Need a little druid help

[MikolasTheAngry]

Hello! I'm having a little trouble with my druid. I'm new to the class, so slightly unsure what to do in terms of spell or feat selection. I had been aiming toward a melee powerhouse, but I'm not sure it's really necessary. The current party makeup is:

Druid (me)
Hexblade
Duskblade
Cleric

We're all level ~7 (I came in late, and am a couple-hundred EXP behind the other members). So I think we are all on equal footing now, but last session I was a level behind.

The Duskblade is a little squishy AC-wise. I'm a little more methodical than the rest of the group, so I have trouble trying to hand out buffs--while I'm trying to calculate they're already in the thick of things... (the character has a phobia of speaking to people, so while he's mustering up the courage to go 'hold on just a moment' everyone's kicked in the door and started setting fires to things and beheading people).

Most combats I've been getting away with Call Lightning blasting while my dog has a field day. I actually rarely use all of my spells, and the few times I've had cause to use Wild Shape to get into things, most of my targets have gotten extremely unlucky and died almost immediately.

That said, I'm not sure what direction to go from here. Given the party's makeup, (and the cleric is a little space-y, and I'm trying not to metagame other people's actions heavily. I don't wanna be that guy constantly going 'no, you should do *this* instead'), I think my best bet is buffing and control, with perhaps a little save-or-die/suck, but I'm unsure the best way to go about that. I've read the Druid Handbook, and while it has a lot of good information, it didn't impart a good sense of HOW to wield all this power.

My issue is, mostly, I'm not used to spellcasters enough to know how to get the most out of my spells. I feel like I'm using very fine tools to hammer nails in to planks, if that makes sense. Can anyone give me a nudge in a direction a little more toward a proper mindset? Years of monks, rogues, and archery fighters haven't helped me much.

I can link a character sheet if that would help (and is allowed).

[RaggedAngel]

This is the only thing that you'll ever need. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#naturalSpell)

Starting next level, you will never not be a bear.

What's your animal companion?

[MikolasTheAngry]

This is the only thing that you'll ever need. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/feats.htm#naturalSpell)

Starting next level, you will never not be a bear.

What's your animal companion?

I already have Natural Spell, though it has hardly come up, strangely. Animal companion is a riding dog with leather barding. The group isn't super-optimized, so I'm not looking to necessarily be a powerhouse, just trying to grasp where to fit.

[Greenish]

Take Sculpt Spell, sculpt some walls, entangles, sleet storms etc.

[Antonok]

Heres my usual druid set up if I'm not going CoDzilla:

Extra Wild Shape feat
Eagles Wings feat (both in Complete Divine)
Masterwork/magical composite longbow

when a battle starts, throw a few buff spells on everyone, use the eagles wings feat, cast a summon spell, then start pelting everyone from above with arrows, while your animal companion and party has melee covered.

It has decent power to it but it also wouldn't insanely overshadow the duskblade and hexblade in your party.

[MikolasTheAngry]

Hmmm. Sculpt Spell is probably a good idea. I did have my heart set on a Wild Shape feat, but I suppose they can wait until 12th or 15th level when really nasty things are more available.

[Eldariel]

Yeah, when you aren't ripping faces off in Wildshape (you have things like Deinonychus Dinosaur as options already), you probably want a dose of battlefield control with a sprinkling of buffs, mastery of your summon options (SNAIV has Unicorn notably, SNAIII has Thoqquas, SNAII has small elementals) and mayhap some slight damage spells (though frankly, just keeping yourself Greater Magic Fanged and attacking in wildshape is often more efficient) is the order of the day.

For your level 1 slots, I'd almost certainly prepare mostly Entangles given that's the one level 1 spell that remains useful when it can be cast. One Faerie Fire is always convenient to keep around (to negate Invisibility, for instance) and perhaps Obscuring Mist and Endure Elements to boot.

Level 2 slots, I like Soften Earth and Stone. Lesser Restoration has obvious benefits (though whether you need to prepare it is another matter entirely; could carry one or have a Wand or whatever) & Barkskin, Gust of Wind and Resist Energy (also Animal's X) are all decent spells.

Level 3 slots, Greater Magic Fang and Sleet Storm are good ones. I like Scroll of Wind Wall but it's rarely worth preparing. Stone Shape and Call Lightning are both somewhat useful too.

Level 4 slots, Air Walk, Dispel, Scrying and Freedom of Movement are all good. Later on you'll want Giant Vermin but that'll take some Caster Level before it gets really good. Ice Storm is a nice control spell with some incidental damage thrown in.


Note, that's all just Core; stuff like Blinding Spittle [Spell Compendium], Venomfire [Serpent Kingdoms] and company is insanely powerful when expanding sources (Venomfire probably a bit too so; ask your DM for a caster level cap or something if you want to use it). This all you can read in Druid Handbook.

But basically yeah, predominantly control and buff spells with some utility and perhaps one-two damage thrown in; summons and items can handle healing and such quite well and yeah.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

Pretty much all of the wild shape feats are worthless. Natural Spell and combat feats like Power Attack, Combat Reflexes, Multiattack, etc. are the only feats you need for improving wild shape. What few wild shape feats that are worth getting are only to gain access to additional forms, most of which are for gimmick characters anyway, so don't even worry about them.

Take the feat Natural Bond in Complete Adventurer and get one of the 'level -3' companion choices, preferably a Fleshraker dinosaur (MM3) or a Dire Eagle (RoS). Natural Bond will offset the -3, so you'll be able to count your full druid level for its benefits.

For spells, I like Heat Metal for making opponents drop their weapons. (It worked on Aragorn in Fangorn Forest!) Produce Flame (Extended) is good because you can deliver fire damage on your natural weapon attacks, as per holding the charge (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/actionsInCombat.htm#standardCastaSpell) on a touch spell. (Extended) Creeping Cold (SC) deals 21d6 damage over six rounds from a 2nd level spell slot with a lesser metamagic rod. Which reminds me, you should definitely get several Lesser Rods of Extend, for both buffs and offensive spells. Freeze Armor in Frostburn is also extremely good but somewhat situational. If you want to break the game, cast (Extended) Snowsight on everyone (get 1st level pearls of power), and cast (Extended) Obscuring Snow every day. Don't worry too much about healing spells, you can spontaneously cast Summon Nature's Ally IV for a Unicorn which can use several cure spells and neutralize poison. With a Ring of the Beast (CC) you can get one via Summon Nature's Ally III instead.

Get Wilding Clasps (MIC), you put one on an item and it continues to function when you wild shape. Get a Circlet of Rapid Casting (MIC) and use it for low level buffs and crowd controls. Get a Monk's Belt and it will add your Wisdom bonus to your AC. Wear Wild armor, preferably Armor of the Beast (CC) and when you wild shape you're not considered to be wearing armor, so you'll still get the Monk AC bonus. Get a Mantle of the Beast (CC) and you won't need to use Greater Magic Fang on yourself. Again, Lesser Rods of Extend are amazing, you don't have enough until you can use a charge for every 1st-3rd level spell you can cast each day.

[erikun]

Honestly, it sounds like you are doing perfectly fine in the game as it is. I would recommend that, rather than trying to get the most mileage out of the Druid class, find something that you like and become good at that.

If you like throwing around magic that lasts more than just a single turn, I might suggest Entangle, Produce Flame, Flaming Sphere, Plant Growth, Sleet Storm, Spike Growth, or Spike Stones. (The area/penality ones are better than the damage ones, most times.) Also, consider casting the buffing spells (Greater Magic Fang, Barkskin, Bull Strength, etc) on your riding dog before it jumps into the fray - probably easier than casting them on impatient allies, although most allies will likely benefit from Barkskin at least.

[MikolasTheAngry]

Oh, very nice advice from you all! Thank you. I did know about wilding clasps and such, but the setting is a little magic item sparse. I'm trying to get my hands on such nifty things, but it's unsure if I will be able to. Do Ioun Stones still function when you wild shape? They aren't necessarily 'part of your form' but floating around your head... In any case, since the DM has mentioned wanting to give me some sort of item or something (since the rest of the party has picked up a few magic weapons, via a powerful/wealthy contact) maybe I'll be able to swing a metamagic rod. Though, Biffoniacus, I'm not sure what CC refers to. Complete Champion?

And, Erikun, I'm beginning to think that's the best option. The Duskblade likes to take on multiple people at once. In three or four sessions I haven't been hit by anything and I'm starting to really like that. I think it's dumb luck mostly, but I'm not going to tempt fate by walking into the range of all the sharp bits of metal to Barkskin him. I'm a delicate flower.

The only problem with Entangle is with how much time we spend fighting indoors, there's no plants to use. Is there a way to circumvent that? I thought I saw someone mention Vine Mines and Plant Growth in another thread whilst I was hunting around for advice.

Another question, and possibly a point of strategy: in the SRD, in the details of preparing spells, unless I'm mistaken it says you are allowed to prepare part of your spells at the start of the day (or whenever your period of prayer is, for clerics/druids) and prepare the remaining portion later, so long as you don't refill slots already used by casting. Am I mistaken? That could help tremendously, because as I said, I don't find myself having to use EVERY spell I prepare, and only readying the minimum and leaving some wiggle room for situational utility would be helpful.

From SRD:

A divine spellcaster does not have to prepare all his spells at once. However, the character’s mind is considered fresh only during his or her first daily spell preparation, so a divine spellcaster cannot fill a slot that is empty because he or she has cast a spell or abandoned a previously prepared spell.

Eldariel, what's particularly attractive about Thoqquas? They seem a little flimsy. The fire damage is nice, I suppose, but a solid smack from anything swinging a big sword around would end it. I'd already gone over Venomfire too, probably will end up capped at 4d6 damage. Which is still REALLY GOOD.

Thank you all for your help again! It's giving me a better idea of how to think about applying myself in combat. I need to get over my old MMORPG mentality ('if my numbers aren't as big as they can possibly be, I'm not contributing enough' sort of thing) really.

[OracleofSilence]

Well advice would be easy if you knew what you were looking for. There are a few druid handbooks out there if they could help. Also, remember that you can change your animal companion there is fun (and thematically interesting) stuff out there.

[Eldariel]

Oh, very nice advice from you all! Thank you. I did know about wilding clasps and such, but the setting is a little magic item sparse. I'm trying to get my hands on such nifty things, but it's unsure if I will be able to. Do Ioun Stones still function when you wild shape? They aren't necessarily 'part of your form' but floating around your head...

Ioun Stone should work just fine. And you could pick Create Wondrous Items if you wish for Wilding Clasps. That could enable you nicely.


Eldariel, what's particularly attractive about Thoqquas? They seem a little flimsy. The fire damage is nice, I suppose, but a solid smack from anything swinging a big sword around would end it. I'd already gone over Venomfire too, probably will end up capped at 4d6 damage. Which is still REALLY GOOD.

Thoqquas dig through ground like nobody's business. Use them to solve cases where you just need a tunnel or something melted or some such. :smallwink:

[MikolasTheAngry]

Wow, so this last session I focused mostly on buffs and area control. Walls, Vine Mine, Barkskin the melee, Entangle, etc.. Unless something wasn't going by the rules, it was devastating.

Unless I'm mistaken, Vine Mine (heavy undergrowth) + Entangle means, even on a successful save it costs 8 squares of movement to move into a square affected? That can't be right. That's ridiculous. That means a human can take a full-round action to move 5 feet. :smalleek:

How does Wall of Water work, anyway? It's frustrating, it mentions '10 foot squares/level' area in the spell description, but the wall is only a foot thick. Yet if you cast it in an area occupied by a creature it engulfs them? I mean, a foot's not that big. Am I missing something?