chicken). Take a bard cohort (there are no prereqs for corpsecrafter feats, so you can have your 6th level feat free) with DFI to add another two or three d6 to that, and when one pops, he heals the others and hurts the target.

Even without chicken infested, chickens are 2cp apiece. You can buy 50 for 1gp, just wring their necks and stuff them in a handy haversack, then invert when you want to start animating. Probably still TO though, aside from driving the DM crazy with an insane number of attacks per round it's not that powerful. Enemies with AoE attacks could just detonate your suicide chickens as you summon them, and hit you with the negative energy to boot. Could be an interesting backup strategy for an enterprising warlock who either made the middling decision to be a necro-warlock or has a bard companion (doubly so a DFI bard). </derail>

[Fouredged Sword]

You could get tomb tainted soul and then use chickens as cure light wounds potions.

It would make a silly low level character, but not actualty gamebreakingly powerful.

The idea of takeing chicken infested, toumb tainted soul and lichloved, going to some field somewhere and raiseing 20-30 thousand chickens as undead amuses me to no end though.